I am against fat acceptance

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Jimmyjames

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thiosk said:
suprisingly, fat people are healthier than we are led to believe. healthy enough that there is in the medical field the so called "obesity paradox." This is that when we have an illness associated with obesity-- like heart disease-- and you look at the survival rates, its the obese people who tend to survive the conditions better. Sure, they are fat, so they probably have good nutrition and enough body fat to survive any wasting illnesses. but its interesting none the less.

in other words, its not a massive health epidemic, not the epidemic its made out to be. Now im not talking about morbidly obese 800 pounds need a forklift to get them to the bathroom, im talking about the chunky kids and tubby folks. I see no reason to accept in society those folks. But im tired of listening to people calling america a land of unhealthy fat people... HECK NO we are a nation of the healthiest fat people you'll ever see.
Those are all very good points.

In fact, everyone I've known that had a heart attack were very skinny (not to say it's the rule, but this is my first-hand observation).

I'm 6'3", 226 lbs. I will tell you for certain that I will bust up a trail faster than probably anyone here. I'm active and exercise a lot, but I enjoy the food and beer I want, too.

This "You're fat" crap is nothing but elitism. The media has put this idea in everyone's head that if you're not skinny as a rail, you're obese.
 

Goon165

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Frizzle I'm not even going to try to explain how ignorant those statements where
 

Jaythulhu

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To be honest, my opinion on this varies. There are a relatively large (pardon the language) group of overweight people who are so because of medical reasons, an over or underactive thyroid is usually the cause. Where I agree with the OP is people who think that eating a couple of large maccas meals for breakfast, lunch and dinner, as well as various snacks during the day.

If your thyroid is fucked, you deserve medical treatment. Otherwise, go on a diet. It's not really that hard to eat properly. Having weighed over 160kg for several years (before I stopped eating junk food and any stuff with refined sugar in it. Now I'm a nice 82kg, which suits my 6'3 frame nicely), I feel more than authorised to speak on the subject of being fat. If you're really that lost when it comes to shopping healthy, ask a diabetic for help. I did, and it's one of the best things I've ever done for my health. I went to an engagement party earlier this year, and no one recognised me without all the weight I used to be packing. The looks on their faces when I proved who I said I was still amuses me.
 

Frizzle

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Goon165 said:
Frizzle I'm not even going to try to explain how ignorant those statements where
How is it ignorant? We've become a society of lazy animals. the only ones. No other living thing has a problem with weight except us, unless we help it (pets etc.) Yeah banning clothing won't ever happen, but it's to make you think of the point. people try and hide what they are, instead of being what they should. Am I in perfect health? no way. Am i trying to be? Yes.

Why shouldn't everone strive for their potential? Granted, if we had natural selection amongs humans, it would be a lot easier for this problem to get worked out, but we don't. Our next best bet is for everyone to try and be in the best shape they can, and as healthy as they can. I could sit here and blame McDonald's, or TV, or any number of other things. but it comes down to the individual.
 

Isaac Dodgson

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May 11, 2008
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I don't know anyone who was born "fat" or supposedly cursed to be overweight forever no matter what. I'm not saying it's not possible, but i've been around...never met anyone, plenty of fat people, but not cursed to be so.

I used to be really skinny, then got really fat, and now only kind of overweight, or at least unhealthy. When i got the motivation i tried diet and exercise, but when i actually gained weight after a month i was a little disheartened and altogether confused. Am I that person i've never met? Quickly realizing that's impossible, as i was once skinny, I did what most so called doomed fat people don't do.

I looked into it

I did research, looked into the variables in my life, like medication, and found that a certain medication I was on may not have been clinically recognized to have weight gain (or retention of water in my case) as a side affect, but nine out of ten testimonials on the subject claimed that they had an issue.

So I stopped taking the medicine, and what do you know? I lost fifty fucking pounds in two months...go me...
 

Frizzle

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Isaac Dodgson said:
I don't know anyone who was born "fat" or supposedly cursed to be overweight forever no matter what. I'm not saying it's not possible, but i've been around...never met anyone, plenty of fat people, but not cursed to be so.

I used to be really skinny, then got really fat, and now only kind of overweight, or at least unhealthy. When i got the motivation i tried diet and exercise, but when i actually gained weight after a month i was a little disheartened and altogether confused. Am I that person i've never met? Quickly realizing that's impossible, as i was once skinny, I did what most so called doomed fat people don't do.

I looked into it

I did research, looked into the variables in my life, like medication, and found that a certain medication I was on may not have been clinically recognized to have weight gain (or retention of water in my case) as a side affect, but nine out of ten testimonials on the subject claimed that they had an issue.

So I stopped taking the medicine, and what do you know? I lost fifty fucking pounds in two months...go me...
This is almost exactly what i'm talking about. Figured out how to better himself, and did it. with all the information we have now, there's no reason everyone can't do this.
 

hypothetical fact

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mkb07a said:
Okay... I'm just going to say, before I (hopefully) turn in for the night (now morning... damn) is that the OP comes off as... Okay. Here's the thing. I understand your point. It's aggravating for people who chose to eat six pizzas a day to then demand that someone accomodate them, rather than take responsibility for their actions. I understand that it's difficult to understand how someone can get up to a 6X shirt and not think there's a problem. I really do. I know where you're going with your argument but I still disagree because it comes off as intolerance. You don't have to accept it, but you tolerate it like you tolerate a smoker or crying infant.

I say all this because my boyfriend, at his healthiest weight, weighs 275 pounds. This was two years ago, at the peak of football season- he was working out every day, taking in a lot of protein, and was incredibly in shape. However, about a year ago he tore his meniscus (he didn't know he tore it till this past August, though), and due to the unholy amount of pain he felt had to quit the college track team he'd been on. Due to the pain (which makes it difficult for him to even walk upstairs), he was unable to continue his usual active lifestyle.

When he went to camp last summer (he's an instructor at a BSA camp for six weeks in the mountains), he weighed 330. Over the course of the summer, he lost only about ten pounds but had gained his muscle definition back. Unfortunately, nothing could be done about his meniscus (the doctor's advice was, see if the cyst in your knee goes away on its own), and once we returned here, he was back in pain (mind you, he was in pain the entire time he was at camp but the food there was... well, they didn't get enough calories for the amount of physical activity they did). As such, I'm not sure his weight now BUT we've committed to a program (together, as it helps to have a buddy and I'm female and thus hate my body) to get back to a healthier weight, and keep down his health risks.

I say all this because even if he got back down to his weight and size senior year (which... oh man, his shoulders *drool*), he'd still be twice my size and bigger than most average people. This isn't to say that every person who weighs that much (and I assure you, that's the weight he's supposed to be) got there because that's just how they are instead of sitting on the couch, playing Wii and eating cheesey-poofs, but not all people that are overweight (by your standards) are in that category, either. As such, he'd need a bigger gown in the hospital, and it's always been uncomfortable for him to sit in a standard school desk, and there's nothing he can do about it.

The reality of the situation is people in developed nations are gaining weight (Australia just beat the US as the fattest nation, so I don't want to hear it), and there will have to be accomodations that're made. Frankly, I, as a female, am saddened every day when thin models are embraced and my only solace comes from Renaissance paintings of nudes that, once upon a time, my body shape was the ideal, but that's not for here.

I dearly hope that I haven't offended you by the previous statements (the sheer length probably did it), and that you take my arguments in stride. I don't negate that their is a bit of a problem, but I also think the treatment of smokers like they were pedophilic Nazis is also a bit extreme. However, there is a comfortable middle ground that can, and should, be reached by all people.

As for the second point, "There are also extreme cases where mothers would end up with eight children before they got the gender they wanted or would abort their child because they were of the wrong gender." That's a throwback to the days of Henry VIII, minus the sheer amount of divorce because back then, they thought it was the woman's fault that males weren't born. That's all I was saying, not outright attacking your point.

Again, I hope I haven't offended you and I assure you I meant no personal attack.
I don't take offense and I am aware that I am being intolerant of fat people as a whole. But NAAFA are trying to get laws so fat discrimination comes under the anti-discrimination act. I feel that this should not be allowed as while race or sex can not be helped being overweight can except in rare cases.
If this is passed it will mean that there can be no complaints over fat people using two seats or requiring larger beds and clothes in hospitals for the same price, when they will cost thin people that have no need of larger beds higher tax rates. This would be discriminating the thin for the fat whether the fat can not help it or are simply lazy.
 

Uskis

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Jaythulhu said:
To be honest, my opinion on this varies. There are a relatively large (pardon the language) group of overweight people who are so because of medical reasons, an over or underactive thyroid is usually the cause. Where I agree with the OP is people who think that eating a couple of large maccas meals for breakfast, lunch and dinner, as well as various snacks during the day.
I want to be careful around this medically obese argument. Have you got some statistics over how many are many are obese where it is not their fault? and whats the definition anyway?

