Nintendo continue to protect your eyes from disgusting female form.

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kenu12345

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Aug 3, 2011
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Kibeth41 said:
kenu12345 said:
Honestly, really doesn't sway me in either way cause the game was already hot trash to me. "Hey lets take Fire Emblem and make it not Fire Emblem while only keeping names from the franchise! yey derp derp" Yeah, I hated this game since it was first announced
Wait.. It's a Shin Megami Tensei game, developed by Atlus, advertised as a crossover (which it is). And you're angry that it isn't Fire Emblem?

There is literally no logic there. It was never advertised as a Fire Emblem title. It's in the same boat as Hyrule Warriors.

Surely the fact that Intelligent Systems has literally no input on this games' development should have been a hint to what the gameplay would be, right?
You said it yourself, crossover, thus if it doesn't have what I like from the series and just carries over names and goes for generic anime style then its shit. I like Fire Emblem. I don't want to play a fire emblem crossover that has nothing to do with fire emblem besides naming a few people in the game after people from fire emblem
 

gyrobot_v1legacy

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EternallyBored said:
I'm going to keep this short, but you keep failing to demonstrate that any of this shit is new or more common, the changes they made here are exactly the types of changes they made to Awakening and Bravely Default, both done well before Iwata died. You keep trying to spin this as a change in Nintendo after his death but you haven't done anything to actually prove that, you're just blindly asserting it based on nothing more than what you would like to be true.

I'll be blunt, I don't think you have any idea what your talking about and are vastly overestimating just how personally involved someone like Iwata would be in the localization process, unless Nintendo works differently than most other huge companies, the president is not going to sit around micro managing localizers, if any change has happened it's likely within NoA not the Japanese headquarters.
What I am trying to say is that if Nintendo takes the barely censored route, this kind of treatment happens to them. Ignoring the niche, realize this kind of stuff has been under heavy scrutiny from the reviews with them often mentioning sexualization as a negative part of the game.

http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-3/hyperdimension-neptunia
http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-vita/hyperdimension-neptunia-pp-producing-perfection
http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-vita/trillion-god-of-destruction
http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-vita/criminal-girls-invite-only

Given Nintendo's recent library of JRPG scores, it makes perfect sense on why they want to heavily censor, not just one or two things but literally rip features out. All to keep the game publications happy over here.
 

Dreiko_v1legacy

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Angelblaze said:
erttheking said:
slo said:
erttheking said:
That has nothing to do with anything. How is a consumer recognizing changes something that can't be done without blowing things out of proportion or assuming that all censorship is inherently bad?
All censorship is inherently murky. There's always mistrust behind it. Bad? Dunno. Dubious? Absolutely.
No. No it isn't. I've censored my own work in the past and there was nothing murky about it. I did it of my own free will because I knew that everyone would hate it, and in the end as I looked back on it, I myself grew to hate it.

That's a very black and white look on it, and the world is never that simple.
The claim that all censorship is inherently murky is to claim that all change made to a piece of work/fiction is somehow bad. As if the first thing anyone ever creates is the most perfect and pure ideal of writing/fiction/creation and all else after is a disgusting disgrace.

I urge you to write any 400+ word anything and, without ever backspacing or changing anything, release it for public consumption on a public forum.

I can't help but think people who make the 'all change is censorship' argument have never actually written a piece of public consumed writing on a non-moderated place before in their lives. At least not anything they've put passion into.

Either that or they're the 'I'm not being mean I'm just being honest' type of people.

Bad Player said:
Maybe some of us want our eyes to be protected from the disgusting female form. Did you ever think of that, hmmm??

just keep the shirtless guys shirtless, k?
Listen to this guy Nintendo!
There's a distinction to be made here, an important one. Editing is part of the creative process, a first draft isn't yet baked. Isn't yet done, you still tweak things, adjust the spices. There does come a point however where the work is christened as "done" and the public is allowed to consume it. It is a very clear line, after that line, any changes indeed are tantamount to sacrilege. By changing stuff you are nullifying the experience of the people who consumed that work and replacing them with a new reality which they have to adapt to, which they may dislike, unlike the original work. By changing stuff past that point you give the work a brittle and fragile nature that is most damaging, as one will not know what or how things may be changed, anything is at risk. For the security of the audience's emotional investment to the story it is good to let things unchanged as products of their time and if you wish to adjust somehing do so in a sequel/alt reality/what if setting that does not decannonize the original work.
 

