Egalitarianism would require one to care about both male and female rights (and the rights of every other group), so in that sense, yes. More broadly, no, if they don't identify as egalitarians I don't see why they should be claimed as such.Zontar said:
A group that whose actual stated purpose is to further the rights of men (specifically fathers' rights) is not classified as part of the movement for Men's Rights? Really?thaluikhain said:
Pretty sure it is. As I understand it the point of egalitarianism is to address imbalances wherever they occur and TO whomever they occur. I can sympathise greatly with that viewpoint and very much dislike the focus on one group or another group that other movements have.Zontar said:
Read down the list.. and they are only naming a few of them in that report...Zontar said:
Mostly it's lonely dudes bitching about how their totally valid lifestyle choices (complete arsehole) means they can't get a date, and like 3 people that thought zero access to their kids seemed a tad harsh so climbed on stuff dressed as Spiderman.inu-kun said:
The specific thing calling itself the Men's Rights Movement, no, men's rights in general, yes. The former is (at least nominally), part of the latter, not the whole.Lightspeaker said:
This is a falt-out falsehood. AS a member of and MRA group in my local area, the comparison to PETA is a fallacy meant to make us seem like lunatics. You are right about MRA being a reactionary to feminism. It is a reaction to feminism and feminist groups often ackowledging but failing to take action on many men's rights issues. Some of those groups are made up of men with an axe to grind due to being screwed over by women in their life. The same can be said of many women feminists.thaluikhain said:
You mean like myself and pretty much everyone associated with the group I belong to? There's a distinct special pleading that goes on with regard to MRM and Feminism where accusations against feminist groups are hand-waved as fallacies by the same people who use the same accusations against MRM. The MRM will have its loonies and will go through the same growing pains of any movement but distilling its activists down to stereotypes and conflating a movement with a specific activist group or groups is no more justified with MRM than it is with Feminism.thaluikhain said:
Okay I think I kinda see where you're going with this. Like the distinction between being in favour and supporting women's rights but not actually labelling yourself feminist, right?thaluikhain said:
No, because mainstream Feminism does not support Misandry, while the MRM not only supports Misogyny, it was basically founded on Misogyny. Feminism is not the opposite of MRM. MRM exists to try to stop feminism, Feminism exists to try to gain equality for women. BIG difference. Mainsteadm MRM is like the extremist of the extreme in feminism, not the mainstream, so it isn't really comparable. Mainstream feminism helps men, mainstream MRM does not do the same for women.Zontar said:
MRM does not exist to "stop feminism." MRM was founded because of clear isntances in our modern society where sexism against men has led to institutionalized oppression. I encounter tons of feminists and progressives that out-right claim this opression doesn't exist, that there are no issues with sexism against men and that anything that seems like sexism or oppression against men is just sexism and oppression against women. It is those attitudes that caused the founding of MRM in response.Lil devils x said:
No, it was meant to illustrate the different between being a Men's Rights Activist and a men's rights activist. PETA was merely the first group to come to mind. Admittedly, I have no great respect for either group.Gorrath said:
Yes. Now, I don't doubt that there are people who are both, but I'd very much doubt they are in large numbers.Gorrath said:
The MRMs like that are in the same proportion and have the same power as the feminists like that, and no more? Yeah, I don't buy that at all.Gorrath said:
Yeah, more or less.Lightspeaker said:
What is not the case? The SPLC already addressed Mainstream MRA's as being misogynist, and YES, feminists are the ones responsible for bringing us our domestic violence and abuse hotlines, they have volunteered countless hours and raised the funds to bring us these services or they would not exist today. In addition, feminists are the ones fighting for men and women to be able to like and do the same things without being ostracized and ridiculed for doing so, that actually benefits men moreso than women, as if women wear mans pants they are less likely to be made fun of than a man in in a woman's dress.Zontar said:
Er...for the record just a few years ago there were reports that major feminist groups here in the UK were working on politicians behind the scenes to oppose more shelters for male domestic abuse victims because it'd take money away from shelters for women (because the ratio of funding was at the time drastically skewed in womens' favour, way beyond the actual ratios of victims, not sure how it is now).Lil devils x said:
