New here, how do you guys feel about libertarian socialism?

[Lord Mountbatten Reborn]

Human nature decrees that Libertarian Socialism will never work.

Seriously, things would go to hell pretty quickly, and the only way to solve it would be a vigilante group, and then the vigilante group would become powerful and try to take over everything...

As you can see, it really wouldn't work, unless everyone was inherently nice. That would be awesome.

 

[That_Which_Isnt]

Human nature decrees that Libertarian Socialism will never work.

Seriously, things would go to hell pretty quickly, and the only way to solve it would be a vigilante group, and then the vigilante group would become powerful and try to take over everything...

As you can see, it really wouldn't work, unless everyone was inherently nice. That would be awesome.

Hmm nature decrees libertarian socialism will work.

It kept us alive for the past 5k-50k years depending on if you're religious or not.

 

[Lord George]

If the world turned into a huge Anarchist world, then most of you would end up dead or enslaved, Anarchy will never work on a large scale because humans are weak minded, petty and greedy, without the police force, the power companies and a form of government everything goes to shit as the strongest guy around will just start enforcing their own law on the weaker among them, ending with the world ruled by totalitarian or fascistic states. It will only work in some form of happy dream land where everyone decides to be happy and nice and no-one decides "I want to be better then someone else".

The only form of Anarchy that has a small chance is free market anarchy and even that is very unlikely to work because it depends on extreme capitalism (which is a brilliant form of society, people get decided through social Darwinism, you work hard, you do the right things you get to play hard.)

 

[That_Which_Isnt]

If the world turned into a huge Anarchist world, then most of you would end up dead or enslaved, Anarchy will never work on a large scale because humans are weak minded, petty and greedy, without the police force, the power companies and a form of government everything goes to shit as the strongest guy around will just start enforcing their own law on the weaker among them, ending with the world ruled by totalitarian or fascistic states. It will only work in some form of happy dream land where everyone decides to be happy and nice and no-one decides "I want to be better then someone else".

The only form of Anarchy that has a small chance is free market anarchy and even that is very unlikely to work because it depends on extreme capitalism (which is a brilliant form of society, people get decided through social Darwinism, you work hard, you do the right things you get to play hard.)

Have you even looked at the topic? Also Social Darwinism is just another form of propaganda similar to Mandate of Heaven

 

[Lord George]

If the world turned into a huge Anarchist world, then most of you would end up dead or enslaved, Anarchy will never work on a large scale because humans are weak minded, petty and greedy, without the police force, the power companies and a form of government everything goes to shit as the strongest guy around will just start enforcing their own law on the weaker among them, ending with the world ruled by totalitarian or fascistic states. It will only work in some form of happy dream land where everyone decides to be happy and nice and no-one decides "I want to be better then someone else".

The only form of Anarchy that has a small chance is free market anarchy and even that is very unlikely to work because it depends on extreme capitalism (which is a brilliant form of society, people get decided through social Darwinism, you work hard, you do the right things you get to play hard.)

Have you even looked at the topic? Also Social Darwinism is just another form of propaganda similar to Mandate of Heaven

The topic prompts no discussion but you telling us your nancy pancy politics, I have therfore decided to argue about why it will not work due to it being a young idealist pipe dream, I believed in Anarchy once when I was younger and flared by the works of Shelley and Ayn Rand, then I took a realistic view and decided that our system is fine and I would not wish to live in a world without electricity, the internet or freedom (while Anarchy does present freedom in the truest sense it does not enable it to work)

 

[That_Which_Isnt]

If the world turned into a huge Anarchist world, then most of you would end up dead or enslaved, Anarchy will never work on a large scale because humans are weak minded, petty and greedy, without the police force, the power companies and a form of government everything goes to shit as the strongest guy around will just start enforcing their own law on the weaker among them, ending with the world ruled by totalitarian or fascistic states. It will only work in some form of happy dream land where everyone decides to be happy and nice and no-one decides "I want to be better then someone else".

The only form of Anarchy that has a small chance is free market anarchy and even that is very unlikely to work because it depends on extreme capitalism (which is a brilliant form of society, people get decided through social Darwinism, you work hard, you do the right things you get to play hard.)

