On downloading games illegally

Recommended Videos

intheweeds

New member
Apr 6, 2011
817
0
0
WaruTaru said:
OT: Perhaps its the same reasoning as people going on Youtube (or any streaming site) and watching movies and listening to music for free. If its free, why pay for it? I think its something to do with the tangibility of the product and the evil of the internet, coupled with the low value of entertainment products. The one downloading is a digital kleptomaniac, and the one uploading is a share-bear. Somehow the share-bear is the one to blame. Shouldn't the person who did the actual stealing be punished more severely instead?
I agree with you about the Youtube mindset. I don't think the logic there holds any water, but this could be one of the arguments used. The culture of Napster doesn't help either. People have gotten used to downloading music they want for free and watching any video they want at their fingertips. The concept of 'intellectual property' as something you pay for has been damaged by those industries, I believe it was during the Napster heyday, but that's just me. Those people need to realize that the 'free' videos you watch on youtube aren't actually free. There is a whole business model going on there that was built for it and works well for those involved, which is why we all have these 'free' videos to watch.

Unfortunately not all industries that deal in intellectual property have the option of working around this effectively like the music movie or tv industries do.

The problem with this as an excuse though is that youtube and limewire/etc. primarily deal in movies and music: two things that produce merchandise and concerts/cinema shows and advertising space. They have the option of adapting a business model to allow for free music/watching privileges as a way to draw you in and still make the money somewhere else.

Once you have taken a free video game. That's it. You have everything they have to offer. Same goes for other boring technologies. Your operating system for instance or microsoft word - an almost required program. I think you would be hard pressed to think of someone who bought a brand new copy and didn't just have someone install it from a disk they had around. Video games are entertainment media, but they are also software applications. Some industries can but I can't think off-hand of any reasonable way a video game dev could allow piracy as a business model and still make any money at all.

It's unfortunate that other entertainment industries have changed peoples mindset about it in the switch to the internet age.
 

toquio3

New member
Nov 7, 2006
43
0
0
Judgement101 said:
Honestly, if you pirate games I think you are beyond the lowest form of scum. I think you are the lowest of the low and the worst of the worst. There is on excuse. And the "I couldn't afford it" excuse isn't legit. If you couldn't afford it then just save up for it. If it isn't avaliable in your country, import it. Seriously, piracy is theft in its purest form.
lower than rapists? mass murderers? really? a person who illegally downloads games is worst than a man who rapes little children?

you are fucked in the head.

[factoid]Oh, and btw, everyone in this thread who says they dont pirate, ever, are all liars.[/factoid]
 

Elivercury

New member
May 25, 2009
154
0
0
Tbh, I used to be pretty pro-pirating back when I was younger and didn't have any disposable income. But I also used to be paying £30-40 a game back then and steam wasn't around/just starting up. Today however the market is far more competitive and the price cuts you can get on even brand new games is pretty shocking. Combine this with the larger options for rental/digital distribution (netflix, lovefilm etc.) and I really don't see any reason to pirate.

It's very rare I spend more than £5-10 on a game these days, and if I do, it's usually a multiplayer focused game and I want to get playing with my friends as early as possible. But for the most part I'm content to wait a whole 2-3 months and get the game for 1/4 of the price.

With gaming being cheaper than it's ever been before I really can't condone piracy on economic grounds. The only place I'd really accept piracy is in the case of abandonware, as the company who would profit probably shut down years ago and to a lesser extent I can approve of "protest piracy", where you refuse to pay for a game for whatever reasons. With the latter I still think if you care enough to protest then you should just sacrifice the enjoyment you'd get from the game, but I can definitely see how some people can hold the opinion of "Why should I PAY for a WORSE game!?".

As for being lower than rapists/murderers etc...lets not get carried away now eh?
 

Cridhe

New member
May 24, 2011
552
0
0
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
Buying used games at Gamestop, or from someone personally is the same as piracy IMO. The devs aren't seeing any of THAT money-cake.
Nope. They ALREADY saw money when the game sold for the first time, dear reader.