Some people say. It's genetical, look how obese parents have obese kids.. That's not genetical. That's social heritage, something that can be thwarted. I don't think we should let the genetically or medically obese argument get to much space. After all. You can have an genetical likeliness to be obese, but you don't have to if you change the premises of your life.
 

Jaythulhu

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Uskis said:
Jaythulhu said:
To be honest, my opinion on this varies. There are a relatively large (pardon the language) group of overweight people who are so because of medical reasons, an over or underactive thyroid is usually the cause. Where I agree with the OP is people who think that eating a couple of large maccas meals for breakfast, lunch and dinner, as well as various snacks during the day.
I want to be careful around this medically obese argument. Have you got some statistics over how many are many are obese where it is not their fault? and whats the definition anyway?

Some people say. It's genetical, look how obese parents have obese kids.. That's not genetical. That's social heritage, something that can be thwarted. I don't think we should let the genetically or medically obese argument get to much space. After all. You can have an genetical likeliness to be obese, but you don't have to if you change the premises of your life.
Your points just further my argument. There is a definite medical link between a faulty thyroid gland and obesity/morbid obesity. Those are the only medical grounds I've heard of, so it's really all I'd accept. I've never seen any scientific reports saying that being overweight or obese is linked to genetics (I do pay attention), and science has mapped the entire human genome at this point in time.

Fat parents feeding their kids junkfood for each meals isn't genetics, as you say, it's societal heritage. Although I'd actually be reticent to say societal, and would prefer familial, since it's specific to the family in question. That's not to say that skinny parents won't have fat kids, it all depends on diet, exercise and discipline.
 

More Fun To Compute

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I don't believe that the majority of obese people can't do anything to improve their condition but there may be a minority who need help rather than abuse. In fact, I don't think that anybody really needs verbal abuse or discrimination. Telling people that it's perfectly acceptable to be morbidly obese when medical knowledge says otherwise would be stupid but is that the actual legislation that they are asking for?

Hearing about fat people not getting proper treatment because they are harder to treat and "brought it on themselves anyway" strikes me of being new puritanism of the worst kind. What's next, people with lung cancer left to die without even pain medication as they bought it on themselves.
 

Isaac Dodgson

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May 11, 2008
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More Fun To Compute said:
I don't believe that the majority of obese people can't do anything to improve their condition but there may be a minority who need help rather than abuse. In fact, I don't think that anybody really needs verbal abuse or descrimination. Telling people that it's perfectly acceptable to be morbidly obese when medical knowledge says otherwise would be stupid but is that the actual legislation that they are asking for?

Hearing about fat people not getting proper treatment because they are harder to treat and "brought it on themselves anyway" strikes me of being new puritanism of the worst kind. What's next, people with lung cancer left to die without even pain medication as they bought it on themselves.
In a nutshell it would be unlawful to discriminate like it is against race, sex, religion etc...

I can see it now, people will add the "Fat Card" to their decks along with the "Race Card" and so on...
 

orifice

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Nov 18, 2008
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People pay their money and take their choice. If someone wants to eat a diet that makes them fat, fine. If people then want special treatment, thats not so fine. Everyone should take responsibility for the choices they make and the consequences that come with with these choices.

Gender selection is immoral and should be illegal.
 

mkb07a

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Oct 11, 2008
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hypothetical fact said:
mkb07a said:
Okay... I'm just going to say, before I (hopefully) turn in for the night (now morning... damn) is that the OP comes off as... Okay. Here's the thing. I understand your point. It's aggravating for people who chose to eat six pizzas a day to then demand that someone accomodate them, rather than take responsibility for their actions. I understand that it's difficult to understand how someone can get up to a 6X shirt and not think there's a problem. I really do. I know where you're going with your argument but I still disagree because it comes off as intolerance. You don't have to accept it, but you tolerate it like you tolerate a smoker or crying infant.

I say all this because my boyfriend, at his healthiest weight, weighs 275 pounds. This was two years ago, at the peak of football season- he was working out every day, taking in a lot of protein, and was incredibly in shape. However, about a year ago he tore his meniscus (he didn't know he tore it till this past August, though), and due to the unholy amount of pain he felt had to quit the college track team he'd been on. Due to the pain (which makes it difficult for him to even walk upstairs), he was unable to continue his usual active lifestyle.

