Jimquisition: Solving the Sexism Situation

[zvate]

Games are designed to make money (they may also make meaningful statements as a bonus but I don't think any game has ever been designed not to make a profit...). The horny heterosexual male has proven an especially profitable demographic. Shove in some sex appeal and they buy it in droves. While women certainly have the capacity to be as dumb as men, until they have demonstrated the willingness to be as stupid and easily led on mass there seems little need for games to pander to them as well. And last time I checked Playboy was still outselling Playgirl, My spam filter was still overflowing with male rather than female enhancement spam and female objectifying porn was still the most popular and profitable thing on the internet. If the goal is equality we do not need male NPCs in thongs we need more stupid horny women with cash...

 

[Scorched_Cascade]

Something that pisses me off about this is that if a user said the same things or posted the same images of half-naked men, penis wolves, and Duke Nukem with no pants on, they'd be promptly banned. If we can't do that, then why should we tolerate him doing it?

[sub]sorry for the quote notification[/sub]
I second this, is this really the sort of thing The Escapist wants to be seen advocating?

I'm going to tack my own question on the end as well. In those four minutes was anything said or shown that I wouldn't have gotten if I started a thread on somewhere like Gamespot or solicited an opinion from youtube comments? [sub]Before you point to the R34 duke I'll suggest that I probably would have had something similar posted in reply to me in those places...[/sub]

It is not parody/satire if you blur the line so much that you become what you are parodying.

Take for example comedians who I've seen take a sideswipe at this issue (sexism in general not sexism in games); Jimmy Carr, Keith Lemon and Al Murray. These comedians also play characters and can come across as a bit controversial. They get away with it because you can tell from watching or listening to them, without them having to outright explain, that it is not their view and that they are just playing the fool. With Jim I'm not so sure.

 

[trollnystan]

Meh, I still don't like him. But I don't have to watch him so if others do like him no skin off my nose.

I might argue against his whole "Men are genetically wired to like to look at tits" bit as I believe that it is more of a cultural thing than genetic - although they do play their part I suppose. Only my opinion though, just like that is only his.

He still hasn't said anything (on the Escapist) that I, as a woman, take serious offence at really, so I'll watch next week and see then whether or not I'll watch him every week or whether I simply ignore him. I doubt he'll care either way; I'm not his demographic =)

/2 cents

 

[Booze Zombie]

They could also give all of the characters personalities, make the slutty women and men wear less clothing than the more "up-tight" and naive muscle-head women and men.

An example of this would be Mass Effect 2, Miranda had this space-Nazi vibe going on, with the uptight officer look and the idea of perfection worn in the form of revealing clothes.

On the other hand, Garrus was armour, tactical visor, he was ready to fight and maybe he had a few scares... he didn't care. He wore that attitude.

Mirranda and Garrus both wore their attitudes, like their appearance came from their personalities, not solely because Bioware wanted an ass-shot in every cutscene with Miranda (they did like to sneak a few in, though). So, that's how I think devs should do it right; work on personality, think about whatever that personality is would wear, do, say, etc, have their being grow organically from the idea of what "they" are.

I think that would solve the problem.

 

[Raistlinhawke]

With all due respect, Escapist, as it is your site and all, but weren't we clear with the initial reaction this new series? Menial improvements does not make up for his complete lack of joke ability and abrasive, unappealing demeanor. His production values are still rock bottom, and he still fails to offer a concise, valid point in any meaningful way.

At the very least I hope at least a portion of the detractors have the courage of their convictions and follow through with their threat to abandon viewership of the site until Sterling's removal. It would at least provide the free market excuse for dumping the series apparently needed in this situation.

Please Escapist, at least do the most obvious math, not that much effort is required here.

 

[icame]

BRILLIANT!

 

[fulano]

Had a good chuckle at this one. I was hopeful after episode 1, and indeed it seems like somebody read the comments and took on some of the criticism; this episode is much slicker all round. Looking forward to the next one!

Not crazy about the MS paint drawings, though. I guess I can appreciate that the video needs something to break it up a little.

Has Jim ever seriously talked to a woman about this topic before? I mean, where does he get it that the issue would be solved if they exploited everyone "equally"? Or maybe I'm just ignorant and am not aware of the growing trend of women demanding men without their clothes on in their videogames, to get their rocks off. Women, on average, have a different sets of base preferences than those of males.

I'm a woman. When I Play Left 4 Dead 2, I purposefully choose a character other than Ellis so that I can stare at his arse while he runs ahead of me. Have you ever seriously talked to a woman about this topic before?

Plenty, actually.

But, hey, you happen to be the exception who wants to see more flesh in her male characters 'cause that should be what equates matters, apparently. Good for you.

 

[Lord_Gremlin]

You know, he's 100% right about Devil May Cry. Same thing with Prince of Persia by the way. And actually Kratos.

 

[Gamblerjoe]

I gave this guy a second chance. This isnt as bas as the fist one, but it still pretty terrible. He doesnt make any points or add any insight to the situation. He just bitches and offers an incredibly half-assed solution. This show is one dimensional, unoriginal, lackluster, and has no reason to exist.

 

[EmpressZombiKitty]

I think this was an improvement over last episode. Still dumb penis drawings, but he used more in-game video and had a better backdrop. I'll watch a 3rd episode to see if he continues to improve.

