Is "dropping the n-bomb" racist?

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sageoftruth

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loa said:
Context matters but america seems to be pretty psychotic about this, constantly referring to it as the "n-word" to keep the adult sized babies souls clean or something so maybe do the same just to be safe.

Personally, I don't see how blanket self-censorship helps.
In germany, people talk about nazis and don't refer to them as the "n-word" too.
That's not quite the same. If they were still okay with swastikas, it would be.

Anyway, it's complicated. As you said, blanket censorship isn't exactly helping much (and definitely hurts in some ways), but I can't say for sure if it's worse than allowing that word the flow freely.

For now, I'll just go with Lacktheknack and say don't, because why bother to in the first place?
 

FalloutJack

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Well actually, yes. It's just that it adds the stigma of people laughing at you for using it wrong too.
 

Phlap

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It all depends on the context. IF you're deliberately trying to offend someone by calling them a *******, then you're an asshole.

But if you're just talking normally, and it just happens to come up, (this thread is a good example) then what's the harm?

I think it's ridiculous that a word should become so taboo that people are forced to refer to it by it's initial. Everyone KNOWS what you mean. Why is that somehow better than saying the word itself?

I don't see any point in dancing around the issue. Start saying the word and take away it's power.

*I type this in the full knowledge that I have precisely zero chance that the word filter will allow this through. Ahh well.

EDIT: Way to prove me wrong, Escapist...
 

Knight Captain Kerr

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MarsAtlas said:
My primary problem with the word "trap", besides its obviously negative connotations, is that nobody, aside from transgender people, ever use it properly, including the many people on the forum here who are apologists for the word's usage that way. Right here on this very forum, I see somebody from 4chan saying "well actually trap is okay to use because what it really means is blah blah insert fucking bullshit here blah blah" and then go on to use "trap" to describe all trans people elsewhere. For example, one of these individuals used "trap" to describe their potential child in the recent "what would you do if you teenage kid said that they were transgender?" thread. Its pretty obvious that cis people who use it don't care about the "proper usage" they hammer on about whenever they're attacked for using it. The word "trap" didn't gain in meaning in a vacuum - trap has a negative connotation, and it was originally used in the context of "lol, its a trap, you fell for it, u gay homo fag!" and aside from it being used by crossdressing, transgender and non-gender conforming people in pornography, it hasn't really deviated from that. Hell, most people I know who use the term "trap" in regards to pornography know that its a no-no outside of that context. The argument that the word has no transphobic root or usage has no legitimacy, as its the people who bang on about this supposed legitimacy who undermine it while the only people who actually adhere to supposed usage of the word are people who self-identify as traps or porn bloggers, and not all of the latter.

So yeah, fuck that word and anybody using it in earnest who isn't somewhere under the trans umbrella or a pornographer.
I think people tend to use it relation to the Trans Panic Defence. Also it's pretty horrible that anyone actually considers that a defence and not, you know, a hate crime.
 

Dizchu

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In relation to the OP and some of the responses I got, I think a lot of the discussion relies on whether or not private discussions should become a public concern. As I said before, nuances that close friends can recognise are lost when the context is removed. You cannot judge how one conducts themselves in public by the language used amongst friends that have an understanding of boundaries and mutual experiences.

I have a couple of black friends that greet others within their peer groups as "my *n-word*!" Is that wrong? Are they not allowed to? If they are allowed to, is it bad, as a white person, to reciprocate that greeting?

It's not quite as simple as "this word is bad, never use it".

MarsAtlas said:
As a side-note, trans panic defense is legal and valid in every state except California. Yep, if somebody finds me attractive, then finds out I'm trans, freaks out, and murders me, they have the potential to get away with the crime by saying that its my fault that they were attracted to me.
That's horrifying. Really shows the lengths people will go to defend their sacred heterosexuality when gay/trans panic defenses exist. This is getting way off-topic though, even though I think it's a good thing to discuss.
 

lokun489

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Yes it is. In the same way that "Chinaman" and "******" are offensive as well. Not because you have bad intentions when you use it, but because of what it has been used as. To devalue, to degrade, to make them not human. Everytime you say those words, it drags their original uses out, even if it is not meant that way. If you call someone vaguely homosexual a "******" the memories of when they were called that and beaten, or the fear of becoming another Mathew Shepard immediately comes to mind. The same is true for any other slur.

Actually this is the reason why you see people trying to reclaim those words and remove their meaning, because people fear them. That's why rap videos are full of people saying "Niggah". There are fewer examples for all other slurs.
 

BeoW0lfe

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Alright special snowflakes, prepare your butts.
******.
I just don't care. Words are words. Thought policing is inherently wrong. Besides, if you are using the word in a 'bad' way, you are already doing it to hurt the other person in question. Besides, I thought we already established that "Niggers" and normal black people aren't interchangeable, if anyone remembers the Chris Rock/Dave Chappelle bits on how "Niggers" ruin black people's good time.