When he went to camp last summer (he's an instructor at a BSA camp for six weeks in the mountains), he weighed 330. Over the course of the summer, he lost only about ten pounds but had gained his muscle definition back. Unfortunately, nothing could be done about his meniscus (the doctor's advice was, see if the cyst in your knee goes away on its own), and once we returned here, he was back in pain (mind you, he was in pain the entire time he was at camp but the food there was... well, they didn't get enough calories for the amount of physical activity they did). As such, I'm not sure his weight now BUT we've committed to a program (together, as it helps to have a buddy and I'm female and thus hate my body) to get back to a healthier weight, and keep down his health risks.

I say all this because even if he got back down to his weight and size senior year (which... oh man, his shoulders *drool*), he'd still be twice my size and bigger than most average people. This isn't to say that every person who weighs that much (and I assure you, that's the weight he's supposed to be) got there because that's just how they are instead of sitting on the couch, playing Wii and eating cheesey-poofs, but not all people that are overweight (by your standards) are in that category, either. As such, he'd need a bigger gown in the hospital, and it's always been uncomfortable for him to sit in a standard school desk, and there's nothing he can do about it.

The reality of the situation is people in developed nations are gaining weight (Australia just beat the US as the fattest nation, so I don't want to hear it), and there will have to be accomodations that're made. Frankly, I, as a female, am saddened every day when thin models are embraced and my only solace comes from Renaissance paintings of nudes that, once upon a time, my body shape was the ideal, but that's not for here.

I dearly hope that I haven't offended you by the previous statements (the sheer length probably did it), and that you take my arguments in stride. I don't negate that there is a bit of a problem, but I also think the treatment of smokers like they were pedophilic Nazis is also a bit extreme. However, there is a comfortable middle ground that can, and should, be reached by all people.

As for the second point, "There are also extreme cases where mothers would end up with eight children before they got the gender they wanted or would abort their child because they were of the wrong gender." That's a throwback to the days of Henry VIII, minus the sheer amount of divorce because back then, they thought it was the woman's fault that males weren't born. That's all I was saying, not outright attacking your point.

Again, I hope I haven't offended you and I assure you I meant no personal attack.
I don't take offense and I am aware that I am being intolerant of fat people as a whole. But NAAFA are trying to get laws so fat discrimination comes under the anti-discrimination act. I feel that this should not be allowed as while race or sex can not be helped being overweight can except in rare cases.
If this is passed it will mean that there can be no complaints over fat people using two seats or requiring larger beds and clothes in hospitals for the same price, when they will cost thin people that have no need of larger beds higher tax rates. This would be discriminating the thin for the fat whether the fat can not help it or are simply lazy.

And I said that there is a problem, and that this is a bit much (see my smoker comment), and that a middle ground must be reached. Neither side is correct in their extremes, but that does not mean some compromise cannot be reached. Also, you gave up the point that you are being intolerant of all overweight people. Does that not lend some insight into your opinion?
 

Lord George

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We should definitely discriminate against fat people as its not like its a disease or a condition its just because there too lazy and they eat too much crap. I mean I'm a very lazy person but I still go for a run at least twice a week and spend about 3 hours weight lifting a week its not that much time out of your day to day routine.

And I know genetics can play some part in fatness but it doesn't mean they're always fat just means it will take a bit of work to lose weight, we should encourage people who try to lose weight and discriminate against those who make no effort to lose weight. If we accept fat people then everyone will get the idea that its ok to be fat when its not the case. Everyone should strive to become mentally and physically perfect
 

mooncalf

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A law will stop a person from rebuking with the hand, a law will not stop a person from rebuking with the heart.
 

O maestre

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there is a point where using "its just my nature" as an excuse. after all theese people must decide if they are human or just primates wearing clothes
 

mkb07a

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george144 said:
We should definitely discriminate against fat people as its not like its a disease or a condition its just because there too lazy and they eat too much crap. I mean I'm a very lazy person but I still go for a run at least twice a week and spend about 3 hours weight lifting a week its not that much time out of your day to day routine.

And I know genetics can play some part in fatness but it doesn't mean they're always fat just means it will take a bit of work to lose weight, we should encourage people who try to lose weight and discriminate against those who make no effort to lose weight. If we accept fat people then everyone will get the idea that its ok to be fat when its not the case. Everyone should strive to become mentally and physically perfect
You can't be serious. I'm sorry, but that is quite the terrible generalization. And striving for physical perfection? I'm sorry again, that you didn't just hear my voice go up six octaves in rage repeating that.