I asked an theist this and didn't get an answer. Can you help?

[Abedeus]

If God IS real...which one is it? Personally I'm hoping for the Norse religon to be right...roll on Valhalla!

Yeah. As Christian I am and my family is, I often wonder - what if Allah is real, and our God isn't? Or what if Ganesh/other Hindu gods are the real ones? We'll all go to hell.

Do Hindu's even have a hell? Allah is the same God as the Christian one btw, you'd just be told off for worshipping him wrong/using outdated rules.

--

OP - Your opening post, to me, reads as 'Do Atheists think you need to believe in a God, and don't say no'. It just looks kind of self-defeating. It's like asking a guy with one arm 'Do you need 2 arms to survive?'...

Okay, Hindu's don't have hell. Then what happens when we die? We return as bugs? Animals? And if we worship Allah the wrong way, we still go to hell.

 

[ThreeWords]

Christians are theists as well...

...monotheists to be more precise...

I always found that slight amusing, where Christians insist that the God they believe in is both one single God, and at the same time, three separate beings, all of whom are no less than the one single God

The idea just doesn't work. Here it is in algebra

1 God = 3 Gods
(divide by God)
1 =/= 3

or

God/3 = God
(divide by God)
1/3 =/= 1

I believe its called 'reducto ad absurdum', or proof by contradiction. The idea put forward leads to something that cannot happen, therefore the first idea also cannot happen.

Er...

Replace 'God' by "infinity" and you will find that the math works fine.

i.e. infinity divided by any number smaller than infinity is still infinity.

As we have all been told... 'God is infinite'

QED

Touche =D
Well said

However, infinity is not a real number. It only exists theoretically for the purpose of wierd and wonderful advanced calculations. It is no more than an abstract, and in the real world, cannot exist. Are 'God' and 'infinity' still interchangeable?

For the record, I'm not against God, but I like to have a hack at things.
Like testing for weak points in an idea to improve the greater whole.

Actually, I never said God was real.

"However, God is not a real thing. God only exists theologically for the purpose of weird and wonderful advanced metaphysics. God is no more than an abstract (existing in thought or as an idea, but not having a physical or concrete existence - hence a metaphysical existence), and does not exist in tangible reality. So 'God' and 'infinity' are still harmonious concepts."

By the way, I am a devout Atheist.

And I, on the other hand, am a free-lance theist

Are you sure we're arguing the right sides here?

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

It depends

Belief in God isn't necessary for its existence, but belief in God may help to give you a moral grounding on which to base further beliefs.

If you can do that without belief, then no, you don't.

You may, of course, choose to. Which defeats the whole idea of logical arguments.

 

[s-l-u-g]

Wait hold on who were you asking? A atheist or a theist, i.e. A Muslim.

AN atheist? or A theist?

 

[thedelightfulme]

Nobody needs to believe in anything really.

Do they?

Nope. Things that exist go on existing irrespective of human belief in them, things that don't exist don't.

Hurray! I can finally stop believing in oxygen.

LOL. The game is up for oxygen.

 

[iJosh]

I just lol'd

 

[shadowstriker86]

I love messing with atheists. This is a great question i ask them and it always turns out like this:

M = Me
A = Atheist


M = So you dont believe in God right?

A = Any deity / Nope

M = Well, do you know what gravity is?

A = Yes / Ya, so what?

M = So you believe that gravity exists?

A = Yes / Ya, so what?

M = So can you see gravity?

A = No.

M = So you believe in a higher source of power that you can't see?

A = .....


lmao it never gets old for me

 

[Danzaivar]

If God IS real...which one is it? Personally I'm hoping for the Norse religon to be right...roll on Valhalla!

Yeah. As Christian I am and my family is, I often wonder - what if Allah is real, and our God isn't? Or what if Ganesh/other Hindu gods are the real ones? We'll all go to hell.

Do Hindu's even have a hell? Allah is the same God as the Christian one btw, you'd just be told off for worshipping him wrong/using outdated rules.

--

OP - Your opening post, to me, reads as 'Do Atheists think you need to believe in a God, and don't say no'. It just looks kind of self-defeating. It's like asking a guy with one arm 'Do you need 2 arms to survive?'...

