I was recently engaged in an enthralling discussion concerning the nature and myriad qualities of zombies, inevitably leaning toward the appropriate methods of evasion and aggression to employ in order to ensure one's continued avoidance of brain-eating hoards and members of their ilk. STOP! THIS IS NOT A ZOMBIE SURVIVAL THREAD! You see, my discussion took an odd and uprecidented turn, stranding me in a tumultuous sea of uncertainty trying desperatly to swim through wave upon unrelenting wave of unconsidered subject matter and long abandoned cogitation. It was a topic concerning which I had garnered no experience. It was so dear to my field of expertise and yet I possesed no quips to employ, no advice to seed and no certainty to gaurd myself behind. Certainty being the strongest of a man's intellectual shields, I must admit I felt quite naked. Any passing fancy might strike me as an arrow forever marring the condition of my countenance; and yet I felt as though I should grab the fletching myself and push it deeper if in doing my intellectual curiosity would be abated and I could return to the stiffling plate-mail of my certainty. I remarked as much near the dissolution of our conversation, and she laughed.
As I remember, and I have a gift for memory, the query was posed, quite innocently, what should be done with a zombie that had been rendered either through natural misfortune or scientific innoculation incapable of spreading its infection and bereft of the taste for brains. Being harmless by all imaginable standards does it remain justifiable to end the creature or should one merely leave it alone? I proposed that providing the zombie with a painless cessation would be the wisest option. Whether it thought like a monster or the man it once was it must be dissatisfied with it's current state and disparaging of it's purpose and, having no greater use to society being incapable of directed labor or higher intellectual pursuits, I could foresee niether a rationale for it wishing to continue nor an argument for endenturing it to persist despite it's wishes. "It would be most humane to give it a quick death." I imparted. She reviewed my logic and decided that my conclusion stood on solid intellectual footing. "Something like the argument for euthanasia, isn't it?" she deduced. "A person shouldn't be forced to live if he doesn't want to. I suppose that right could apply to zombies as well."
[IMG_inline align=right]http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/638/zombiea.jpg[/IMG_inline] [http://img269.imageshack.us/i/zombiea.jpg/]
To me it was a singularly distant perspective, I had never considered my vaugely utilitarian argument parellel to assisted-suicide but a decent synthesis could be made of the philosophies and, anyway, she appeared to be agreeing with me and so I murmured "Precisely. Take the undead and remove the prefix, thats my stance. In the case of peaceful ones, perform the action painlessly in the presence of any immediate family whom desire to attend. Perhaps light candles, reminice afterwards about what a sport he'd been in his hey-day, get inebriated."
"Zombie euthanasia ... Wait, wouldn't that make it illegal in some states?"
"Indeed." I answered playfully, not yet fully concious of the virgin ocean I had plummetted into.
"But suppose it was early in the zombie apocalypse and the infected were still only considered ill humans and not endless waves of stumbling death; just before the quarantine stage where the infected are growing but the government has yet to declare a national emergency. If they were still only considered ill-humans you couldn't kill any of them in certain states without being sued later for violating Euthanasia laws. Places like Montana would be screwed!"
This time I laughed. "A prerequisite of government penalization is a functioning government. The zombie apocolypse would leave no such institution intact."
"Well," she countered, seeming quite enamered of her own realization. "assume the hoard never reaches full apocalypse quotas. A low to medium level of humans continue to become infected but a low to medium number of the hoard are lost to natural events. They get mauled by mountain-lions or something. That must happen, don't laugh. Big cats always go for the throat on antelope and things and they always try to break the spine. If one of them broke a Zombie's spine it would be as good as dead. Plus, factor in environmental hazards like being trapped in swamp mud or falling into caves or wells or crevices in glaciers and I think it's reasonable to assume the zombie population would effectively decrease over time. The influx of new-infected would keep the hoard at about the same size perpetually. Let's call it, 4 percent of the population. Enough that zombies are an accepted fact and visible in most communities but not enough for the government to do much more than issue fliers on how to avoid them. Like with swine flu or the bird flu. Serious, but not that serious. Under those circumstances, I think you could be sued for killing a zombie in Montana. It would be euthanasia." She leaned back; satisfied.
I realized then I was unaware of my surroundings and rather out of my accustomed depths, but I felt that she was too and therefore I had as strong a rationale to continue as I needed. That is to say, I wasn't wrong yet and there was a distinct possibility the eventuallity might be avoided all together.
"Hmm ... We haven't yet declared a state of emergency?"
"Nope, business as usual except for those silly foam medical-masks they give everyone."
"Alright... I think it would depend on the circumstances under which the zombie was killed. I'm almost certain brain-eating is a felony and if not assault-and-battery is an equitable charge. If you were defending yourself from the zombie than his death would fall quite comfortably under self-defense and not euthanasia."
