Next Xbox; If not blu-ray, Then what?

[boag]

It will probably use BD because developing proprietary technology will be a heck of a lot more expensive than using stablished INDUSTRY STANDARDIZED technology that is drooping in production costs.

It would be a completely unwise to do otherwise unless the new Technology outdid BD by 10 or so years of development.

 

[newwiseman]

There are always the holodisc formats that support terabytes of information, not that they're ready for anything yet, and won't be available for consumers for at least 5 more years.

I would expect dual-layer blu-ray discs, followed by sony attack ads about how they used it first. It would be my wish that they would just ignore discs and start selling games on dedicated USB 3.0 flash sticks, but compared to the cost of producing discs that will never happen.

 

[Eri]

If not Blu-ray? Seriously? They'd be shooting themselves not only in the foot, but in the chest, arm, leg and head if they didn't chose Blu-ray *reads OP*

I'm going to assume the next xbox won't have blu-ray..it probably won't...They're even trying to squeeze out a last drop of life with
the incoming May firmware update that gives a 15 percent-ish boost to disc space for their games.

If not blu, What are they planning on doing? Maybe trying to make their own new format just for the new console? Staying with DVDs even? Thoughts?

Firstly, why would you make that assumption?

Secondly that's impossible, unless you're describing some sort of new format for save files on the hard drive, physically increasing the size of a compact disc is not possible by any means, let alone a mere firmware update, the only way to increase game space on a disc, is to do some sort of dual layering (eg. 4.7GB single layer DVD = 9.4GB dual layer DVD), which only fixes future discs, or to upgrade formats to Blu-Ray, which would be far too expensive - even if they released an external Blu-ray drive (like thier HD DVD from my understanding), people would be loathed to buy a new add-on just to be able to read certain types of games.

Multiple disks are a far more simpler alternative stop gap, untill their next console - which must use Blu-ray discs.

Their own new format? Their software developers, not manufacturers. The big power companies in Japan have been driving new formats for decades, Sony invented the Compact Disc in the 70s, DVDs emerged in the late 90s thanks goes mostly to Toshiba, Sony also invented Blu-ray discs.

Options that exists in an alternate realities, and for the consoles, after these ones include these

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holographic_Versatile_Disc

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protein-coated_disc

Those two discs, now they are cool, they make Blu-ray look like a 5 1/2 inch floppy drive by comparison.

Not an assumption. Fact.

Currently, a 7.95GB Xbox 360 disc can only have 6.8GB of game data on it, because there's an inaccessible partition on the disc itself that has stuff like video code and anti-piracy measures behind it. They're reducing some part of that. I would know, I have one of the Halo: Reach test copies.

They've been experimenting with new versions. I remember a news story a month or two ago where they sent out Halo: Reach copies with the new format for players to try out. They'll use that.

Actually, That's what I mentioned. It's not a new "format", they are just freeing up 15% space on the current discs. Not nearly enough to compete with blu-ray.

 

[Sacman]

Isn't it obvious? they're going with HD DVD next...<.<

thats blu ray...

Nope... ;P

HD DVD [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_DVD] Blu-Ray [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-ray_Disc]

 

[Macrobstar]

Digital distribution

This, all games will be downloaded in HD quality and stored on a large HDD

Yes. Because everybody has a high speed internet connection.

You are aware that around 40% of consoles are not hooked up to the internet, right?

well along with 80% of statistic being made up (good job)
There is the thing that the planned release date is years away, they want to make this generation last aslong as they can.

Realistically physical media is on the way out in gaming, see the rise in development of i-phone apps and xbla and psn titles as proof of this. It's impossible to get those games without an internet connection right now and both those industries seem to be doing quite fine. It's highly likely the next generation of consoles will be the last in the traditional system and downloadable titles being the mainstream is the most effective way to get a product to your audience.

A delivery system where the recipient never needs leave the house, its clearly possible given the amount of pc gamers who do only buy downloadable titles. So don't be caught by suprise when it happens.

Thats gonna suck, I want to actually physically own my games, I want to still have them if the console blows up and not have to re download them, digital distribution will never completly take over, or at least I hope not

heaven forbid you have to press a button
THE HORROR THE HORROR

yes the level of sarcasm is warranted

Oh yeh I forgot that in this magical land of ours download is completely instant and odesn't require a stable internet connection throughout, what disadvantages does the disk actually have? Oh No! you have to walk to the store, excersize! THE HORROR THE HORROR!

