Mega Man Creator Shakes Fist At Japanese Game Industry

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Jan 22, 2011
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Sylveria said:
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Cecilthedarkknight_234 said:
Paya Chin said:
Cecilthedarkknight_234 said:
Baresark said:
He's right. In my youngest days I used to admire the luck of Japanese gamers. They seemingly got the best and most interesting games and if we got some over here it was a lucky treat. Now though, What is to envy. The Japanese game industry hasn't changed one single bit from when I admired it. American companies have made fun, interesting, and unique games while they Japanese industry is lagging behind in any sort of creativity.
The main problem is most of the games that are decently made are on the hand-held and no one wants to support them here. Everyone has an android or ios device so why buy a psp or ds?? ...
bad trolling is bad...
I am not trolling in the western market mainstream people want ios or android devices to play games on instead of hand held from Sony or Nintendo. Look at the sales numbers of those devices because of the portability they have or wide array to apps/games. No one in this day/age wants to lug around 2-3 tech devices anymore to play games, use a phone or tweet with.
Spoken like a true hipster-casual. Yes, phones do have higher market penetration that handheld gaming devices.. because almost everyone has a phone, but not everyone plays video games. Your grasp of the obvious astounds even me. I always do like the "It isn't mainstream, therefor it doesn't need to exist," argument. In other news, McDonalds is the greatest restaurant in the world because they have the most locations and the Big Mac is the best food product in the world because it has the highest sales.
You didn't just call me a hipster...oh boy here go. Listen it doesn't matter what x minority of gamers wants which I am part off. What matters is what sells and how fast they can push it out. This country based off capitalism of the idea of pushing greater shit people don't need each year because it exist. Game developers are looking at this going.. well we can make money on these devices because nearly everyone has one so they push to sell games on them by doing so many ports of old rpgs or ios/android only games because that is where the market is headed. I don't like it myself to be honest with you but games are also heading towards drm download only to prevent used sales or encode disc to have drm on them so what can you do?
 

Therumancer

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Well, the thing is that your dealing with a pragmatic fellow whose personal success has come largely as a part of the western market. What he either doesn't want to admit, or isn't getting, is that racism is a huge issue here and always has been, I was shocked by it when I went through a phase reading translated Japanese periodicals. To a lot of Japanese developers and gamers the money isn't as important as keeping Japanese things in Japan, with the perception that selling to a western audience (especially the US) somehow cheapens them.

The thing is that Japanese developers aren't nessicarly as profit crazy as their western counterparts. More money might be availible by selling to the west, but they don't want to be scorned by the gamers are home and viewed as sell outs, or themselves might very well prefer to cater exclusively to a Japanese audience.

All claims of "needing to change" aside, the big question is do the developers care about global reception, and if they are happy operating at the level they are now and making the current level of profits (and associated budgets). Things like the mania over getting a US release for "Xenoblade Chronicles" probably hasn't given many devs the attitude that their products aren't in demand or well received either.

What's more when it DOES come down to Western/International game development, fingers can be pointed at things like the "Shin Megami Tensei" titles and things like that which have fairly big niche followings. Not all developers want to step outside of their niche to trade it in for more money, stabbing their followers in the back, and develop AAA shooters and such that sell better. Right now ATLUS seems to realize it can probably move a pretty solid pile of units for a SMT RPG, why why the heck should they change when that is what people want? To some extent I've kind of hoped more companies would follow that chain of thought instead of running after the next big money maker constantly like a gerbil with ADHD.

In short, I disagree with the creator of "Megaman", for a mixed bag of reasons, not all of which are nice. I'd like to see MORE Japanese releases be localized and released internationally, but I do not want to see all the companies Westernize. Oddly the companies like "Capcom" that are mentioned above are ones that have been making good money, but also inspiring tons of hate due to theri games with on-disc DLC and things like that.
 

LilithSlave

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Japan and the gaming industry has been a pretty angsty issue as of late.

One that's fairly multifaceted, and I don't think there's a single cause. Some things are their own fault, and some not.

Square, Enix(now of course, Square Enix), Capcom, Konami, and several other very successful companies with a great history have gone pretty downhill.