Further, take a game like Dragon Age 2. A person buys it, plays it, and doesn't like it. So they sell it back to Gamestop. Person 2 buys it. They like it, and decided to keep it. They also buy DLC for it. Had person 1 heald on to that game, person 2 would have never bought any add-on

Further, if your line of reasoning is "Devs see no money" then you must also think that lending games is just as bad as piracy. Or that libraries are just as bad.
See my above comment on not giving a crap what anyone does, regardless. :p

But yeah lending/renting and "ownership" are a couple completely different things though. I didn't say it was wrong or bad, these game companies would nail you to the wall for all you got anyway faster than you can say "Xfinity". Everyone's out for themselves and they're only in the business to make money, if you think they care about the gamers you're fooling yourself.

Pirating an indie game however I could go ahead and kinda give a damn about, and give you the "disappointed grandmother" look for it. Otherwise I couldn't care less whether someone got their game on Steam or a torrent site, I just don't.
 

CM156_v1legacy

Revelation 9:6
Mar 23, 2011
3,997
0
0
Cridhe said:
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
Buying used games at Gamestop, or from someone personally is the same as piracy IMO. The devs aren't seeing any of THAT money-cake.
Nope. They ALREADY saw money when the game sold for the first time, dear reader.

Further, take a game like Dragon Age 2. A person buys it, plays it, and doesn't like it. So they sell it back to Gamestop. Person 2 buys it. They like it, and decided to keep it. They also buy DLC for it. Had person 1 heald on to that game, person 2 would have never bought any add-on

Further, if your line of reasoning is "Devs see no money" then you must also think that lending games is just as bad as piracy. Or that libraries are just as bad.
See my above comment on not giving a crap what anyone does, regardless. :p

But yeah lending/renting and "ownership" are a couple completely different things though. I didn't say it was wrong or bad, these game companies would nail you to the wall for all you got anyway faster than you can say "Xfinity". Everyone's out for themselves and they're only in the business to make money, if you think they care about the gamers you're fooling yourself.

Pirating an indie game however I could go ahead and kinda give a damn about, and give you the "disappointed grandmother" look for it. Otherwise I couldn't care less whether someone got their game on Steam or a torrent site, I just don't.
Ahhh, I see

I was more refering to the argument that "They don't see any money from second hand sales"

Firstly, if someone no longer wishes to own your game, chances are, they aren't going to buy DLC for it. While a person who buys second hand very well may

And secondly, they should see money when an item they sold is re-sold? That's an... odd view of ownership.
 

Cridhe

New member
May 24, 2011
552
0
0
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
Buying used games at Gamestop, or from someone personally is the same as piracy IMO. The devs aren't seeing any of THAT money-cake.
Nope. They ALREADY saw money when the game sold for the first time, dear reader.

Further, take a game like Dragon Age 2. A person buys it, plays it, and doesn't like it. So they sell it back to Gamestop. Person 2 buys it. They like it, and decided to keep it. They also buy DLC for it. Had person 1 heald on to that game, person 2 would have never bought any add-on

Further, if your line of reasoning is "Devs see no money" then you must also think that lending games is just as bad as piracy. Or that libraries are just as bad.
See my above comment on not giving a crap what anyone does, regardless. :p

But yeah lending/renting and "ownership" are a couple completely different things though. I didn't say it was wrong or bad, these game companies would nail you to the wall for all you got anyway faster than you can say "Xfinity". Everyone's out for themselves and they're only in the business to make money, if you think they care about the gamers you're fooling yourself.

Pirating an indie game however I could go ahead and kinda give a damn about, and give you the "disappointed grandmother" look for it. Otherwise I couldn't care less whether someone got their game on Steam or a torrent site, I just don't.
Ahhh, I see

I was more refering to the argument that "They don't see any money from second hand sales"

Firstly, if someone no longer wishes to own your game, chances are, they aren't going to buy DLC for it. While a person who buys second hand very well may

And secondly, they should see money when an item they sold is re-sold? That's an... odd view of ownership.
Naw I didn't say they SHOULD see money money for a second hand game, just that they don't see money for it. I mean... it just seems to me there's no difference between buying used or pirating in that sense.
 

