I dont get why these people do it... i never do...

[kazikian]

Nah, Lullabye here has it down. He's has come to show us the opposite end of the spectrum; get your coping skill and stick with it. Even if your coping skill does cause you to hate your fellow man... well whateva gets you through the night (is alright).

Suicide avoidance tip 6: get a fucking coping skill, stat.

 

[kazikian]

Heh, I had existential depression like mad. You know what cures it? Ulcerative colitis [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulcerative_colitis]

 

[TheBlobThing]

It's a tragedy when a kid offs himself, whatever the circumstances. That someone feels there is no other way out might be stupid, or fucked up, but the fact that they are at that stage is a tragedy nonetheless.

Hormones really mess people up sometimes.

Yes, as evidenced by Lullabye's "internet-tough-guy" attitude.

 

[Sion_Barzahd]

[quote="enzilewulf" post="18.155812.3815381a kid with straight A's and a better family than mine[/quote]

Sorry but i had an issue with that line. I mean who is to say that these things will make you happy? Its like when celebrities kill themselves, people say "But they were famous and had all that money."

Back to the actual topic. I think that sometimes people don't know how to handle their emotions. Takes a lot to kill yourself after all.

 

[oppp7]

I remember when my homeroom teahcer killed himself. I may or may not have thought the whole thing was hilarious. I'm pretty sure my way of dealing with death is hilarity. But I guess that wouldn't work for you because everyone has a different reaction.

 

[oppp7]

Maybe the kid thought that killing himself he would be able to rest and get away from life, probably. He killed himself just to get girl scarred for life I bet, shoot yourself to get back at someone sounds like stupidest idea ever. Also if your spoiled enough it is hard to understand why life isn't perfect or way you want it and you blame people for it.

That's what I do!
OT: Why do people have so much trouble communicating that they're depressed?

 

[ctrl-alt-postal]

Mabye he believed in an afterlife? To leave behind this frail vessel can seem appealing in the context of certain religious outlooks.

That, however, does not address the problem in general.

Our society (the west) is flooded with dysfunctions at present, we have war, flu and economic instabilities constantly reminding us that this world is DANGEROUS. Along with the increase in suicide is also an increase in incidents of random shootings and the like. This constant state of fear takes its toll, not to mention the slow attrition of nutrients from food or neurological effects of chemicals such as nutrasweet (some anti-depressants list suicidal thoughts as a side-effect!!).

An excess of stimulation, especially if in the form of contradictory messages about reality, can cause trans-marginal inhibition, which was first scientifically investigated (to my knowledge) by pavlov. The over-stimulated dogs responded by either shutting down or going psychotic.

I am hypothesizing here that suicide in cases involving relationships can have this underlying social stress as a factor in lowering reasonable thought structures, then something acts as a catalyst, whether it be an imagined paranoia or real event that needs to be discussed. If guilt is involved then suicide is a more dominant option, as opposed to offence taken which can lead to a more homocidal inclination. The lowered ability to reason combined with emotional stress can also lead to heightened neurotransmitters which in nature serve us to deal with danger, but in this case lead to a clarity of mind which, while being able to reason well in terms of planning (where to get a weapon, driving, ect.), totally lacks any real conscious appraisal of the situation. This state becomes, then, quite literally insane (and unstable...how many murder suicides have been in the news this year?)

I didn't realise how much I just wrote....
Anyways, hope that wasn't to much of a ramble & some-one got somethin' useful out of it....

 

[ma55ter_fett]

They are takeing themselves out of the genepool and future generations are better for it.

 

[BaldursBananaSoap]

Ah well, at least he's in a better place. Hell.

 

[Bat Vader]

hahahahahahahaahhahahahaha.......oh thanks for the laugh, I was feeling so down I was about to kill myself. Gotta love people. Means more cake for me in the end.

So here is a question. If you killed yourself would you be laughing?

