Inside the Sick Mind of a School Shooter Mod

[Nurb]

If you start putting limits on expression, you're going to be getting more people wanting to include more things that people can't say, write, draw, or create.

Stop getting worked up over things that don't exist. There's two unjust wars going on and people trying to take rights away from the working class.

Sorry to butt in here, but I noticed a wee bit of hypocrisy that I figured should be brought to light. You are simultaneously devaluing artistic expression by reducing literature to ink on a paper and all that, but still putting importance on creative expression? Well, is it important and impacting or not? Because you are only contradicting yourself if you are simultaneously saying that art is meaningless but artistic expression is important.

By the way, it's not meaningless. Art is one of the most vital aspects of a society and culture. So what exactly are you trying to say here?

I'm not devaluing anything, speech or expression in any form is something I am VERY liberal about in regards to protecting rights. Books are just words; it's what importance people give them that makes them valuable or not. If it's a bad book or offensive, then don't give it attention and it has no value or power, but good books can be classics and part of the cultural history. Same goes for video games and this mod. Don't give it attention and it will have no power over anyone who doesn't have problems already.

So you see I'm not devaluing anything. A painting or book or game is only what people take from it or as valuable as people make it because no one has the authority to judge what books or drawings or paintings are acceptable or have artistic value, it's all subjective.

Just to point out, a gunman used Glenn Beck's book as a hit list, but that doesn't mean it makes people into murderers if they aren't already disturbed like that guy.

 

[Flap Jack452]

I like killing defenseless NPC's as much as anyone else, but when you put it in a school environment that is when it becomes disturbing.

 

[Carlston]

Sorry, not moved at all.

Every disaster has someone cashing in on it, or offending others by cheering the deaths of innocent people to get some TV footage. If it is real or a imagined event, like the certain japanese car "stuck" accelerator...

 

[kaieth]

Either everything is okay to make games about, or nothing is.

The game is morally reprehensible, but it has a right to be made.

 

[Jaime_Wolf]

I'm honestly not sure what to think about this.

On the one hand, I actually agree with a lot of what he said. Also, it frustrates me to no end when people say that video games shouldn't be allowed to be about certain topics. In this particular case, it seems like there's also an undercurrent of "games could be about this topic, but only if they make some greater point", which, likewise, seems dumb. I also agree that games can be about just having fun without needing to be about something deeper. His closing comments about how this isn't going to lead to school shootings (and might actually prevent them) also seem reasonable.

On the other hand, his insistence that the game shouldn't have any meaning seems silly. I'm right on board with the idea that games don't have to have any depth of meaning, but saying that they're at their best when they don't have it is myopic and stupid.

Still, while I doubt I'd play it, I don't really think I have a problem with them making it. The people saying he's just seeking attention seem not to have read any of the interview. He's seeking to make a game he wants and to give it good gameplay. He harps on the latter for the entire interview. He never really comes off as saying "look at me, look at me, look at this terrible thing I'm doing!". Instead, he just says "I'm doing something that you might find terrible and I don't particularly care either way what you think about it." I think those are very different things.

 

[Bobbity]

Spoiler

snip

True. I think this is more a case of a game that shouldn't have been made because it's insensitive, rather than a game that must be banned and flamed and stabbed and so on because it'll destroy society. Still, the guy in the interview shows a remarkable level of detachment from his subject matter.

there is absolutely nothing wrong in creating it
especially if it comes with a point that wants to be made

the most important point made is that people are different and that taboos exist only in our minds
this game is nothing but absolute honest
it's even more honest than the people that actually like to play this but try to convince themselves otherwise

The thing is though, he's making this game because he thinks it'll be fun. "What's the best part of GTA?" he asks. "The surprise and horror as you turn on innocent victims who are unable to defend themselves".
Or something like that. I thought that was kind of disturbing. True, it's only lines of coding, but makes is difficult to accept.
Personally, I did have fun murdering innocents in GTA, but that was as an expression of freedom in a sandbox game. For this game to be based entirely around the murder of innocents leaves a bad taste in my mouth. True, it was the best bit of GTA, but the context now makes it different.
Maybe I am being sensationalist, but it doesn't mean I'm wrong.

i think your biggest concern is not that this game is solely based around a shooting but that it's the actual goal of the game to reach as much havoc as possible
if it were a shooting simulation without a scoring system it would make probably more sense even to you since the objective is freedom and not killing... i'd love to go on further but i have to hurry to work...

