I have a hard on for Okami

[Maximum Bert]

Love Okami have finished it 3 times over the years which is a lot for a single game for me as I usually dont bother to replay games of that length again due to there always being new games out.

There was just not much I did not like about it from the art style to the way you used powers to the dungeon designs and the overworld to the way it infused itself with Japanese mythology it was and is just a beautiful game I just enjoyed going forward wondering what new stuff was around the corner.

I have just been replaying the PS2 original but it seems its coming out on PS4 now for cheap so I may pick that version up just incase my PS2 packs in.

Still looks great on PS2 though the art style used means it doesnt really show its age beyond being a bit low rez. It really did give me Zelda vibes when playing but for me it did Zelda a lot better than Zelda did which is about as high praise as I can give it.

 

[Drathnoxis]

I like how a discussion about Okami has turned into a discussion about the best Zelda.

You can create a thread, but where it goes is out of your hands.

Well OP was the first one to get Zelda involved. It's his own fault, really.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

The fans want the same formula and tone over and over. This is why we can't have nice things.

I actually liked Adventure of Link, a lot. It's interesting to note as one of the first action-RPGs, if nothing else. The design of the temples and the overworld can be a little annoying at times, and some of the enemies are a real pain to fight like the guys who throw unblockable projectiles, but overall it's a neat game.

And despite it coming out before there was a set 'formula', people now call it an aberration...

 

[Signa]

I like how a discussion about Okami has turned into a discussion about the best Zelda.

You can create a thread, but where it goes is out of your hands.

Well OP was the first one to get Zelda involved. It's his own fault, really.

Well, I'm not the ones that started shitting on both IPs, or pretending to have played the Steam version long enough to hate it before it's even released.

 

[Signa]

A few seconds of footage darker/eerier than Ocarina and MM... Yeah, sure.

I can't speak for much of Ocarina, but Majora's Mask is dark in its underlying philosophy.
"You can help these people, but as soon as you go back, they'll go back to being sad, and there's nothing you can do."
"Every time you go back in time, you've left the world to die, because you couldn't save it."
"This person can't be helped. The only way you can 'heal' them is to offer them a peaceful death."

Yeah, as dark as protagonist murder is, when the entire world is built around darkness, that's another matter.

Totally. Sad people like the OP call it not a Zelda game, but "Groundhog Day: The Game." The fans want the same formula and tone over and over. This is why we can't have nice things.

Hey! I didn't say MM was a bad game, just that it didn't follow the formula, so it doesn't get a spot in the Greater Than / Less Than comparison I have to make with at least 5 completely different games.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

Hey! I didn't say MM was a bad game, just that it didn't follow the formula, so it doesn't get a spot in the Greater Than / Less Than comparison I have to make with at least 5 completely different games.

Even if a game doesn't follow a series formula, it can still be considered for that series' best or worst. Just because Super Mario 3D Land has straight-line courses in 3D doesn't mean it can't be compared to either the original or 64.

 

[Signa]

A few seconds of footage darker/eerier than Ocarina and MM... Yeah, sure.

I can't speak for much of Ocarina, but Majora's Mask is dark in its underlying philosophy.
"You can help these people, but as soon as you go back, they'll go back to being sad, and there's nothing you can do."
"Every time you go back in time, you've left the world to die, because you couldn't save it."
"This person can't be helped. The only way you can 'heal' them is to offer them a peaceful death."

Yeah, as dark as protagonist murder is, when the entire world is built around darkness, that's another matter.

Totally. Sad people like the OP call it not a Zelda game, but "Groundhog Day: The Game." The fans want the same formula and tone over and over. This is why we can't have nice things.

Hey! I didn't say MM was a bad game, just that it didn't follow the formula, so it doesn't get a spot in the Greater Than / Less Than comparison I have to make with at least 5 completely different games.

How is that a valid point? If something is different but better... it's better! Why do you think so many people are unhappy now with The Force Awakens? It's too derivative and safe. Change is good. Still, it is VERY MUCH a Zelda game. It's more of a Zelda game than Okami, so I don't know what you're babbling about, calling Okami the best Zelda while saying Majora's Mask isn't really a Zelda game. Your logic, no sense.

When you aren't following the formula, then it gets compared to games within its own series. MM may be the best Link protagonist game (Not sure if I agree because having only 4 dungeons is bullshit. MAJOR point loss right there), but because it falls outside of the formula, it's not a "Zelda" game. Would be it better to you if I came up with another term for the formula? We have "Metroidvania" for a similar type of game.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

When you aren't following the formula, then it gets compared to games within its own series. MM may be the best Link protagonist game (Not sure if I agree because having only 4 dungeons is bullshit. MAJOR point loss right there), but because it falls outside of the formula, it's not a "Zelda" game. Would be it better to you if I came up with another term for the formula? We have "Metroidvania" for a similar type of game.

