Is it stealing to pirate a game you own physicaly but cant install

[sapphireofthesea]

I don't believe so, I know a lot of devs would argue with me (since they'd get more money if you broke it and had to buy another) but I think most of the money that is paid for a game is going towards the intellectual property, rather than a mass produced disc or cartridge so IMO if you have bought a game I believe it should be ok.

I bought a truck and it broke down so I stole another one from the dealer.

As I said, I believe most of the money is towards intellectual property, rather than individual parts made to make it, which would almost undoubtedly be more expensive in a car.

it doesn't matter what the money is for its still using an illegal copy

In think the better analogy to this would be my truck broke down so i got the mechanic to tool the part that was needed (that could not be obtained. He is not making a copy, he is just unable to install it in the standard way and so must examine a different route.
Using your analogy again, it is not like getting a new truck, it is like not being able to drive the truck out of his street. If he can find a way to get it out of his street then he can happily drive it, otherwise he needs to go and find something completely different. Either way there is no loss to the truck company as he still has the truck, just he is looking for ways to drive it.

 

[Dys]

Given that piracy is different from theft, no, it is not stealing to pirate a game you own. Piracy is never theft, it is piracy. They are different.

Legally yes, it is stealing and you can be punished for it. You bought one license and you are only allowed to use that one license. You can't then download the game and have another license to play it without breaking the EULA that you agree to at installation of the game or simply buying the game.

Right....I've already pointed out that piracy is different from theft, so skimming past that little gem, I'd like to point out that a 'EULA' contract is legally inadmissible unless it's agreed upon before the software is purchased (not after the software is purchased but before it's installed). One cannot enter into a legal contract (such as a sale) and later alter the terms of that contract, that is to say, I cannot sell you software x, then, at installation, specify that you may not make backup copies of the product. You can, however, alter the contract by having a clearly visible part of the box expressly state that the terms of the software license are such that it is a term of purchase that the consumer may not copy the software. Imagine the absurd situation where you purchase, say, a car, for the implied purpose of transport, only to have it delivered and find a notice in the glove box claiming that you are not contractually allowed to use the car except for on road activities, as this was not made clear before that purchase of the car, it is legally inadmissible and you're free to drive the car off-road at will[footnote]Note that the warranty is in no way relevant in this example, as it's a separate contract).[/footnote].

 

[AndrewOfHell]

Go for it, if you pay your part and helped the developers at retail then I think that's fine.

There are consequences though:

The developers/publishers will receive no money that could aid future development.

It may encourage the user to pirate other items.

 

[sapphireofthesea]

I think it's fair to say the majority of people agree that the OP's original dilemma of transferring a PC game to another computer via "illegally" copying or downloading the game he's already paid for once is justifiable because the computer he's wanting to put it on doesn't have a disk drive so he can't simply install it normally.

However, just because I find this topic of conversation interesting here are a few examples of different hypothetical scenarios and would like to see if people also think these are justifiable or in people's view wrong (or perhaps pushing it).

1) I go out and buy a legal copy of a multi-format game for either PC/PS3/360, and then download a copied version of the same game for the other formats.

2)I go out and buy a legal copy of a multi-format game second-hand for either PC/PS3/360, and then download a copied version(s) of the same game for the other formats.

3) I buy a game first hand for any format, I then download a copied version sell my game and keep the copy to play.

4) In 1992 I pay £50 for a first hand copy of Sonic the Hedgehog for the Sega Megadrive (Genesis), in 2011 I no longer have my Megadrive (lost, damaged or sold) or Sonic game, but I download a emulator and a rom of the game as it is something I paid for back in '92.

5) Same as 4 but I still have my Sonic the Hedgehog game in a closet or attic somewhere (but not necessarily have the Megadrive).

Personally I don't think any of these are really justified, except for possibly number 5 which could be argued is ok but is still a rather controversial issue. Anyway I'd love to hear other opinions either for or against.

Any game over about 10 years old has already had it's rights lost (copyrights do expire). While some studios renew it many just drop into freeware.
So while 1-3 are defo dodgy (I personally wouldn't use it as an excuse and would look to buy the one that fits the format I will use the most, maybe trade for a different format if I change) 4 and 5 are compleyely legit as they would have dropped into freeware range (roughly 1-2 years or so after they cease to release copies of the game, but I usualy go with the 10 year rule, just to be sure).

 

[Pyro Paul]

However, just because I find this topic of conversation interesting here are a few examples of different hypothetical scenarios and would like to see if people also think these are justifiable or in people's view wrong (or perhaps pushing it).

1) I go out and buy a legal copy of a multi-format game for either PC/PS3/360, and then download a copied version of the same game for the other formats.