Erttheking

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Kibeth41 said:
It's classified as a spin off now, and I'm not talking about gameplay, I'm talking about keeping true to the ideals, the spirit, of SMT. Persona did that in its own unique way. This didn't.

....Uh, I never said anything about it being a fire emblem game. I'm saying it's not an SMT game. For one simple reason. I refuse to associate this piece of shit with Shin Megami Tensei

I am not selectively whining. I am calling a giant piece of shit a giant piece of shit. Hyrule Warriors didn't pull a giant bait and switch. I was expecting a direct crossover including the protagonists of both games. That thing the original teaser hinted at before it was revealed to be utter bullshit. I wanted the Demi-Fiend, not this drek.

You seem to have missed the point of my post. I wasn't saying that it should've been a Fire Emblem game. I'm saying, fuck absolutely everything about this game. It's a disgrace to Fire Emblem, it's a disgrace to Shin Megami Tensei. Just. Fuck. It.
 

RaikuFA

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erttheking said:
I wasn't saying that it should've been a Fire Emblem game. I'm saying, fuck absolutely everything about this game. It's a disgrace to Fire Emblem, it's a disgrace to Shin Megami Tensei. Just. Fuck. It.
This. Why couldn't it just be Majin Tensei with SMT and FE characters? It seemed like it was going down that path then BAM some... thing pops up and I'm like "... the fuck?"
 

BX3

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*Looks at thread*
Yeesh....

So... I'm not a big fan of the alterations and am even less of a fan of the fact that they did it in such a half-baked and inconsistent manner, for now the alterations they made for the sake of content and localization in the first place are now pretty much rendered worthless.

Where do I lie in this... er, debate I guess?
 

Dreiko_v1legacy

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BX3 said:
*Looks at thread*
Yeesh....

So... I'm not a big fan of the alterations and am even less of a fan of the fact that they did it in such a half-baked and inconsistent manner, for now the alterations they made for the sake of content and localization in the first place are now pretty much rendered worthless.

Where do I lie in this... er, debate I guess?
Pervert who likes to watch teenagers in panties and oogle at gray boobs.


Or just normal person who didn't see anything worth the damaging effect to the psyche of the fanbase that comes with a company telling people what is appropriate for them to cosume. Both seem interchangeable to the eyes of some.
 

BX3

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Dreiko said:
Pervert who likes to watch teenagers in panties and oogle at gray boobs.
http://31.media.tumblr.com/27f777cae2b3b389ca1f860223cbb66b/tumblr_mpq609M5Xe1rh9eaqo2_250.gif
*me on a saturday afternooon*


Or just normal person who didn't see anything worth the damaging effect to the psyche of the fanbase that comes with a company telling people what is appropriate for them to cosume. Both seem interchangeable to the eyes of some.
That's the thing though, I don't even see it as damaging just... kinda annoying. And maybe a bit patronizing, but that's a personal thing. It's weird because this game is about as weeb as weeb can get, so the average consumer is already turned off from it, and now the fellow weebs are being spurned because they're altering the stuff that we've never had a real problem with in the first place, which makes it annoying and confusing. Then apparently, they didn't even bother to consistently remove all aspects of the cheesecake, so now it's annoying, confusing AND didn't even accomplish what it set out to do.

I just don't actually get it.
 

Something Amyss

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EternallyBored said:
In nintendo's case I would say there has been an increase in them changing stuff to reduce fan service in their own games, but not because of any managerial change, it's because Nintendo only recently started getting involved in games with traditional anime fan service.
Nintendo has demanded alterations even to third party games since the 80s. If there's been any change, I'd argue it's an apparent reduction simply because of the limited amount of third party support. The stuff they're doing, however, is old hat for Nintendo.