CM156_v1legacy

Revelation 9:6
Mar 23, 2011
3,997
0
0
Cridhe said:
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
Buying used games at Gamestop, or from someone personally is the same as piracy IMO. The devs aren't seeing any of THAT money-cake.
Nope. They ALREADY saw money when the game sold for the first time, dear reader.

Further, take a game like Dragon Age 2. A person buys it, plays it, and doesn't like it. So they sell it back to Gamestop. Person 2 buys it. They like it, and decided to keep it. They also buy DLC for it. Had person 1 heald on to that game, person 2 would have never bought any add-on

Further, if your line of reasoning is "Devs see no money" then you must also think that lending games is just as bad as piracy. Or that libraries are just as bad.
See my above comment on not giving a crap what anyone does, regardless. :p

But yeah lending/renting and "ownership" are a couple completely different things though. I didn't say it was wrong or bad, these game companies would nail you to the wall for all you got anyway faster than you can say "Xfinity". Everyone's out for themselves and they're only in the business to make money, if you think they care about the gamers you're fooling yourself.

Pirating an indie game however I could go ahead and kinda give a damn about, and give you the "disappointed grandmother" look for it. Otherwise I couldn't care less whether someone got their game on Steam or a torrent site, I just don't.
Ahhh, I see

I was more refering to the argument that "They don't see any money from second hand sales"

Firstly, if someone no longer wishes to own your game, chances are, they aren't going to buy DLC for it. While a person who buys second hand very well may

And secondly, they should see money when an item they sold is re-sold? That's an... odd view of ownership.
Naw I didn't say they SHOULD see money money for a second hand game, just that they don't see money for it. I mean... it just seems to me there's no difference between buying used or pirating in that sense.
Ahhhh.

But they is a really big difference, if you think about it.

When I buy a copy of, say, Mass Effect 2, Bioware knows that for that one sale, there will be one copy. Even if I give it to a friend, or sell it, there is still only one copy of that game per sale. If I give it away, I can no longer play it.

With piracy, one copy of the game can have millions of downloads. For that one sale, there will be multiple people playing, at once. If I give it away, I can still play it.

And that's a big distinction
 

Cridhe

New member
May 24, 2011
552
0
0
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
Buying used games at Gamestop, or from someone personally is the same as piracy IMO. The devs aren't seeing any of THAT money-cake.
Nope. They ALREADY saw money when the game sold for the first time, dear reader.

Further, take a game like Dragon Age 2. A person buys it, plays it, and doesn't like it. So they sell it back to Gamestop. Person 2 buys it. They like it, and decided to keep it. They also buy DLC for it. Had person 1 heald on to that game, person 2 would have never bought any add-on

Further, if your line of reasoning is "Devs see no money" then you must also think that lending games is just as bad as piracy. Or that libraries are just as bad.
See my above comment on not giving a crap what anyone does, regardless. :p

But yeah lending/renting and "ownership" are a couple completely different things though. I didn't say it was wrong or bad, these game companies would nail you to the wall for all you got anyway faster than you can say "Xfinity". Everyone's out for themselves and they're only in the business to make money, if you think they care about the gamers you're fooling yourself.

Pirating an indie game however I could go ahead and kinda give a damn about, and give you the "disappointed grandmother" look for it. Otherwise I couldn't care less whether someone got their game on Steam or a torrent site, I just don't.
Ahhh, I see

I was more refering to the argument that "They don't see any money from second hand sales"

Firstly, if someone no longer wishes to own your game, chances are, they aren't going to buy DLC for it. While a person who buys second hand very well may

And secondly, they should see money when an item they sold is re-sold? That's an... odd view of ownership.
Naw I didn't say they SHOULD see money money for a second hand game, just that they don't see money for it. I mean... it just seems to me there's no difference between buying used or pirating in that sense.
Ahhhh.