2)I go out and buy a legal copy of a multi-format game second-hand for either PC/PS3/360, and then download a copied version(s) of the same game for the other formats.

3) I buy a game first hand for any format, I then download a copied version sell my game and keep the copy to play.

4) In 1992 I pay £50 for a first hand copy of Sonic the Hedgehog for the Sega Megadrive (Genesis), in 2011 I no longer have my Megadrive (lost, damaged or sold) or Sonic game, but I download a emulator and a rom of the game as it is something I paid for back in '92.

5) Same as 4 but I still have my Sonic the Hedgehog game in a closet or attic somewhere (but not necessarily have the Megadrive).

Personally I don't think any of these are really justified, except for possibly number 5 which could be argued is ok but is still a rather controversial issue. Anyway I'd love to hear other opinions either for or against.

1/2. Arguable, as pointed out in the post i made just above yours.
some will point out that the DMCA protects this so long as you own the Console(s) and Game as the game is an 'Adaptation' in order to work on that specific console.

others will point out that the versions of the game designed to work on diffrent consoles are acctually diffrent games. case in point Resident Evil 4 for the PS2 and Resident Evil 4 for the GameCube. the PS2 Version has diffrent content as the cut scenes could not be procedurally generated on the fly because of the PS2 limited processing power... and because the content is not identical, the two games are diffrent.


3. Illegal, Violation of DMCA. Section 117-2:
(all) copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful.

4/5. If the Console is:
Lost/stolen- Illegal
Damaged and disposed of- Illegal
Damaged but in possession of- Legal
Sold- Illegal

even in the open arguments defending emulators, you must be in possession of the console you are emulating. The same pertains to the game (again SMCA, Section 117-2).

 

[Wicky_42]

Wow thats a hard one, I think you still are technically pirating the game.

He already owns a license to use it, and that's all you buy when you purchase a game. Since he's still only using the one license, and no-one else is, then he would appear to be fine. Of course, the guy seeding the torrent/whatever is in violation of copyright laws, but not our chap here.

 

[ultimateownage]

Would it be wrong to find that your copy of a PC game is broken, so you go and steal another copy from the same store you bought it from? Even if you give it back later?

 

[Something Amyss]

Recently my gaming computer broke down so im forced to use a netbook my mom lent me now what I am wondering is if it is considered stealing if I own the game example Gothic 1 but becouse the netbook lacks a disc drive I cant install and play it like normal so is it bad to get a online copy for a game I legitedly own?



I dont support piracy or theaft and such so this is why I am asking if this kinda question is against rules then sorry in advance.

It's not stealing, period. It's still piracy, however. People might argue it's "justified piracy," but it's still illegal to do so.

 

[Pyro Paul]

Any game over about 10 years old has already had it's rights lost (copyrights do expire). While some studios renew it many just drop into freeware.
So while 1-3 are defo dodgy (I personally wouldn't use it as an excuse and would look to buy the one that fits the format I will use the most, maybe trade for a different format if I change) 4 and 5 are compleyely legit as they would have dropped into freeware range (roughly 1-2 years or so after they cease to release copies of the game, but I usualy go with the 10 year rule, just to be sure).

a Copyright Expires 95 years after publication.
120 years if under special cases.

the argument about some oldware isn't that the copyright has expired, it is the company that held the copyright no longer exists. Like when 3DO caved in 2003. while some of their more popular franchise where bought up (ArmyMen, Might and Magic, etc.) a large portion of their cataloge was not.

people argue that because these games no longer have a copyright holder they in turn become public domain.

 

[ImpofthePerverse]

@Pyro Paul

Your post above mine was posted as I was writing, but I did read it afterwards, like I say it's all very interesting.


@sapphireofthesea
I used Sonic as an example because I know it's a game that is available on a number of platforms today STEAM/Xbox Live/PSN for around about £4. So it's not a game that really falls into free or abandonware as it is easily available and reasonably priced for a game that's 20 years old (bearing mind it cost £50 back in the day).


EDIT: Wow 95-120 years for copyright, is that just video games? I know literature is 70 years after the creator's death.

 

[isnosche]

As for the o.p.
I used to own a gamestore & my friend still does (a second hand one).

[In europe ]

far as we know, Even downloading a pirated version when you have the
Original disc's (bought new or second hand) or have the unique bought key.
Is legal, basicly the publisher didn't provide a channel for you to get it.
trough helpdesk or steam. You can even use your friends discs and use your key
(though i know this is not an option here)


1) I go out and buy a legal copy of a multi-format game for either PC/PS3/360, and then download a copied version of the same game for the other formats.

This is illigal, same as its illigal to download a blueray for a dvd or vhs you own
Different format is a no no

2)I go out and buy a legal copy of a multi-format game second-hand for either PC/PS3/360, and then download a copied version(s) of the same game for the other formats.

