let's debate piracy and the hypocrisy behind it

[L-J-F]

Well:

* Piracy obviously isn't great for the developers.
* Piracy is EXAGGERATED to the extremes, inflated out of all proportion.
* "Fighting" piracy only strengthens it.
* Being a douche to your paying customers only strengthens it further.

 

[JonnWood]

Well:
* Piracy obviously isn't great for the developers.
* Piracy is EXAGGERATED to the extremes, inflated out of all proportion.
* "Fighting" piracy only strengthens it.
* Being a douche to your paying customers only strengthens it further.

* DRM obviously isn't great for the players.
* DRM is EXAGGERATED to the extremes, inflated out of all proportion.
* "Fighting" DRM only strengthens it.
* Being a douche to game developers only strengthens DRM further.

Hm.

 

[Asehujiko]

Pirate: "This is the situation we have in an undeveloped country completely ignored by publishers or basically any type of available jobs."
Anti-pirates: "I'm not in the same situation as you so you are wrong because my personal experience is universal. Also, my opinion is a fact and disagreeing makes you a bad person."
Pirate: "You are not addressing my points"
Anti-pirates "LALALALALA CAN'T HEAR YOU OVER HOW RIGHT I AM"

A general summary of this thread.

Yes, there are valid arguments against piracy but most of the fallacious and strawmanny rhetoric here wouldn't look out of place on an Irish town square after an English club called Pirates beat the home soccer team.

And from my clipboard of things I have to say 20 times a day:
And I re-iterate again, most likely in vain since nobody seems to read my posts beyond the first paragraph, I am against people who pass their opinion as a fact, not pro or anti . I don't fully agree with either side. I just think that circular logic has no place in discussions and you are displaying a lot more of it then the other side in this topic.

 

[zarathustra2k1]

Maybe you'll say this is purely semantics (wait for it...) but IP infringement is _not_ theft - & it 'Bugs The hell Outta Me' (tm) when folk churn out said horse-puckey. Theft (legally speaking) is a very specific term: the unlawful removal of an object from the owner. I'm paraphrasing here & I ought to be precise. Here's a legal dictionary's entry: "A criminal act in which property belonging to another is taken without that person's consent."

Duplication of data may well be copyright infringement but it ain't theft. Please stop saying it is or I may cry.

Thank you - much love.

Terry Tibbs, Esq.

 

[numaiomul]

snip

I don't really feel like wading through 100+ posts about you trying to justify your need to feel privileged. The only reason I can think of that you wouldn't have a job is because you're too young. And if that's the case, then why the fuck can you afford a computer and high speed internet, but not food? Like I said before (and you, for some reason, ignored), if you have to justify something, especially to strangers, you know it's wrong.

An in regards to what you said about whateverhisnamewas, it's not really a mistake if you keep doing it. My assessment is that you are too young to know what the fuck you're talking about, so stop talking about it.

am i the only one tho thinks you have no right in a smart conversation? you posted in the first page telling me i have some guilt on my conscious which is as me saying: "you have a guilty conscious because you go to the toilet when the digestive process ends". i said it before but i am gonna repeat myself just for fun because i know you won't even read my entire post.
so i was born in a country where buying games is and exception and the motto of the country is "if he doesn't feed you, you can ignore his needs" so i have no moral dilemma here. there are no jobs, taxes are sky-high and internet and computers you can find free at the corner of the street [about two moths ago i found a 60gb hdd, a busted mother board, 2 functional cooling fans, 256 MB ram in a busted pc tower] so if you know where to look you can get a computer and high-speed internet is mostly because of my mother because she need it at her job and i have to right some documentation for the right to use it.
Dr.Doctor how old are you? I am 18 years old and i highly suspect that i would have had a ban or probation by now taking into consideration that we have been discussing an illegal subject until now me being the one that started it, but i know how to discuss a subject without being controversial and my needs and wants aren't illegal.
i don't have a need to feel privileged.
anyway some said that here is a circular logic. i doubt it. it's almost a spiral and i solved my main problem my biggest issue was with the hate on pirates and i got some enlightement. most people are idiots whose only world existent is their own. they can't possibly imagine someone looking through the garbage of a pc store looking for a functional 520MB ram. they will continue to hate and be blind to the problems of the world which is good in some situations they are the normal people who the world leaders can control easily by finding escape goats. still i found some really interesting people here [from both sides of the war] and i really wish to thank you for this hard fought battle
of and i agree with the fact that piracy isn't stealing, it's scamming an investment. the game itself is just a normal cd with a different setup of 1 and 0, but we don't pay for the product we pay for the investment of time and money the developers put into finding a combination of 1 and 0 that actually works.
anyhow i didn't expect developers to actually see this thread and listen to any of my concerns [although i sent a message to shamus http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/columns/experienced-points/7467-Experienced-Points-Impossible-to-beat-DRM to join the conversation but it was no use]. anyway i got my answers so mostlly we can either snipe the remaining idiots that want to flame or just go into a spiral conversation that never gets resolved because there isn't yet a resolve. you can't make me buy every game [because i don't have money] and i can't make you change the minds of developers to make new methods of payment for games in undeveloped countries.
anyway if there are still unresolved issues with this topic please continue but i found out what i wanted

