Let's Play: Knights of the Old Republic II: Update 23: The Dark Side of the Force

[woodaba]

What do you mean, repeated face models?

That was totally Revan guarding a door on Onderon.

Hey, it's preferable to what ended up being canon.

(glares angrily at the Revan novel)

Never read it. What terrible things did they do?

SPOILERS FOR KotOR II AHEAD

Spoiler

1. Completely failed to mention the Exile's force wound, which is literally the most dangerous thing in the entire Star Wars canon

2. Recharacterised the Exile (oh, I'm sorry Meetra Surik) as basically a Revan fangirl

3. Recharacterised Revan from his KotOR II character (i.e Well intentioned extremist, magnificent bastard, all that good stuff) into the KotOR I character (i.e no character at all)

4. Killed off the Exile in an incredibly uncerimonious fashion to facilitate a pointless cameo in TOR

5. The rest of it is basically a masturbation session for Karpyshyn's Revan, with all the characters telling us how awesome Revan is, without actually doing anything interesting to make us believe said awesomeness

6. Was just generally poor as a book, a new sith character takes up way too much space despite not being interesting or compelling in the slightest, and even sorta becomes the main character in the end

 

[The_Lost_King]

I don't think anyone played Sith Lords as a male jedi without pick beard-face.

It's just a requirement.

Vote Kung-Fu Moses.

Seriously, what is it about beard-face? When I played through KOTOR II on the Xbox (oh so many years ago), I went male, and ended up picking beard-face. Is there some kind of subversive mind-fuckery going on that makes it impossible not to pick him?

It is Jesus. Why wouldn't you play as Jesus? That is your subliminal message right there. Now I am going to make a kung-fu jesus too. Also the Exile will never be Meetra Surik he will always be Lanius Salm in my eyes. I name all of my Exiles Lanius Salm, I don't make females because handmaiden kicks way more ass than Disciple.

 

[Shadows Risen]

SPOILERS FOR KotOR II AHEAD

Spoiler

1. Completely failed to mention the Exile's force wound, which is literally the most dangerous thing in the entire Star Wars canon

2. Recharacterised the Exile (oh, I'm sorry Meetra Surik) as basically a Revan fangirl

3. Recharacterised Revan from his KotOR II character (i.e Well intentioned extremist, magnificent bastard, all that good stuff) into the KotOR I character (i.e no character at all)

4. Killed off the Exile in an incredibly uncerimonious fashion to facilitate a pointless cameo in TOR

5. The rest of it is basically a masturbation session for Karpyshyn's Revan, with all the characters telling us how awesome Revan is, without actually doing anything interesting to make us believe said awesomeness

6. Was just generally poor as a book, a new sith character takes up way too much space despite not being interesting or compelling in the slightest, and even sorta becomes the main character in the end

I've haven't read it either, but after that, I don't want to. I'm quite happy with my KOTOR II memories that Revan was, well, a magnificent bastard and I always viewed the exile as on par with Revan, as a result of that force wound.

 

[C F]

SPOILERS FOR KotOR II AHEAD

Spoiler

1. Completely failed to mention the Exile's force wound, which is literally the most dangerous thing in the entire Star Wars canon

2. Recharacterised the Exile (oh, I'm sorry Meetra Surik) as basically a Revan fangirl

3. Recharacterised Revan from his KotOR II character (i.e Well intentioned extremist, magnificent bastard, all that good stuff) into the KotOR I character (i.e no character at all)

4. Killed off the Exile in an incredibly uncerimonious fashion to facilitate a pointless cameo in TOR

5. The rest of it is basically a masturbation session for Karpyshyn's Revan, with all the characters telling us how awesome Revan is, without actually doing anything interesting to make us believe said awesomeness

6. Was just generally poor as a book, a new sith character takes up way too much space despite not being interesting or compelling in the slightest, and even sorta becomes the main character in the end

Spoiler: My pointless add-ons: Click to View

Seven: They gave Revan a canonical look [http://i838.photobucket.com/albums/zz304/Tau_Rho_lambda/RevanLook.jpg].

Eight: They chopped through Obsidian's overarching story framework for KotOR II, and gave nary a mention to the critical events that took place in the finale.

Nine: Just about the only thing they didn't alter from this game in any way was Atris's personality, instead keeping her just as elitist and snobbish as she'll be when we'll meet her.