But they is a really big difference, if you think about it.

When I buy a copy of, say, Mass Effect 2, Bioware knows that for that one sale, there will be one copy. Even if I give it to a friend, or sell it, there is still only one copy of that game per sale. If I give it away, I can no longer play it.

With piracy, one copy of the game can have millions of downloads. For that one sale, there will be multiple people playing, at once. If I give it away, I can still play it.

And that's a big distinction
Yeah I suppose you actually have a point there, never really thought about it that way.

Also, I should add that lack of support for Bioware (ONLY Bioware... EA is jerks! I really wish Bioware could go on their own.) also gets a "disappointed grandmother" face from me.
 

CM156_v1legacy

Revelation 9:6
Mar 23, 2011
3,997
0
0
Cridhe said:
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
CM156 said:
Cridhe said:
Buying used games at Gamestop, or from someone personally is the same as piracy IMO. The devs aren't seeing any of THAT money-cake.
Nope. They ALREADY saw money when the game sold for the first time, dear reader.

Further, take a game like Dragon Age 2. A person buys it, plays it, and doesn't like it. So they sell it back to Gamestop. Person 2 buys it. They like it, and decided to keep it. They also buy DLC for it. Had person 1 heald on to that game, person 2 would have never bought any add-on

Further, if your line of reasoning is "Devs see no money" then you must also think that lending games is just as bad as piracy. Or that libraries are just as bad.
See my above comment on not giving a crap what anyone does, regardless. :p

But yeah lending/renting and "ownership" are a couple completely different things though. I didn't say it was wrong or bad, these game companies would nail you to the wall for all you got anyway faster than you can say "Xfinity". Everyone's out for themselves and they're only in the business to make money, if you think they care about the gamers you're fooling yourself.

Pirating an indie game however I could go ahead and kinda give a damn about, and give you the "disappointed grandmother" look for it. Otherwise I couldn't care less whether someone got their game on Steam or a torrent site, I just don't.
Ahhh, I see

I was more refering to the argument that "They don't see any money from second hand sales"

Firstly, if someone no longer wishes to own your game, chances are, they aren't going to buy DLC for it. While a person who buys second hand very well may

And secondly, they should see money when an item they sold is re-sold? That's an... odd view of ownership.
Naw I didn't say they SHOULD see money money for a second hand game, just that they don't see money for it. I mean... it just seems to me there's no difference between buying used or pirating in that sense.
Ahhhh.

But they is a really big difference, if you think about it.

When I buy a copy of, say, Mass Effect 2, Bioware knows that for that one sale, there will be one copy. Even if I give it to a friend, or sell it, there is still only one copy of that game per sale. If I give it away, I can no longer play it.

With piracy, one copy of the game can have millions of downloads. For that one sale, there will be multiple people playing, at once. If I give it away, I can still play it.

And that's a big distinction
Yeah I suppose you actually have a point there, never really thought about it that way.

Also, I should add that lack of support for Bioware (ONLY Bioware... EA is jerks! I really wish Bioware could go on their own.) also gets a "disappointed grandmother" face from me.
Hey, I enjoy debate. Thanks for listening.

And yes, I agree. I bought ME 1 used about a year ago. Loved it so much that I got ME2 new, along with DA:O, also new, and then DA:2 at launch.

Wonderful games that I'll be keeping because they have great replay value.
 

Yopaz

Sarcastic overlord
Jun 3, 2009
6,092
0
0
The_Critic said:
so what your saying is.. Oh you bought a bad game your fucked, don't you dare try to sell that to a friend or trade it in, you don't deserve to receive even a portion of your money back cause you were stupid and bought it.

You said above the Publisher has already been paid for the game, they print 50k copies of a game, 50k copies are sent to the stores. So they are paid for 50k copies at $30 (whatever best buy or gamestop buys the games at) so they make 150k dollars.

45k of the games are returned (cause it's FFXIII and it's a pos)Game stop pays trade in value for them thereby losing a portion of their original profit lets say 15 bucks.35k retard fanboys buy used coppies now being sold at 40 bucks a game, games top makes some more profit off it, and then takes over the world because of it.

Apocalyptic catastrophe aside. You still miss the point because the publisher still sold all 50K. There are only 50K in circulation.

If you want to hold on to a bad game and be ripped off by giant companies that don't give a fuck about you feel free. I've never gotten a personal apology from square enix because FFXIII sucked ass, and I'm pretty sure no one else has, I even had the audacity to email them and let them know I was unsatisfied with their product. They didn't care.You know why, they had already been payed for that product, Gamestop paid them for me, and I bought the game from gamestop.

Not only did they not care that FFXIII was a piece of stale chalky shit, they proceded to release FFXIV, I think Satan has puss filled blisters that would be more entertaining then that shitty excuse for an MMO.

As far as I'm concerned Fuck em all, if they sell me shit, I will do all I can to trade the game in to at least get a portion of that cash back.

As far as the DRM is concerned, they can shove it up their asses. I'm half a mind to pirate any game that has a DRM, if they keep force feeding that shit to me. If you want to keep me from getting my hard earned money when you make a shit game, maybe I shouldn't pay for their shit games anymore. It's not like DRM stops piracy. I just prevents me from selling games to my friends or giving my used games as gifts to younger relatives. Its far easier to deal with having to teach them about torrenting then it is to deal with angry aunts and uncles who call me to tell me the game I gave their son for his birthday doesn't work.

I think I had a purpose behind this post, If I remember right it was FUCK DRM.
If you don't have half a mind to make your questions on how the market works, I wont try to explain the factors behind demand and production for you.

I'm sure only bad games get bought used and you will save the world by being the most awesome person in the world and only buying used and downloading your games.
 

CM156_v1legacy

Revelation 9:6
Mar 23, 2011
3,997
0
0
Yopaz said:
The_Critic said:
so what your saying is.. Oh you bought a bad game your fucked, don't you dare try to sell that to a friend or trade it in, you don't deserve to receive even a portion of your money back cause you were stupid and bought it.

You said above the Publisher has already been paid for the game, they print 50k copies of a game, 50k copies are sent to the stores. So they are paid for 50k copies at $30 (whatever best buy or gamestop buys the games at) so they make 150k dollars.

45k of the games are returned (cause it's FFXIII and it's a pos)Game stop pays trade in value for them thereby losing a portion of their original profit lets say 15 bucks.35k retard fanboys buy used coppies now being sold at 40 bucks a game, games top makes some more profit off it, and then takes over the world because of it.

Apocalyptic catastrophe aside. You still miss the point because the publisher still sold all 50K. There are only 50K in circulation.

If you want to hold on to a bad game and be ripped off by giant companies that don't give a fuck about you feel free. I've never gotten a personal apology from square enix because FFXIII sucked ass, and I'm pretty sure no one else has, I even had the audacity to email them and let them know I was unsatisfied with their product. They didn't care.You know why, they had already been payed for that product, Gamestop paid them for me, and I bought the game from gamestop.

Not only did they not care that FFXIII was a piece of stale chalky shit, they proceded to release FFXIV, I think Satan has puss filled blisters that would be more entertaining then that shitty excuse for an MMO.

As far as I'm concerned Fuck em all, if they sell me shit, I will do all I can to trade the game in to at least get a portion of that cash back.

As far as the DRM is concerned, they can shove it up their asses. I'm half a mind to pirate any game that has a DRM, if they keep force feeding that shit to me. If you want to keep me from getting my hard earned money when you make a shit game, maybe I shouldn't pay for their shit games anymore. It's not like DRM stops piracy. I just prevents me from selling games to my friends or giving my used games as gifts to younger relatives. Its far easier to deal with having to teach them about torrenting then it is to deal with angry aunts and uncles who call me to tell me the game I gave their son for his birthday doesn't work.

I think I had a purpose behind this post, If I remember right it was FUCK DRM.
If you don't have half a mind to make your questions on how the market works, I wont try to explain the factors behind demand and production for you.