Beyond that though, this is 2015. White people have been beaten with the slavery/institutional racism original sin stick for so long, I have never heard a white person in real life say ******. I have however, heard it used by blacks all the time in real life.

On a personal note, during a GTA online heist, I saved one of my crew during the pac standard finale, who informed me that I was "a honorary nigga" So the whole idea that it's a 'terrible word that insults and demeans all black people' comes off as ridiculous.

I don't mean to discount or minimize the actual experiences with actual racism that some people have encountered, however, the use of "THE N WORD" as an insult, as I mentioned above, is merely using the most effective weapon against someone.

If I want to hurt your feelings, there are words to insult you:

Gay? ******.
Jew? Kike.
Black? ******.

See the pattern? Does typing these words mean that i'm a raging racist gay-bashing anti-semite? Of course not. They are merely weaponized words used by unsavory people to hurt others.
 

Tsun Tzu

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It's been answered. Using in a derogatory fashion? Racist. Just uttering the word? Not racist.
Twintix said:
...Now that I think about it, would the use of the N-word in these contexts be "OK" or "more acceptable"? Just curious...
Personally, I think it's completely acceptable and even beneficial.

You're effectively yanking the word's teeth out. I like that approach far, far, far more than I do the hushed tones and transparent meaning behind "The N-Word."

The more the word is used and abused, the less power it has. By making it some unutterable term you're giving the racist fucks who use it with any degree of sincerity a word-shaped bludgeon.
 

CrystalShadow

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Well, yeah, it's racist. But more so in America than anywhere else.
It likely would offend black people in general though.
I've never met a single person, black or otherwise that actually uses that word though, which perhaps tells you how rare it's use is outside the US...

And yes, black people themselves seem to use it a lot in the US, but that doesn't mean anything, and doesn't stop it being racist.

Appropriating insults is pretty common amongst marginalised minorities in general.


Now, there will always be some double standards that result from this.

Blackface is largely considered a very bad thing to do (though again it seems to be a bigger deal in the US than elsewhere. Last year I saw a French documentary about a ballet company. They did a performance whose story had something to do with Africa, and pretty much all the children in the performance were completely covered in brown paint, playing african It didn't so much as occur to anyone involved whether this might be racist or offensive, they just did it)

meanwhile of course, there's the film 'white chicks' in which two black men dress up as white women, and nobody cares.

Why? Because it doesn't have any offensive history to it.
that word... Has a very long history to it related to slavery and all kinds of other stuff (such as the implied racial inferiority of africans).
Even though when you remove all this history you are merely left with a word that means 'black' (compare it with the words negro, and the actual words for the colour black in spanish and italian for instance), it is the history behind it, and it's constant use as a term to belittle and insult and imply inferiority, lesser worth, lesser status, and so on that makes it racist.
 

L. Declis

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I shall paraphrase Chris Rock to explain this;

Can a white person say nigga? The answer is not really.

You need to consult with your local nigga consulate, and get a run down of the rules in your area. But you need to what is the Dr. Dre rules? Like when a Dr. Dre song comes on? Because there are a lot of niggas in a Dr. Dre song and nothing is more pathetic than watching a white person try to sing a Dr. Dre song but miming the word nigga.

-------------------------------------

Frankly, I find that using the word is obviously charged (I'd say it's the new '****', in most offensive thing to call the intended target), and I wouldn't use it in casual conversation, but I also think that saying "the n-word" is probably as stupid as well as offensive as saying it because then you're acting like the black person in question is both sensitive and should be offended by it.

Much like dyke, kike, ***** and the rest, I wouldn't use any of them, except to talk about the words themselves. They know what the topic is, and they know what the intended meaning is.

A world of difference between talking about the word nigga and shouting it at black people.

I know quite a few of my black friends are actually offended if you call them "African-British". They just say "I'm British" or "I'm black". They're not Americans who worry so much about this.

Zhukov said:
Wait, there's a "K-word"? What on earth is the "k-word"?
Kike. No one else seems to be saying it, and we may as well get it out of the way.
 

Zhukov

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L. Declis said:
Zhukov said:
Wait, there's a "K-word"? What on earth is the "k-word"?
Kike. No one else seems to be saying it, and we may as well get it out of the way.
All good. The chap who I quoted PM'd me and explained it.

I was confused since we don't really say "kike" in Australia. Or at least I've never heard it said aloud. I'd only heard it in regards to American media and even then had no idea what it meant.
 

L. Declis

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Zhukov said:
L. Declis said:
Zhukov said:
Wait, there's a "K-word"? What on earth is the "k-word"?
Kike. No one else seems to be saying it, and we may as well get it out of the way.
All good. The chap who I quoted PM'd me and explained it.

I was confused since we don't really say "kike" in Australia. Or at least I've never heard it said aloud. I'd only heard it in regards to American media and even then had no idea what it meant.
Same; I have never heard about it in the U.K. either. Again, I only got it from American media.

