ME3 "Operation Goliath"

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Elamdri

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Zeel said:
Let me get this straight. This entire thread is about fanboys gushing about how "AMAZING" and "PERFECT" it is(except the ending) but my ONE comment about how abysmal the game is, sets you off? Yes, that makes you a fanboy. Any normal human being would shrug their shoulders and go about their merry business. if ANY criticism of the game makes you upset. DING DONG! YOU'RE A FANBOY!
Dude, every time anyone has ever said anything positive about Mass Effect or criticized you for your negativity, your response has always been something akin to "Well you're just a Fanboy, so nobody cares"

I mean, it is as reliable as the sun rising in the morning. Would you please get over yourself? I've had a few discussions with you now, and while I feel like some of your points have some merit, you're such an unpleasant person to have a discussion with that it's just not worth it. I mean, look at your forum health bar, I'm clearly not the only one in this camp.

For the sake of just have a more pleasant forum community, could you just do us all a favor and stop, please? At the very least tone it down.

OT: I like multiplayer challenges like this, I think it's fun to mix things up a bit. Sucks that PS3 players are excluded :(
 

Emiscary

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SecretNegative said:
Emiscary said:
...failings of the single player campaign....
Wut? The Singeplayer campaign is great. I mean, you can't say the singleplayer failed just because 10 minutes of a 25+ hour game was bad.
Okay:

A) "Failings" is a term describing shortcomings, faults, misses, fucks ups, pick a word dumbass.

B) Yes I can. Stories (PARTICULARLY long running franchises... like triologies) are built around their endings. That's not an empty claim, that's basic story structure.
 

Beryl77

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Gustof26 said:
Beryl77 said:
Seems like a normal PR damage control move. Whether they had planned this before or not, now they're trying to use it and distract fans with "FREE STUFF".
It does seem to the point of the whole affair. Odd though, as it gets people talking about Mass Effect 3. Talking about Mass Effect 3, it leads to talking about the thing this entire event was attempting to avoid. Still if I get free stuff for a game I enjoy, as I watch a company run in circle when it comes to their promotion, won't hear a complaint from me.
I don't think it's that odd. This will get more news about the multiplayer out and try to push news about outraged fans away. They're trying to get articles like the one from Forbes away from Google's frontpage and are hoping that this will quiet down the disgruntled fans.
I don't know how successful it will be but it surely won't be their last move.
That said, you can enjoy it as much as you want. I don't really care all that much about this, just pointing out what I think about this.
 

Gustof26

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Beryl77 said:
Gustof26 said:
Beryl77 said:
Seems like a normal PR damage control move. Whether they had planned this before or not, now they're trying to use it and distract fans with "FREE STUFF".
It does seem to the point of the whole affair. Odd though, as it gets people talking about Mass Effect 3. Talking about Mass Effect 3, it leads to talking about the thing this entire event was attempting to avoid. Still if I get free stuff for a game I enjoy, as I watch a company run in circle when it comes to their promotion, won't hear a complaint from me.
I don't think it's that odd. This will get more news about the multiplayer out and try to push news about outraged fans away. They're trying to get articles like the one from Forbes away from Google's frontpage and are hoping that this will quite down the disgruntled fans.
I don't know how successful it will be but it surely won't be their last move.
That said, you can enjoy it as much as you want. I don't really care all that much about this, just pointing out what I think about this.
And I'm happy to hear a different opinion. I see where your coming on this matter. Hopefully Bioware can move past all this to produce some more great games.
 

TsunamiWombat

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This is a PR dmg control move called 'The False Olive Branch" intended to placate the masses.

TsunamiWombat said:
http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/10084349

atghunter wrote...

Posted this yesterday, I'll repost here. Hope it helps to see what's on the other side of the mirror atm.

I don't think Bioware is out of touch with their customers though I agree with an earlier poster that right now they are assessing their options. Nor do I think that everyone speaking up for them at the moment is a "yes man" or shill. That said:

I don't for a moment think there are any other endings, this was a hallucination, etc. Bioware/EA is letting these speculations go on for two reasons. First, they are letting people vent. Secondly, they are weighing options.