Um your wrong, i interupt my steam downloads ALL THE TIME. So good job on the research buddy. And as instant as i need it to be, considering i can preload it before its released so ding on release date its effectively instant (even if you have a bad connection).

And lets see disks can be lost, broken (oh wait dont certain consoles occasionally destroy the disks in their system as well)and stolen. All of which would leave you without a game. And its not the going to the store thats the issue, its the having to spend time on that when there are better things to do like see you friends, or do some exercise, or play said game.

Well the same can be said for digital media, hard drives can be broken or lost, account details can be forgotten or hacked, I don't htink the industry will completely switch to digital media until it satrts outselling physical, which it doesn't, plus how do people who don't have credit cards or don't want to trust there details with someone online buy games? how do people without an internet connection buy games, and plus what about people who want to take games and play them at there friends houses, oh no thats fine just tell him your steam login then a few hours later hey presto!

Lets see how do you lose a hard drive exactly?? their kind of stuck in their. Yes they can be broken but all the money you spent on the game isn't wasted as you can redownload it.

Account details can be reclaimed fairly easily (also big boys don't forget their passwords).

Well they ask their parents. And as for not trusting online payment issues thats easy, pay through paypal, if you get screwed off they get your money back for you. As for internet connections thats becoming less and less of a problem.

Your only valid point is your last one. And even that is a little pirate-ey if we are being technical. (also remove-able hard drives can overcome this by bringing it with you

but feel free to think the scary future is out to get you
<spoiler=scary future>http://perculaclown.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/rbtmoaa.jpg

Wow you seem to be aggressively defending your position to the point I'm almost offended at least I would be if I didn't think you where so pretentious, you know people game on things other than PCs? you know things with removable hard drives, laptops consoles etc,and I've had to format my hard drive on my PS3 before, had to redownload a lot of shit, its not that I can't download games its just I prefer to go out and buy them its just better, plus what happens when you get bored of your game and want to sell it? its not that I'm afraid of the future, its just I'll only embrace it when its not stupider and a lot more hassle than whats currently going on

 

[fingerbang143]

I was about to write either Hd-DVD or some new hardware but in all likely hood games will be digitally distributed, mostly to stop places like EB games from selling used games....If they did this and screwed gamestop/eb games over I would be sooooo happy

 

[Macrobstar]

Digital distribution

This, all games will be downloaded in HD quality and stored on a large HDD

Yes. Because everybody has a high speed internet connection.

You are aware that around 40% of consoles are not hooked up to the internet, right?

well along with 80% of statistic being made up (good job)
There is the thing that the planned release date is years away, they want to make this generation last aslong as they can.

Realistically physical media is on the way out in gaming, see the rise in development of i-phone apps and xbla and psn titles as proof of this. It's impossible to get those games without an internet connection right now and both those industries seem to be doing quite fine. It's highly likely the next generation of consoles will be the last in the traditional system and downloadable titles being the mainstream is the most effective way to get a product to your audience.

A delivery system where the recipient never needs leave the house, its clearly possible given the amount of pc gamers who do only buy downloadable titles. So don't be caught by suprise when it happens.

Thats gonna suck, I want to actually physically own my games, I want to still have them if the console blows up and not have to re download them, digital distribution will never completly take over, or at least I hope not

heaven forbid you have to press a button
THE HORROR THE HORROR

yes the level of sarcasm is warranted

Oh yeh I forgot that in this magical land of ours download is completely instant and odesn't require a stable internet connection throughout, what disadvantages does the disk actually have? Oh No! you have to walk to the store, excersize! THE HORROR THE HORROR!

Um your wrong, i interupt my steam downloads ALL THE TIME. So good job on the research buddy. And as instant as i need it to be, considering i can preload it before its released so ding on release date its effectively instant (even if you have a bad connection).

And lets see disks can be lost, broken (oh wait dont certain consoles occasionally destroy the disks in their system as well)and stolen. All of which would leave you without a game. And its not the going to the store thats the issue, its the having to spend time on that when there are better things to do like see you friends, or do some exercise, or play said game.