I find it silly for people to kill themselves over relationships. If it is for a cause like saving someone then I see it differently.

Trick question. only if there's an afterlife.

It wasn't a trick question. You laugh about people committing suicide so I am asking would you laugh at yourself as you committed suicide?

 

[Silver]

*Snip*

Finally, someone in this thread who has some idea of what the fuck they're talking about.

Just glad someone read it. Thanks.

*Snip*

Yeah, a breath of wisdom and insight amidst a not as intelligent as usual conversation.

You too. Thanks.

There's no good reason. He was either emotionally unstable (And I mean really unstable. Standard teenage emotional instability doesn't even come close.) or medically insane. Because there's absolutely no good reason to kill yourself. Period.

*Snip*

*Snip*

Ah, I see... So the implication is that you're a misunderstood genius?

We ALL have a moment where we realize our insignificance in relation to the world, society and our peers. We all feel the pressures to settle for a life of mediocrity, the cruel reality which states that for every one who reaches their star, a hundred more go bowling on Saturdays with the guys, settling for a fat wife and comfortable, boring job.

Some people can't handle that idea. Others man up and do something about it. Now, if somebody took their life for the reasons I mentioned, I understand and sympathize. If somebody took their life because they couldn't stand the idea of maybe not realizing their dreams or because they suddenly noticed they were small in relation to the world, then I understand but cannot respect them.

The difference is that some people know for a fact that they are able to do much more, if they just had access to more resources, or were listened to, and it has nothing to do with arrogance.

It's one thing to realise you're going to live a mediocre life, and being unable to do anything about it because what you do doesn't matter. It's entirely another matter to realise you're going to be forced to live a mediocre life, and being unable to do anything about it because no one will listen to what you say, or understand what you propose.

It's not always due to misunderstood genius, sometimes it's due to delusions of grandeur. But the same issue comes up when watching a documentary about some genius children in some super school, or some genius who changed the world. Most people will be jealous of their abilities. These people are instead furious that they never got a change to attend such a school. Yes, it's implied that I count myself among them, less so than I used to, because I've begun to accept that a lot of other people will have to suffer for it, but it's not my responsability to improve the world, at least not until the world asks me to, or is willing to accept it when I offer.

 

[Fraeir]

If they are a teenager, I suspect there is an underlying problem, such as shockingly low self-esteem or crippling shyness that stops them from talking about it or seeing that there are more fish in the sea.

Guess I should be happy my shockingly low self-esteem and crippling shyness had until January 2008 (when I was 19.5 years old) kept me from even really even -talking- to girls for real then 8D If you ain't got those, I'm surprised you can even find one girl and have the balls to ask her out...

Nowadays I'm like halfway to 22 and... still have to find a girlfriend XD

Oh well, I'm not gonna actively look for one *Glares at party-people and shivers*

 

[Ghengis_tron]

There's no good reason. He was either emotionally unstable (And I mean really unstable. Standard teenage emotional instability doesn't even come close.) or medically insane. Because there's absolutely no good reason to kill yourself. Period.

It's more comfortable for us to use those excuses, but that's all they are.

The truth of the matter is that either the guy had some sort of chemical deficiency (it's amazing how many times "depression" and "mental instability" really just come down to a lack of seratonin or some such) or a series of events which shaped his character to such a degree that he felt his life was without worth. In those cases, it's never just one thing. Maybe there was a history of abuse in his family? Just a guess.

I've heard our society today has something like the highest suicide rate in history among young people (can't remember where I heard that), so there might be societal contributors.

Not all depressions are caused by chemical imbalances. Things like existential depression [http://www.sengifted.org/articles_counseling/Webb_ExistentialDepressionInGiftedIndividuals.shtml] can cause often gifted children to commit suicide. Most people wouldn't understand it, but it usuay stems from the discovery of finally realising that there is no particular reason you are alive, any preconceptions of invulnerability are completely destroyed. The despair that a frustrated young genius might go through would feel ten times worse than normal. I know this because I am prone to bouts of existential depression and have often thought about suicide simply because it seems more interesting than living a life of debt, mediocre job, mediocre family and a generl mediocre existence. It kinda makes you think what's the point in even going through the motions... All your current problems, be it money or girlfriends or family tend to seem much worse than they are.

