Im 22 and still not laid (starting to get anxious)

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Baby Tea

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Sep 18, 2008
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SikOseph said:
Your argument assumes your proposition - that sex is a gift. How do you distinguish between giving the gift (to adopt your terms) of your humour and giving the gift of your sex? It can't be on the basis that they take something physical away with them, and arguably giving someone an enlightening thought is at least as much of a gift as having sex with them for the nth time. I would certainly argue that sharing emotions puts one in a much more vulnerable state than having sex, because it can put out your innermost secrets and insecurities and leave you open to rejection, disagreement, and even scorn.
The distinguishing difference between a shared joke, and a shared sexual encounter, is the intimacy involved in the sex. Where humor is enjoyed and experienced in all facets of life and between many people, I see sex as a personal, intimate, and private experience. They could both be classified as gifts, certainly, but one cannot deny the the weight that sex carried.
If a man cheats on his wife sexually with someone else, and this causes an end to the marriage, it's because there is a trust, a bond that is broken. My wife certainly wouldn't be mad if I shared a word, a joke, or a cry with another woman, but if I had sex with another woman, she'd be devastated. Why? Because it's a deep, continuous connection.
And while a sharing emotions can certainly leave you vulnerable, as you suggest, sex offers a vulnerability that goes beyond mere words. Look at the previous example of a man and woman in a relationship: How much trust is there in each other? How vulnerable are they both to the lustful desires of the other? Should the man, or the woman, selfishly lust after another, the other is vulnerable, without defense, to the pain and hurt caused.
 

ace_of_something

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Abengoshis said:
ace_of_something said:
Knew about 100 girls who were like that. They changed as soon as they hit college or were a bit older. It's an excuse for being scared or not ready. (Which are fine reasons on their own and don't need an excuse)
No, it's not an excuse, it's a mindset. I, for example, am not scared of sex and are completely ready - if I wanted to, I could easily have sex (well, if I had a partner that is). I just don't like anyone enough; I don't want it to get in the way of more important things such as studies.

I'm not homosexual, I'm heterosexual, but I'm also asexual - I don't want to have sex and don't like the idea of relationships (especially the irrationality one acquires during relationships) but I am still attracted to females...which is annoying.
What I said has almost nothing to do with what you said... I'm just saying he shouldn't take it personally some people just aren't mentally ready sometimes. And that's nothing to be ashamed of.

And your 'asexual' choice (I think the word you're looking for is non-sexual) is also nothing to be ashamed of it's your choice.
 

lazy_bum

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Mar 25, 2009
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Baby Tea said:
SikOseph said:
I've had plenty of both types of sex (fucked and sober) and am yet to regret any of it... Baby Tea is full of shit - 'giving all of myself to her' pffffffft. Every time you come up with a witty comment or joke and tell someone it you are giving them a part of yourself. What, should you not share with anyone until you decide to settle down monogamously?
No, I'm not full of shit.
And yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying.

You know, I didn't regret my premarital sex either, until I fell in love with my wife. I wanted (And still want) to give her everything, but I gave part of myself away to other people. I realized what I wasted, and what I couldn't get back. I'm not moping around sad about it, but it's certainly how I feel.

Sorry but i felt i had to jump in here as i disagree whole heartedly with what you are saying Baby Tea. while it is true that sex makes a good relationship great and all that. I feel that if i hadn't had sex before her (and she before me) we wouldnt be able able be so intimate and comfortable with each other during sex due to the fact we have experiance and now what we are doing. where as i've seen virgin couples who have decided to wait and be each others first time make a spectacular mess by not having had any experiance apart from friends and the internet for guidance and completley destroyed their relationship and ruined they're enjoyment of sex until they got with someone who knows what the hell they are doing. I will personally be forever indebted to the girl i lost it to. she may have shagged me on basis she like shagging virgins and then dumped me, but we hooked up together again, just as friends with benifits and she taught me what to do and how to do it properly. between losing my virginity to her and hooking up as FBs i had slept with another girl, after my arrangement with the first girl had come to a close, i slept with the second girl again and she remarked on how i had improved and i have been in good stead ever since. (My particular social group is very frank and open about sex) when people are in a relationship amongst my lot people are comfortable with saying what does and does not work for them and are usually actively encouraged to by the other 1\2 (we are also very open about our relationships to each other).

Basically what i mean to say is that sleeping with someone doesnt mean you lose something, but you gain something, experiance, which, when you meet the person you want to settle down with you can properly connect with them sexually without any awkwardness.
 