Well the same can be said for digital media, hard drives can be broken or lost, account details can be forgotten or hacked, I don't htink the industry will completely switch to digital media until it satrts outselling physical, which it doesn't, plus how do people who don't have credit cards or don't want to trust there details with someone online buy games? how do people without an internet connection buy games, and plus what about people who want to take games and play them at there friends houses, oh no thats fine just tell him your steam login then a few hours later hey presto!

Lets see how do you lose a hard drive exactly?? their kind of stuck in their. Yes they can be broken but all the money you spent on the game isn't wasted as you can redownload it.

Account details can be reclaimed fairly easily (also big boys don't forget their passwords).

Well they ask their parents. And as for not trusting online payment issues thats easy, pay through paypal, if you get screwed off they get your money back for you. As for internet connections thats becoming less and less of a problem.

Your only valid point is your last one. And even that is a little pirate-ey if we are being technical. (also remove-able hard drives can overcome this by bringing it with you

but feel free to think the scary future is out to get you
<spoiler=scary future>http://perculaclown.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/rbtmoaa.jpg

Wow you seem to be aggressively defending your position to the point I'm almost offended at least I would be if I didn't think you where so pretentious, you know people game on things other than PCs? you know things with removable hard drives, laptops consoles etc,and I've had to format my hard drive on my PS3 before, had to redownload a lot of shit, its not that I can't download games its just I prefer to go out and buy them its just better, plus what happens when you get bored of your game and want to sell it? its not that I'm afraid of the future, its just I'll only embrace it when its not stupider and a lot more hassle than whats currently going on

simple solution there is to buy better games
good games never need to be resold

What a perfect world it would be where games that are said to be good are actually good, COD, Halo, brutal legend, need for spped shift, and plus sometimes a game just loses appeal, you finish it, get bored and need money for a new one
TBH I think the solution would be a console that has something like steam as its main menu, for downloading media (Game, films and such) but still has a disk drive for cavemen like me, steam has a lot of cheap games that are great but probably wouldn't get a disk release (The latest being terraria) so I would still use the download feature, its just for big games I want a physical copy

 

[epikAXE]

Isn't it obvious? they're going with HD DVD next...<.<

thats blu ray...

Nope... ;P

HD DVD [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_DVD] Blu-Ray [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-ray_Disc]

Well i'll be damned!

 

[Gudrests]

On topic: Blue-ray....or USB's or something but...Blue-ray

I was thinking USB's ages ago as a format for Movies/Games, and to be honest it could easily work, i'm surprised no one has used it as a format.

OT: Blu-Ray for sure, although as stated the USB idea could easily work

I think what it boils down to is this simple fact..How many CD's can you fit in a box...how many USB's. Which is more expensive

Well usually USB's are more expensive depending how many Gigs they can hold(a 16 gig is much more expensive than a 4 gig), A USB needs what? A gig or 2 to hold a game? Not even that. I have about 3-4 on one USB and it's only a 2 gig.

IDK about that....most games should be more than 2 gigs. But again just think...how many CD's could go in the place of 1 Usb

 

[MASTACHIEFPWN]

There is no way Sony will let Microsoft use their technology.

Sony does own the rights to Blu-ray, right?

Remember that sony only hates the Xbox division of Microsoft...

OT: I personally think blu ray is over rated. We don't need it for graphics, Games are almost realistic on normal disk formats, though most do have major problems graphically and asthetically...

 

[nazzer]

My proposition: The X-Kiosk

This has been brought up once in this thread, but I feel that it would be a good intermediate for the downloads vs physical media problems, so I feel it would be good to elaborate some

One of the driving companies in the dvd rental industry right now is the Redbox kiosk, which is, as you most likely all know, a kiosk often found at various unrelated places of business (McDonalds, Walgreens, walmart, etc) where a person can use a credit card do be distributed a physical DVD directly from the kiosk through an automated system, and then they can reinsert the dvd in it's case when they are finished.

The main argument here against digital distribution of games over the internet through services similar to the XBLA is that players of console games do not all have reliable, quick, or uncapped internet connections. This would of course alienate many gamers.



HERE IS THE BIG IDEA:
My idea for a solution would be a melding of the current store-bought gaming model and a Redbox-like distribution point where a person may bring a heavily encrypted specialized mass storage device, lets call it the xPod for this thread(Probably a large solid state drive) that would be priced at lower than it's manufacturing cost (much like the PS3 and Xbox 360 were at their release) and attach it to the kiosk. They would then select and download a game from the kiosk's own mass storage, which would have a library of all recent and popular titles for the console, and then they could port them to their own console.

Special editions of games could come in boxes with a special read-only version of these mass storage devices as well, for customers that appreciate having physical copies of games and having some sort of manual or supplementary material.



TL;DR
Have Redbox-like kiosks to download games onto a specialized mass storage device for gamers that don't have internet or don't want long waits for the games to download. For gamers that are old enough, think of the Blockbuster Pokemon Snap kiosks of old.




I'd say that this solution could work, especially given the obvious receptiveness that we have seen among consumers to kiosk-style automation. This could potentially revolutionize the distribution of games and would be able to bring about a viable optical-disk-free gaming console model. These "xPods" could retain encrypted account information for xbox live, including a way to allow gamers to simply insert the xPod into the X-Kiosk and only have to enter their xbox live account password to download the game, and their credit card could be billed automatically. I can also imagine there being some sort of "demo package" that could be downloaded periodically, complete with game demos, trailers and interviews. It may be essential that kiosks have options for 1-3 points of access, so that higher-traffic places of business can service more customers from a single kiosk.

This "xPod" model might also make game preorders easier to maintain. Players who pre-order a game could "predownload" the game, much like on the Steam service.

 

[Conza]

I'm going to assume the next xbox won't have blu-ray..it probably won't...They're even trying to squeeze out a last drop of life with
the incoming May firmware update that gives a 15 percent-ish boost to disc space for their games.

Firstly, why would you make that assumption?

Secondly that's impossible, unless you're describing some sort of new format for save files on the hard drive, physically increasing the size of a compact disc is not possible by any means, let alone a mere firmware update, the only way to increase game space on a disc, is to do some sort of dual layering (eg. 4.7GB single layer DVD = 9.4GB dual layer DVD), which only fixes future discs, or to upgrade formats to Blu-Ray, which would be far too expensive - even if they released an external Blu-ray drive (like thier HD DVD from my understanding), people would be loathed to buy a new add-on just to be able to read certain types of games.

Multiple disks are a far more simpler alternative stop gap, untill their next console - which must use Blu-ray discs.

Not an assumption. Fact.

Currently, a 7.95GB Xbox 360 disc can only have 6.8GB of game data on it, because there's an inaccessible partition on the disc itself that has stuff like video code and anti-piracy measures behind it. They're reducing some part of that. I would know, I have one of the Halo: Reach test copies.

Actually, That's what I mentioned. It's not a new "format", they are just freeing up 15% space on the current discs. Not nearly enough to compete with blu-ray.

Well you can see why, based on you saying the word 'assume' in your OP, that I would take it to be an assumption. That being, Xbox aren't going to use the current generation of compact disc format (Blu-ray), in their next generation console - which I maintain is an idiocy beyond a company as smart as Microsoft.

Now, as for the current generation, the Xbox 360, their may be some truth to the fact their discs are currently limited in size due to an inaccessable portion, like you say. However, this of course doesn't help any of the current discs out there, only future ones, and if they do this, their maximum space available on a dual layer DVD is 8.7GB*, so their best bet would be to minimize the copyright protection portion, so a 24GB game (which can fit on one Blu-ray disc, let's not forget), would require 3 DVDs and not the current 4.

I'm also at a loss to know, why do you believe Microsoft would decide not to use Blu-ray? I haven't looked up any news items at time of writing, but that just seems so, so, 'so' stupid, wouldn't you say? (I'm talking about Xbox mk III/720, not 360, expanding discs for 360 seems logical).

*http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Video_Disc

 

[Eri]

I'm going to assume the next xbox won't have blu-ray..it probably won't...They're even trying to squeeze out a last drop of life with
the incoming May firmware update that gives a 15 percent-ish boost to disc space for their games.

Firstly, why would you make that assumption?