Ten: Revan talked. While wearing his iconic +10 mask of silence and awe.
Granted his first quote was a pretty awesome declaration along the lines of "Guess who's back, suckers", so maybe I won't kill Karpyshyn. Perhaps I'll just keep him in suspended animation and use his mind as a perception conduit whenever I'm forming the (not-so)rhetorical question "What were the writers thinking?"

The figure of Revan worked just fine when he was a vague archetype of a Jedi-turned-Sith Lord and a master strategist we never saw in action (well, outside of the player's direct influence). No need to kill the myth. As a matter of fact, if the fates of the protagonists of KotOR I and II were kept mysterious and enigmatic throughout the MMO, they could have still brought out KotOR III as an independent game and set it at the climax of The Old Republic's war using the MMO's events as a frame instead of a substitute.
Sure, it would have diminished the importance of the player character in said MMO, but on the other hand: it's Revan. Revan's the mystery. Revan's the man, the myth, and the legend. There's only one of him. There's plenty of player characters, and it would work better than saying "yeah, a group of these mundane Jedi/Soldiers/Mercs/whatever canonically killed the Sith Emperor." Bring him back in top form in his own game, and we can not only have more KotOR, we can play our own characters in the MMO and then play Revan and the Exile for the events of III.
For the sake of speculation: imagine a KotOR game where you've got two player-crafted protagonists, run them parallel with half the party each and their own equipment until they meet up somewhere around the climax, and then drop the hammer for the finale having them both in the same party gunning for the most powerful antagonist yet. It could either be two Light-side Jedi, a dichotomy of one Light, one Dark with a fragile and tense union, or a Sith Lord and his/her skilled apprentice coming to conquer the Galaxy (again, yay cyclical Star Wars plots!)

Alas, wasted possibilities. I don't think EA and Bioware would be willing to put forth that kind of effort while also juggling the Mass Effect and Dragon Age properties.
SIGN

So, have you crafted a protagonist for us to mess with yet, woodaba?

 

[woodaba]

Spoiler: My pointless add-ons: Click to View

Seven: They gave Revan a canonical look [http://i838.photobucket.com/albums/zz304/Tau_Rho_lambda/RevanLook.jpg].

Eight: They chopped through Obsidian's overarching story framework for KotOR II, and gave nary a mention to the critical events that took place in the finale.

Nine: Just about the only thing they didn't alter from this game in any way was Atris's personality, instead keeping her just as elitist and snobbish as she'll be when we'll meet her.

Ten: Revan talked. While wearing his iconic +10 mask of silence and awe.
Granted his first quote was a pretty awesome declaration along the lines of "Guess who's back, suckers", so maybe I won't kill Karpyshyn. Perhaps I'll just keep him in suspended animation and use his mind as a perception conduit whenever I'm forming the (not-so)rhetorical question "What were the writers thinking?"

The figure of Revan worked just fine when he was a vague archetype of a Jedi-turned-Sith Lord and a master strategist we never saw in action. No need to kill the myth. As a matter of fact, if the fates of the protagonists of KotOR I and II were kept mysterious and enigmatic throughout the MMO, they could have still brought out KotOR III as an independent game and set it at the climax of The Old Republic's war using the MMO's events as a frame instead of a substitute.
Sure, it would have diminished the importance of the player character in said MMO, but on the other hand: it's Revan. Revan's the mystery. Revan's the man, the myth, and the legend. There's only one of him. There's plenty of player characters, and it would work better than saying "yeah, a group of these mundane Jedi/Soldiers/Mercs/whatever canonically killed the Sith Emperor." Bring him back in top form in his own game, and we can not only have more KotOR, we can play our own characters in the MMO and then play Revan and the Exile for the events of III.
For the sake of speculation: imagine a KotOR game where you've got two player-crafted protagonists, run them parallel with half the party each and their own equipment until they meet up somewhere around the climax, and then drop the hammer for the finale having them both in the same party gunning for the most powerful antagonist yet. It could either be two Light-side Jedi, a dichotomy of one Light, one Dark with a fragile and tense union, or a Sith Lord and his/her skilled apprentice coming to conquer the Galaxy (again, yay cyclical Star Wars plots!)

Alas, wasted possibilities. I don't think EA and Bioware would be willing to put forth that kind of effort while also juggling the Mass Effect and Dragon Age possibilities.
SIGN

So, have you crafted a protagonist for us to mess with yet, woodaba?

