I'm socially ignorant: Please tell me what a "Hipster" is.

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Faelix

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I remember my professor during my last years at university. He was pretty accomplished in the field of molecular biology, and he told me of a meeting he had partaken in. Where him and his colleagues, for some reason or another, suddenly took their ties and bound them around their heads. And then they continued their meeting.

This ironic act of humour, could be called hipster. This way of saying: It's not all so damn important!
But as always, as soon as hipster got a name, it became aetheric. You can't be spontaneous ironic on a bandwagon. Real hipsters thus, don't have a name for themselves.

Tracing the movement back into history, an artist like Salvador Dali stands out with his surreal paintings. His moustache was hipster.



So a hipster is, someone who says to the conformity of iLife: you don't own me.
 

emptyother

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Kaleion said:
Watch Scott Pilgrim, everyone in that movie is hipster, or read the comic both are pretty awesome.
What makes Scott Pilgrim a hipster movie? Never found it fitting with any hipster definition i've ever heard about.
 

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empty_other said:
Kaleion said:
Watch Scott Pilgrim, everyone in that movie is hipster, or read the comic both are pretty awesome.
What makes Scott Pilgrim a hipster movie? Never found it fitting with any hipster definition i've ever heard about.
Not the movie, the characters, they are hipsters, they even say so and when they are discussing why Lucas Lee is evil they say "He's evil because he's a sell-out or he's a sell-out because he's evil, I'm not sure" though I can't remember if that's only said in the comic, also they dress like Hipsters.
 

Pink Gregory

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Wonderful how people can be so arrogant as to determine for themselves the level on which someone else appreciates something, usually without asking them.

Oh, you* don't like looking at them or hearing them or reading them, you say. Well I don't like looking at, hearing, or reading you; but I don't have snooty little diatribes on the internet about you (except this one), and to be honest, my way is easier.

*this is a hypothetical 'you'

Also I'm going to assume that you gents know that the etymology of the word goes back to the beat generation and further back to the 1920's.

For fuck's sake, I'm supposed to not enjoy or appreciate things because they don't 'fit' somehow into the linear, historian's annotation of the world?

Who elected you the crown prince of 'genuine'? How would you feel if I started implying that you're a hipster because you're into anime and yet not of Japanese or Asian stock? That's what the PBS video implies. I'd be hounded off this forum. That's how ridiculous calling out supposed hipsters sound. It's all in your heads, for God's sake.
 

Varrdy

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Will I get into trouble for considering the term "Hipster" synonymous with "pretentious tw*t"?
 

Bara_no_Hime

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Copper Zen said:
I've looked up "Hipster" [http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=hipster] on the Urban Dictionary....

But folks here use the term with a casual familiarity that leaves the UB's definition lacking. So I am asking you, my fellow Escapists, to enlighten me: What is a "Hipster"?
Ha! I love how the definition of Hipster on Urban Dictionary was obviously written BY a hipster, as it basically goes out of its way to say that hipsters are awesome and anyone who says otherwise is ignorant. Pfft! Hilarious!

shirkbot said:
Hipster is an ambiguous term for describing the current pop-counter-culture movement. If you really take it apart, they tend to be upper-middle class kids with a deep aversion to their own roots, seeking non-conformity to the extreme. The entire "movement" is just a patchwork of previous counter-culture movements laced with a liberal-arts mentality that doesn't have any strong views on anything.
But yeah, OP, this is probably the best definition in the thread so far. I edited out the more grouchy bits since a proper definition should be non-biased (unlike the Urban Dictionary definition, which loves hipsters, or the Dramatica definition that hates them).

I've had hipster friends. They can be annoying or fun, depending on the situation. Just like most of my friends.

In another thread, I said I didn't want to look like a hipster. That is because I hate hipster fashion. No offense to others who wear it, I just don't want to. It actually looks pretty good on some of my hipster friends.
 

Bara_no_Hime

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empty_other said:
Kaleion said:
Watch Scott Pilgrim, everyone in that movie is hipster, or read the comic both are pretty awesome.
What makes Scott Pilgrim a hipster movie? Never found it fitting with any hipster definition i've ever heard about.
**blinks**

Because it is a movie about hipsters.

Scott Pilgrim self-identifies as a hipster. In the movie, directly in a line of dialog, I believe?

Or maybe he only says it in the comic book?

Anyway, the nightclub at the end of the film where the password is "whatever" is a "hipster nightclub". The Sex Bob-ombs are a hipster band.