Baby Tea

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Sep 18, 2008
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lazy_bum said:
Basically what i mean to say is that sleeping with someone doesnt mean you lose something, but you gain something, experiance, which, when you meet the person you want to settle down with you can properly connect with them sexually without any awkwardness.
I completely disagree.
I fully know (First hand) that sex can be awkward the first time, but if people who waited for sex until marriage found their first sexual encounter to be awkward, and then they end the relationship because of it, then they were far too immature to be married. Sex is far from the end-all-be-all of a relationship, and if a few awkward first couple times causes a relationship to end, then the problems with that relationship run much deeper then their awkward sexual encounters.
I mean, if I just got married to my wife, whom I just told the world through our wedding that I loved enough to spend the rest of my life with, and then we get to the honeymoon suite and I'm not comfortable, then there is a deeper problem there.

I'm all for educating people about sex so help make thing easier for first timers. My wife, actually, read a great book that helped her immensely at the beginning of our marriage. That, I think, is a great idea. But you don't need to sleep with a bunch of people to get the information. That's like saying I need to get hit by a bus to know it's not good for me. There is plenty of information out there that can educate people to help them with their 'first time'. And the exploration is part of the beauty of a relationship! Things might be awkward at first, but as you grow in your love for each other, you'll learn what your partner likes and dislikes and vice versa.
It's a great learning and growing experience that you share with your spouse, and it's something I wouldn't trade the world for. I'd gladly give up all my past 'experience' if I could. It didn't do anything for me.

EDIT:
SikOseph said:
What doesn't seem to come through at allis how any of this relates to past sexual experiences. You're talking about trust and faithfulness, but this doesn't really relate to your actions prior to your current relationship. Why should/do you regret past sexual experiences in the context of loving your wife?
My example of the relationship with the man and the woman and the affair wasn't merely focused on the bond, though indeed it is there. Sex is often thrown out as something that isn't a big deal. 'It's just sex' I hear so often. And what I'm saying is that it's not 'just sex', if it was, the wife certainly wouldn't have got mad, since it doesn't mean anything. But people do get mad, and marriages to get destroyed because sex carries with it a deeper and greater weight the is given credit these days. You mentioned kissing on the cheek, or lips, or holding hand, and I agree completely. We are in a society with an ever increasing apathy and indifference for the physical realm within (Or without) a relationship, and I think it's a dangerous and slippery slope we tread.

Also, quickly and for the record, I stopped using the term 'gift' because I felt I sufficiently made my position known in previous posts. I certainly still stand by the statement, but since we were having a bit of an issue in making our positions clear to each other, I opted to use slightly different language for the sake of clarity. Fair enough?

As for your final question, and at the risk of sounding redundant, since I view sex as a gift, then I regret my past experiences because I cannot give all of me to my wife. My first time was thrown away, as was a bunch of times after that. And what does my wife end up with? What's left. And, for me, that's not good enough. She deserves everything. Now, she loves me regardless, and it is not a strain or issue in our marriage, but it's certainly a regret that I hold.
 

Abengoshis

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Aug 12, 2009
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xDarc said:
Abengoshis said:
Why don't you save it for someone you will probably be with for the rest of your life.
Because there's nothing special or sacred about it. It's all bullshit people made up. It's reproduction and evolution has encouraged it by making it feel very good. Believe whatever ya want, but the fact is you are wasting the best years of your natural life pursuing experiences that are much more artificial and not nearly as memorable.
I know that. I am not religious in any way at all, and I completely accept (and strive to understand) evolution. Your point has actually changed my mind. Thanks.

lazy_bum said:
Abengoshis said:
Why do you even need to have sex, can't you control your urges? I HOPE I never have sex.
Are you an asthetic by any chance?
I don't know what that is.

ace_of_something said:
Abengoshis said:
ace_of_something said:
Knew about 100 girls who were like that. They changed as soon as they hit college or were a bit older. It's an excuse for being scared or not ready. (Which are fine reasons on their own and don't need an excuse)
No, it's not an excuse, it's a mindset. I, for example, am not scared of sex and are completely ready - if I wanted to, I could easily have sex (well, if I had a partner that is). I just don't like anyone enough; I don't want it to get in the way of more important things such as studies.

I'm not homosexual, I'm heterosexual, but I'm also asexual - I don't want to have sex and don't like the idea of relationships (especially the irrationality one acquires during relationships) but I am still attracted to females...which is annoying.
What I said has almost nothing to do with what you said... I'm just saying he shouldn't take it personally some people just aren't mentally ready sometimes. And that's nothing to be ashamed of.