Have you even looked at the topic? Also Social Darwinism is just another form of propaganda similar to Mandate of Heaven

The topic prompts no discussion but you telling us your nancy pancy politics, I have therfore decided to argue about why it will not work due to it being a young idealist pipe dream, I believed in Anarchy once when I was younger and flared by the works of Shelley and Ayn Rand, then I took a realistic view and decided that our system is fine and I would not wish to live in a world without electricity, the internet or freedom (while Anarchy does present freedom in the truest sense it does not enable it to work)

So lets just make me reinvent the wheel JUST for you, no you're not that special. And you seriously think this system is fine? You've got some low expectations bro.

 

[Lord Mountbatten Reborn]

Hmm nature decrees libertarian socialism will work.

It kept us alive for the past 5k-50k years depending on if you're religious or not.

Nature eh? Not human nature?

It's really not going to work at this point in time. Organised crime, jerks with guns unimpeded by the law (and we can't just defend ourselves in some countries where guns have been banned - if government in general collapsed tomorrow where would we get the weapons to do so?), chavs etc. would be able to run rampant.

 

[That_Which_Isnt]

Hmm nature decrees libertarian socialism will work.

It kept us alive for the past 5k-50k years depending on if you're religious or not.

Nature eh? Not human nature?

It's really not going to work at this point in time. Organised crime, jerks with guns unimpeded by the law (and we can't just defend ourselves in some countries where guns have been banned - if government in general collapsed tomorrow where would we get the weapons to do so?), chavs etc. would be able to run rampant.

Oh good heavens no I don't want capitalism and the government to go away tomorrow, that'd be chaos. I want people to self-liberate themselves and wake-up and face the reality of their oppression and then through grass roots groups using direct action overthrow the hierarchies in place.

 

[Clashero]

I always believed an anarchy would only work in a small commune of people (and by small I mean small. No more than 50 people or so). Anything bigger, and all it takes is one guy wanting to get an advantage over the rest for it fall apart. With no police force, no gov't, there's nothing to stop murder and thievery.

In a state of anarchy, the world's resources would be even more unfairly distributed than they are now. For people of simple needs (Pre-Columbian tribes, for instance), anarchy would have worked because resources were abundant.

I have a feeling that 90% of so-called anarchists would be dead within the first week of anarchy.

 

[Clashero]

Oh, and for Christ's sake, do what most anarchists haven't done and pick up a book by either Machiavelli, Jean Bodin or Hobbes. People, in their natural state, are evil, petty and greedy, and need some sort of hyerarchy to put them in place.

 

[Lord George]

If the world turned into a huge Anarchist world, then most of you would end up dead or enslaved, Anarchy will never work on a large scale because humans are weak minded, petty and greedy, without the police force, the power companies and a form of government everything goes to shit as the strongest guy around will just start enforcing their own law on the weaker among them, ending with the world ruled by totalitarian or fascistic states. It will only work in some form of happy dream land where everyone decides to be happy and nice and no-one decides "I want to be better then someone else".

The only form of Anarchy that has a small chance is free market anarchy and even that is very unlikely to work because it depends on extreme capitalism (which is a brilliant form of society, people get decided through social Darwinism, you work hard, you do the right things you get to play hard.)

Have you even looked at the topic? Also Social Darwinism is just another form of propaganda similar to Mandate of Heaven

The topic prompts no discussion but you telling us your nancy pancy politics, I have therfore decided to argue about why it will not work due to it being a young idealist pipe dream, I believed in Anarchy once when I was younger and flared by the works of Shelley and Ayn Rand, then I took a realistic view and decided that our system is fine and I would not wish to live in a world without electricity, the internet or freedom (while Anarchy does present freedom in the truest sense it does not enable it to work)

So lets just make me reinvent the wheel JUST for you, no you're not that special. And you seriously think this system is fine? You've got some low expectations bro.

The system is fine, people are fine, the government is not some kind of shadowy organisation that wants to take your liberties and steal your babies, you are not some kind of great rebel who is trying to convince the "sheep" to wake up, in most western countries (which it is likely your from considering your on a computer with access to the internet and have freedom of speech) people have brilliant lives compared to nearly every other time period in history and compared to the rest of the world were doing great. Its just this whole set of generation X'ers who need something to rebel about and so think the world is out to get them and need a sense of purpose. You want to change the world go help a charity to deal with some of the real problems of our society not focussing on imaginary evil totalitarian capitalist overlord's.