Okay, Hindu's don't have hell. Then what happens when we die? We return as bugs? Animals? And if we worship Allah the wrong way, we still go to hell.

Yeah I think they believe in re-incarnation, a lot of their stuff is cyclical whereas heaven/hell is a very definite 'end'.

On the Islam thing - Yeah that's true, but you'd probably go to a 'nicer' spot than a heretic would...that counts for something right?

The whole thing paints the Abrahamic God as really really mean/petty, imo. Spend your life time worshipping him and spreading his word, but even then theres a 66% chance you're preaching the wrong 'version' of his word. Heck it's probably higher than that, do Protestents go to Hell in the catholic version? Anglicans think Baptists go to Hell?

People taking this stuff seriously, and thinking they're practising the 'right version' with such absolute conviction is completely beyond me.

 

[Danzaivar]

M = So you believe in a higher source of power that you can't see?

A = .....


lmao it never gets old for me

You can measure and quantify gravity, you can explain it and (If the LHC returns positive results we'll understand why it happens). You can also physically feel it's effects.

God on the other hand is a selective force that's inherently un-explainable, can't be measures or quantified AND his effects can often be explained with simpler natural occurances. Comparing it to gravity is the most ridiculous comparison I've heard since school, thanks for that.

By your argument, sound proves God exists (We believe sound exists, but i've never 'seen' sound).

 

[thedelightfulme]

I love messing with atheists. This is a great question i ask them and it always turns out like this:

M = Me
A = Atheist


M = So you dont believe in God right?

A = Any deity / Nope

M = Well, do you know what gravity is?

A = Yes / Ya, so what?

M = So you believe that gravity exists?

A = Yes / Ya, so what?

M = So can you see gravity?

A = No.

M = So you believe in a higher source of power that you can't see?

A = .....


lmao it never gets old for me

You can FEEL gravity. It is the effect of a large mass. Its proven. Science has proven gravity exists. Its a power you cant see, like the wind (which is caused by different temperature air flows rising and falling). I cant see that, but i know its real. If your basis for believing in a God is purely because no one has proved he hasnt...then this will end up being a gigantic circle. And totally pointless. You can not say something exists because it has not been proved other wise, like you cant say it does exist. It will merely hang there and drive you crazy.

 

[Skeleon]

Especially if you think about the many thousands of years humanity has existed and prayed to different deities before the Abrahamic god. I mean, come on, how are we to know the ancient Egyptians didn't have it "right"? Or the Greeks? Or whoever?
It is, after all, belief, not fact.

 

[Uncompetative]

Christians are theists as well...

...monotheists to be more precise...

I always found that slight amusing, where Christians insist that the God they believe in is both one single God, and at the same time, three separate beings, all of whom are no less than the one single God

The idea just doesn't work. Here it is in algebra

1 God = 3 Gods
(divide by God)
1 =/= 3

or

God/3 = God
(divide by God)
1/3 =/= 1

I believe its called 'reducto ad absurdum', or proof by contradiction. The idea put forward leads to something that cannot happen, therefore the first idea also cannot happen.

Er...

Replace 'God' by "infinity" and you will find that the math works fine.

i.e. infinity divided by any number smaller than infinity is still infinity.

As we have all been told... 'God is infinite'

QED

Touche =D
Well said

However, infinity is not a real number. It only exists theoretically for the purpose of wierd and wonderful advanced calculations. It is no more than an abstract, and in the real world, cannot exist. Are 'God' and 'infinity' still interchangeable?

For the record, I'm not against God, but I like to have a hack at things.
Like testing for weak points in an idea to improve the greater whole.

Actually, I never said God was real.

"However, God is not a real thing. God only exists theologically for the purpose of weird and wonderful advanced metaphysics. God is no more than an abstract (existing in thought or as an idea, but not having a physical or concrete existence - hence a metaphysical existence), and does not exist in tangible reality. So 'God' and 'infinity' are still harmonious concepts."

By the way, I am a devout Atheist.

And I, on the other hand, am a free-lance theist

Are you sure we're arguing the right sides here?

I'm not sure about anything. That's why I'm more likely to be right...

 

[shadowstriker86]

I love messing with atheists. This is a great question i ask them and it always turns out like this:

M = Me
A = Atheist


M = So you dont believe in God right?

