Nintendo Belittles Achievements As "Mythical Rewards"

[pokepuke]

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Yay Nintendo! Achievements are fucking retarded and every time I hear someone talking about trying to get one I have to resist the urge to punch them.

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Moderator Edit: Please be a little less confrontational in the way you post. You can express your opinion just fine without the need for language or attacks. Thanks![/footnote]

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Yes, please do avoid LANGUAGE in your posts, we wouldn't want someone getting upset by seeing LANGUAGE. I don't think using LANGUAGE is very necessary to get a point across, and you don't see me po--

Woops.

 
Topic: I agree with Nintendo. They are usually a shallow way to expand replayableness without adding content, and people tend to exploit the game to get achievements easily, especially when you're also publicly rated by them.

If you want to get a gold rating in all levels, that's fine, but it shouldn't really affect the game. Sometime it can be good because it forces a player to master a level to a certain degree, but I find it very irritating when there are multiple endings. That might mean unless I suck then I won't see one of the bad endings, and if I can't be as perfect as the game wants then I won't see the last ending. Forcing you to go to youtube isn't a good feature.

Stuff like "kill 5 people in one shot" is just extraneous. Sure, you can brag about doing it and point to your trophy.jpg, while appearing like a douche to others, but you could have just had 5 friends stand in a line for you. I think the whole idea should be a private one, as a personal diary for unique circumstances; no public scoring involved.

 

[Taunta]

LOLNINTENDOSUCKSIDISAPPROVEOFEVERYTHINGTHEYDO

Iono. I'm on the fence. While one on side I respect Nintendo's decision, because a lot of times I feel like achievements are there to artificially pad the game's length. There are a lot of achievements in WoW that are there only for 10 epeen points and nothing else. Then again, there are a lot of achievements that reward you with something shiny ingame, like a cool mount, or a schmanzy title. (of course, this could also be viewed as epeen points and nothing else)

It's not like Nintendo games don't have anything for you to do after you beat the game. Complete all the sidequests in Legend of Zelda, unlock Super Luigi Galaxy, unlock hard mode on Super Mario Land, play The True Arena in Kirby Super Star. Usually a lot of the best features don't even unlock until you beat the Elite Four in Pokemon. I've always liked their approach of "after you think you've completed it, it's an entire new game".

So achievements could be done right, yes, but I think they're entirely unnecessary. I just think with douchebaggery points, hand-holding awards, operant conditioning, and artificial padding, there are more pros than cons.

And you know for every achievement that requires skill, there are 10 that are "complete level 1!"

 

[Taunta]

"Mythical rewards".

Yet you're a fucking VIDEO GAME COMPANY. God Nintendo, you just turned into a massive truck load of hypocrites with that statement.

Lolwut?

 

[Something Amyss]

Arrgh, Nintendo...must...defy...progress!!!

Seriously, again with Nintendo refusing to implement new features because they are so stuck on gaming being in the past. You know the past where Nintendo was the only game in town and had no real competition. Achievements aren't the wave of the future. It's 3D technology which was introduced in the 60s with stupid glasses and the Wiimote, which is basically the same as the power glove.

Dear Nintendo, the future is not in the past.

Acheivements are hardly online play or similar.

 

[SNIPERFOX ft. Harry P.Ness]

its funny because its true

 

[Torrasque]

Achievements are irritating, and completely useless.
When I don't care about achievements, I just play the game, and I get a nagging sensation to get all the achievements just so they are done. Fucking completionist nature...
When I do care about achievements, I am not having fun, I am playing to get a magical +10 dickhat points.
And when I get all the achievements for a game, its like I've beaten it, so why play it?

This comic (the part about ecks bawks) sums it up:

 

[GonzoGamer]

*looks at 20 platinum trophies*

I rather enjoy getting them. I'll admit that they feel a bit arbitrary now-a-days, but it definitely adds to the replay value. There's been several games that I feel I would not have kept playing if I wasn't so close to getting a platinum trophy for it. It's not just for bragging either, because I got 121 stars twice on SMG1 just for the fun of it.

Also, this guy would like to disagree as well:

http://www.yourgamercards.net/profile/duck360

So really it seems that the only replay value alot of games have is in the Achievements/Trophies. This is artificial length and eventually people will tire of it.