I'm sure only bad games get bought used and you will save the world by being the most awesome person in the world and only buying used and downloading your games.
People don't rush out 3 days after launch to get rid of a game they really loved.

Just sayin'

And secondly, the system they use to sell their games (IE. capitalism) is the system that allows used sales of every product.

Also, just sayin'
 

Kekkles

New member
Feb 19, 2010
293
0
0
I'm gonna keep writing this until people realise what they're doing.

Right, I never download anything, games/music/movies, because I respect the developers and believe they deserve all the money for the hard work they put in. Imagine if I came into your home and stole all your teeth, since they need to make games to eat and you're stealing from them and can deny people from making money and eating. Since it's alright for them then it's fine for you right, I'll just take your teeth now.
 

cefm

New member
Mar 26, 2010
380
0
0
You answered your own issue in your question. "Illegal" is exactly that - illegal. So if you choose to do it, you're a criminal. Don't expect anyone to buy any bullshit excuse for why.
 

GunboatDiplomat

New member
Mar 23, 2009
50
0
0
Swifty714 said:
Watch Extra credits video on piracy.
Don't, its shit.

Not that thats surprising, pretty much anyone who works with the gaming industry HAS to toe the party line that video piracy is "EVIL" or they'll run into all sorts of problems. Extra credits made a stab at being a bit more balanced than some but they toe the party line at the end of the day. God I hate that show. (Note to self: Then why do you keep watching it? Muppet)

OT: Personally I don't give a damn whether someone illegally downloads games or not. I'm certainly not concerned about "the industry" collapsing because thats the same bullshit we heard from the music and movie industries. "Oh noes nobody will make music or movies anymore!" Excepet they are and dvd/cd's are actually a reasonable price now. All thanks to piracy. Go Consumer Freedom Fighter Pirates!!!
 

PatrickXD

New member
Aug 13, 2009
977
0
0
I have never illegally downloaded a game, I only download cracks for games that I already have a copy of.
With a single exception, being Left 4 Dead. I got it from Steam, then Steam went a little derpy and took it off of my steam library. i contacted them and they said they had record of my payment, could not pay it back and were not willing to put it back into my library. So I just downloaded it illegally from the internets.
 

Siyano_v1legacy

New member
Jul 27, 2010
362
0
0
I think the problem I have is with PC games, there no in between, 99% of the time there is no demo until way to long after the release, there no option to rent and there no option to buy used. So how do I try my new game without taking the risk of losing 60$?
Like Deus Ex, I bought it and found out I did not like it, so now what? I just take the hassle to lose 60$? that just sucks!
Sometimes it very tempting to get that pirated version and use it purely for a demo version. Until developer decide to release demo at about the same date of the release, I will buy less and less game.
 

Savagezion

New member
Mar 28, 2010
2,455
0
0
Yopaz said:
Square might have fucked over GameStop there, but haven't GameStop fucked over Square by selling their games to us where none of the money reaches Square for years as we speak? Square fucked GameStop over and GameStop fucks the consumer over. Is that fair to the consumer? Also GameStop didn't really lose anything on the OnLive coupons. They had already received money from the sale of a new copy of Deus Ex. Also GameStop wasn't kind and offered us an apology. GameStop saw that they had fucked up and that this would lead to a loss in customers and then decided to make it up to us. Note that this was after they had acted high and mighty and said they were taking a stand and even boycotted the PC version of Deus Ex.
Gamestop did not fuck over Square by selling the game used. That game could easily be sold used somewhere else. Gamestop just made sure it happened at their business, not another retailer, or amazon.com, or ebay. I hope you can see it from their perspective since you can easily see the SAME thing going on from the other perspective. Onlive is to Gamestop what publishers claim used games are to them. Gamestop is opposed to digital sales as, if everyone buys that way, they threaten business. Just like publishers argue used games sales do to them. The difference there though is that used games are perfectly legal and also a social norm. Only since the past couple years has selling used games been considered "unacceptable" and even with all this fuss being thrown it is still largely socially moral. (Most people see no problem with it.)
Square, sprang this onto retailers without their knowledge. It was not part of the deal when Gamestop made its orders. They placed an order for X copies of Dues Ex and the promotion was never mentioned. What if Pepsi packaged coupons in ALL their cases telling people to shop at Hy-Vee and give free coupons? Do you think other retailers wouldn't get upset and want to take those coupons out? Gamestop acted in a legal way to simply not promote what square wanted them to promote as it was not part of the original deal.