Secondly that's impossible, unless you're describing some sort of new format for save files on the hard drive, physically increasing the size of a compact disc is not possible by any means, let alone a mere firmware update, the only way to increase game space on a disc, is to do some sort of dual layering (eg. 4.7GB single layer DVD = 9.4GB dual layer DVD), which only fixes future discs, or to upgrade formats to Blu-Ray, which would be far too expensive - even if they released an external Blu-ray drive (like thier HD DVD from my understanding), people would be loathed to buy a new add-on just to be able to read certain types of games.

Multiple disks are a far more simpler alternative stop gap, untill their next console - which must use Blu-ray discs.

Not an assumption. Fact.

Currently, a 7.95GB Xbox 360 disc can only have 6.8GB of game data on it, because there's an inaccessible partition on the disc itself that has stuff like video code and anti-piracy measures behind it. They're reducing some part of that. I would know, I have one of the Halo: Reach test copies.

Actually, That's what I mentioned. It's not a new "format", they are just freeing up 15% space on the current discs. Not nearly enough to compete with blu-ray.

Well you can see why, based on you saying the word 'assume' in your OP, that I would take it to be an assumption. That being, Xbox aren't going to use the current generation of compact disc format (Blu-ray), in their next generation console - which I maintain is an idiocy beyond a company as smart as Microsoft.

Now, as for the current generation, the Xbox 360, their may be some truth to the fact their discs are currently limited in size due to an inaccessable portion, like you say. However, this of course doesn't help any of the current discs out there, only future ones, and if they do this, their maximum space available on a dual layer DVD is 8.7GB*, so their best bet would be to minimize the copyright protection portion, so a 24GB game (which can fit on one Blu-ray disc, let's not forget), would require 3 DVDs and not the current 4.

I'm also at a loss to know, why do you believe Microsoft would decide not to use Blu-ray? I haven't looked up any news items at time of writing, but that just seems so, so, 'so' stupid, wouldn't you say? (I'm talking about Xbox mk III/720, not 360, expanding discs for 360 seems logical).

*http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Video_Disc

My first reasoning is that Microsoft refused to release a blu-ray addon after their hddvd addon failed so miserably. A basic blu player would be amazing and they have no reason for not releasing one except to save face from Sony and other blu-ray contributors in general.

Secondly, They've talked pretty hard about going "all digital". I think it's a pretty BS statement, because there's just no viable way right now. Who knows what they'll attempt. But in the end, I just think they are too prideful to use blu-ray and don't want to lose face, or they would have already released a player for their 360.

 

[Conza]

I'm going to assume the next xbox won't have blu-ray..it probably won't...They're even trying to squeeze out a last drop of life with
the incoming May firmware update that gives a 15 percent-ish boost to disc space for their games.

Firstly, why would you make that assumption?

Secondly that's impossible, unless you're describing some sort of new format for save files on the hard drive, physically increasing the size of a compact disc is not possible by any means, let alone a mere firmware update, the only way to increase game space on a disc, is to do some sort of dual layering (eg. 4.7GB single layer DVD = 9.4GB dual layer DVD), which only fixes future discs, or to upgrade formats to Blu-Ray, which would be far too expensive - even if they released an external Blu-ray drive (like thier HD DVD from my understanding), people would be loathed to buy a new add-on just to be able to read certain types of games.

Multiple disks are a far more simpler alternative stop gap, untill their next console - which must use Blu-ray discs.

Not an assumption. Fact.

Currently, a 7.95GB Xbox 360 disc can only have 6.8GB of game data on it, because there's an inaccessible partition on the disc itself that has stuff like video code and anti-piracy measures behind it. They're reducing some part of that. I would know, I have one of the Halo: Reach test copies.

Actually, That's what I mentioned. It's not a new "format", they are just freeing up 15% space on the current discs. Not nearly enough to compete with blu-ray.

Well you can see why, based on you saying the word 'assume' in your OP, that I would take it to be an assumption. That being, Xbox aren't going to use the current generation of compact disc format (Blu-ray), in their next generation console - which I maintain is an idiocy beyond a company as smart as Microsoft.

Now, as for the current generation, the Xbox 360, their may be some truth to the fact their discs are currently limited in size due to an inaccessable portion, like you say. However, this of course doesn't help any of the current discs out there, only future ones, and if they do this, their maximum space available on a dual layer DVD is 8.7GB*, so their best bet would be to minimize the copyright protection portion, so a 24GB game (which can fit on one Blu-ray disc, let's not forget), would require 3 DVDs and not the current 4.