Like I said, I have nothing against hipsters themselves, I just wouldn't wear their clothes. Scott Pilgrim is a good example of hipsters being awesome.
 

V8 Ninja

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If I were to take a stab at this, I would say that hipsters are people who actively avoid local cultural trends while picking up foreign cultural trends and believing themselves to be more elite because of it. Very rarely is there true passion involved in adopting those foreign trends and it is more of a statement of anti-establishment.
 

Eternal_Lament

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Generally speaking, Hipsters are people who aren't just into obscure or non-mainstream products, but people that view their interest in these obscure products as proof that they're better than everyone else. They have a very specific style, which I'll discuss down below, but generally speaking their attitude is one of elitism. It's not just enough that they are aware of something obscure and that they must always tell you about how they know said obscure thing, but they also like to say things along the line of "You've probably never heard of it" or "I used to like it till everyone else found out about it" Essentially the type of people who insult others because they aren't aware of whatever obscure thing the Hipster likes. I've seen some people compare Hipsters to Goths, but there's more to it than just the non-mainstream stuff.

Although simply categorizing Hipsters as people who didn't like mainstream things would be the easy way out, it's also misleading. The mere liking of non-mainstream things or dislike of mainstream things in that of itself is not necessarily what defines a Hipster. Now while Goths aren't as prominent as they used to be (in my mind, maybe I'm wrong, it's just that in Toronto you see more Hipster or Scene Kids than you do Goths) Goths used to have a similar definition; people whose interests could be considered obscure or non-mainstream, and often distanced themselves from mainstream products. There are several differences though. In terms of aesthetics, there is often a clear difference between a Goth and a Hipster. For the sake of space, just click the spoilers for specific aspects:

Fashion (Goth)
Goth fashion varies, especially depending on what time frame you're looking at. Early Goth fashion was in fact quite different from what it is considered today. The clothes were like regular jeans, sweaters, and coats, but often a bit baggy or worn. It was less a particular statement (although you can infer one) and more something of a coincidence; these Goths were less concerned with how they looked, and as such would simply wear whatever they had around. It later evolved with the inclusion of the more "darker" images, just as dyed black hair, black nail polish, black eyeliner and lipstick (although dark red was also sometimes used) and the "pale" look (whether it be lack of sun or make-up) Around this time the clothing added a few more things, such as piercings, black PVC leather/latex, studded collars and bracelets, and sometimes necklaces with a cross pendant. There was some lapping over with Metal fashion at the time, since a) there was some lapping over with the music, and b) both were considered non-mainstream sub-cultures. Goth fashion now can be defined in a few ways: the first is the inclusion of things such as laces, fishnets, corsets, gloves, boots or stilettos, and even more silver jewelry with religious or occult symbols. The next type is more Victorian, so long black coats, complex dresses/skirts, veils, tophats, glasses with black lenses, corsets, walking sticks, etc., basically Steampunk, but less tech and more black and white coloring. Special mention should also be made to Lolita
Goth. It's more popular in Japan than it is in the West, but there are some Western Goths that fit into it: the fashion is more along the line of the "cute" Goth. It's not too dissimilar to the Victorian style; in fact, Lolita Goths could almost be described as looking like large, living Victorian dolls. The difference is that Lolita Goths are more likely to add color to the style as opposed to just straight black and white. Further, there is a certain "cuteness" to the style, a certain playfulness in juxtaposition to the sometimes serious, melancholic fashion that Victorian Goths subscribe too. Generally speaking, Goth fashion is derived from two aspects: the first is that it emerged in contrast to the disco style of the 70's, what with the slick visuals and heavy use of color. This was done to the lighter extent seen in early Goth and late 80's/early-to-late 90's Goth, while Victorian Goths use the black and white motifs combined with the extravagant clothing as a type of commentary on Victorian era extravagance, and to that end a commentary on extravagance as a whole. The other reason was that many Goth interests steam from Romanticism, a movement mostly found in music, art, and literature near the mid-to-late 18th century, which acted as a rebut to the Age of Enlightenment and the Industrial Revolution, focusing on the raw emotions, horrors, and beauties found in the untamed nature. Notable pieces related to Romanticism includes the works of Edgar Allan Poe and Frankenstein, which if you've seen any visual representations of can give you an idea of where Goth fashion started from.