Oh, and GameStop offering us discount on new games if we've already bought new games there is simply a strategy to draw us back to buy from them again, not an act of kindness. At least where I am GameStop is the most expensive place to buy games except for the oldest used games and then they're cheaper only by a little bit.
Valve has actually been doing research on the subject and offering discounts doesn't shave off profits. It increases it in all cases and in some cases multiplies it. They even earned money on selling Team Fortress 2 for $1.
First off, that is what I said. Second, so when Valve does it, it is OK and a good deal but when Gamestop does it, it is because they are greedy and should not be looked at favorably? For me, the reward system is a positive because Gamestop is one of the best places to get my games, and I live in a large city with decent competition.

And ask yourself. Could GameStop exist without games? Nooooooope!
Could publishers exist without GameStop? Yes. In fact I was probably 15 the first time I ever saw a GameStop and it took 3 years after that until I saw the next one. There are many electronic stores and malls that sell games without selling used games. There are online stores that sell them cheaper than all retail stores because they don't need to spend money on anything but storage and enough employees to run, maintain the site and treat orders. There's Steam, there's Onlive, there's Origin, to a big extent there's XBL and PSN. GameStop is only a retailer and will be doomed without publishers. The opposite is not true.
Gamestop houses traffic for a large amount of gamers in each community it is in. When people go in there to look around, it is an advertising haven for publishers. Like it or not, your argument doesn't hold as much weight as you think it does. The industry would feel an impact if Gamestop wasn't there tomorrow. That is a lot of physical copies they move for no other reason than they are one of the few specialty stores out there. That is why they bought EB. They bought a huge share of the market and thus weight in the market. People like me that want my physical copies want retailers and not digital services. The closest retailer that will aid my gaming habits is Best Buy with their "meh" rewards program I never really use. Gamestop pushes product like a drug dealer for publishers. No other retailers do that for publishers, they just rely on the desire. Your lucky if you see a poster in another retailer let alone a worker that knows about video games.

The industry of selling used games hurt the publishers and developers just as much as piracy and you can't really debate that.
This is a hot issue for debate for a year or two now. Turns out you can debate it. The guy that resold that game may have bought another one. You know what hurts sales? Telling people who paid hard earned money for a used copy of your game they are no better (actually worse) than thieves. Hell, that tells people it is "more honorable" to just steal it.
Yeah, the guy with 60 bucks who bought a used game for 30 might buy another used game for 30. So if he buys 2 used games that makes all the difference in the world. The publisher will get no money which is twice as much as no money. Some of those who pirate end up buying the game if they like it (most don't) no-one of those who buy used have any need to buy it new since they already got it. Also you said that someone who buys a used game will have more money to buy another one. Wont the same apply to someone who pirate it? Since he used nothing he will still have just as much money as he had before he played the game and can still afford to pay full price.[/quote]
No, the guy that traded in his NEW game probably (Which becomes used) used the extra cash to buy more NEW games in my example. I have done it, friends have done it. It isn't a rare thing.