Also I didn't quite get your wheel comment but I am in fact just that special .

 

[Mr Companion]

Well I haven't met a librarian before, let alone a socialist one. I don't go to the library that often so...

I am not stupid im just playing .

 

[Internet Kraken]

This thread is still going on?

Numerous people have already shown how anarchy will not work. I don't see what's so hard to understand about that.

Hmm nature decrees libertarian socialism will work.

It kept us alive for the past 5k-50k years depending on if you're religious or not.

Nature eh? Not human nature?

It's really not going to work at this point in time. Organised crime, jerks with guns unimpeded by the law (and we can't just defend ourselves in some countries where guns have been banned - if government in general collapsed tomorrow where would we get the weapons to do so?), chavs etc. would be able to run rampant.

Oh good heavens no I don't want capitalism and the government to go away tomorrow, that'd be chaos. I want people to self-liberate themselves and wake-up and face the reality of their oppression and then through grass roots groups using direct action overthrow the hierarchies in place.

Why would I want to overthrow the people that have done nothing wrong to me?

I don't get why people hate the government so much. They don't go out of there way to be a bunch of evil bastards. That would be pointless.

 

[That_Which_Isnt]

This thread is still going on?

Numerous people have already shown how anarchy will not work. I don't see what's so hard to understand about that.

Yea I think I'm done with trying to discuss things with a brick wall.

I should've known better though, this is the internet most of you guys will be middle/uppermiddle class, so you won't actually have ever seen THAT much oppression to understand. The streets are the best place to talk to people about this, people that can relate to the whole idea.

 

[Internet Kraken]

This thread is still going on?

Numerous people have already shown how anarchy will not work. I don't see what's so hard to understand about that.

Yea I think I'm done with trying to discuss things with a brick wall.

How ironic.

 

[Lord George]

This thread is still going on?

Numerous people have already shown how anarchy will not work. I don't see what's so hard to understand about that.

Yea I think I'm done with trying to discuss things with a brick wall.

I get the same feeling, never mind most people grow out of there rebellious anti-establishment phase by about 20, I know I did (though I'm still keeping the leather jacket and the motorbike).

 

[littlelacysurprisepageant]

Centerist all the way. Anarchy really isn't good. I would point out all it's flaws but it seems most people have already done that.

 

[Lord George]

Snip

What have your brought to this discussion except your hatred and insecurities exactly?

I pointed out that Ayn Rand's books show how Anarchism is a load of crap and I find it hard to believe you've even read Atlas shrugged so you can't really form an opinion based on what the writer was like at some point in their life just look at Ann Rice for that.

 

[DoomyMcDoom]

*snip*

*snip*

Yea you should read my wall of text I posted... YOU CAN ORGANIZE WITHOUT HIERARCHY by the way.

If you say no I'm finished responding to you.

So, if I disagree with you, you won't talk to me? A bit closed off from outside influence?

I'm sorry but in my view even a committee is a form of hierarchy as even though they speak for the people and are elected thus, they are still elected... thus the elect... thus the elite. even if it's a proponent of a truly free society you still gotta have rules and you will still always have someone in a position to negotiate those rules that is over your head. a million voices in a room is chaos, therefor to represent the rights of the people we must organize in such a way that if someone is not really popular the mass of idiots don't have said individual disenfranchised just for the sake of it. and in electing anyone even if it's by mass vote or by some sort of random act of choice there is always someone above someone else whether its for 5 minutes for a year or for a lifetime.

I'm sorry if you see some shining way of making everyone equal but due to even the most basic of property of human nature and different ideas upbringings and minds it impossible to make everyone equal.

and in this it is impossible to have a true anarchy without it devolving into chaos and being conformed into a hierarchy by the fearful bleating masses....


I'm not hopeless or depressed, I just see with my eyes and hear with my ears. and think/process outside information with my brain... conclusions I come to are based on both watching and interacting with other people over the course of my lifetime. I cannot agree with you, as there is no solid proof of it being possible and no hint of the slightest evidence of any truly successful anarchistic society working in any way. I know too many people who'd ruin it in a matter of days...

sorry if you can't see my point without trying to insult my intelligence or my individuality as a person. But if you think it's possible go start a country, I won't say i told you so if it crumbles and falls apart in a week. I'll only just observe it and make yet another note on yet another failed utopia.