Hipster Fashion
Hipster fashion by contrast, although stemming from a similar time-frame as Goth fashion, was a very different look and intention. As mentioned, Goth sub-culture had many overlaps with Metal sub-culture through the late 80's and early 90's, and to that end had similar fashion trends. Hipster fashion, by contrast, had more overlaps with Grunge than anything else, which was also at it's peak in the early-to-mid 90's. This included the "rugged" Hipster look, which was torn jeans, t-shirts, and plaid shirts worn on top. Other mentions of this style include shaved hair styles similar to those found in Punk, mostly with women, and for men there would be somewhat lightly groomed facial hair. The overlap probably has more to do with the fact that Grunge got it's start in Seattle more than anything else, which may also explain the clothing seeing as how Seattle's major labor force was concentrated with forestry to a certain extent. Hipster fashion was more likely to be called indie fashion though, and for a while nothing really happened. Around the mid 2000's, when the Hipster sub-culture started to become more prominent in New York, the fashion became a bit more bohemian. The fashion isn't too dissimilar to 80's fashion actually. In fact, barring the hair styles and makeup, Hipster fashion and 80's fashion are very similar to one another. A few notably additions includes things such as scarves, lens-less glasses, and skinny jeans. Some Hipsters look more like they're from the 60's/70's than they do the 80's though, with more brown colors, long coats, and as mentioned, bohemian fashion. The reasons for Hipster fashion are far and wide depending on who you ask. For some, it has to do with the nostalgia factor and love of all things retro that Hipsters are drawn towards. For others, it's too wear the clothes as an ironic statement on either a) the fashion at the time, b) fashion as it stand today, or c) the mere fact that there are fashion trends at all. Some do it as a counter-cultural statement to society as it stands today, mainly in it's constant move-forward in regards to trends and technology. Some do it as a point of pride, that is to say either a) because no one else does it, and therefore it makes them unique, or b) because they go out of their way to wear uncomfortable clothes, them wearing it is sort of like "Pft, whatever, it's easy for me. You're just not committed to it I guess."

Music (Goth)
As mentioned, since Goth had overlaps with Metal, Goth music for a while WAS Metal music. It was around the early 90's that "Goth music" formed itself, although it was still a subset of Metal. Industrial Metal, such as Nine Inch Nails and Marilyn Manson, were considered Goth music even if their music was more situated in the Industrial side (or with Marilyn Manson a mix of Industrial and Shock) Goth Metal in that of itself isn't too different from Doom Metal actually, sometimes even in lyrics. Vocally though, Doom Metal has more in common with the harsh vocals of Death Metal, while Goth Metal vocals are a bit lighter, and not as harsh in tone. Type O Negative is a perfect example of this, in which while the droning sounds are similar to those found in Drone Metal and non-European Doom Metal, the vocals are bit lighter. Goth Rock also formed around this time, with the two best examples I can think of off the top of my head being The Cure, Siouxsie and the Banshees, Jack Off Jill, and Scarling. Unlike Goth Metal, Goth Rock got it's start actually from Punk Rock and indie rock in the late 80's/early 90's. There were some similar drone like aspects, although Goth Rock was more willing to add lighter aspects to the music itself, again relying more on a Punk sound rather than a Metal sound, and while there are many exceptions, Goth Rock has a bit more female vocals in contrast to Goth Metal. Goth music today isn't very popular, if at all present. The closest I can think of would be current day Cradle of Filth, originally a Black Metal band from the UK, but there sound and visuals, while definitely more Goth than their previous stuff (although I'd argue that the Elizabeth Bathory character on the cover of Cruelty and the Beast, as well as the female characters on the cover of Midian, are very Goth like in their appearance) is still more routed in Symphonic Black Metal, it's just that it's probably the closest thing to Goth music right now. This particular absence of Goth music can be attributed of course to the dying out of the Goth sub-culture, along with the growth of the Emo and Scene Kid sub-culture that has replaced Goth sub-culture (for youths anyways) and as such more music is being catered to the Emo and Scene Kid crowd than the Goth crowd.