And your 'asexual' choice (I think the word you're looking for is non-sexual) is also nothing to be ashamed of it's your choice.
I wouldn't call it a choice, I just can't like it, it repulses me. And I'm not ashamed. :)
 

lazy_bum

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Mar 25, 2009
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Baby Tea said:
lazy_bum said:
Basically what i mean to say is that sleeping with someone doesnt mean you lose something, but you gain something, experiance, which, when you meet the person you want to settle down with you can properly connect with them sexually without any awkwardness.
I completely disagree.
I fully know (First hand) that sex can be awkward the first time, but if people who waited for sex until marriage found their first sexual encounter to be awkward, and then they end the relationship because of it, then they were far too immature to be married. Sex is far from the end-all-be-all of a relationship, and if a few awkward first couple times causes a relationship to end, then the problems with that relationship run much deeper then their awkward sexual encounters.
I mean, if I just got married to my wife, whom I just told the world through our wedding that I loved enough to spend the rest of my life with, and then we get to the honeymoon suite and I'm not comfortable, then there is a deeper problem there.

I'm all for educating people about sex so help make thing easier for first timers. My wife, actually, read a great book that helped her immensely at the beginning of our marriage. That, I think, is a great idea. But you don't need to sleep with a bunch of people to get the information. That's like saying I need to get hit by a bus to know it's not good for me. There is plenty of information out there that can educate people to help them with their 'first time'. And the exploration is part of the beauty of a relationship! Things might be awkward at first, but as you grow in your love for each other, you'll learn what your partner likes and dislikes and vice versa.
It's a great learning and growing experience that you share with your spouse, and it's something I wouldn't trade the world for. I'd gladly give up all my past 'experience' if I could. It didn't do anything for me.

EDIT:
SikOseph said:
What doesn't seem to come through at allis how any of this relates to past sexual experiences. You're talking about trust and faithfulness, but this doesn't really relate to your actions prior to your current relationship. Why should/do you regret past sexual experiences in the context of loving your wife?
My example of the relationship with the man and the woman and the affair wasn't merely focused on the bond, though indeed it is there. Sex is often thrown out as something that isn't a big deal. 'It's just sex' I hear so often. And what I'm saying is that it's not 'just sex', if it was, the wife certainly wouldn't have got mad, since it doesn't mean anything. But people do get mad, and marriages to get destroyed because sex carries with it a deeper and greater weight the is given credit these days. You mentioned kissing on the cheek, or lips, or holding hand, and I agree completely. We are in a society with an ever increasing apathy and indifference for the physical realm within (Or without) a relationship, and I think it's a dangerous and slippery slope we tread.

Also, quickly and for the record, I stopped using the term 'gift' because I felt I sufficiently made my position known in previous posts. I certainly still stand by the statement, but since we were having a bit of an issue in making our positions clear to each other, I opted to use slightly different language for the sake of clarity. Fair enough?

As for your final question, and at the risk of sounding redundant, since I view sex as a gift, then I regret my past experiences because I cannot give all of me to my wife. My first time was thrown away, as was a bunch of times after that. And what does my wife end up with? What's left. And, for me, that's not good enough. She deserves everything. Now, she loves me regardless, and it is not a strain or issue in our marriage, but it's certainly a regret that I hold.
the examples i mentioned were not married couples (though at least one of thos couples was engaged.) However, while these days there are numerous self help books and this not so much a problem today, many couples who wait till they are married before they have sex and don't know what they are doing usually end up not having good sex, and both of them, not having any experiance of anything else, just thing this is how its meant to be, and bad sex has been shown to be a major factor in the breakdown of marriages in the long run (there is a paper on it somewhere but i cannot find it atm). Especially, i believe the paper mentioned them as a case in point, between the abstanance couples in the evangelical churches, here and in america. anywya i went quite abit off topic there i think but while we can both happily agree that people should get alot more education about sex before they have it. (which on an aside is why i focus specific ire towards these abstinance plegde groups.) But I personally dont think you should nessesarily wait till you get to the altar before you have sex (well not actually at the altar...that would probably cause comment). Many are the older couples who tell me that there is nothing worse than waiting till your married till sex as there is nothing worse than finding your sexual tastes/prefereances are incompatable. (for the record i had already pretty much made up my mind on the subject before they werean influence.)
as to yout analogy, you might know its bad, but not how bad until it happens to you or something similair has happened (like being run over by some drunken tosser in a car, lying on a curb alternatley screaming and using every swear word i knew and clutching my leg was not fun, so for a bus...) so you have reference point. might be able to imagine, but understand. Having had good and the occasional bad sex, give references to rely on.

My point is that if you wait till marriage and it doesn't work your stuck. I realise we are not going to agree on this one but i like to discuss different points of views and see things though someone else eyes as well as challenging their ideas as they challenge mine.

in reference to your comments to SikOseph i believe it is possible, as two (or more if you want) consenting persons to 'just have sex'. I have before. the problem is when one side does not understand/been made aware of that. that's when all the problems come into it. If both parties however have both been made aware that it is purely just sex and nothing more, then there is no problem or repercussions, i am living proof it can be done, just requires honesty and openess.

Also i disagreed with the slippery slope in our society about sex and holding hands and kissing etc. I am encouraged by our societies opening up of sexuality, which has been supressed for too long. the problems mainly stem from a lack of education on such matters.
 

lazy_bum

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Mar 25, 2009
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Abengoshis said:
lazy_bum said:
Abengoshis said:
Why do you even need to have sex, can't you control your urges? I HOPE I never have sex.
Are you an asthetic by any chance?
I don't know what that is.
The christian asthetics believe/d by 'mastering the body and its urges' principly by abstaining from sex and fasting, they could get closer to salvation (its alot more detailed than that but that is the gist of it.)

While you have stated you're not religious there are non-religious asthetics who seek mastery over there body, basically boils down to mind over matter.
 

MrBirdy

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Sep 10, 2008
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silverbullet1989 said:
MrBirdy said:
silverbullet1989 said:
ThatDudeThere said:
Go to Amsterdam.

PROBLEM SOLVED
lol i have to admire that idea as i have just got back from amsterdam and was completely...shocked to say the least at what its like over there.
Why where you shocked? There's nothing that special there you know... ( yes I live 30 minutes from Amsterdam...)
I live in the UK, and were not as open as you are across the sea... obviously you hear about the red light district all the time... but seeing it is something else... shocked in a good way :)
Yeah, i figure. It's quite nice here, you just get used to it. Like the massive fields filled with flowers, the ""legal" weed and alcohol dirnking age :). You forget that the rest of the world is more strict :(
 

Baby Tea

Just Ask Frankie
Sep 18, 2008
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SikOseph said:
I think Lazy Bum expresses my position on sex as capable of being 'just sex', and it seems to be the fundamental point on which we differ (and not one that I have any appetite to convert you on).

I now understand exactly what you mean by gift and your decision on terminology for clarity is more than fair enough - it is greatly appreciated.
Thanks for not trying to convert me! Hah! I feel we'd be here arguing for much longer then either of us would like! I will say, for the record, that I'm glad that some people can still have a fairly intelligent discussion on the internet, while disagreeing, and remain respectful with each other. It's a good thing to see, and participate in.

I only want to ask if you think that it is likely that you and your wife (or in general, I don't want to pry too much, please feel free not to answer) would have been different in your sex life if you hadn't had sex before? As in, if the way sex happens between you is more or less the same in either case, why does there existing some sex in your life prior to meeting her make any difference?
I would make a difference, as I don't think it would have been the same. Let me explain:
When my wife and I had sex for our first time, my wife hadn't had it before, but I had. I was bringing with me all my presuppositions that I 'learned' from previous encounters, whether they are good or bad. This means, therefore, that rather then us learning together about each other sexually, our likes and dislikes, and cementing our relationship further with our intimate 'discussion', we had a tension stemming from my 'experience', and from her 'inexperience'. I was reacting and moving based on what I 'knew', while she was reacting and moving based on what she 'felt'. It was like trying to dance a routine when one person knows it and another doesn't.

Some would say that the one who 'knows' the dance, to continue that analogy, should lead the dance, but I whole-heartedly disagree. It's two people together, not one person leading the way. Therefore, if I hadn't had any sexual activity before my marriage, my wife and I would have learned the dance together, forming our own, personal, intimate, and unique way of expressing our love in that way. As it stands, my experience got in the way of that learning process. I thought I knew what was 'good' and what was 'bad', but all I knew was what was good and bad for those girls I slept with before. I would happily give up all past 'experiences' so that I could 'learn' everything all over again with my wife.
 

Treefingers

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Aug 1, 2008
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Rigs83 said:
Or go to third world nation *cough* Thailand *cough* where your money instantly gets tripled and be the big money man for a week.

The Exploited girls will just be thrown themselves at you by their pimps.
Fixed.