A = Any deity / Nope

M = Well, do you know what gravity is?

A = Yes / Ya, so what?

M = So you believe that gravity exists?

A = Yes / Ya, so what?

M = So can you see gravity?

A = No.

M = So you believe in a higher source of power that you can't see?

A = .....


lmao it never gets old for me

You can FEEL gravity. It is the effect of a large mass. Its proven. Science has proven gravity exists. Its a power you cant see, like the wind (which is caused by different temperature air flows rising and falling). I cant see that, but i know its real. If your basis for believing in a God is purely because no one has proved he hasnt...then this will end up being a gigantic circle. And totally pointless. You can not say something exists because it has not been proved other wise, like you cant say it does exist. It will merely hang there and drive you crazy.

my basis for believing in God is because of the physical and historical evidence. Plus in the fact that even though science is one of my favorite subjects, has failed to give me a proper alternitive to creationism aside from Albert Einstein when he said "when we die, we return to the source from which our energy comes from" or at least i think it was him who said it, but that still implies intelligent design. Furthermore, one of the biggest atheists/anti-creationists Richard Dawkins admitted that to a small degree he believes in intelligent design, so that kind of puts a large dent into atheism when one of its biggest advocates says somthing like that

 

[Aptspire]

There is never any need to believe in God
im a satanist

 

[ThreeWords]

Christians are theists as well...

...monotheists to be more precise...

I always found that slight amusing, where Christians insist that the God they believe in is both one single God, and at the same time, three separate beings, all of whom are no less than the one single God

The idea just doesn't work. Here it is in algebra

1 God = 3 Gods
(divide by God)
1 =/= 3

or

God/3 = God
(divide by God)
1/3 =/= 1

I believe its called 'reducto ad absurdum', or proof by contradiction. The idea put forward leads to something that cannot happen, therefore the first idea also cannot happen.

Er...

Replace 'God' by "infinity" and you will find that the math works fine.

i.e. infinity divided by any number smaller than infinity is still infinity.

As we have all been told... 'God is infinite'

QED

Touche =D
Well said

However, infinity is not a real number. It only exists theoretically for the purpose of wierd and wonderful advanced calculations. It is no more than an abstract, and in the real world, cannot exist. Are 'God' and 'infinity' still interchangeable?

For the record, I'm not against God, but I like to have a hack at things.
Like testing for weak points in an idea to improve the greater whole.

Actually, I never said God was real.

"However, God is not a real thing. God only exists theologically for the purpose of weird and wonderful advanced metaphysics. God is no more than an abstract (existing in thought or as an idea, but not having a physical or concrete existence - hence a metaphysical existence), and does not exist in tangible reality. So 'God' and 'infinity' are still harmonious concepts."

By the way, I am a devout Atheist.

And I, on the other hand, am a free-lance theist

Are you sure we're arguing the right sides here?

I'm not sure about anything. That's why I'm more likely to be right...

But that makes you an Agnostic, unless you believe for certain that there is no God

 

[GloatingSwine]

I don't particularly think God gives a shit if people believe in him or not, I'm incredibly religious but I really don't see how people believing, praying or devoting their lives to him could help an omnipotent being in anyway...

Three out of his ten commandments were specifically about believing in Him and only Him. It's a fairly major part of his schtick.

 

[Skeleon]

my basis for believing in God is because of the physical and historical evidence.

Care to elaborate?
Also, I never heard of that Dawkins quote you're refering to.

 

[Danzaivar]

my basis for believing in God is because of the physical and historical evidence. Plus in the fact that even though science is one of my favorite subjects, has failed to give me a proper alternitive to creationism aside from Albert Einstein when he said "when we die, we return to the source from which our energy comes from" or at least i think it was him who said it, but that still implies intelligent design. Furthermore, one of the biggest atheists/anti-creationists Richard Dawkins admitted that to a small degree he believes in intelligent design, so that kind of puts a large dent into atheism when one of its biggest advocates says somthing like that

Einstein probably meant the Universe in general, when you die your body becomes 'stuff' that cycles back in to plant life and such.

Dawkins - God knows, he's a militant atheist so I'd wager he was either being sarcastic or something. A scientist believing in God isn't as damaging as a priest not believing. Why? Because the scientist won't try to teach you morality based off of what they do or don't believe.