As well, gaming has been taken over by a new generation. A generation that may have at first begrudgingly accepted non-Western culture in their video games, and may have even grew to love it, my generation, after seeing how fun and refreshing it could be. Is not the same generation as the current one. In this current generation, Western companies aren't copying Japanese games like they used to. And Western companies are having more blockbusters of their own. The United States video game industry, for instance, is currently going through an "American pride" high now that they have much more staying power in the industry and have found a larger audience.

As well, retrogaming and old games are even losing so much respect it's ridiculous. I've even seen it on this site. Fans of old games are starting to become a minority. And it's certainly in part because of a newfound pride in American games and embarrassment towards Japanese games. Many companies in the West might not admit it, but there's a sort of rising "buy American" mentality on the rise. A little bit, at the very least.

Partially this is in part because video games have become even more mainstream than before. As the hobby now has a large portion of adult who don't think of video games as merely toys. Video games are rubbing up against and taking various influences from Hollywood. And the sort of Asian heritage of "old school" gaming is starting to be treated as a sort of "Mongol Yoke".

Video gaming isn't allowed to be "different enough" as a mainstream media, because of certain ways it differs from other pop cultures. And Japanese companies aren't doing good at holding up, a lot of companies are holding on to successful franchises of the past. But the current generation could care less about classic music, classic movies, or classic video games. The kids today are saying "Megaman who? God of War has boobies." The industry is going through a growing pains of a sort, and I hope normality will not win out. But in the meantime, Japanese companies need to try extra hard, and not sit on their laurels or betray their fans.

That being said, Japanese games aren't doing THAT horribly. Several video gaming outlets have their own biases. Nintendo is doing wonderful, a inconvenient truth that many in the industry try to ignore and shove under the rug. It doesn't matter if the Wii is a "casual friendly" platform, Zelda games have never been "casual games". And hardcore Nintendo fans are certain as hardcore of a crowd as any in gaming. I'm getting really tired of the Nintendo shaming propaganda.

And as others have stated, where people like Square, Enix, Capcom, Konami, and so forth, are falling. Atlus is still carrying very strong in many respects. So are many other Japanese companies on the rise. They may not be a juggernaut yet, but they're picking up steam. I have faith in them.

Ironically, though, in terms of creativity, it's the idea pushed on Japanese developers that their games are inferior that's stifling them. This notion is sending shockwaves throughout the industry and creating somewhat of an inferiority complex. Capcom is abandoning things like Megaman Legends 3 and Japanese aesthetics and gameplay in favor of Western developers making things like the DMC, because they have no esteem in Japanese culture selling outside of Japan. Part of the downfall of Square Enix and Capcom seem to be related to Westernizing. If Japanese developers are going to be afraid to make Japanese games, they're certainly going to be afraid to do anything unique. And among the very worst games they've been making, have done so to cater to the Western audience, like MindJack.

If the West keeps acting like they need to Westernize and drop Japanese aesthetics and gameplay, they're just going to keep making more atrocities like MindJack. Instead of good games.
 

Something Amyss

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As long as cost is such an issue, I'm not sure how criticism will change anything. Will criticism make more money appear?
 

RhombusHatesYou

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Between There and There.
Country
The Wide, Brown One.
LilithSlave said:
Many companies in the West might not admit it, but there's a sort of rising "buy American" mentality on the rise. A little bit, at the very least.
'The West' is more than just the US.

If the West keeps acting like they need to Westernize and drop Japanese aesthetics and gameplay, they're just going to keep making more atrocities like MindJack.
No, Japanese publishers and developers need to decide whether keeping their own unique gaming philosophies and gaming culture is more important than chasing the mainstream Western markets.
 

LilithSlave

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RhombusHatesYou said:
'The West' is more than just the US.
No, be we are arguably the largest group of developers outside of Japan. And our culture is more influential throughout the West than Japan.

And as a major part of the "West" and the Western market, the US is going through a "pride boom" with a new industry they've been able to since their teeth into and would like to dominate. In a globalist economy, this has global reach.
 

