No Real Gay Characters in Bioware?

[sir.rutthed]

I've played a lot of Bioware games. Probably all but the very earliest few. One thing I've always enjoyed about them is the romance options are always pretty varied, and keep things interesting. Recently, you've probably noticed a lot of people jumping on either side of the "fire the writers for gay stereotypes" argument, but I'm why people chose to be mad about that when I can't think of any actual "gay" characters in Bioware games. Sure, there are characters who will sleep with an avatar of the same sex, but they'll also sleep with an avatar of the opposite sex; which makes them bi-sexual according to my understanding. Has there ever been a male/female character that will ONLY sleep with a player-character of the same sex in a Bioware game? What are your thoughts on this? Should the gay community be upset about this since it seems to imply that sexuality is completely a choice? What are your thoughts, fellow Escapists?

 

[Pedro The Hutt]

Juhani in KotOR could only be romanced by a female player character, thus making her a lesbian. I'm sure there's a few others around.
Edit: Come to think of it, in the Jedi Enclave a female Jedi (possibly a padawan) even sheepishly admits that she and Juhani used to spend many... nights under the stars together. So even a male player character could at least get an insight into that aspect of her character.

 

[Wayneguard]

The purpose of making all of the characters bi is to give the pc options. They don't shoehorn you into any scenario; they let you choose.

 

[Drake_Dercon]

The purpose of making all of the characters bi is to give the pc options. They don't shoehorn you into any scenario; they let you choose.

That and one other thing.

There's this scale. I have a friend that sticks to it religiously. She never told me what it's called, so I've yet to look it up. Certain psychologists use it to note the sexuality of their patients (usually used in the case of insecure parents). On one end of the scale are fully heterosexual people; not interested in the same sex at all. On the other end are fully homosexual people. Almost nobody falls into either of those categories. In between are varying degrees of bisexuality, where most people find themselves. I'm not sure exactly what it's all about or what factors determine a person's placement, but theoretically most characters in a video game should be able to go both ways, at least for the right person.

I suppose a good example would be Leliana from origins. She usually prefers men, but a woman can start a relationship with her if she tries hard enough. That one was paraphrased from the guidebook that I'm ashamed to own.

 

[Pedro The Hutt]

You're referring to the Kinsey Reports [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinsey_Reports] which were conducted back in the 50s that indicate that roughly 10% of people are truly straight, and another 10% are truly homosexual, and that everyone else is all sorts of shades of bisexual. (But this can also count being 95% straight)

 

[Misho-]

I think people are reading way too much into this.

If this is a major issue the gay community has to worry about, then they aren't doing so bad.

That's what I think anyway. The two gay people I know told me as much too.

I totally agree with this...

 

[Jaded Scribe]

I agree that people read way too much into it.

BioWare doesn't have many (if any) flat-out gay characters simply because they don't. Their games and characters simply don't revolve around a pro-gay platform. They have no need to have completely gay major characters.

They aren't trying to say "see, being gay is a choice!" They're just trying to give options to the player, and by making characters that swing either way (especially when its all of them in DA2) allows the player to develop and grow their own characters and relationships in the way the player wants.

In DA:O it drove me nuts that I'd have to play as a male character to romance Morrigan (not accounting for mods of course). Playing as a male character breaks the role-playing immersion for me.

In DA2, I can romance who I have the best connection with, whether that happens to be a straight relationship or a homosexual one. It allows me to build my character my way instead of being pigeon-holed (whether to play as a gender I don't want to be to romance a character, or to build a homosexual character who only has one choice for romance).

 

[Worr Monger]

Bioware gives you colorful characters... and lots of options. That's what makes them interesting.

I don't think they should be out to make characters that represent specific groups. If they included some kind of flamboyant gay male character or some kind of bulk-dyke... the gay & straight communities would be up in arms equally.... as usual.

I don't pursue the gay romances personally... but I thought Zevran was classy & hilarious.

Hopefully we don't end up debating whether Bioware needs to include a wheel-chair bound character to satisfy that community...

 

[neppakyo]

Hopefully we don't end up debating whether Bioware needs to include a wheel-chair bound character to satisfy that community...

That would be awesome! Wheel-chair based attacks! Handicapped parking tag ranged attacks.

I'd totally play that character.

 

[Gigano]

Isn't your characters sexual orientation entirely up to the player in those games? Do you have to sleep with someone of the same/opposite gender?

Give the gay players the option to pursue gay relationships, the straight players the option to pursue straight relationships, and the bi-sexual players the option for both. It's not like it's saying anything on whether being straight/gay/bi in orientation is a choice in real life (and it doesn't really matter whether it is anyway, as there's nothing wrong with either of it in the first place), it's just being inclusive by allowing you to take your pick according to your fancies.

And isn't it only 0,01 % dating sim anyway? If Bioware went out of their way to give a shout for "homosexuality is fine by us", then kudos to them on that one, but the real meat of the gameplay is what the game should be evaluated on.

 

[neppakyo]

Fuck yeah!

I want my whole party to have various disabilities.

Blind archer.
Wheelchair bound warrior.
Wizard with profound learning difficulties.
Rogue with hyperactivity and tourretes.

Fuck. That would be awesome. Throw in ADD on to the mage or rogue and that'll be a hit.

We'll call it.. Wheel-Chair Age: Park in my spot you asshole will you?

 

[Worr Monger]

Hopefully we don't end up debating whether Bioware needs to include a wheel-chair bound character to satisfy that community...

That would be awesome! Wheel-chair based attacks! Handicapped parking tag ranged attacks.

I'd totally play that character.

NO!! Don't encourage them!

 

[Woodsey]

"Should the gay community be upset about this since it seems to imply that sexuality is completely a choice?"

Them being bisexual doesn't then make it a choice.

 

[manythings]

If the protagonist is Male the male characters are gay vice versa for the female characters. There aren't two Hawke's running around to confuse this concept. You decide how things play out.

 

[neppakyo]

Hopefully we don't end up debating whether Bioware needs to include a wheel-chair bound character to satisfy that community...

That would be awesome! Wheel-chair based attacks! Handicapped parking tag ranged attacks.

I'd totally play that character.

NO!! Don't encourage them!

C'mon, admit it. It would be fun!

 

[SageRuffin]

Juhani was supposed to be the "gay option" for female characters in the first KotOR, but LucasArts wasn't too keen on the idea. What the writers did was simply tweak some of her lines (the confession's still there, just more ambiguously worded) without having to cut out the feline lightsaber duelist from the game entirely.

Which is nice enough. She's one of the more interesting characters in the game (can't beat Jolee BIndo and HK-47 though).

 

[SageRuffin]

And isn't it only 0,01 % dating sim anyway? If Bioware went out of their way to give a shout for "homosexuality is fine by us", then kudos to them on that one, but the real meat of the gameplay is what the game should be evaluated on.

This reminds me of something a friend said: the one thing he hates about BioWare games is that when you try to talk about them on forums, everyone tries to turn the game into a dating sim (example: go to the GameSpot/GameFAQs forums and look up either ME).

It's pathetic, in the grand scheme of things.