Is this right, or even legal?

[ToastiestZombie]

[EDIT numero tres!] Removed the bit about him not liking water since many people here are just using that to say that he deserved it, when truly that fact is very very trivial.

I'm neutral about the topic, but I don't think removing information because people use it to make a point you don't agree with is right.

It's because that the people who dont agree with me are using that, and only that in their arguments. I already knew that this debate was a half and half situation, I just wanted to see if the attacking comments changed after I deleted it. I was not trying to sway the people to think like me. Still, if you read the edit then the info is still there, its just not in the actual main paragraph.

 

[willsham45]

I am sure there is a health and safty issue there, That is not right, suspention would be too harsh and yes detention do nothing.

I am all for creative punishments In my school typiclly the teacher with the harshest punishments, detention while she was on duty so your detention is in the dinner hall with her also gave detentions to those who did not compleat homework even if they were not in when the work was given.

But still sounds like a tough one, insidently the best thing to do would probally to beat up the socal workers and just give the kid what he wants, I do not think I have ever seen a socal worker sean in a good light.

 

[Shannon Matchett]

This reads to me like a very thinly veiled complaint about the head teacher. Every comment I've read from the OP is discrediting the headmaster or school policy and additionally, isn't there a breach of privacy that your mother is telling you about the issues of your classmate? From the sounds of it, she's a teacher or otherwise carer at the school who is privy to the circumstances of that messed up kid.
On topic, however, the child stole from the school and can be punished accordingly. If he's going to steal because he doesn't like water and doesn't respect other people's property or paying for things, then he's going to have to get used to cleaning toilets or pushing trolleys, because that's the path laid out for him.

 

[Sir Thomas Sean Connery]

To be completely honest? I don't think it was "Wrong" for him to steal the drink in the first place.

Stealing is NOT inherently wrong.

And obviously, that punishment is FAR too extreme for trying to grab some soda.

Yes, stealing IS inherently wrong. you are taking something that doesn't belong to you. He wasn't dying of thirst. Shitty or not, there was alternatives but for whatever reason he decided it was better to steal than to take what was free just because he didn't like it. Having a shitty life doesn't justify crime.
The punishment I agree was excessive. A better alternative should have been reached though what I don't know.

I disagree on the issue of stealing being wrong 100% of the time (and explain why in later posts) and if you had read those later posts, you would realize that I have come around on this one and I agree that a can of soda is neither a just nor good reason to steal.

 

[BlumiereBleck]

That'd make the news here in the States.

Which probably explains why your schools are also often making the news for being out of control, needing to have security guards, and metal detectors.

I blame hollywood and the rap music

 

[ninetails593]

[EDIT numero tres!] Removed the bit about him not liking water since many people here are just using that to say that he deserved it, when truly that fact is very very trivial.

I'm neutral about the topic, but I don't think removing information because people use it to make a point you don't agree with is right.

It's because that the people who dont agree with me are using that, and only that in their arguments. I already knew that this debate was a half and half situation, I just wanted to see if the attacking comments changed after I deleted it. I was not trying to sway the people to think like me. Still, if you read the edit then the info is still there, its just not in the actual main paragraph.

If I remove something and put EDIT: Removed couch bit, I've still removed information. My point was more that you shouldn't remove information because you think it's useless or invalid. You should make your point as to why it's useless or invalid, whilst keeping it in.

 

[Helscreama]

EDIT: I say all this and I do believe in it, but there is something else I feel I should mention - when kids are already society's scumbags and can't be helped in conventional means, then using the sort of discipline they will respond to is something I feel is acceptable too. That is, bring back caning and corporal punishment, and National Service. Teachers have too little power now and are sometimes even running scared in their own classrooms, harsher discipline would do wonders to make things better...

I loved your edit. The world would be a much better place if kids had a better sense of discipline. I don't believe in hurting them but making National Service a requirement at a later age or possibly bring in Cadetship as a requirement during Primary/Secondary schooling.

The problem with National Service and Cadetship is that you compromise a lot of people's moral values for discipline, which is wrong. I think of the choices we get to make as humans, the right to not fight and kill is a big 'un, and the right to object to fighting and killing is another big 'un.

Besides, we have the CCF (Combined Cadet Force) at my school (though it's voluntary) and the big problem with that, it's not soldiers in charge, it's older kids. And the day I respect one of those over-zealous power-hungry bastards is the day I drown myself in hydrochloric acid.

As a cadet or member of the National Service you aren't required to kill people, there are such things as non-combat roles. National Service also doesn't have to be military, in Australia we have the State Emergency Services, who respond to national disasters.

 

[brighteye]

As it states in the question that normal punishment doesnt work, i would agree that labour for a minimum of one hour and a maximum of eight is perfectly suited the situation.
I would also suggest that the timelimit for this labour doubles for each future theft, then its up to the kid to decide how much labour he will do.

What is strange is that i dont see a suggestion for an alternative from the guy asking this question to begin with, he clearly dont agree, but doesnt serve any alternative ?

 

[SenseOfTumour]

I'd suggest if this punishment was to go thru, I'd have made it one hour, AFTER school.

He does the time, without the associated public humiliation. I fear a kid who already has problems is going to get labelled toilet boy or worse for the duration of his school years.

It really doesn't take much for a kid to get labelled 'weird' and end up on the outside and teachers and other adults shouldn't take any action that adds to that.

 

[Archedgar]

Thievery is unacceptable.


I don't care what kind of life he's had, you don't teach kids that "stealing is A-ok!", you come down hard and make sure it doesn't happen again.
Sure, give him the counseling he needs, but he absolutely needs to be punished.

 

[TheDarkestDerp]

Beats having his offending hand cut off in town square. Standard punishment for stealing in some cultures.

 

[Legit101]

................

 

[Aethren]

How the hell can someone not like water? Good water has no taste, no ill effects whatsoever, and is very good at quenching thirst. Even then, he couldn't bum a...whatever they call a dollar there...from someone? This kid had plenty of options available to him, yet all he could manage was theft. A bit of labor is a fitting punishment, I say.

 

[SuperiorityComplex]

It strikes me that those saying this boy deserved what he got, also sound very akin to those saying disabled people deserve what they get

I love it when people completely miss the point and throw out these completely irrelevant comparisons. We aren't talking about a disabled person having it hard because they're disabled, we're talking about a kid who passed up free water and instead stole a drink because "I don't like water".

Really? I love how you can imagine how exactly this whole thing worked out because you were there. I mean, totally there, right?

Also, I said it sounded like. It's actually not irrelevant, at all. It's a comparison, because ultimately the boy got a far worse deal than anyone should get. He admitted he stole the soda. And for admitting it, he got thrown to the wolves, because he cleaned the bathrooms whilst people were still using them. I've actually never seen a school janitor or cleaner clean bathrooms during school time in my life, and I did go to school for 12 years. Why make a child what you wouldn't let an adult do? Adults don't clean the toilets during school time because it's impossible to. Kids are retardedly messy. Always have been.

Edit: I posted this late because I'd actually just seen a reply to a quote of mine earlier and I still feel the need to point out- kid shouldn't have nicked it. Simple as. I still don't see how forcing him to clean sanitation areas at a time you wouldn't ask adults to clean the same sanitation areas is an effective punishment, at all.