But, they aren't a huge deal. A bad game, or one that you don't like, isn't going to get you to keep playing just to get achievements. But, it does keep a game interesting after you initially beat it. You can only play through a game so many times before it gets old. This helps keep it fresh just a little bit longer.

Haha this is quite funny.
So before this console generation you never did any post-end content in games? Final Fantasy Uber Bosses? Megaman Battle Network Uber Bosses? Epilogue part in Lunar 2 Eternal Blue? Harder Difficulties like in the Devil May Cry, Zone of the Enders or Metal Gear Solid series? No?

If achievements are the only thing to get you to do any of the bonus stuff in games it tells a lot about you as a gamer then. And don't start with achievements like killing 72000 zombies in Dead Rising 2 or whatever. That isn't an achievement. That's just downright stupid lol. And what exactly is the replay >VALUE< in that?

I always thought people play games because they have fun with them. And when they have fun with them it's only natural that they'd unlock/clear every part possible in that game; because they have fun with it and not for some to-do list aka achievement points/trophies.

Achievements are quite funny. They are like a drug that makes 'casual gamers' call themselves hardcore and gets them addicted to games - good and bad ones.

That?s the weird thing about achievement trophies: they reward you for things that (if you like the game in the first place) you?re going to be doing anyway. I have very few platinum trophies because there are very few games that were so good that I felt compelled to do everything (or close to what they thought would be everything): Fallout 3, Borderlands, and Asscree 2. If they want people to stop trading in their games they don?t need some arbitrary and worthless point system, They need to make better games.

The second problem I have with them is that they have replaced the in game rewards that used to be much more plentiful. Take GTA: in all previous gen GTAs when you complete the vigilante missions, you get an armor bonus. Come this generation?s gta4, you get an achievement trophy.

Finally I?m happy that the Wii wont be getting one of these scoring systems because It?s been much easier backing up and re-loading data without them. If you get a new ps3 (even if you use the same psn) you?re not going to be able to transfer a lot of your saves because they?re locked. Some just say you can?t get trophies, other?s just make you start from the beginning even if you don?t want trophies. I know a lot of people like them but I?d much rather be able to back up my save data.

 

[MetalGenocide]

Achievements, are useless, needless, and a sigh of bad design. However they have an expected effect, so they are not entirely useless. They help spot completionists, people with "less life" than an average gamer, tools, idiots and they bring more business to Microsoft.

An evil corporate ploy to increase sales praying on the shortcomings of players.

 

[OceanRunner]

I used to be big on trophies and achievements, but I've simmered out on that. I play games because I enjoy it, not for "points".

 

[Geekosaurus]

Achievements are awesome. They can't make a game worse, but they can make one better. Nintendo doesn't have to follow Sony or Microsoft, not when they have Sony and Microsoft following them.

 

[BlumiereBleck]

Achievements are like ambition...people need them.

 

[Wintermoot]

achievemnets are ok but they should be achieved and not rewareded 90% of them are like this "use gunX' or "complete stage X"

 

[BehattedWanderer]

Well, they do make a point. Finding things on my own is more rewarding. But, at the same time, occasionally the achievements point out things I didn't realize I could do (they informed me of the extra combat skills like long weapons and sand in AC2). Though, there's always the option of keeping the requirements off of the list, like how some games leave stuff in ???'s. That doesn't affect the artificial point score, though, and receiving an arbitrary award value for completing the things the developer put in the game to make you spend more time in the world they made.

All that said, if Nintendo did start with them, I fully expect them to be something akin to a Sisyphean effort. Imagine the next Mario Kart with an achievement/trophy system. Beat the 16-course All Star Cup, in mirror mode, on the distinct Mario Kart Insane difficulty level, with every character, for a Silver Trophy equivalent. Finishing all of the next Mario without a single hit/health loss, in under 8 minutes, never once touching the ground. Play through Zelda without using your sword to defeat enemies. Donkey Kong without ever once dying. Can you even fathom that??

 

[Raykuza]

I like trophies/achievements. They give me a little bit extra out of a game. What I usually do is play the game through my own way first without any regard for the trophy list. Then once I've beaten it (or maybe sometime I just get bored) I look at the list and see what else there is to try. Maybe I'll test my skills by playing through again on hard mode. Maybe I'll try to find all the hidden glowing orbs. You know, stuff I wouldn't do on a normal playthrough. It's just more motivating to have goals in place. Sometimes if my friend has the same game, we will compete to see who can get Platinum first.