Emphasis mine. Contradiction, yours.

Pick one. Is Majora's Mask a Zelda game or not?

 

[RaikuFA]

Well this thread escalated quickly. The pretentiousness meter is going through the roof.

 

[maninahat]

I tried it once.

It was terrible.

The intro was 23 motherfucking minutes of unskippable cutscene during which it repeated the same damn story twice for no apparent reason and sat me through an eternity of sloooooowly scrolling unskippable text accompanied by jibberish dialogue.

Got through all that to be greeted with the kind of nothing-special gameplay I would expect from a random $15 game on Steam.

Uninstalled it in disgust.

Understandable response. I veered between being delighted by the painterly style and inking mechanics, and utterly disgusted by the permanent training wheels and cacophonous jabbering that never lets up.

 

[Zhukov]

[snip]

Well, aren't you special.

Special enough to construct a coherent point instead of spouting empty snark apparently.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

[snip]

Well, aren't you special.

Special enough to construct a coherent point instead of spouting empty snark apparently.

Alright then. Coherent, non-snarky version: I think you're exaggerating a little when you say 'disgust'.

 

[Raggedstar]

*rushes into Okami thread* Aw yeee, best Zel-..oh...ohhhh...we have a Zelda debate happening. I'll step away from that side of the thread.

...

It may be long-winded (with unskippable cutscenes in the original). It may chug on a PS2. It may have terrible pacing at times (particularly at the start). It may hand-hold you too much. However, for all it's many faults, it's my favourite game. I dunno how to describe it well, but I just think it has a lot of love put into it, and the game oozes so much charm and heart. Okami was one of the first games I bought when I got back into gaming about 10 years ago, and it hit me hard, so I guess that's why it means so much to me and why I can't say something simple like "Ya, it's pretty and stuff and you can poop on demons".

Also, with the game being ported to PC, it allows me to force this game onto my friend just in time for Christmas :3 (pending it has a decent port job with workable mouse/keyboard controls)

 

[Signa]

When you aren't following the formula, then it gets compared to games within its own series. MM may be the best Link protagonist game (Not sure if I agree because having only 4 dungeons is bullshit. MAJOR point loss right there), but because it falls outside of the formula, it's not a "Zelda" game. Would be it better to you if I came up with another term for the formula? We have "Metroidvania" for a similar type of game.

Emphasis mine. Contradiction, yours.

Pick one. Is Majora's Mask a Zelda game or not?

Bolded the part that was the main point of the post. I'm referring to Zelda both as a series and a genre. Okami is the best Zelda genre. Majora's Mask is (arguably) the best Zelda series.

 

[Zhukov]

Alright then. Coherent, non-snarky version: I think you're exaggerating a little when you say 'disgust'.

Nope.

I am in the habit of choosing my words rather carefully.

After sitting through 23 minutes of unskippable cutscene that told the same story twice and equally unskippable text that scrolled at a snail's pace I think disgust, "a feeling of revulsion or strong disapproval", perfectly described my state of mind as I hit the uninstall button.

 

[Silvanus]

After sitting through 23 minutes of unskippable cutscene that told the same story twice and equally unskippable text that scrolled at a snail's pace I think disgust, "a feeling of revulsion or strong disapproval", perfectly described my state of mind as I hit the uninstall button.

Amazing. You must be gut-wrenchingly horrified if somebody fails to thank you for holding a door, or utterly mortified if someone moves the remote control.

Not sure if I could operate with such extreme emotional response to mild inconvenience.

I'm referring to Zelda both as a series and a genre.

Well don't, because it's factually incorrect. Zelda is not a genre.

Okami is the best Zelda genre. Majora's Mask is (arguably) the best Zelda series

This doesn't make sense, quite literally. A single game cannot be a series by definition.

 

[Zhukov]

After sitting through 23 minutes of unskippable cutscene that told the same story twice and equally unskippable text that scrolled at a snail's pace I think disgust, "a feeling of revulsion or strong disapproval", perfectly described my state of mind as I hit the uninstall button.

Amazing. You must be gut-wrenchingly horrified if somebody fails to thank you for holding a door, or utterly mortified if someone moves the remote control.

Not sure if I could operate with such extreme emotional response to mild inconvenience.

Nah.

I don't particularly expect to be thanked for holding doors open and I've never owned a remote control.

Also, I personally wouldn't consider "revulsion or strong disapproval" to be on par with "gut-wrenching horror" or "utter mortification". Your mileage may vary I suppose.