Pretty much right
Anyway, I checked out the Colombine Shooter website, and the guy seemed genuinely interested in putting out his message. Everything everyone's said in defence of it pretty much holds true. http://www.columbinegame.com/ That's the site.

Then, you have the School Shooter: North American Tour 2012. http://www.moddb.com/mods/school-shooter-north-american-tour-2012
That's the link. I've just been watching the live stream, and these guys are doing it ONLY for shits and giggles. It's really disturbing, and those guys sound like dickheads.
I support their right to make this game, but I really think that it shouldn't have been made.

 

[keideki]

While I admit that the guy has a right to make a game like this, I think that the only thing this will do will make things worse for the rest of us. I am ashamed to be put in the category, 'gamer' as someone who thinks making a game like this is okay.

 

[Blank Verse]

I agree with this fellow's points.

That said, I attend Virginia Tech. I was not attending when its tragedy occurred, though I attended a nearby high school. I know several people who suffered a loss from the Virginia Tech Massacre. I was not one of them, and I consider myself an observer of the disaster's repercussions at an objective distance.

I agree with this fellow's points, but only since I understand the semantic range of "game" is broad and deep. He intends to make an activity valuable only for its mindlessly entertaining engagement. That is a kind of game. He isn't creating an immersive experience to be taken with the same austerity as "Foundations (or Groundworks) of Metaphysics of Morals," or "Anna Karenina," and I doubt it will be something which can be dissected well as, say, "Ico."

Many people ignorant of video game's semantic range will be spurred into more conflict with those who practice video games as an art; who dissect it with similar methodology as any other art critic.

His video game will lead to semantic confusion and contextual offense, but I'm pleased about that because it will further differentiate video games as art from video games as games, which will likely lead to a net societal gain. Furthermore, for every one person that may cite this as a reason for one's personal violence, I shall demonstrate many, many more people who play this game and practice pacifism.

I'd rather people were more educated to know the difference to which fewer are bothered, but hey, at this rate we'll realize that dream soon. Given my disgust with the potential material and context the game may employ, I won't play it though. I pass the memorial each day, and tutor others in those grim buidings.

Edit 1: I "knew" several people who suffered a loss? No, I still know them. My mistake.

 

[moopig66]

The individuals who made this mod need to drink some bleach and die. they are a disgrace to gamers and all man kind.

 

[PrinceofPersia]

I wouldn't ban or delete this game, He has the damn right to create a game like this to tackle on the problems of the society. Or is it banned to point flaws in western civilization? Is it the 2nd Cold war again, but this time we are missing 2nd party in it.

There is the flaw of your argument. He didn't make the game to tackle the problem he just created because he wanted an entertaining, functional, non-buggy school shooting game. He and his friends could have built a message into the mechanics, they could have put something in the game to give it some depth, but instead they went for the shallow crass end of the pool. That is why both him and his buddies get an epic fail.

 

[Oliver Pink]

The entire conversation made me feel slightly ill to read...

But I must admit, I was amused by the delicious irony that Xan Krieger brought it to his attention - given that Xan is the king of senselessly blowing people up for entertainment and profit.

All in all however, the moment that guy lost all his credibility for me was when he said 'The media is right to dismiss games as "bang-bang shoot 'em ups" and "murder simulators," - Clearly sir, you have never played Psychonauts, or Chime.

Oh well - to quote the age old line, 'I disagree with what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it...' - but still, I disagree.

 

[beniki]

What a total prick.

Just because there's a fire is no reason to throw fuel on it. He could have chosen anything to be his NPCs, from aliens to little fluffy bunnies. But he went for the high school students.