ArkhamJester

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[quote[If the West keeps acting like they need to Westernize and drop Japanese aesthetics and gameplay, they're just going to keep making more atrocities like MindJack.[/quote]

No, Japanese publishers and developers need to decide whether keeping their own unique gaming philosophies and gaming culture is more important than chasing the mainstream Western markets.[/quote]


Can't the Japanese do both? Besides I don't know about you but im a bit "westernized" out. Besides heres a thought, this is the first generation that the western developers emerged from PC's and took the reigns of the mainstream (yes I know they did put the occasional title on consoles but get my point)and quite frankly the west dev's seem to be a tad drunk on the spotlight, trash talking the japanese seemingly every chance they get. Yes I know Im REALLY generalizing here but what I'm getting at is the west isn't as high and mighty as they claim.
 
Mar 7, 2012
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This is why I think From Software will become a Japanese powerhouse and Bamco will become Japan's EA.

Bamco knows how to appeal to both and From Software listens to criticism.
 

Korten12

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Allthingsspectacular said:
This is why I think From Software will become a Japanese powerhouse and Bamco will become Japan's EA.

Bamco knows how to appeal to both and From Software listens to criticism.
You mean Namco? or by Bamco did you mean Namco Bandai?
 

acillies45

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Right, so I don't know if this has been said yet (it probably has) but I don't have time to read all the comments tonight before bed and I want to say something before I sleep and forget about it...

First of all, I agree with what he is saying. While not all games coming out of Japan are doing poorly, many are. I think that it isn't them not wanting to necessarily work with outside developers necessarily either. Look at games like Zelda and Mario, both done by Nintendo and they didn't really need help on that front (albeit, it COULDN'T hurt to have outside help either).

Now, my main problem with Japanese games (Nintendo being the main offender) is that they don't know how to go outside their 'comfort zone'. I'm tired so I'm going to make a point quickly, but hopefully it gets across. Basically Nintendo (whom I'm going to use as an example, but it can be spread to more than just them) has great games out there, but they haven't changed since their predecessors much if at all. While one could argue that, yes things have been moved around in the games, the core of the games are the same.

I personally haven't bought a Poke'mon game in forever. Why? Because I have played many of them, and the formula hasn't changed. YES there is a better story (so I've heard) in Black and White. But so what? The core mechanics are still the freaking same from the original games! They haven't changed them from the original Gameboy! It's still turn-based and repetitive as hell.

Now, there are other games that haven't changed their cores for some time as well: Zelda, Mario, even Final Fantasy still has turnish based fighting from what I hear. My main point is this: Japanese Developers seem to find a strategy for a game that sells, and then sticks with it, not moving away from that until no one wants it any more. Now, again, this is a generalization, and this may be me just hitting Nintendo hard for it, but I guess this is what I've noticed. (Japan doesn't seem to be the only ones either. I'm looking at you Ubisoft and Assassin's Creed).

And that is my 2.5 cents.
 

kouriichi

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I feel a mighty manga/anime style speech coming on...

YESSS! With the power of American raw idealism and Japanese depth of sight and unyielding will, WE CAN DO ANYTHING! For together we are stronger then we ever could be separate! Imagine the true power of the combination! From sea to sea the world would chime loudly about the combination! Let the burning strength of our might SHINE THROUGH THE NIGHT AND LEAD US TO TRUE VICTORY, AT THE TOP OF THE SALES CHARTS!!!! *clenches fist* For we are strong! We stand together! AS TRUE FRIENDSUUUUUU~!


More on topic, its would also help if Japanese games came over seas more often. I mean, just bringing over the Monster Hunter MMO would do great things money wise for both sides. But make sure to actually MARKET your games, not just have them show up out of the blue. I mean, Monster Hunter Tri did pretty well. ((Not amazing by any standard, only about half a mil sales, but it was basically a new IP to america. Sure the others had been sold before, but none were marketed 1/50th of what Tri was.))
If they released another MH game with good marketing, im sure the sales would be even higher. Also, release it on Xbox and PS3. Please. They are the two big systems right now, and with how competitive the American gamer demographic is, just throwing in an Online Stat board would guarantee a sales spike.
 