Years ago, I worked for a PR damage control team and everything right now is going by the book. First, re-affirm and ignore (also known as doubling down), then try and define the detractors in the mainstream with things like "this is all a big mistunderstand", etc. while remaining civil in the hopes the detractors go rabid. Meanwhile go dark and use countermeasures through third part sources to prop up your position and brand the outcry as driven by hacks, haters or a minority trying to wear out the detractors on these outlets or "shock troops" while protecting the corporate core. Next, offer something distracting (notice SWTOR is free this upcoming weekend) known as the "faux olive branch"/ask the angry people to explain their concerns (without agreeing to commit to a compromise), buy more add time (definitely going on right now), and hope it dies down. If the pressure is still on, determine the economic viability of 1) ignoring the outcry and banking on the fickle nature of consumers to get over it or 2) determining if we can make money off of fixing it.

If it is any consolation, the decision whether or not there is a fix DLC, etc, won't be made by the writers so illusions to things they wanted to convey don't matter much atm (to wit: the leads comments yesterday). I suspect he's been called in and politely told by the PR guys to not do that again. This is now a corporate problem, not an artistic struggle with fans. Somewhere in the EA bunker, attorneys, PR guys, writers and brass are sharing numbers b/c in the end this will come down to hard currency.

As one who despises the endings, I'm hoping the suits tell the visionaries that the customers are loud enough and numerous enough to swollow their pride and get them out of this storm. For those that love them, I readily accept your position and respectfully disagree.
atghunter wrote...

Greetings All,

First, I?m flattered someone would repost this. Many thanks.

A couple follow-up thoughts for those wondering what is likely going on with the other side of the mirror in the last couple days:

First, Operation Goliath, the free Star Wars online weekend, and the recent noncommittal overtures to listen arefaux olive branches. Sorry. Customers intrinsically want to believe companies they patronize listen and when they stop believing that, the company has to say they are listening and do anything to get the detractors off-message. There are a dozen names for this, but the most memorable was "The Shell Game."

You will know that there?s a genuine need for dialogue in the corporate bunker when the message turns from ?we?re listening? to ?we acknowledge we may have a disconnect with our consumers and are willing to discuss a meaningful solution to the problem.? It signals an end to non-committed deflection and opening genuine talks to solve the problem (it?s knows as ?Exposing Your Throat? btw). At present, you?ll notice Bioware/EA has only said they will ?explain? the endings. That?s not a give, that?s a delay tactic.

But here?s the part that amazes me as an old PR guy and is totally new. The disenfranchised base here is changing the old methodology. It?s akin to comparing old-style bunker PR defenses to new blitzkrieg-style consumers. To date, the ?bunker strategy? was always used because it was virtually foolproof. However, social media and the 24 hour news cycle have simply changed everything. Twenty years ago, you could not mass 30,000 protesters into a networked base without some luck, money, a GREAT cause and (most importantly) time. By the time you did get organized, folks were either burned out or lost interest. Groups like Take Back have altered the landscape and suddenly the contest is taken from the old paradigm to a crazy new (and wonderful IMO) place. Preorder sales took away customers biggest weapon in the past (i.e. don?t buy the product). Now customers who feel they have received poor value have been potentially re-empowered by the internet. Bioware/EA is feeling the full brunt of this thing while passion is hottest. They are deploying countermeasures faster than the old strategies ever would have ever suggested. To some degree, they are being outmaneuvered atm. But now it depends on how long the protest/outcry holds up.