I'm also at a loss to know, why do you believe Microsoft would decide not to use Blu-ray? I haven't looked up any news items at time of writing, but that just seems so, so, 'so' stupid, wouldn't you say? (I'm talking about Xbox mk III/720, not 360, expanding discs for 360 seems logical).

*http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Video_Disc

My first reasoning is that Microsoft refused to release a blu-ray addon after their hddvd addon failed so miserably. A basic blu player would be amazing and they have no reason for not releasing one except to save face from Sony and other blu-ray contributors in general.

Secondly, They've talked pretty hard about going "all digital". I think it's a pretty BS statement, because there's just no viable way right now. Who knows what they'll attempt. But in the end, I just think they are too prideful to use blu-ray and don't want to lose face, or they would have already released a player for their 360.

Ok, your first reasoning doesn't quite stand up, since Blu-rays were initially expensive, so it wasn't worth it then, and now, it'd likely be a failed investment since their first add-on didn't sell well, and everyone who has a 360 now, probably has a Blu-ray playing already OR doesn't want one, not to mention the firmware they'd need to add to support a Blu-ray add-on, software to drive it ect - they should just plan on releasing it in their next console, and expand their current generation DVDs.

Honestly, I agree to a point with you there, it's unlikely in the extreme they'll go entirely digital, however, it is still a viable option, looking at companies like Steam who make a killing by cutting out all the middle men.

So lets recap here, this is not acutally a fact, this is just your opinion based on current market trends? Reasonable opinion, it's not quite reasonable to call it fact however. And as I said before, Microsoft would be very foolish not to include Blu-ray in their 'next' console.

Bringing it back to the OT (original topic), if not Blu-ray, then they pull out of the console market basically. There really is no better option 'except' the potential discs that I previous mentioned (not going to happen), or digital.

 

[Sinclair Solutions]

It will most likely play HHDDVVDDBVD's. Brofist for reference.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

My first reasoning is that Microsoft refused to release a blu-ray addon after their hddvd addon failed so miserably. A basic blu player would be amazing and they have no reason for not releasing one except to save face from Sony and other blu-ray contributors in general.

Actually, they have a very good reason for not releasing one - they have this whole thing about any game released for the 360 being able to be played on any 360. Having games come out in 2 formats will be a pain in the dick with complaints coming from all quarters, from publishers who only want to use Blu Ray to consumers who accidentally bought the wrong format. They also would have to go to the hassle of squashing in all that proprietary firmware they like to stick in their hardware just to let people turn their 360 into a BR disc player. I don't see them doing that, seeing as basic standalone BR players are already cheaper than what MS would need to charge for their addon player to make it viable for them to do so.

 

[Eri]

They are making there own format, its being call the "Xbox game disc " or something like that.
There will be an extra 1Gb of space on the dis compared to DVDs.

That's not for the next xbox. That's for the current one. It's also not a new format, They're just freeing up some space. That cannot compete with blu ray. I explained this in a bit more detail in previous posts.

My first reasoning is that Microsoft refused to release a blu-ray addon after their hddvd addon failed so miserably. A basic blu player would be amazing and they have no reason for not releasing one except to save face from Sony and other blu-ray contributors in general.

Actually, they have a very good reason for not releasing one - they have this whole thing about any game released for the 360 being able to be played on any 360. Having games come out in 2 formats will be a pain in the dick with complaints coming from all quarters, from publishers who only want to use Blu Ray to consumers who accidentally bought the wrong format. They also would have to go to the hassle of squashing in all that proprietary firmware they like to stick in their hardware just to let people turn their 360 into a BR disc player. I don't see them doing that, seeing as basic standalone BR players are already cheaper than what MS would need to charge for their addon player to make it viable for them to do so.

When I said blu player, I meant of movies. I didn't mean or try to mean they would use it for current games. Just a movie player.

I'm going to assume the next xbox won't have blu-ray..it probably won't...They're even trying to squeeze out a last drop of life with
the incoming May firmware update that gives a 15 percent-ish boost to disc space for their games.

Firstly, why would you make that assumption?