Those are all some very well thought out points. In fact, your description of KotOR III is exactly how I expected it to turn out. They're still some chance that EA/Lucasarts might declare TOR an alternate timeline or some shit (kinda like how DCUO operates) and give us the game we actually want, but then again, that would require anyone at EA or Bioware-In-Name-Only having a brain cell or a soul.

I have not created the character yet, I'm giving it a couple more days in case there's a massive influx of people demanding we play Jedi Taco Salesman, but if that doesn't happen, it looks like Kung-Fu Moses will be brought into existence very soon...

 

[C F]

I have not created the character yet, I'm giving it a couple more days in case there's a massive influx of people demanding we play Jedi Taco Salesman, but if that doesn't happen, it looks like Kung-Fu Moses will be brought into existence very soon...

Come on guys! Think of the comical moustach- aww whatever. We're going to end up with Beard-face, aren't we. With this level of devotion, he's practically canon (y'know, aside from the fact she's supposed to a girl, but whatever).

Wow, the models really need identifiable names. If I weren't on my crappy laptop, I could try to crack open the files and say "PMHC08" or whatever, but that's hardly descriptive.

 

[woodaba]

I have not created the character yet, I'm giving it a couple more days in case there's a massive influx of people demanding we play Jedi Taco Salesman, but if that doesn't happen, it looks like Kung-Fu Moses will be brought into existence very soon...

Come on guys! Think of the comical moustach- aww whatever. We're going to end up with Beard-face, aren't we. With this level of devotion, he's practically canon (y'know, aside from the fact she's supposed to a girl, but whatever).

Wow, the models really need identifiable names. If I weren't on my crappy laptop, I could try to crack open the files and say "PMHC08" or whatever, but that's hardly descriptive.

It's a bit late at night for now, but what I'll do tommorrow is go digging in said game files, and post all the possible faces, so we can better decide what we like best.

 

[gamptrak]

While Jedi Taco Salesman sound wonderful, Kung-Fu Jesus is the way to go. Knowing that I can hand to hand combat my way through the game makes me want to go do it on my own. Is is even remotely possible to kung-fu your way in KOTOR 1?

 

[The_Lost_King]

While Jedi Taco Salesman sound wonderful, Kung-Fu Jesus is the way to go. Knowing that I can hand to hand combat my way through the game makes me want to go do it on my own. Is is even remotely possible to kung-fu your way in KOTOR 1?

Not unless you are mostly using force powers and only sometimes kicking people in the face. The only reason unarmed combat is viable in KotOR 2 is the unarmed mastery perks.

 

[woodaba]

Alright, there's an image of all the male faces up now. If you want to select one you like, then just say the number of the face.

 

[Gabriela D.]

All right! I vote for the awesome beard. Number 13, I believe. Oh yeah!

 

[C F]

I'm voting for 9 because I think it would be funny, but 13's probably going to win it. That hair and beard combo is the best of all the default models.

 

[A-D.]

Alright Woodaba, since we're going with male this time, and we all remember the magnificient bastard that was Jolee Bindo, go with either face 9 or face 10, or face 4/5 from the black males. Lets call it Revenge of the Bindo.

Just a thought there. It also made the "Pulling a Bindo" Joke later on alot more humorous in my head.

 

[AD-Stu]

I vote #9 as well - second row, second from the right with the sweet sweet moustache

 

[Terrible Opinions]

Number 13: Kung Fu Moses. There is no other option.

 

[woodaba]

Alright, we're tied: Three for Beard-Face and Three for Captain Mustache. Who shall prevail? If there's no more votes in 24 hours, I'll toss a coin. At either the vote that pips ahead or after the coin toss, I'll create the character, and capture the first footage.

EDIT: Edited to make myself clearer.

 

[DustyDrB]

I think I remember #9 showing up as a merc commander (maybe on Taris). I could be wrong. #5 shows up everywhere. Some of those faces look Sith-ified already. I like #10. We'd still get a sweet beard face without being Jedi Jesus #2. That's Captain Riiken's face, but I think it actually changes his to another face model if you pick that one.

So I'm for 10

 

[woodaba]

Vote Count

Face 13: 3
Face 9: 3
Face 10: 2

 

[gamptrak]

I'm going to cast my vote for #10. As A-D mentioned, he does look like a young Jolee, and I feel that he needs some love after what we did to him in the other playthrough.

 

[woodaba]

Alright, that's it then! Our character is set in stone, and as soon as I finish my session of Dishonored, I'm gonna create our character and get started!

Spoiler

Dishonored is really freaking good.