Also, since sex does sell and it wont be going away ANY time soon. Why not throw in some more Kratos type outfits here and there. At least it would be fair and amusing to me.

 

[wizzy555]

It does solve something, it solves the inequality. When presented with any inequality there is usually more than one way to solve it.

I don't want to derail the thread, but what's with all the my little pony avatars?

I enjoy the show is all, so I am expressing that I am a fan of Rainbow Dash- but if you'd like to know more about that, just PM me please. I would like to get on topic since we're on a pretty important issue:

That's the problem actually. It's so simple the way he 'solved' inequality. That won't solve anything because if people decided to go with his idea, what would that really solve? Then our games would revolve around men and women both looking sexual which would strip the game's meaning. Not to mention that the way he presented his idea was just ..awful.

Besides that, the issue is still at large today. If it was that simple, it would of been solved 20-30 years ago (As [user]Okysho[/user] stated above 2 posts). Just to clarify that even if he did make a good point (which I know and agree with most he didn't) that he wasn't even funny about it. Just sickens me really.. inequality is far more complex then what it seems and making the guys as attractive will only add onto the problem believe it or not.

I wasn't singling your avatar out, I've seen a lot of them in this thread and wondered if a meme was going on.

Why does sexualisation strip something of it's meaning? Even Shakespere's Macbeth had penis jokes in.

 

[mjc0961]

Oh man, that was great! I had to pause at the Marcus Fenix in a thong part. "WHO WANTS TOAST?!" Ah man did I laugh.

Anyway, treating men in games the same way as women get treated in them instead of treating women. That's certainly an interesting idea. Hopefully some creative developer out there will try that just to see how it turns out.

Also, I just want to say that I liked this episode a lot better than the previous one. This leaves something to discuss, which is nice. I like that better than the previous episode which basically left "Well no shit games aren't movies, I wish more developers would realize that too" as the only thing to say.

 

[EmpressZombiKitty]

Had a good chuckle at this one. I was hopeful after episode 1, and indeed it seems like somebody read the comments and took on some of the criticism; this episode is much slicker all round. Looking forward to the next one!

Not crazy about the MS paint drawings, though. I guess I can appreciate that the video needs something to break it up a little.

Has Jim ever seriously talked to a woman about this topic before? I mean, where does he get it that the issue would be solved if they exploited everyone "equally"? Or maybe I'm just ignorant and am not aware of the growing trend of women demanding men without their clothes on in their videogames, to get their rocks off. Women, on average, have a different sets of base preferences than those of males.

I'm a woman. When I Play Left 4 Dead 2, I purposefully choose a character other than Ellis so that I can stare at his arse while he runs ahead of me. Have you ever seriously talked to a woman about this topic before?

Plenty, actually.

But, hey, you happen to be the exception who wants to see more flesh in her male characters 'cause that should be what equates matters, apparently. Good for you.

Yeah, I'm a woman and I wouldn't mind to see more half-naked men. Also, to brownstudies, I usually choose Coach or Rochelle...because Nick is just as good.

 

[Roboto]

I turned it off at the duke's balls part. Don't need that. Won't watch again.

 

[mjc0961]

I gotta be honest. I was hoping that when this guy didn't post a video in the past 3 weeks I thought the Escapist might have scrapped him. I'm basically going to reiterate my points that I did on his last video because they still apply here.

It was one week man. First video was April 18th, he skipped next week (April 25th) to take some of the feedback into consideration and get a background and a little podium, and then made a new video for today (May 2nd).

 

[ArmorArmadillo]

Very, very, very, very bad. First, tackles one of the deadest horses in gaming issues and doesn't really offer anything new. Second, has this constant smug "Oh, did that shocking thing I just said offend you? Yeah, well sorry but I'm shocking so deal with that." weasely thing going on.

the reason why hardcore criticism and shocking imagery works for Yahtzee is that there's this definite sense in ZP vids that he is not interested in your opinion. ZP wheels past shocks and opinions with a kind of contempt for everything from a man who seems to be talking out loud to himself.

In this, it's that kind of thing where he smugly stops and lingers on each point like he's desperately concerned for making sure that he really did pop your monocle out you because even though he's trying to offend you he really cares about your opinion.

The worst thing about this, though, is that it's really nothing but a worse version of shows the Escapist already has. ZP does shocking funny offcolor British guy better, MovieBob does ranting guy better, Extra Punctuation does gaming insights better. I don't see what it brings to the table.

 

[A_who]

I feel a little sick because I saw the picture of duke nukem.

 

[Frozengale]

I gotta be honest. I was hoping that when this guy didn't post a video in the past 3 weeks I thought the Escapist might have scrapped him. I'm basically going to reiterate my points that I did on his last video because they still apply here.

It was one week man. First video was April 18th, he skipped next week (April 25th) to take some of the feedback into consideration and get a background and a little podium, and then made a new video for today (May 2nd).

Huh... seems longer. Maybe I was just being hopeful.

 

[Loki the Fool]

I thought games was starting to objectify men more... I was surprised by Heavy Rain and Fragile Dreams...

 

[jovack22]

0 for 2

he has nothing to say, he just says things angry and sarcastic and believes he's some intelligent pundit.