Secondly that's impossible, unless you're describing some sort of new format for save files on the hard drive, physically increasing the size of a compact disc is not possible by any means, let alone a mere firmware update, the only way to increase game space on a disc, is to do some sort of dual layering (eg. 4.7GB single layer DVD = 9.4GB dual layer DVD), which only fixes future discs, or to upgrade formats to Blu-Ray, which would be far too expensive - even if they released an external Blu-ray drive (like thier HD DVD from my understanding), people would be loathed to buy a new add-on just to be able to read certain types of games.

Multiple disks are a far more simpler alternative stop gap, untill their next console - which must use Blu-ray discs.

Not an assumption. Fact.

Currently, a 7.95GB Xbox 360 disc can only have 6.8GB of game data on it, because there's an inaccessible partition on the disc itself that has stuff like video code and anti-piracy measures behind it. They're reducing some part of that. I would know, I have one of the Halo: Reach test copies.

Actually, That's what I mentioned. It's not a new "format", they are just freeing up 15% space on the current discs. Not nearly enough to compete with blu-ray.

Well you can see why, based on you saying the word 'assume' in your OP, that I would take it to be an assumption. That being, Xbox aren't going to use the current generation of compact disc format (Blu-ray), in their next generation console - which I maintain is an idiocy beyond a company as smart as Microsoft.

Now, as for the current generation, the Xbox 360, their may be some truth to the fact their discs are currently limited in size due to an inaccessable portion, like you say. However, this of course doesn't help any of the current discs out there, only future ones, and if they do this, their maximum space available on a dual layer DVD is 8.7GB*, so their best bet would be to minimize the copyright protection portion, so a 24GB game (which can fit on one Blu-ray disc, let's not forget), would require 3 DVDs and not the current 4.

I'm also at a loss to know, why do you believe Microsoft would decide not to use Blu-ray? I haven't looked up any news items at time of writing, but that just seems so, so, 'so' stupid, wouldn't you say? (I'm talking about Xbox mk III/720, not 360, expanding discs for 360 seems logical).

*http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Video_Disc

My first reasoning is that Microsoft refused to release a blu-ray addon after their hddvd addon failed so miserably. A basic blu player would be amazing and they have no reason for not releasing one except to save face from Sony and other blu-ray contributors in general.

Secondly, They've talked pretty hard about going "all digital". I think it's a pretty BS statement, because there's just no viable way right now. Who knows what they'll attempt. But in the end, I just think they are too prideful to use blu-ray and don't want to lose face, or they would have already released a player for their 360.

Ok, your first reasoning doesn't quite stand up, since Blu-rays were initially expensive, so it wasn't worth it then, and now, it'd likely be a failed investment since their first add-on didn't sell well, and everyone who has a 360 now, probably has a Blu-ray playing already OR doesn't want one, not to mention the firmware they'd need to add to support a Blu-ray add-on, software to drive it ect - they should just plan on releasing it in their next console, and expand their current generation DVDs.

Honestly, I agree to a point with you there, it's unlikely in the extreme they'll go entirely digital, however, it is still a viable option, looking at companies like Steam who make a killing by cutting out all the middle men.

So lets recap here, this is not acutally a fact, this is just your opinion based on current market trends? Reasonable opinion, it's not quite reasonable to call it fact however. And as I said before, Microsoft would be very foolish not to include Blu-ray in their 'next' console.

Bringing it back to the OT (original topic), if not Blu-ray, then they pull out of the console market basically. There really is no better option 'except' the potential discs that I previous mentioned (not going to happen), or digital.

Sorry if I wasn't clear about the fact thing. The only thing I was saying was a fact was that they're freeing up some space on their current discs for the current 360. The rest, is as you said, just my feelings.

 

[s0m3th1ng]

flash based memory cartridges. Kinda like the handhelds do it, now for the big consoles. It'll even allow you to store your savegames and DLC on the cartridge as well.
And since it's a console, they can put in the most demonic and obscure DRM, as long as it's offline enabled and out of the player's eye, noone will care (I'm looking at demonic versions of securom)

IT HAD COME FULL CIRCLE.
Nintendo would vomit from happiness if that were to happen.
Ohhh...you want learn how make game cartridges Sony? MUAHAHAHAHAHA.