North Korean Fear Mongering

[bad peanut]

Well, take a look at a night time photo of the area:

(with an outlay of the country outlines)

South Korea - Bright lights and clear signs of strong economic development.

China - A few lights; some clear signs of development.

North Korea - Blackness. Few or no lights at all.

N. Korea is like Stalinist Russia, with the people completely cowed to follow the leadership.

On the other hand, North Koreans might just have enough common sense to turn their lights off when they go to sleep. Except Kim Jong-Il in his palace.

Maybe, maybe - they don't need street lights given the lack of cars, I suppose, heh

Not the lack of cars. N.K is just the greenest country on Earth

 

[hypothetical fact]

Leave it to the Chinese. Dirty commie vs dirty commie. No one from the uk or us dies, NK is no longer a problem and China have less power because they just fought a big expensve war and gives further proof that communism does not work. If NK has a one million man army, that means the chinese only outnumber htem 250-1. Good odds for anyone.

So you value Chinese lives less because of what country they happen to live in. What a great person you must be.[/sarcasm]
Second - they only outnumber them by about a million once you count reserves, and I have my doubts they'd mobalise their entire military to it in a hurry, wheras NK most definately would. Either way it's not as clear cut as your simple "OMG COMMIES" little mind seems to think.

I'm sure you would rather send chinese guys rather than your own as would most people. And the commies are the ones with decades of human rights violations. It also makes more startegical sense for the chinese to do it, common border and everything. And it really woudn't take the chinese that long to mobalise an army capable of dealing with NK.
And no, its not that clear cut, there would be long term ramifications to consider such as creating a sustainable democracy and the reunification of north and south but sending in china is the most simple solution and the safest for the uk and usa

Why do you want to send soldiers there in the first place? Has Iraq taught you nothing? Americans and every other country on Earth has centuries of human rights violations. What makes you think America - the dieing empire, can control the actions of China? China invests millions into America so you can continue to buy their stuff and they can avoid hyper inflation.
But if China really wanted to they could kill America in an instant as can Iran, and not a bullet fired.

 

[Randomologist]

Just let China invade N. Korea - think about it...

[1]The Chinese don't feel threatened by a US/UN task force establishing a foothold on their border...

[2]The Western powers no longer have to worry about an East Asian nuclear war (Sadly, Pakistan and India are still a possiblity)...

[3]Japan doesn't have an rogue nuclear power on there border...

[4]S. Korea doesn't have to have the problems of West German after the wall fell...

[5]The N. Korean people get a new government thats more open and freer (a measure of how repressive N.K is that China is more open and free).

1. China will always be paranoid about the West. If it moves into North Korea, it now has South Korea and Japan on its doorstep.

2. The US and the UK both have histories with Pakistan and India, and the two countries are slowly making progress. Personally, I'm doubtful of a nuclear war.

3. With a small, poor country like North Korea, we can have some leeway over their nuclear tech. With China, a vast country gobbling up western business with a fork and spoon and providing the labour, this problem becomes quite difficult. The western powers have a very "you cant have nukes, only we can have them" diplomatic attitude. Though it is of course understandable from their perspective, I'm sure I'll be forgiven for assuming that had we the chance to stop China from getting nuclear tech, we would have.

4. You're assuming China will say "We've done all the dirty work, here's your country back?". IMHO, I think North Korea will turn into Chinas newest province.

5. Free as a Taiwanian, at best. Yes, you may stick to your customs, but we're still pointing a barrage of ballistic missiles at you in case you have too much independent thought.

Oh, and that night map of North Korea?
Mr Kim, you left your landing light on, I think.

 

[dontworryaboutit]

I'm curious as to how their fear mongering differs from any other nation or organizations fear mongering other than the fact that they're not actually much of a threat.

 

[Doug]

Just let China invade N. Korea - think about it...

[1]The Chinese don't feel threatened by a US/UN task force establishing a foothold on their border...

[2]The Western powers no longer have to worry about an East Asian nuclear war (Sadly, Pakistan and India are still a possiblity)...

[3]Japan doesn't have an rogue nuclear power on there border...

[4]S. Korea doesn't have to have the problems of West German after the wall fell...

[5]The N. Korean people get a new government thats more open and freer (a measure of how repressive N.K is that China is more open and free).