"Haha! So you'd sue a zombie for trying to eat your brains?"
"I'd win to. The coward wouldn't show up to court."
"I don't think you would win. I'm not sure that a member of the infected would be considered responsible for his own actions under American law."
"Well then, you sue the immediate family of the infected for gross negligence. If he's sick he's theoretically under their care and the fact that they let him loose endangered not only my safety but the safety of the entire county."
"Sue the wife and kids for letting their beloved husband and caring father turn into a zombie? You wouldn't do that."
"No, I probably wouldn't. But I could. Here's the more interesting question: when daddy begins his rampage, who gets the house? Assume theres no mommy involved and his kids are eighteen or older. Does his estate pass onto his next of kin at the moment of zombification or could a member of the hoard retain ownership of his effects?"
[IMG_inline align=left]http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/7694/zombie2l.jpg[/IMG_inline] [http://img43.imageshack.us/i/zombie2l.jpg/]
"Imagine trying to find shelter from the zombie hoard by tresspassing on zombie property!" she cried, following a moment of consideration. Her face had lit up with that illustrious glow that hails merriment. "Better yet, the zombie's property has been ransacked and mostly destroyed by the zombie hoard. It can be proven beyond question that the zombie in ownership of the real estate was not involved in the destruction of his own house. He also happens to own insurance on the property. Does the insurance agency have to pay a zombie for the destruction of his zombie house by other zombies?"
"Or if he did participate in the destruction of his house, can he be sued for insurance fraud?" I added.
"Again, I don't think a court would consider him responsible for his own actions."
"Ah! You keep saying that. I think there are some ways in which a zombie has to be held accountable for his own actions. Suggesting otherwise means they would have to be treated either as minors or crazy people under the American legal system, neither of which is a good fit. It wouldn't make sense to send zombies to an insane asylum, they would acrue no psychological benefits from it and would certainly endanger the non-zombie residents, and I wouldn't want to let them off with a warning and a fine for their parents. In some ways, a zombie must be able to stand a full trial as a capable and reasoning individual. To do otherwise would be a miscarriage of justice." I announced with finality, convinced I had defeated her strongest contention.
"But zombies aren't capable and reasoning. They act on instinct and primitive urges alone. If American law tried them as fully composed adults it would be a further miscarriage of justice." She countered. "They aren't fully composed and they shouldn't be considered as such. A zombie could never premeditate a crime and it wouldn't even enjoy the benefits of any crime it had commited; this removes sensible motivation and leaves a very strong case for the insanity plea. A defense attorney who couldn't get an insanity plea for a zombie would be a very poor attorney indeed."
Rhetorical joustings of a similar nature continued after this point but it is not my purpose to bore you. It is my purpose to entreat you to consider the ramifications of the zombie scienario described. And I would ask you to consider the scene from the perspective of a statesmen as opposed to a survivalist. Your well-being is not threatened and your wearwithall is not in question. I don't want to know where you would hide from the zombies or the means you would adopt to get there. Let us assume the goal is to co-exist with the hoard (approximately 4-8 percent of the population) until such time as a cure can be fabricated; and that extra-points are given for retaining the human rights of the zombies. If this is the case -
[HEADING=1]How would you establish the laws and bi-laws of your community to ensure optimal safety for non-infected while safegaurding the human and civil rights of the infected, in the eventuality that a cure is fabricated?[/HEADING]
[HEADING=2]Rules[/HEADING]
1) You may not declare martial law and proceed to destroy the zombie menace. This is primarily an intellectual exercise, and it takes no intellect to say "I kill them all".
2) Focus should be on establishing a system that can be implemented quickly and efficiently. Inventing new branches of government is dicouraged unless you have a very good reason to do so.
3) Extra points are awarded for ensuring the civil and human rights of the infected.
4) Don't tell us your personal zombie escape plan. It has nothing to do with this thread besides a tangential link to zombies and is evidence you didn't read the OP.
5) I encourage "inventive and innovative" solutions; but do keep it somewhat serious.
6) I encourage disscussion and debate on the merits of your fellow statesmen's plans but as with all topics I remind you to be respectful and behave yourself as if a mod was watching. (THEY ARE!!!)
7) Don't post tl;dr. I hate that. I know it's long.
[HEADING=2]Issues To Be Incorporated Into Plans[/HEADING]
[sub]Don't feel as though you have to adress all the issues listed. This is merely to help you get started. This is also not a complete list. I encourage posters to provide more issues that could complicate a possible co-existance plan and I will be updating this list as more ideas come in.[/sub]
[IMG_inline align=right]http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/7303/zombie3.jpg[/IMG_inline] [http://img9.imageshack.us/i/zombie3.jpg/]
Zombies and their applicability for euthanasia.