If a game doesn't have trophy support, I certainly don't miss them. I don't play the game to get trophies, they are just there for me to get more enjoyment out of a game.

 

[robinkom]

Achievements are useless... literally.

We didn't need them before the Xbox 360, we don't need them now.

You don't need them to profess your level of "hardcore gaming." That's arbitrary bullshit. If you're an accomplished gamer, you should be happy with that fact based on your own MEMORIES of what you've played without feeling the need to wave your figurative "dick hat" in peoples' faces.

Developers basically use achievements to make sure you understand you just participated in an important event in their game's storyline/progress... you know, because NARRATIVE is such a hard thing to do. >:\

Casual gamers are not casual gamers, that's a made up term. They're you when you were 4 or 5 years old and just learned which end of the fucking controller to hold. They'll either continue to fuel their new-found hobby, or give it up for something they deem more important of their time... like a family or a life. Hardcore gamers is also not a real term... its bullshit that companies like GameStop use to fuel your ego over an imaginary social standing in counting on you to pre-order/buy every Collectors Edition of a game and the associated merchandise from them.

At most one could only measure their experience as a gamer by how long they've been playing games and, even then, it's not a measure of skill because everyone is into different genres and excel to different extents in each. Some 20-something Dudebro shithead can get the top spot non-stop in Halo deathmatches... but he'd get his ass handed to him by his buddy's dad in Pong who was a severe addict of the game back in the 70s after his tour of 'Nam.

And do any of you really care what Nintendo does or doesn't do if it doesn't directly affect you? I could care less if they made their own achievements, I cared just as little unlocking them in Smash Bros. except for the ones that unlocked actual game functions (which didn't really need to be there and could have been replaced with a "You unlocked this!" text box).

 

[Jfswift]

I'm siding with Nintendo on this one. I understand the reasoning behind achievements, in that they provide a convenient and verifiable way to brag to your friends that you actually did something awesome. However, in reality all they manage to do is disrupt gameplay. Case in point, I've seen players stop participating in multiplayer fps just so they can gain an achievement. They cease to care about winning and focus all their efforts on gaining what Nintendo calls a "mythical achievement". Here's your cookie, thanks for not helping the team.

 

[SpaceGhost2K]

I agree with the poster above who gave a chuckle to the phrase "mythical reward." Everything in a video game is a "mythical reward." That is, unless someone has discovered some new game where you get something tangible for playing a video game.

What is more rewarding, blowing up five guys with one grenade, or getting a virtual award that says you blew up five guys with a grenade? They're the same thing, except that you can show off the award to your friends.

I just went back and played Mass Effect 2 again. This makes about the sixth time. Or eighth. I forget. Anyway, I had three achievements I hadn't received, so I altered my gameplay. One was for Incineration and one was for Melee (knock an enemy back with a punch and kill him while he's off-balance). It was fun and added a new challenge to the game.

I hear people ***** and moan about how short some games are when they try their hardest to get from one end of the game to the other as quickly as possible. Achievements say to the OTHER people, hey, have you tried this? Did you know about this? Wanna see something cool, do this. If you're going to drop $60 on a game, I'd think you would want to know all the game has to offer.

People with large gamerscores DO impress me, because it says to me, here's a guy who loves games, and spends a lot of time with them. Knuckles Dawson made it a point to get at least one Achievement every day - and he has, for five solid years. THAT'S A GAME. Real gamers find games everywhere, in everything. A non-gamer in a Denny's puts some sugar in his coffee. A gamer in a Denny's puts some sugar in his coffee, stacks up the little jelly containers, folds the sugar packet into a triangle, and flicks it back and forth with his friend. Achievements are just a game within a game. Don't chase them if you don't want to, but don't dismiss the idea for those who enjoy the pursuit.

 

[Hamster at Dawn]

I like the types of achievements that set you unusual goals. I'm going to complete the main storyline anyway so I don't need 20 achievements just for that but some achievements can be good. I think Crackdown had a fairly good use of achievements, being a sandbox game with a fairly large emphasis on the sandbox part. The Orange Box also did a good job with some fun little tasks like "Keep off the Sand!" where you have to move objects around to make yourself a path through a beach.