I'd also add that while not fanservice, there are numerous localisation changes made to all sorts of games on Nintendo consoles, including blood, language, and Japanese cultural references. This makes the "censorship is bad" argument kind of transparent to me, since t only seems to be sexual censorship (and only of women) that's the issue.

Fanservice isn't the only time one might alter attire or sexual content, though.
 

EternallyBored

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Jun 17, 2013
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BX3 said:
That's the thing though, I don't even see it as damaging just... kinda annoying. And maybe a bit patronizing, but that's a personal thing. It's weird because this game is about as weeb as weeb can get, so the average consumer is already turned off from it, and now the fellow weebs are being spurned because they're altering the stuff that we've never had a real problem with in the first place, which makes it annoying and confusing. Then apparently, they didn't even bother to consistently remove all aspects of the cheesecake, so now it's annoying, confusing AND didn't even accomplish what it set out to do.

I just don't actually get it.
I'd say that's a normal reaction, Dreiko's view that changing anything is somehow "tantamount to sacrilege" and that it gives a work a "brittle and Fragile nature" is honestly a very extreme reaction that views the audience as weirdly emotionally fragile. Most people don't see changes like this in such a stark light as the company that owns the property can change things without it being a disaster or a crime against art in most people's eyes, we just judge whether the changes are negative or positive and how they effect the game as a whole.

Most people's "psyche" isn't being damaged by this, even most SMT and FE fans are emotionally strong enough to just roll their eyes and accept that big companies do dumb shit from time to time, at least they aren't EA and trying to nickel and Dime us all to death with DLC and buggy releases.

In this case, despite the arguing in this thread, I think most people here are agreeing that it's a weird change, that doesn't seem to actually accomplish eliminating the game's fanservice, and seems wholly unnecessary. It strikes me as a wholly corporate decision, like the NoA localization team just making changes to justify their budget, or to appease the ESRB in some fashion, not for a lower rating like knocking it down from an M to a T rating, but if the changes make it so it doesn't get a partial nudity or sexual themes content tag, NoA might be trying to do that for some reason.

Still, yeah, kind of comes off as patronizing to the Western otaku crowd who's already used to Japan's tendency to insert fanservice into underage (in the West) characters, honestly, I don't really get why NoA seems to be the main ones doing this, and not even consistently. Nintendo's a weird company, when every other Japanese game seems to be getting by just fine with fanservice intact, bar the porno visual novels edited for release on Steam, NoA seems to just be doing their own thing.

EDIT: In the end, I'd think most fans are more bothered by the game just kind of sucking than they are about this, everything I've heard about the game has been pretty lukewarm to outright negative. I suppose Nintendo could be trying to attract casual handheld owners in a younger age demographic, since the game is likely going be a failure among the weeb crowd in the West like it was in Japan. Try to attract a wider audience since your usual dedicated fanbase already largely dislikes the game. That's just another guess on my part though.
 

Dango

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Oh no, now I will have to turn to the internet to see lewd pictures of generic looking anime girls *sad piano music*.

Deary me.
 

gyrobot_v1legacy

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EternallyBored said:
In this case, despite the arguing in this thread, I think most people here are agreeing that it's a weird change, that doesn't seem to actually accomplish eliminating the game's fanservice, and seems wholly unnecessary. It strikes me as a wholly corporate decision, like the NoA localization team just making changes to justify their budget, or to appease the ESRB in some fashion, not for a lower rating like knocking it down from an M to a T rating, but if the changes make it so it doesn't get a partial nudity or sexual themes content tag, NoA might be trying to do that for some reason.
.
Keeping the reviewers happy is the first thing, at this point Nintendo is accustomed to ESRB but not to the fickle nature of reviewers. Given how they have seen IGN give games like Killer is Dead a bad rating because of sexualized content and how openly they admit to that on their twitters, http://archive.is/Ulc27.

Nintendo has decided that it was better to nip the problem in the bud and ignore the few thousand weebs who are into this and win the scores of professional reviewers then to suffer through the tirades of journalists complaining about anything that has traces of weeb tier fanservice/sexual content.