Two more quick points and I?ll close. First, the Child?s Play movement was brilliant. Notice over the past few days how some of the most visceral detractors to the outcry have had to shift their vitriol from ?you?re spoiled selfish haters? to ?sure you gave to charity, but you are spoiled selfish haters.? Nobody is drinking that Kool-Aid. Better yet, some outlets are now saying ?maybe the game has problem but its still art? from the precedent message ?best game ever.? That won?t fly with the mainstream. If its one thing they know is that when ?art? hits the marketplace, it is a commodity, nothing more. You?ve changed the countermeasures from "unbiased" critics of the movement into drum beaters simply trying to get you angry. EA?s PR guys probably envy you (grudgingly) atm.

Second, don?t buy the only X people voted in the poll out of 1 billion customers, so they don?t care. That?s bunk. Are there "drum beaters" on both sides of this issue that just want to see controversy, sure. But if I was sitting in an office looking at that Bioware poll, I?d be reaching for a cigarette.

Finally remember, they have much more data at their disposal. They know how sales are going, how much time people are playing that are synced into Origin, etc. They will watch those numbers this weekend. If sales slow, watch for price cutting within 10 days (just over the two week US release date). It will mean that retailers are getting nervous and will slow new unit orders. As I?ve said before, this will come down to hard currency. If the protests start having an effect on that front, the response will come.

I?m an older gamer and again appreciate the repost. To everyone (on both sides) continue to let your voices be heard. You are consumers and have every right to engage in this discourse. The boards being locked yesterday proves someone is watching and knows this is an issue. I'm in the hated-ending camp to be sure, but I admire everyone one of you who is arguing for what believe on both sides!

Cheers.

Many men may be willing to die heroically for a noble cause, but few men will live humbly for one. Wilhelm Stekel
atghunter wrote...

Greetings All,

Really flattered with the responses. Respectful regards and thanks to all. Been spending a few minutes reading over Mr. Hudson?s response. Here's my PR insider perspective. Hope it helps a bit.

First, let?s simply look at strategy over content. 1) They definitely released this on a Friday evening to bury it in the news cycle (because it does acknowledge in passing there are unhappy customers, but more next paragraph). Btw, kudos to those who pointed that out earlier in the thread-Solid catch. 2) Several of the ?anti-ending? articles (most notably Forbes) are now creeping into front page searches for ?Mass Effect 3? instead of ?Mass Effect 3 endings? and they are hoping this release will knock those stories to page 2. 3) They are hoping to deflect some of the current silence anger by combining this message with this weekend?s faux olive branches (discussed earlier).

All in all, the message release strategy is nothing too interesting at this point.

The content, however, is interesting. Most of the statement is doublespeak meant to let you see whatever you want as to as to the direction this thing is heading. Mr. Hudson then clearly tries to give validity to the greatness of the game by citing a couple news sources in the hopes of getting those stories more hits and onto search page one (nicely played EA PR), but the main thing is a clear acknowledgement that Houston has a problem with ?some? fans. Mind you, he uses the term ?some? and ?most passionate fans? to try and minimalize the level of the outcry, but the disenfranchised fan base has reached the level of acknowledgement. That is important. Does it mean those disenfranchised fans have won? Not by a long shot. But Mr. Hudson?s statement was written (or at least approved by someone running damage control). And ultimately any time you have to acknowledge a problem with your product or customers, you have issues.

Does he continue on holding his own line that they intended ?bittersweet? endings? Yes. Is the comment that you?ll see more of Commander Shepard an illusion to an ?ending? DLC? Not certain but probably not at the moment. Does he utilize the ?we?re listening to feedback but not promising we?ll do anything? line used on the boards yesterday? Sure.

It is clear most of his statement is insubstantial and leaves tons of room for spin either way down the road. Whether it gets used or not, management is trying to find some wiggle room in case they have to change course.

Last bit. A warning. PR guys know that right now many people?s emotions are on edge and often use a tactic called ?Sound and Fury? (Shakespearean reference see Macbeth) to see if it gets people raging. It helps that strategy that people are looking at anything coming out of Bioware to detect wind changes. That said, I was reading through the thread burning with Mr. Hudson?s statement (though to be fair it is a Bioware/EA statement) and it seems for the most part folks are being passionate, but civil. EA PR will probably chalk up that aspect of this release as a failedruse de guerre (trick of war).