See point 1 - Store bought or via Ebay or where ever you want - still different format

3) I buy a game first hand for any format, I then download a copied version sell my game and keep the copy to play.

Still a no, since you sold the license to own that game.


4) In 1992 I pay £50 for a first hand copy of Sonic the Hedgehog for the Sega Megadrive (Genesis), in 2011 I no longer have my Megadrive (lost, damaged or sold) or Sonic game, but I download a emulator and a rom of the game as it is something I paid for back in '92.

Nope, since you dont own a legal copy anymore of the game .

5) Same as 4 but I still have my Sonic the Hedgehog game in a closet or attic somewhere (but not necessarily have the Megadrive).

A very grey area this one, Last time we checked the law on this one, if you owned a copy and that copy was not available on the system you are running it on.
like not on the wiipoint system or xbox life sony store. It would be okay
Thats to say playing the ORIGINAL Wad , this does not count for any updated versions designed for the wii,xbox,ps3

like i said very grey area, also the means to play it - softmod hard mod would have to be legal. In your country it might be legal to play the game on your system playing the actual wad, but not be legal to actualy hard-softmod your wii.
Kind of like the soft drugs laws in some countries (legal to own-not to buy,sell)

 

[Pyro Paul]

Would it be wrong to find that your copy of a PC game is broken, so you go and steal another copy from the same store you bought it from? Even if you give it back later?

Yes. you're stealing a Box and a Plastic CD.
the Data on the CD you already own so you're not stealing it.

again, Digital Mellineium Copyright Act section 117.

 

[ultimateownage]

Would it be wrong to find that your copy of a PC game is broken, so you go and steal another copy from the same store you bought it from? Even if you give it back later?

Yes. you're stealing a Box and a Plastic CD.
the Data on the CD you already own so you're not stealing it.

again, Digital Mellineium Copyright Act section 117.

Yes, but if you return it in the same condition you took it and used it just to install the game is that not the same thing?

 

[ImpofthePerverse]

Yes, but if you return it in the same condition you took it and used it just to install the game is that not the same thing?

If you've STOLEN the copy of the game in the first place then yes, it's wrong. Perhaps if you bought the game, installed it then took it back for a refund it'd be less illegal.

 

[ZombieGenesis]

I've done it bunches of times because my Acer One has no cd drive. There's no practical or moral reason to say it's wrong to, only legal policy nonsense. And I know my fair share of policy nonsence, I work in the law, I admit it's 98% bull.

 

[isnosche]

Would it be wrong to find that your copy of a PC game is broken, so you go and steal another copy from the same store you bought it from? Even if you give it back later?

Yes. you're stealing a Box and a Plastic CD.
the Data on the CD you already own so you're not stealing it.

again, Digital Mellineium Copyright Act section 117.

Yes, but if you return it in the same condition you took it and used it just to install the game is that not the same thing?

This is a very bad comparison to start with but here goes ..

Same thing as stealing the same car you bought when your car breaks - not okay -
This is simply stealing someone elses copy of that design.
STEALING from a vendor then returning it is still STEALING.... END

You could borrow it (the game) from a friend or a public library and use your Key to install.
This would be legal

 

[Pyro Paul]

Would it be wrong to find that your copy of a PC game is broken, so you go and steal another copy from the same store you bought it from? Even if you give it back later?

Yes. you're stealing a Box and a Plastic CD.
the Data on the CD you already own so you're not stealing it.

again, Digital Mellineium Copyright Act section 117.

Yes, but if you return it in the same condition you took it and used it just to install the game is that not the same thing?

... No.
it is not.

Theft is the Act of taking something that doesn't belong to you.
Returning it after words does not remove the fact that you stole it.

You Stole a Plastic Case and CD.

regardless if you have the content on the CD or Not... you stole something from that establishment.

 

[Anti Nudist Cupcake]

Recently my gaming computer broke down so im forced to use a netbook my mom lent me now what I am wondering is if it is considered stealing if I own the game example Gothic 1 but becouse the netbook lacks a disc drive I cant install and play it like normal so is it bad to get a online copy for a game I legitedly own?



I dont support piracy or theaft and such so this is why I am asking if this kinda question is against rules then sorry in advance.

I honestly don't think there's anything wrong with downloading it, you DID buy the game so the developers don't lose any money.

I feel you're pain... My awesome pc has been busted as well and i'm waiting for a call from the supplier but it's been busted now for six weeks .

Even made a thread about it here.

 

[rokkolpo]

You already know the answer.

Why would you come here if you didn't.

 

[Pandaman1911]

Piracy is piracy, it doesn't matter why you're doing it. In the eyes of the law, it's wrong, and that's all that really matters. I don't see anything wrong with it, but the judge will.