Zombies and the ownership of property.
Zombies and inheritance.
Zombies and the insanity defense.
Zombies and their prior employment.
Zombies and restricted zones.
Zombies and curfews.
Zombies and medical attention.
Zombies and taxes.
Zombies and custody of minors.
Zombies and restriction on travel.
Zombies and public education.
Zombies and anti-discrimination laws.
Zombies and social security.
More to follow...
As I remember, and I have a gift for memory, the query was posed, quite innocently, what should be done with a zombie that had been rendered either through natural misfortune or scientific innoculation incapable of spreading its infection and bereft of the taste for brains. Being harmless by all imaginable standards does it remain justifiable to end the creature or should one merely leave it alone? I proposed that providing the zombie with a painless cessation would be the wisest option. Whether it thought like a monster or the man it once was it must be dissatisfied with it's current state and disparaging of it's purpose and, having no greater use to society being incapable of directed labor or higher intellectual pursuits, I could foresee niether a rationale for it wishing to continue nor an argument for endenturing it to persist despite it's wishes. "It would be most humane to give it a quick death." I imparted. She reviewed my logic and decided that my conclusion stood on solid intellectual footing. "Something like the argument for euthanasia, isn't it?" she deduced. "A person shouldn't be forced to live if he doesn't want to. I suppose that right could apply to zombies as well."
[IMG_inline align=right]http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/638/zombiea.jpg[/IMG_inline] [http://img269.imageshack.us/i/zombiea.jpg/]
To me it was a singularly distant perspective, I had never considered my vaugely utilitarian argument parellel to assisted-suicide but a decent synthesis could be made of the philosophies and, anyway, she appeared to be agreeing with me and so I murmured "Precisely. Take the undead and remove the prefix, thats my stance. In the case of peaceful ones, perform the action painlessly in the presence of any immediate family whom desire to attend. Perhaps light candles, reminice afterwards about what a sport he'd been in his hey-day, get inebriated."
"Zombie euthanasia ... Wait, wouldn't that make it illegal in some states?"
"Indeed." I answered playfully, not yet fully concious of the virgin ocean I had plummetted into.
"But suppose it was early in the zombie apocalypse and the infected were still only considered ill humans and not endless waves of stumbling death; just before the quarantine stage where the infected are growing but the government has yet to declare a national emergency. If they were still only considered ill-humans you couldn't kill any of them in certain states without being sued later for violating Euthanasia laws. Places like Montana would be screwed!"
This time I laughed. "A prerequisite of government penalization is a functioning government. The zombie apocolypse would leave no such institution intact."
"Well," she countered, seeming quite enamered of her own realization. "assume the hoard never reaches full apocalypse quotas. A low to medium level of humans continue to become infected but a low to medium number of the hoard are lost to natural events. They get mauled by mountain-lions or something. That must happen, don't laugh. Big cats always go for the throat on antelope and things and they always try to break the spine. If one of them broke a Zombie's spine it would be as good as dead. Plus, factor in environmental hazards like being trapped in swamp mud or falling into caves or wells or crevices in glaciers and I think it's reasonable to assume the zombie population would effectively decrease over time. The influx of new-infected would keep the hoard at about the same size perpetually. Let's call it, 4 percent of the population. Enough that zombies are an accepted fact and visible in most communities but not enough for the government to do much more than issue fliers on how to avoid them. Like with swine flu or the bird flu. Serious, but not that serious. Under those circumstances, I think you could be sued for killing a zombie in Montana. It would be euthanasia." She leaned back; satisfied.
I realized then I was unaware of my surroundings and rather out of my accustomed depths, but I felt that she was too and therefore I had as strong a rationale to continue as I needed. That is to say, I wasn't wrong yet and there was a distinct possibility the eventuallity might be avoided all together.
"Hmm ... We haven't yet declared a state of emergency?"
"Nope, business as usual except for those silly foam medical-masks they give everyone."
"Alright... I think it would depend on the circumstances under which the zombie was killed. I'm almost certain brain-eating is a felony and if not assault-and-battery is an equitable charge. If you were defending yourself from the zombie than his death would fall quite comfortably under self-defense and not euthanasia."
"Haha! So you'd sue a zombie for trying to eat your brains?"
"I'd win to. The coward wouldn't show up to court."
"I don't think you would win. I'm not sure that a member of the infected would be considered responsible for his own actions under American law."
"Well then, you sue the immediate family of the infected for gross negligence. If he's sick he's theoretically under their care and the fact that they let him loose endangered not only my safety but the safety of the entire county."
