To begin on topic; yes, as a Christian, I am looking forward to the "end of the world." My reasons for doing so probably differ considerably from the average wasteland wanderer, though.
Housebroken Lunatic said:
Christian? Prayer?
Aren't you the ones claiming that God has some sort of infinitely complex "divine plan" for exactly everything in existence?
If he does, do you really think that he'd CHANGE that divine plan just because you get down on your knees, clasp your hands together and begs him to?
And now, to discuss HL's posts.
There is nothing contradictory about a Christian praying for the second coming of Christ. Jesus Himself said (in "the Lord's prayer;" Luke 11:2) that we (Christians) are to pray "Our Father in heaven ... Your kingdom come. Your will be done On earth as it is in heaven." This isn't because Christians want to see the world burn; rather, we're praying for the fulfillment of God's plan on the earth. To say that this is something completely separate from our personal lives is folly; we are a part of God's plan and are individually responsible to do what He has called us to. We aren't praying to try and get God to change His will (Malachi 3:6 says that God doesn't change,) rather we're praying
for God's will to be done - a process which involves positive changes in our personal lives, in the church (as a whole,) and in the world at large.
Housebroken Lunatic said:
Well revelations wasn't written by God now was it? Humans wrote it. So it is essentially worthless as a source of information if you're trying to determine what God is planning.
The Bible would beg to differ with your comment on Revelation (John 1:1, 2 Timothy 3:16-17.) Now, the legitimacy of these claims is a whole different debate - one close to the very heart of Christianity. This is something that every individual has to decide for themselves, and I'm not interested in trying to beat you into agreement with me (a feat neigh impossible to accomplish because, again, it involves a personal decision.) What I
do hope you'll agree with me on is the fact that Christianity does see the Bible as the canonical Word of God, and as such Revelation provides a wealth of valuable insight into the plan of God to all who share this belief.
Housebroken Lunatic said:
Also your somewhat off-topic statements didn't answer my question in the slightest, and the question remains:
Why would God in his "infinite wisdom", CHANGE any of his divine plans because some little Christian ask him to? I mean they are DIVINE plans after all, it's pretty safe to assume that there's no stopping or changing them just because some insignificant human wants them to be changed, stopped or altered in any other way.
From what I gather, the question you're asking essentially boils down to "If God already has a divine plan, who are you to think that anything you do will change it?" Is this correct?
The problem with this line of thinking is that, while God
does have a divine plan for the world that will
ultimately be accomplished, we, as individuals, are also involved in His plan on a personal level - a level which includes prayer.
For example, it's God's will for everybody to accept Jesus as their personal Lord and savior (1 Timothy 2:3-4,) but we have a part to play in this. Romans 10:9-10 says "...if
you confess with
your mouth the Lord Jesus and
[you] believe in
your heart that God has raised Him from the dead,
you will be saved." Now, obviously, there's a whole lot of "you" involved in that verse. God has given you the authority in this situation, as well as many other areas where prayer is involved, and He's not going to overwrite that authority. So God, in essence, needs men and women to pray before He can move in certain areas; not because He isn't big enough to take care of things on His own but because He has chosen to get His kids involved. Hopefully that will help clarify the position that prayer plays in Christian life.
GZGoten said:
the bible also states god's kingdom won't come until the entire world is Christianized. Might as well never come you'll have an easier time finding the sun in the middle of the night
I don't know of anywhere in the Bible where this is stated; are you sure that you haven't been misinformed? If you find any Bible verses that support this view, please post them here. I'd love to have a look.