Stay civil, stay passionate, and stay vocal no matter which side you take. For myself, I?ll shamelessly

Hold the Line
 

CrazyBlaze

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Zeel said:
Sparrow said:
Zeel said:
Ok, seriously? What's your hard-on for being so anti-BioWare? Hell, I'm not BioWare's biggest fan but even you're starting to piss me off. Any mention of BioWare, EA, Mass Effect or Dragon Age and you're on it like a hawk to spout your useless and inane hatred.

You don't like BioWare, we fucking get it.

Anyway, they said they'll "talk" about the ending in the future so... this seems like more of an olive branch than a "PLEASE FORGET OUR ENDING SUCKS" tactic. That is, y'know, if they actually do speak about it.
Let me get this straight. This entire thread is about fanboys gushing about how "AMAZING" and "PERFECT" it is(except the ending) but my ONE comment about how abysmal the game is, sets you off? Yes, that makes you a fanboy. Any normal human being would shrug their shoulders and go about their merry business. if ANY criticism of the game makes you upset. DING DONG! YOU'RE A FANBOY!

It's also not 'useless' or 'inane'. Did it ever occur to you that Mass Effect 3 isn't perfect? That the game is not this golden chariot cascading down a rainbow? Does that idea seem foreign to you? jesus christ. fanboys these days.


I actually haven't attacked Dragon Age. I liked DA:O and DA2.
And you are an anti-fanboy. You seem to exist purely to call anyone who enjoyed the game a fanboy. The things you say are deliberately said in such a way that anyone that liked the game is pissed off and then when they proceed to reply back you call them a fanboy. We get that you don't like the game and you are entitled to your opinion but can you please just leave people who liked the game and wish to discuss it alone. Why don't you go find a topic or make a topic about a game that you like and leave the rest of us alone. Please and thank you.
 

violinist1129

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Gustof26 said:
And I'm happy to hear a different opinion. I see where your coming on this matter. Hopefully Bioware can move past all this to produce some more great games.
First, thank you for bringing some civility to the ME3 discussions. It has been much-needed.

OP: I think Bioware is scrambling a bit because they made a mistake (not that the endings were the worst things ever, the quality is irrelevant in this particular use of "mistake", just a mistake in that the fans (not fanboys) were displeased) and a multiplayer weekend is just another thumb in the levee.

It's important to remember that it hasn't even been 2 weeks since the game was released, so Bioware is working fairly fast on damage control. It just seems like longer because so much attention has been paid to the issue, and the internet is great at amplifying rage.

(I've never used so many disclaimers in a single statement)
:)
 

Elamdri

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Zeel said:
Tone what down.. exactly? my 'negativity' for Mass effect 3? Are you serious. me simply expressing negative thoughts about a game is bothering you? Unbelievable.

I get you guys think this game is the second coming of christ. I know i represent a scary alternate universe, where Me3 isn't that good, Bioware isn't that nice and scary and bad things actually happen.

You guys just have to get over it.

I'm not going to praise a game I think sucks. Furthermore I'm not going to entertain some crazy fanboy's allusions.


How about you look at this from my perspective. How many posts do we see of people just salivating at ME3? How many? I will bet my ass that there are more "positive" posts inregard to Me3 than "negative". So I find this tirade a little ridiculous. As if ME3 fans are cowering, as "anti-fans" destroy and wreck havoc on their series. That is just not the case.


To address your whole "fanboy" thing. Well, I mean, can you blame me? everytime I spit out some reasonable criticism, the overall response is "WAH U R ANTI FANBOY" as if pratical criticism of the game can't exist.
I think the manner in which you interact with other people on the forums is overly negative. I mean, you're infamous on the forums for the love of all that is holy. I do not mind that you don't like ME3, I myself am disappointed in it. But I feel that you treat people that disagree with you in an outrageous and negative manner.
 