So in the case of this straight A boy, my guess is he was existentially depressed... Poor kid.

But unfortunately unless you've been in his situation you will never understand why he took his own life... But I can.

I know this all too well, been dealing with it since I was about 12-13.

 

[Yumi_and_Erea]

I don't want to turn this into some kind of political rant about everything that's wrong with society so I'll be brief:

Society has become increasingly shallow, materialistic, pathetic and whiny over the years.

You mentioned that this is kid was doing great in most parts of his life and that's just the thing: people can't accept the fact anymore that life isn't always fair.
They expect to get what they want, when they want it.

I'd call it "a sad commentary on society" if I was feeling polite and "natural selection" if I wasn't.

 

[chronobreak]

Everyone has the right to exit this world whenever they see fit. Why should everybody have to wait around until they are old and crippled? And then the whole selfish argument... I don't buy it. We're all going to croak sometime, people better get it through their heads that everyone they love will not be around at some point. Just because it comes earlier then some people would like does not make that person selfish, in fact, I would say it makes that person's friends and peers the selfish ones, wanting them to stay around longer just for them.

It can be a terrible thing to look at someone so young and have to spend the rest of your life wondering why they took their own life, but you never fully know that persons frame of mind of motivations, or if that person was just simply done living. For some people, I am sure it would be much better to be dead than to live a life of misery.

I also don't think suicide is cowardly at all. It takes balls to put a gun to your head and pull the trigger.

This is not meant to offend anyone, I have lost a friend myself who decided to hang himself one day, seemingly totally out of the blue. But who am I to say he was wrong in doing that, or that it wasn't the right decision for him, or that he didn't think it through?

 

[Lullabye]

hahahahahahahaahhahahahaha.......oh thanks for the laugh, I was feeling so down I was about to kill myself. Gotta love people. Means more cake for me in the end.

So here is a question. If you killed yourself would you be laughing?

I find it silly for people to kill themselves over relationships. If it is for a cause like saving someone then I see it differently.

Trick question. only if there's an afterlife.

It wasn't a trick question. You laugh about people committing suicide so I am asking would you laugh at yourself as you committed suicide?

oh. well that depends on how I kill myself. I cant really laugh if cut my throat or drown. But leading up to the moment before, maybe not. it depends on the situation. if i was gonna suicide bomb a mall or something, then yes, I would be laughing maniacally up till i sploded.

 

[Samurai Goomba]

The difference is that some people know for a fact that they are able to do much more, if they just had access to more resources, or were listened to, and it has nothing to do with arrogance.

It's one thing to realise you're going to live a mediocre life, and being unable to do anything about it because what you do doesn't matter. It's entirely another matter to realise you're going to be forced to live a mediocre life, and being unable to do anything about it because no one will listen to what you say, or understand what you propose.

It's not always due to misunderstood genius, sometimes it's due to delusions of grandeur. But the same issue comes up when watching a documentary about some genius children in some super school, or some genius who changed the world. Most people will be jealous of their abilities. These people are instead furious that they never got a change to attend such a school. Yes, it's implied that I count myself among them, less so than I used to, because I've begun to accept that a lot of other people will have to suffer for it, but it's not my responsability to improve the world, at least not until the world asks me to, or is willing to accept it when I offer.

"You are not a unique and beautiful snowflake."

Everyone is a genius in their own minds. Everyone considers themselves misunderstood. Everybody is looking for their place in life. Nobody wants to think the world could get by just find without them, or that they will be forgotten shortly after their death.