"Sue the wife and kids for letting their beloved husband and caring father turn into a zombie? You wouldn't do that."
"No, I probably wouldn't. But I could. Here's the more interesting question: when daddy begins his rampage, who gets the house? Assume theres no mommy involved and his kids are eighteen or older. Does his estate pass onto his next of kin at the moment of zombification or could a member of the hoard retain ownership of his effects?"
[IMG_inline align=left]http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/7694/zombie2l.jpg[/IMG_inline] [http://img43.imageshack.us/i/zombie2l.jpg/]
"Imagine trying to find shelter from the zombie hoard by tresspassing on zombie property!" she cried, following a moment of consideration. Her face had lit up with that illustrious glow that hails merriment. "Better yet, the zombie's property has been ransacked and mostly destroyed by the zombie hoard. It can be proven beyond question that the zombie in ownership of the real estate was not involved in the destruction of his own house. He also happens to own insurance on the property. Does the insurance agency have to pay a zombie for the destruction of his zombie house by other zombies?"
"Or if he did participate in the destruction of his house, can he be sued for insurance fraud?" I added.
"Again, I don't think a court would consider him responsible for his own actions."
"Ah! You keep saying that. I think there are some ways in which a zombie has to be held accountable for his own actions. Suggesting otherwise means they would have to be treated either as minors or crazy people under the American legal system, neither of which is a good fit. It wouldn't make sense to send zombies to an insane asylum, they would acrue no psychological benefits from it and would certainly endanger the non-zombie residents, and I wouldn't want to let them off with a warning and a fine for their parents. In some ways, a zombie must be able to stand a full trial as a capable and reasoning individual. To do otherwise would be a miscarriage of justice." I announced with finality, convinced I had defeated her strongest contention.
"But zombies aren't capable and reasoning. They act on instinct and primitive urges alone. If American law tried them as fully composed adults it would be a further miscarriage of justice." She countered. "They aren't fully composed and they shouldn't be considered as such. A zombie could never premeditate a crime and it wouldn't even enjoy the benefits of any crime it had commited; this removes sensible motivation and leaves a very strong case for the insanity plea. A defense attorney who couldn't get an insanity plea for a zombie would be a very poor attorney indeed."
Rhetorical joustings of a similar nature continued after this point but it is not my purpose to bore you. It is my purpose to entreat you to consider the ramifications of the zombie scienario described. And I would ask you to consider the scene from the perspective of a statesmen as opposed to a survivalist. Your well-being is not threatened and your wearwithall is not in question. I don't want to know where you would hide from the zombies or the means you would adopt to get there. Let us assume the goal is to co-exist with the hoard (approximately 4-8 percent of the population) until such time as a cure can be fabricated; and that extra-points are given for retaining the human rights of the zombies. If this is the case -
[HEADING=1]How would you establish the laws and bi-laws of your community to ensure optimal safety for non-infected while safegaurding the human and civil rights of the infected, in the eventuality that a cure is fabricated?[/HEADING]
[HEADING=2]Rules[/HEADING]
1) You may not declare martial law and proceed to destroy the zombie menace. This is primarily an intellectual exercise, and it takes no intellect to say "I kill them all".
2) Focus should be on establishing a system that can be implemented quickly and efficiently. Inventing new branches of government is dicouraged unless you have a very good reason to do so.
3) Extra points are awarded for ensuring the civil and human rights of the infected.
4) Don't tell us your personal zombie escape plan. It has nothing to do with this thread besides a tangential link to zombies and is evidence you didn't read the OP.
5) I encourage "inventive and innovative" solutions; but do keep it somewhat serious.
6) I encourage disscussion and debate on the merits of your fellow statesmen's plans but as with all topics I remind you to be respectful and behave yourself as if a mod was watching. (THEY ARE!!!)
7) Don't post tl;dr. I hate that. I know it's long.
[HEADING=2]Issues To Be Incorporated Into Plans[/HEADING]
[sub]Don't feel as though you have to adress all the issues listed. This is merely to help you get started. This is also not a complete list. I encourage posters to provide more issues that could complicate a possible co-existance plan and I will be updating this list as more ideas come in.[/sub]
[IMG_inline align=right]http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/7303/zombie3.jpg[/IMG_inline] [http://img9.imageshack.us/i/zombie3.jpg/]
Zombies and their applicability for euthanasia.
Zombies and the ownership of property.
Zombies and inheritance.
Zombies and the insanity defense.
Zombies and their prior employment.
Zombies and restricted zones.
Zombies and curfews.
Zombies and medical attention.
Zombies and taxes.
Zombies and custody of minors.
Zombies and restriction on travel.
Zombies and public education.
Zombies and anti-discrimination laws.
Zombies and social security.
More to follow...