Cobbs

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I for one love the multiplayer aspect, some of the best fun I've had online in many a year. The challenges may have always been meant to be integrated, but due to the overwhelming negativity towards the ending of ME3 people are bound to think Bioware hit the "Oh fuck me attempt to placate the masses (see what I did there?) button!"

In response to Zeel's seemingly endless hatred towards ME3, maybe the game's RPG elements seem more diluted due to the fact that this is the game's third offering. When ME1 came out it was the first game of it's kind, where two playthroughs could have truly different outcomes. I remember going "Gee golley this game is fucking sweet, I feel like part of the action." When Mass Effect 2 came out it had thoroughly changed the gameplay mechanics in positive ways. The roleplaying was still very much the same. It also allowed Bioware to flesh out returning characters (Ashley/Kaidan being bitchy that you didn't call, Wrex being big boss or a corpse, Garrus becoming even more of a badass etc.)after two hard, sheperdless years.
ME3 However acts under the assumption that you know about the events that have shaped your squad mates lives so to me it doesn't seem as though a great deal of exposition about the characters is needed. The new character's all have their background explained through cutscenes or conversation. The paceing of ME3 is also alot faster and more urgent seeing as how the galaxy is getting a royal pounding at the tentacles of the reapers. Yes the ending was shitfull to a degree, but for the most part the roleplaying still exists much as it stood in ME1 and ME2. Why explain something that I already know again? For all I know if you start a fresh ME3 save then maybe the dialogue explains alot more in order to catch you up.
Final note: Are you sure you didn't play the game in Action mode?
 

Rawne1980

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That sounds great.

I have ME3 for my PS3 so when I can start this weekend event ..... oh, it's 360 and PC only....

I'll crawl back under my rock then.

On the subject of the single player though, ME3 did kind of piss on my Frosties and expected me to eat them.

Why?

Because no choices I made in any of the previous 2 ME's made a single bit of difference.

I killed the Rachni Queen, didn't matter the Reapers got me a new one. Mordin died in the suicide mission of ME2, didn't matter I had "Not Mordin" as Joker put it. I blew up the collector ship, didn't matter I still got the parts for the Crucible. Didn't unite all the races? who cares, slap on multiplayer for a few hours and your 100% ready for the final showdown (so much for MP not affecting the single player). Make the Geth all loving and homely? Who gives a toss, sparkly imagination child still says they are bad. So on and so forth.

Yeah, the game is solid. It has well written parts and the gameplay is great and smooth. I really enjoyed it, i'm on my third playthrough with my save list (wanted to see how different things played out and went through ME2 several times).

But for a final of a trilogy, it's not good enough.
 

Sparrow

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Zeel said:
Oh, holy fuck you're just a troll aren't you? Because I just told you I'm not on good terms with BioWare, I made it quite obvious in my post that there are issues I have with ME3. I pretty much put it straight out there and you just went "HURR DURR YOU MUST BE A FANBOY". Find something better to do with your life you pathetic, little man.
 

ToastiestZombie

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Hmm, first actual post in ages.
First of all I'm gonna talk about the actual topic of this thread.
Personally I loved the multiplayer and an event where people played together on it would be a fun thing for the people participating. I don't think they announced it just to get people to stop whining about the ending, they probably planned it ages ago and now that the game has come out and people have gotten to grips with multiplayer their doing an event.
Secondly, Zeel will never stop posting hate and making it seem like it's truth so just stop replying.
 

sabercrusader

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I think the multiplayer's great, with friends. I can't stand to play it with other people, but it's not like any other multiplayer game can make me stand to do it either. The multiplayer's fun, and I sure do hope they add some new things in, hell, maybe even a whole new mode, like a co-op misson mode, like another poster above me said. I'd like all this done, after they decide if they're going to change the endings or not.
 

Marietta Perconti

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I am boycotting this because it is a PR stunt to deflect away from the real issues a portion of the fan base has with the game. Some people enjoy MP but for me it was hording.... not my cup of tea.