Music (Hipster)
Hipster Music, as mentioned, has it's starts in indie rock and Grunge in the early 90's. When Grunge died out, some fans went back over to Punk, but Hipsters ended up moving to indie rock and alt music. You can infer that the reason for this, much like the fashion, has more to do with the fact that not many people are ware of the music more than anything else. The problem though with categorizing Hipster music, if you haven't figured it out already, is that it never remains consistent. There's a few reasons for this, one of the big ones related to the idea of "I liked them before they went mainstream" Sometimes it has less to do with the specific nature or genre of the music, and more to do with it's presence. The less well known it is, the more likely it is to be liked by the Hipster community. If the band or the artist end up becoming "mainstream" as it were, the band is viewed as to have sold out, and therefore the community loses interest. An example of this can be something like Odd Future or Tyler the Creator (I know, Tyler's part of Odd Future, but there's a point to this) A rap group/artist, many of their lyrics and their styles aren't normally in line with the indie rock that Hipsters go back to, but a few things made them fairly popular among Hipsters for a bit: a) they had yet to hit the mainstream, and b) their style could be described as "avant-garde" music. That's the one thing that's usually consistent; Hipsters often have an appreciation of avant-garde music (would take too long to explain in detail; essentially experimental music, but doing experimenting for the sake of it rather than the results; heavy focus on presentation as well) as well as folk music. Another big one, although I see it more popular among Hipster girls rather than Hipster guys, is the ukulele. For some reason, I don't know why, but Hipster girls go fucking ape-shit over a ukulele; that is to say, they always bring one with them, try to play them whenever they're with other people, and always consider getting new ones (maybe this is more a Toronto thing than anything else though)

Entertainment (Goth)
Goth entertainment is usually anything itself that is "Gothic." Whether this be movies, games, books, or whatever, if it has a dark, Gothic look, it's usually something Goth's like. Castlevania is a big game example, as is Vampire: The Masquerade. Generally speaking, horror is where Goths like to look. Even non-Gothic horror is also liked, but mainly if it stays on the more serious end. In terms of comic books, things like the Sandman series are also liked, and in terms of modern comics, I can tell you that comics (or any art even) by Menton3 is often appreciated by Goths. Generally speaking, Goths tend to favor fantasy over sci-fi, but there are exceptions. Sci-fi where there is a mad scientist character (such as Frankenstein) or somewhat dark visuals (such as things inspired by the art of H.R. Giger) is something Goths can trend towards. Although on the whole, their limit in terms of technology would be something modern, not futuristic (or at least one that isn't alien) One of the big stereotypes about Goths, which is sort of true, is that they are fans of the over-dramatic. Speeches, brooding characters, over-dramatic displays of emotion, basically things related to Romanticism. The other big stereotype, which is again partially true, is that some stuff can be dark for the sake of being dark. This is found mostly in the "Here I sit all broken-hearted, weak and weary..." type poetry. On the whole, their interests have more to do with the macabre, and generally speaking prefer escapism and topics not pertaining necessarily to the current of their community.

Entertainment (Hipster)
Hipster entertainment, much like the music and fashion, can come down to what is considered indie or underground. The difference between someone who, for instance, plays indie games and a Hipster is that the Hipster goes out of their way to play indie games because they're indie, not necessarily because they are of a good quality. The other caveat for entertainment is often things that are retro; old movies, old books, and especially old games. However, unlike the indie aspect, the retro aspect comes either from their nostalgia or attempt to be ironic. Outside of that, Hipster entertainment, in contrast to Goth entertainment, is perhaps more non-fictional. It's not that they don't trend towards fiction, it's just that the fiction is more like a slice-of-life than it is escapism or fantasy. In fact, Hipster entertainment usually doesn't go off into escapism or fantasy UNLESS it's trying to make a point or, again, trying to be ironic. For movies, it can range anywhere, from the European art house films that no one save art-house fans would even know about, let alone watch, to pieces that feature awkwardness as a character trait for everyone. Although not always the case, if you eve hear a film be described as a "white person film" it can sometimes be a Hipster film (although not always) Hipster entertainment also attempts to always be subversive, sometimes in progressive ways, other times for avant-garde's sake. Interior Semiotics is the perfect definition of the second type of Hipster entertainment; avant-garde for the sake of being avant-garde (also, fuck Interior Semiotics; it amazes me someone could take the already bland and useless product of Spaghetti-O's and make them worse) The other part, the progressive part, stems more from the personal politics of Hipsters. I didn't get into it that much with Goths, since it's not as prevalent, but generally speaking Goths aren't as concerned with politics so much as they are with individuality and non-conformity. Hipsters have that as well, but they are also more political and progressive. Generally speaking, a protester isn't always a Hipster, but a Hipster may be a protester. In stark contrast to Punk, which leans more towards the Anarchistic side of politics, Hipsters tend towards the more heavy left-wing aspects of politics (sometimes Communist, but not always; further, Hipsters are more likely to identify as Marxists than the are Communists, by which I mean if you call them a Communist, they'll respond by saying "No, I'm a Marxist, get that straight!") I only bring it up because their politics are more likely to fuel the entertainment they consume/produce where as a Goth's politics are less likely to affect how they view their entertainment.
 