1. China will always be paranoid about the West. If it moves into North Korea, it now has South Korea and Japan on its doorstep.

2. The US and the UK both have histories with Pakistan and India, and the two countries are slowly making progress. Personally, I'm doubtful of a nuclear war.

3. With a small, poor country like North Korea, we can have some leeway over their nuclear tech. With China, a vast country gobbling up western business with a fork and spoon and providing the labour, this problem becomes quite difficult. The western powers have a very "you cant have nukes, only we can have them" diplomatic attitude. Though it is of course understandable from their perspective, I'm sure I'll be forgiven for assuming that had we the chance to stop China from getting nuclear tech, we would have.

4. You're assuming China will say "We've done all the dirty work, here's your country back?". IMHO, I think North Korea will turn into Chinas newest province.

5. Free as a Taiwanian, at best. Yes, you may stick to your customs, but we're still pointing a barrage of ballistic missiles at you in case you have too much independent thought.

Oh, and that night map of North Korea?
Mr Kim, you left your landing light on, I think.

Points 1, 2, and 3, fair enough...

4) I more meant S. Korea won't have to rebuild N. Korea BECAUSE China would most likely either make it a pronvince or a new puppet state.

5) Yeah, but look at what the N. Korean people have to put up with now. Even that scenario, with China's boot on the neck of N. Korea is more free that it currently is now. China isn't as bad as Stalinist Russia - don't get me wrong, China has a hell of alot of problems, but Stalinist Russia was almost certainly worse.

In summary, China at least has a vested interest in keeping friendly with the West, whereas N. Korea, or rather, the leadership, simply have no interest in any external country - even China, their biggest, nearest ally, doesn't seem to have much sway with the leadership. And even though I think China needs MASSIVE economic and democratic reform, its definitely the lesser of 2 evils.

EDIT: More accurately, China at least has a vested interest in reducing the possibility of nuclear stand off with the west.

 

[mikecoulter]

its not right to expect certain countries to not have certain weapons.


if a country has them, all countries have the right to research and develop them.

Not ones that are run by irresponsible militant's that have expressed themselves as an enemy to many vital countries across the world.

North Korea is irresponsible and should be put in it's place.

 

[yeah_so_no]

Pretty much. The papers I was reading today were up in arms about the strength of the explosion, which was apparently 'as powerful as the one that leveled Hiroshima'. So the North Koreans are up to WW2 tech. Thats laughable!

Here's the thing, though. The last test they did was in 2006. In 2006, the nuclear bomb test they did logged in as one kiloton, which was 1/20th of the bomb dropped on Hiroshima. They were aiming for ten kilotons, but only got one. It was the equivalent of an atomic monkey fart.

In three years, they have increased the power of their bombs twentyfold. That with their reactors having been shut down for a while. Three years.

N. Korea is willing to pour everything it has into its weapons and weapon development, and they don't care who they sell those weapons to.

I'm not so much worried about N. Korea dropping a bomb (Kim Jong-il is crazy, not stupid, and does not want to piss off China), but about them selling it to people who will have no qualms about bombing someone.

 

[vampirekid.13]

its not right to expect certain countries to not have certain weapons.


if a country has them, all countries have the right to research and develop them.

Thats not right, thats very wrong. We should prevent the spread of nuclear/bio weapons and get rid of the exsisting ones, countries should not act like three year olds: "But he has WMD's I want some too!"
I know these weapons are going to continue to exsist, but i don't have to support it.

I agree let's throw all of ours away to set an example...

 

[Overlord Moo]

The N. Korean people get a new government thats more open and freer (a measure of how repressive N.K is that China is more open and free).

Holy crap, I knew it was bad, but not that bad!

Well, take a look at a night time photo of the area:

(with an outlay of the country outlines)

South Korea - Bright lights and clear signs of strong economic development.

China - A few lights; some clear signs of development.

North Korea - Blackness. Few or no lights at all.

N. Korea is like Stalinist Russia, with the people completely cowed to follow the leadership.

Wow, just wow.

 

[Overlord Moo]

Invade North Korea, clear out the farcical communist regime and get the country working again

Easier said than done when they have a truly fanatical regime and million strong army.

The North Koreans', strong, maybe I've got my facts wrong or don't understand things, but when has N.K been strong. More people from China fought for them than their own soldiers in the Korean war. (Chinese soldiers out numbered them about alot to 1)