According to Google, it's kike because when the Jews first came to the U.S. but couldn't write in Latin characters, they'd put a circle (as a cross is Christian) and a circle in Yiddish is kike or something. Huh.
 

Zhukov

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L. Declis said:
Zhukov said:
L. Declis said:
Zhukov said:
Wait, there's a "K-word"? What on earth is the "k-word"?
Kike. No one else seems to be saying it, and we may as well get it out of the way.
All good. The chap who I quoted PM'd me and explained it.

I was confused since we don't really say "kike" in Australia. Or at least I've never heard it said aloud. I'd only heard it in regards to American media and even then had no idea what it meant.
Same; I have never heard about it in the U.K. either. Again, I only got it from American media.

According to Google, it's kike because when the Jews first came to the U.S. but couldn't write in Latin characters, they'd put a circle (as a cross is Christian) and a circle in Yiddish is kike or something. Huh.
Heh, yeah, I read that too when I was looking into it.

Seems awfully innocuous, calling someone a little circle signature.
 

SonOfVoorhees

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Either the word is offensive or it isnt. One group cant be allowed to use it yet everyone else is condemned for it. If rappers use ****** in rap songs then dont be surprised if some white kids uses it as well.
 

L. Declis

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SonOfVoorhees said:
Either the word is offensive or it isnt. One group cant be allowed to use it yet everyone else is condemned for it. If rappers use ****** in rap songs then dont be surprised if some white kids uses it as well.
I disagree.

Wheelchair isn't offensive.

Retardation isn't offensive.

Microscopic isn't offensive.

Dogs aren't offensive.

Cannot isn't offensive.

Care isn't offensive.

Cousin isn't offensive.

But I call someone a dog-faced retard with a microscopic penis who is wheelchair-bound and therefore useless, and their only hope of ever having sex is to hope their cousin gives them pity sex because no other person will ever care for them... That's offensive.

Anything can be offensive. It's all about context.
 

Scars Unseen

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L. Declis said:
SonOfVoorhees said:
Either the word is offensive or it isnt. One group cant be allowed to use it yet everyone else is condemned for it. If rappers use ****** in rap songs then dont be surprised if some white kids uses it as well.
I disagree.

Wheelchair isn't offensive.

Retardation isn't offensive.

Microscopic isn't offensive.

Dogs aren't offensive.

Cannot isn't offensive.

Care isn't offensive.

Cousin isn't offensive.

But I call someone a dog-faced retard with a microscopic penis who is wheelchair-bound and therefore useless, and their only hope of ever having sex is to hope their cousin gives them pity sex because no other person will ever care for them... That's offensive.

Anything can be offensive. It's all about context.
How's that hair splitting business working for you? What he's saying is that the word "******" - in almost any context that it's actually used by actual people - is racist, and that doesn't change based on the level of melanin in one's skin.
 

Relish in Chaos

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Depends on the context, really. I?d say, only use it around people that you know will be fine with it.

And a lot of black people, such as rappers or comedians, liberally use the word ?nigga? for the same reason that a lot of LGBT people use the word ?queer?. They may not be setting a good example, but in their eyes, they?re reclaiming the word by using it as a casual greeting. Sometimes, they even use it to poke fun at themselves, because it?s not as mean as poking fun at a different marginalised minority for things that there?s still a social sensitivity about.

I dunno about ?Oriental?, but I?ve heard it can be taken as offensive in America but not really here in the UK. I was raised that ?Oriental? merely meant ?people from Far East nations like China, Japan, Korea, Thailand, etc.? rather than a provocative slur like ?*****?. But in public, I?d only say ?Oriental? around my family or my close group of friends who are mature and educated enough to know that I?m not trying to be a dick, and outside of those contexts, I would just use the broader term of ?Asian? (which, in the UK, predominantly refers to people from places like India and the Middle Eastern countries, not the Far Easterners).
 

SonOfVoorhees

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L. Declis said:
SonOfVoorhees said:
Either the word is offensive or it isnt. One group cant be allowed to use it yet everyone else is condemned for it. If rappers use ****** in rap songs then dont be surprised if some white kids uses it as well.
I disagree.

Wheelchair isn't offensive.

Retardation isn't offensive.

Microscopic isn't offensive.

Dogs aren't offensive.

Cannot isn't offensive.

Care isn't offensive.

Cousin isn't offensive.

But I call someone a dog-faced retard with a microscopic penis who is wheelchair-bound and therefore useless, and their only hope of ever having sex is to hope their cousin gives them pity sex because no other person will ever care for them... That's offensive.

Anything can be offensive. It's all about context.
If everything can be offensive then how can ****** be offensive? Everything is how you percieve it to be. You insult me using that phrase i just think your a dumb ass and not offensive (your insult thing was to long). Some things are insulting, yet it depends on who says it and the context its said.