Apparently the coke and hookers bribe don't work anymore for reviewers.
 

Strazdas

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So if i understand this correctly, Nintendo took a game from another developer and changed it for release in NA? because that is not ok at all. Developers should be allowed to show what they want in their games and publishers should do their job - publish - and keep they grubby hands off the code.
 

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gyrobot said:
EternallyBored said:
In this case, despite the arguing in this thread, I think most people here are agreeing that it's a weird change, that doesn't seem to actually accomplish eliminating the game's fanservice, and seems wholly unnecessary. It strikes me as a wholly corporate decision, like the NoA localization team just making changes to justify their budget, or to appease the ESRB in some fashion, not for a lower rating like knocking it down from an M to a T rating, but if the changes make it so it doesn't get a partial nudity or sexual themes content tag, NoA might be trying to do that for some reason.
.
Keeping the reviewers happy is the first thing, at this point Nintendo is accustomed to ESRB but not to the fickle nature of reviewers. Given how they have seen IGN give games like Killer is Dead a bad rating because of sexualized content and how openly they admit to that on their twitters, http://archive.is/Ulc27.

Nintendo has decided that it was better to nip the problem in the bud and ignore the few thousand weebs who are into this and win the scores of professional reviewers then to suffer through the tirades of journalists complaining about anything that has traces of weeb tier fanservice/sexual content.

Apparently the coke and hookers bribe don't work anymore for reviewers.
First, the link doesn't work, and second, that didn't stop IGN, GameTrailers, and most other other sites from praising GTA V. A game with more real-life like violence in comparison to Killer Is Dead. Not mention it and the previous GTA allowed you to go in to strip clubs, so where the fuck were most of those complaints and morals then. I swear the gaming review media is full of cowardly hypocrites. You can do this, but you can't do the other thing, because it's "wrong".

Nintendo trying to keep reviewers happy is pointless, because most of them would not have bothered to pick up the game in the first place. Way to go Big N, you pleased a couple of self-absorbed assholes.
 

runic knight

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That change is very, well, silly. The new outfit is pretty cute though. The weird pattern in how they are censoring the game is sort of baffling though. Not just in the game itself (Isn't this part of the series that actively tries to explore deeper topics maturely, albeit surrealistically, in the first place?) and within different moments of the game (before and during boss fight), but also with the other nintendo properties and games. Bayonetta comes to mind, among other uses of a bit of cleavage or swimsuit.

This comes off like they gave someone overzealous the rubber censor stamp and they revealed their own lack of maturity to hold such authority.

Just, silly overall.
 

Fulbert

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Eh. Wait till they screw up the translation, replacing chunks of text with ellipses and memesing up the dialogues, and then dismiss any crtitcism of the localisation as "those pervy weebs whining about their underage panties".
 

minkus_draconus

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Revnak said:
You say as if censorship has never been added to an anime in post-production. It has, and not just by the localization team.
This made me think.

Photon made the best use of censorship intentionally.
(a totally serious Anime about a disk read failure)
The show would have been lesser without the censorship.
 

minkus_draconus

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Strazdas said:
So if i understand this correctly, Nintendo took a game from another developer and changed it for release in NA? because that is not ok at all. Developers should be allowed to show what they want in their games and publishers should do their job - publish - and keep they grubby hands off the code.
What is the number of the parallel Earth you are posting this from?

Publishers have been messing with studios work (usually forcing the studio to make the change) since probably the moment they stopped just having an internal development pool.
 

minkus_draconus

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Frankster said:


Wow. This has got to be the most ridiculous change i've seen in a while.
I think the smoke does not look good because it does not fit in with the art style.
I am looking at the Japanese version and think the outfit is incredibly stupid looking and bad outfit design IMO.
 

Dragonbums

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Strazdas said:
So if i understand this correctly, Nintendo took a game from another developer and changed it for release in NA? because that is not ok at all. Developers should be allowed to show what they want in their games and publishers should do their job - publish - and keep they grubby hands off the code.
Are you just not aware of how game development works in general? Because this happens so often and so frequently that people who are against any changes don't work well AT ALL in general game development.