sumanoskae

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The most useful definition I've heard is "A person who follows the trend of not following trends. The hipster seeks to be unique above all else, but they're pursuit of this goal often results in them being shallow and superficial; the fact that the things they do are obscure is more important to them than their quality. A hipster would speak in support for a movie as long as it was unique, even if it was terrible, and would speak against a movie no matter how good it was, as long as it was popular enough"
 

Dollabillyall

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Long story short: They are people who are so obsessed with being the trendsetters that they are willing to jump on anything that is not already a trend just to be able to say they liked it BEFORE it was a trend to then feel like an elite part of society if those things do become a trend. An important aspect of this is blatant anti-commercialism in favor of "true" and "pure" things.
The actual reality however is a vague blend of just about every other subculture that has been relevant in the previous century. In that sense they really fit the current era in wich decades do not carry their own distinct trends but people in general are more into picking and choosing what they like about all past trends. Actually saying you are following a past trend however is "not done" because that would mean you follow instead of lead.
 

ace_of_something

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Pretty much this
http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/

If you go there and read every entry you'll have a good idea what a 'hipster' is, granted hipsters can be something other than white but they behave pretty much like the described people in these entries.

Also, it's funny.
 

Shuu

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My understanding is that it's basically one who adheres to a system of what is cool and desirable, that runs counter to what mainstream culture values. When used in the negative sense, it points to those people, who care more about their values being defiant of the mainstream opinion than they do about what those values even are. ie, a hipster (in the negative sense) may buy one phone (phone A), and say it's the best, and everyone else is using 'phone B'. But then that hipster's opinion becomes the mainstream, and now everyone has phone A. Now hipster thinks 'phone C' is the best, for you see, they only valued phone A because it made them stand out from the mainstream.

I guess the hipster to be admired is one who forms their own opinions and values, independant of their popularity, and they just happened to fall outside the mainstream views.
A hipster to be mocked, on the other hand, is one who chooses their opinions and values based on their popularity.
 

SuperSuperSuperGuy

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The term "hipster" is quite nebulous. Personally, I've always associated the term with a sort of pretentious, condescending individual who's counter-cultural and "indie", not because they necessarily enjoy it, but because it's "edgy" and it makes them feel superior, or something. I know that's probably not the actual definition, but it's what I've always thought when I've heard the term "hipster."

Now, there's nothing inherently wrong with counter-culturalism, but the thing is, I think being different for the sake of being different is kinda dumb. I mean, if there's a good reason to go against the norm, then I'm all for it. However, sometimes, things are the norm for a reason. People who reject conformism blindly are just as bad as people who blindly conform.
 

Heronblade

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Faelix said:
So a hipster is, someone who says to the conformity of iLife: you don't own me.
This statement describes a huge number of people that have nothing to do with "hipsterism", myself included. I would in fact argue that it does not in fact include most hipsters, unless you add the term "tries to" in there.

A hipster would be someone that not only decides to not be "owned" by conformity, but then goes out of his/her way to brag about this decision (by action more often than words, but it is still bragging) For a group that is so big into irony, they seem to miss one of the biggest ironies around. By deliberately choosing things because they are not popular, they are still letting mainstream society influence their decisions. Indirectly to be sure, but they still follow fashion
 

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Depulcator said:
Come down here to Portland Oregon, we have hipsters calling out hipsters with hipsters hating hipsters.
"The dream of the 90s is alive in Portland..."

OT: Hipsters... The "avant-garde" of the ironic social norm that is "mainstream"... Both easy and hard to point out right away, given first impressions... and there's rarely a middle ground, unless you really do your research beforehand...

According to how I am as a person, I am a hipster more in the music category than anywhere else, considering what I do tend to listen to on a daily basis... (But, then again, I never do defy myself as a hipster in the first place...)

captcha: smelly socks
Just because my sock are smelly does not make me a hipster in sock fashion... LOL
 

fromthepoisonwell

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Faelix said:
This is described as; Wearing ironic sunglasses. For example. He is breaking the mold that is so dumbed down, in order to show individuality. His accesories, show irony, and the irony is; that you don't get it. That you who wear "the best", is the one who doesn't "get it".
What? Can you further explain the point of open rimmed glasses or is this meta-irony?

Because wearing open rimmed glasses to be silly and laugh at people who 'don't get it' isn't something I'd call 'irony.'