TechnAmateur

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I still like their games. Capcom for Devil May Cry & Lost Planet. Konami for the Metal Gear Solid series. Square Enix for aquiring the third True Crime game that got cancelled last year. Namco for Soul Calibur, Tekken, and the upcoming shooting game called Inversion. Q Entertainment & Feelplus for Ninety-Nine Nights 2. Koei for Dynasty Warriors. They're other good Japanese companies that I like too. They're good Japanese Role-Playing Games out there, but I don't like the turn-based battle system which I think had messed up a lot of them like: Lost Odyssey, Resonance of Fate, The Last Remnant, and Infinite Undiscovery. All of which I really wanted to play because they seemed like they have such interesting stories, but that battle system is what made me change my mind about getting any of those games. With the exception of Lost Odyssey since I have played it before, and only had it for one night before returning it to GameStop the next day out of disappointment. I haven't turned my back on any of the companies. I'll never turn my back on Capcom as long as they keep making Devil May Cry games because Dante is my favorite video game character of all time.
 

Something Amyss

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LilithSlave said:
RhombusHatesYou said:
'The West' is more than just the US.
No, be we are arguably the largest group of developers outside of Japan. And our culture is more influential throughout the West than Japan.

And as a major part of the "West" and the Western market, the US is going through a "pride boom" with a new industry they've been able to since their teeth into and would like to dominate. In a globalist economy, this has global reach.
It also doesn't hurt that, as the west was a major consumer in terms of video games, it was actually a bit weird that so much of our gaming content came from the East to begin with. I'm surprised a shift took as long as it did.
 

TrevHead

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Its not a case of good or bad games anymore, its who has the biggest marketing budget and the best known IPs that can be milked dry with sequels and DLC.

Sega and THQ are learning this the hard way
 

spectrenihlus

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Remember the days when the credits of your favorite games had a whole bunch of Japanese names? Yea..not anymore.
 

ThePenguinKnight

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I agree with Inafune and the comments above, they refuse to change. The only JRPGs I play anymore come from Atlus exclusively.
 

xPixelatedx

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Wow, I'm sorry, but he couldn't be more wrong. I am one of his long time fans and this is exactly the mindset he shouldn't have. There is nothing more pathetic then willfully allowing yourself to be assimilated because you no longer have confidence to be yourself. Nintendo has proven if you treat your product like a AAA game, you still get the sales of one. They haven't changed their ways or mindset, and Mario games sell fantastic. So what if it's not COD, it doesn't need to be. All a japanese developer as to do to stay 'in the game' is attempt to develop the same product they did in their "glory days", and that's just not what we are seeing.

Resident Evil is now a game/franchise altered forever just to appeal to western gaming ideals, as is Devil may Cry, Ninja Gaiden and sadly Final Fantasy. Do you know what else these franchises have in common? They now all suck. They suck BECAUSE they tried to appeal to western sentiments and they lost their spark along the way. Japan 'Being themselves' is not the problem at all (again, as Nintendo demonstrates). The problem resides in the fact that Nintendo is the only one left putting the same level of care into it as they did 20 years ago.
 

FriedRicer

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Sep 19, 2010
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xPixelatedx said:
Wow, I'm sorry, but he couldn't be more wrong. I am one of his long time fans and this is exactly the mindset he shouldn't have. There is nothing more pathetic then willfully allowing yourself to be assimilated because you no longer have confidence to be yourself. Nintendo has proven if you treat your product like a AAA game, you still get the sales of one. They haven't changed their ways or mindset, and Mario games sell fantastic. So what if it's not COD, it doesn't need to be. All a japanese developer as to do to stay 'in the game' is attempt to develop the same product they did in their "glory days", and that's just not what we are seeing.

Resident Evil is now a game/franchise altered forever just to appeal to western gaming ideals, as is Devil may Cry, Ninja Gaiden and sadly Final Fantasy. Do you know what else these franchises have in common? They now all suck. They suck BECAUSE they tried to appeal to western sentiments and they lost their spark along the way. Japan 'Being themselves' is not the problem at all (again, as Nintendo demonstrates). The problem resides in the fact that Nintendo is the only one left putting the same level of care into it as they did 20 years ago.
I disagree with Keiji,but FF13 is ANYTHING BUT WESTERN.