 

[Dr. Doctor]

snip

I don't really feel like wading through 100+ posts about you trying to justify your need to feel privileged. The only reason I can think of that you wouldn't have a job is because you're too young. And if that's the case, then why the fuck can you afford a computer and high speed internet, but not food? Like I said before (and you, for some reason, ignored), if you have to justify something, especially to strangers, you know it's wrong.

An in regards to what you said about whateverhisnamewas, it's not really a mistake if you keep doing it. My assessment is that you are too young to know what the fuck you're talking about, so stop talking about it.

am i the only one tho thinks you have no right in a smart conversation? you posted in the first page telling me i have some guilt on my conscious which is as me saying: "you have a guilty conscious because you go to the toilet when the digestive process ends". i said it before but i am gonna repeat myself just for fun because i know you won't even read my entire post.
so i was born in a country where buying games is and exception and the motto of the country is "if he doesn't feed you, you can ignore his needs" so i have no moral dilemma here. there are no jobs, taxes are sky-high and internet and computers you can find free at the corner of the street [about two moths ago i found a 60gb hdd, a busted mother board, 2 functional cooling fans, 256 MB ram in a busted pc tower] so if you know where to look you can get a computer and high-speed internet is mostly because of my mother because she need it at her job and i have to right some documentation for the right to use it.
Dr.Doctor how old are you? I am 18 years old and i highly suspect that i would have had a ban or probation by now taking into consideration that we have been discussing an illegal subject until now me being the one that started it, but i know how to discuss a subject without being controversial and my needs and wants aren't illegal.
i don't have a need to feel privileged.
anyway some said that here is a circular logic. i doubt it. it's almost a spiral and i solved my main problem my biggest issue was with the hate on pirates and i got some enlightement. most people are idiots whose only world existent is their own. they can't possibly imagine someone looking through the garbage of a pc store looking for a functional 520MB ram. they will continue to hate and be blind to the problems of the world which is good in some situations they are the normal people who the world leaders can control easily by finding escape goats. still i found some really interesting people here [from both sides of the war] and i really wish to thank you for this hard fought battle
of and i agree with the fact that piracy isn't stealing, it's scamming an investment. the game itself is just a normal cd with a different setup of 1 and 0, but we don't pay for the product we pay for the investment of time and money the developers put into finding a combination of 1 and 0 that actually works.
anyhow i didn't expect developers to actually see this thread and listen to any of my concerns [although i sent a message to shamus http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/columns/experienced-points/7467-Experienced-Points-Impossible-to-beat-DRM to join the conversation but it was no use]. anyway i got my answers so mostlly we can either snipe the remaining idiots that want to flame or just go into a spiral conversation that never gets resolved because there isn't yet a resolve. you can't make me buy every game [because i don't have money] and i can't make you change the minds of developers to make new methods of payment for games in undeveloped countries.
anyway if there are still unresolved issues with this topic please continue but i found out what i wanted

Wait, so it's OK for you to generalize everyone who hates pirates, but not OK to generalize pirates, who actively choose to partake in piracy? I see some hypocrisy, here. But friend, don't preach to me about your problems. Not only do I not give a shit, they are no worse than my own. Furthermore, they have nothing to do with the gaming medium whatsoever. They are extreme variables, and they have no place in a proper argument about ethics.

Here's the skimmy, friend: Developers make a great game, people buy it, developers continue making great games.

Developers make a great game, half the people who like it pirate it, developers either don't bother putting as much effort into the next one or they just don't have the resources. Money makes the world go round. If you want to steal, go ahead. I honestly do not give a fuck. Not a one. However, don't start preaching about how it's OK. It's not, and it's destroying gaming as a medium.

Think of it like working as a waiter. If you go up to a table and the first thing out of their mouth is "we're not going to leave a tip, no matter what. Then we're going to complain about your service and refuse to pay the bill", are you gonna work extra, super hard for these people, or are you going to half-ass it because you have to?

Also, I'm 20

 

[numaiomul]

snip

i generalize because the majority of people are idiots. it doesn't matter on which side their on.just that most people that talked here couldn't put themselves in someone else's shoes.
still i respect a good conversation and a good debate but dr. doctor, i never said that piracy is okay, should be legal, is justified or anything of that s***. i just said that some people don't have a choice if they want to be at an equal level to the world.
the topic wasn't to change anything: we're too small to change anything in good or bad, it's just how the world works, i just wanted to see the general movement on piracy