"Ideally, gamers who accept that video games shouldn't be particularly deep or insightful, and that they are most fun when they can just shut off their brains and let their reflexes take over."

And after you've played that crap you can go and watch a 2 hour movie of a guy's arse farting, or complain that the lightsabre duels in the original trilogy weren't as exciting as the ones in the prequels.

He can rationalise it anyway he wants, but he's still just being a prick.

 

[ryanxm]

what is wrong with these guys!? you know this is just...god i dont even know where to start,i dont even care about all the crap this is gonna put on our medium right now its just insane for someone to in any way shape or form think that this is at all fun

 

[PrinceofPersia]

That guy's a troll. I'm just calling it now--he's trolling.

...Right?

Absolutely. That is why it's best to call him what he is and then ignore him and his mod.

 

[Nincompoop]

I respect his arguments. I feel it to be a little over the top though.

 

[Seneschal]

Considering this topic has already hit 12 pages I think this mod almost certainly qualifies as modern art - it's definately more thought provoking than most of the stuff in the Tate Modern. Art is all about evoking emotional response and nobody could deny that this achieves that.

Do you believe that art can arise spontaneously without the author's intent? Or will this dimwit pull a "Shape of Things" on us and announce that we were all fooled by an art project?

Even though, by his own admission, his "game" is just a digital time-waster and he is just a modder. No art required, he says. Hmmm, artless tasteless dross spawns modern art, how poetic and most likely unintended.

 

[Voltano]

I find the idea around this game revolting. I consider myself a sane person with good morals, yet I recognize that I like being a "dick" in video games at times. Why not, since no one is hurt and it could be comical? I just finished "Knights of the Old Republic" a few weeks ago by playing as a dick in that game, and it was pretty fun. I recognize the characters in that game are just fictional and as much as Bioware tried tugging my heart strings, I had no reason to attach emotionally to them (especially when I'm forced to like them, but I digress).

However I can see this game definitely passing over my morals on what is the right thing to do in a video game.

And yet, I also (somewhat) agree with what Pawnstick wrote in that interview. And yeah, I see a lot of offensive games like these in the indie community--from adult "hentai" games made in RPG Maker to extremely violent Flash games on Flash sites. Where do we cross the line on what can be created in a media that requires human creativity, even if that creativity comes from the darkest depths of humanity? I know that this mod is not something appealing for me, yet I recognize the intention in making the game. It's just meant for a fun game experience.

I also recognize that other forms of media have their own "dark contributions" like this game. Such as the book "Lolita", to a foreign film where a homeless, cannibalistic, homosexual male thinks he is a zombie (I can't find the article here on the Escapist that mentioned it, but it looked like an offensive film). I guess Pawnstick is trying to point out that video games can be offensive, just like other forms of art like Dread Scott's "What is the Proper Way to Display the U.S. Flag? [http://www.dreadscott.net/artwork/photography/what-is-the-proper-way-to-display-a-us-flag]" I don't approve the message of this game, and I recognize it as being offensive, but I can see games, like any art, should not be denied this content.

 

[AgentNein]

As someone who has routinely championed games as a legit and distinct art form, I think he's got every right to make and put out his game.

I (and everyone else) however reserve the right to figuratively rip him to shreds for it. Hope he enjoys a life as a social pariah.

There's a reason we call making things like this "taking risks". It's risky. You put out something like this and you better make damn well sure that you're adding some insight, something new to say about all of this, cuz otherwise you're treating school shootings in a grotesquely light manner with nothing of substance to back it up. From reading this interview it doesn't look like he is.

I'd love to say that I can simply ignore this and it won't it effect me, but there's a good chance something so irresponsible is going to effect all of us gamers and game makers. Nice job giving ammunition to the anti-game wingnuts buddy (so to speak).

 

[TheMadTypist]

Right. Well. Takes all kinds to make a world. Best treat it like the WBC: ignore it, attention only lends it credence and gives it a louder presence.

But someone should get that guy help. Seriously. Unique first-person suicide animations? Really now, there must be something more constructive he can direct his energies into. Perhaps making pottery or painting landscapes. Preferably something with a minimum of violence.