Like somebody else said, our society glorifies shallow, self-centered morons. That's why I think so many young adults deal with existential problems like this: because up 'till now, they HONESTLY THOUGHT the world revolved around them, and all their dreams would come true (usually meaning they would get whatever they wanted).

I can't really feel sympathetic if somebody kills themselves because they feel humanity is conspiring to "keep them down."

 

[Raven's Nest]

Ah, I see... So the implication is that you're a misunderstood genius?

We ALL have a moment where we realize our insignificance in relation to the world, society and our peers. We all feel the pressures to settle for a life of mediocrity, the cruel reality which states that for every one who reaches their star, a hundred more go bowling on Saturdays with the guys, settling for a fat wife and comfortable, boring job.

Some people can't handle that idea. Others man up and do something about it. Now, if somebody took their life for the reasons I mentioned, I understand and sympathize. If somebody took their life because they couldn't stand the idea of maybe not realizing their dreams or because they suddenly noticed they were small in relation to the world, then I understand but cannot respect them.

Not so much misunderstood genius, just one that hasn't found a use to apply his ingenuity.

I wouldn't be so sure that we all feel that 'moment' as strongly as eachother, if indeed at all. I think it becomes more problematic to people who believe they have a purpose in life but are struggling to find it. One in that position might become frustrated with the social norms of aspiring to the 'american dream' ethos of living. It's also a condition which can affect inherent idealists and perfectionists too. When one spends too long trying to discover their purpose hoping it will offer them some kind of direction in life, one usually becomes distressingly aware that there isn't one. Now if you've been described as intelligently gifted, this realization can often hit much deeper than your average person. One by one certain 'givens' slip away as they observe and gain a truer perception of the nature of the world. From violence to wars, racism, greed, apathetic ignorance. These are all things that stem from people. People like you and me are the reason evil exists, not gods or devils or corporations or the media. We become those things, it is our will that dominates countries, not a faceless governmental administration. The shocking realisation that it is our choice to live that kind of life or not can really fuck with one's head especially when they couldn't even find a direction to begin with. When one realizes the importance of such choices, that can make every choice so much harder to make. With no sense of purpose these choices can become unbearable.

One day it'll seem like you are breezing through life thinking the future's bright and the next day you may suddenly realise the 'light' hasn't actually been switched on... Yet. Now for most people when they reach this position, the 'yet' part, is the part they set about fixing. This gives them drive and focus, and if their commited enough, they'll find a way to switch it on.

However those that can't, are the ones thinking, "I don't know where the switch is", or have any electricity, or bulbs. Life for them, becomes one long, dark, confusing road, where the roadsigns are all jumbled up, in an untelligible language and have fragments missing. Are you beginning to see the problem?

Now for the most part people that reach this stage often turn to religion, or some other cult group offering them a 'path' or a 'home'. Some of these people will fit right in, others will do it because they know they have to force themselves to believe in something. As this is the only thing that can prevent them from reaching the next "stage"...

The stage where people do some incredibly stupid things...

Unfortunately some never find the light, and can often take drastic measures to escape the endless wondering. The saddest part is that many kids with this condition end up taking their lives because they simply can't think there is anywhere else to turn. Until you share in their dread, you may never understand why they feel that way...

Anyway that applies only to the genuine ones, think what you will of anybody else. I'm only trying to convince you of the tragicness of these particular sufferers.

I can't really feel sympathetic if somebody kills themselves because they feel humanity is conspiring to "keep them down."

If someone feels that much paranoia from something which is beyond their control I would argue that it is somewhat justified that they would feel that way. I know you're trying to understand, or at least entertaining the notion but I really feel this just comes down to your ability to empathize with people.

"feeling the weight of the world on your shoulders", it's such a throw-away term but can you not actually imagine what it would be like if this was meant in a very literal fashion? This is what people like us suffer. We can't help but be narcissistic like that. Just as an Alzheimer's patient can't help having Alzheimer's disease.