If I were to download Deus Ex (I already bought it so I kinda did download it from Steam already), shoplift it from a nearby store or buy it used the publisher would actually earn the most if I shoplifted it (given that's a new copy).
Wrong. The used copy they already made profit on once and now stand to make more money off of any DLC. A used game buyer proves they are willing to spend money on your game already. That may change if you start saying they are no better or worse than a dirty thief. They don't make the same money off of a stolen copy as they do a sold one. Nice try though.
Actually you're wrong. All the copies of one game you see in GameStop has already given the Publisher money. Every new copy is already paid for. If one of the new copies is stolen that's GameStop's loss not the Publisher's. So if new games are stolen then GameStop will have to order new copies form the publisher.
DLC works as a way to get profit from used games, sure. However not everyone buys DLC, not all games have DLC and some of those who pirate actually buy the DLC. Most Wii games lack DLC so Nintendo gains nothing from used sales at all. If I were to mod my Wii and download Super Mario Galaxy Nintendo would get no money. If I buy it used Nintendo would get no money.[/quote]

A lot of the time a stolen copy grants credit with dealers. I am not sure if this applies to software or not, probably not. Regardless, so your argument is stealing is better because Gamestop gets screwed over and has to pay for the stolen copy plus another one. What did Gamestop do to you to piss you off this bad? How is that justifiable? If anything, they have every right to sell used games because of that risk they are taking for publishers. Used games helps them recover any losses from shoplifting. (OR damaged product)


Also you seem to imply that I call everyone who buy used games thieves. I didn't say in one word that buying used games was just as bad as stealing games (either physically or digitally) I said it hurts the publisher/developer just as much. Can you seriously say that a publisher get any money from either scenario?
Don't be so literal and read what is being placed in the subtext.
Some of those who pirate end up buying the game if they like it (most don't)
no-one of those who buy used have any need to buy it new since they already got it.
Right there is a good example, pirates are more likely to buy than used games buyers. As well stop looking at individual puchases and look at grand scale. SOmeone who buys used games is showing they are willing to spend money on games. The pirate's behavior does not suggest this about them. Used games sales probably has to do with price point if $5 really means that much to them. Additionally, if a game is good enough, it will be very hard to find it used and they will have to shell out the extra $5. L.A. Noire is hard to find used in my area and a friend bought it new after waiting for almost 2 months for a used copy to show up. I am sure it is not the only case of that. Used game sales require a lot of product to move and be discarded first. Piracy does not. If a game is being sold used over and over, the game probably isn't that good. Can you seriously say that a developer deserves money for every transaction of people buying a game that looks interesting to be crap?

Used games are not a threat to the industry. Games like this are:
[QUOTE=Yopaz]Square might have fucked over GameStop there, but haven't GameStop fucked over Square by selling their games to us where none of the money reaches Square for years as we speak? Square fucked GameStop over and GameStop fucks the consumer over. Is that fair to the consumer? Also GameStop didn't really lose anything on the OnLive coupons. They had already received money from the sale of a new copy of Deus Ex. Also GameStop wasn't kind and offered us an apology. GameStop saw that they had fucked up and that this would lead to a loss in customers and then decided to make it up to us. Note that this was after they had acted high and mighty and said they were taking a stand and even boycotted the PC version of Deus Ex.[/QUOTE]
Gamestop did not fuck over Square by selling the game used. That game could [i]easily[/i] be sold used somewhere else. Gamestop just made sure it happened at their business, not another retailer, or amazon.com, or ebay. I hope you can see it from their perspective since you can easily see the SAME thing going on from the other perspective. Onlive is to Gamestop what publishers claim used games are to them. Gamestop is opposed to digital sales as, if everyone buys that way, they threaten business. Just like publishers argue used games sales do to them. The difference there though is that used games are perfectly legal and also a social norm. Only since the past couple years has selling used games been considered "unacceptable" and even with all this fuss being thrown it is still largely socially moral. (Most people see no problem with it.)
Square, sprang this onto retailers without their knowledge. It was not part of the deal when Gamestop made its orders. They placed an order for X copies of Dues Ex and the promotion was never mentioned. What if Pepsi packaged coupons in ALL their cases telling people to shop at Hy-Vee and give free coupons? Do you think other retailers wouldn't get upset and want to take those coupons out? Gamestop acted in a legal way to simply not promote what square wanted them to promote as it was not part of the original deal.

[quote]Oh, and GameStop offering us discount on new games if we've already bought new games there is simply a strategy to draw us back to buy from them again, not an act of kindness. At least where I am GameStop is the most expensive place to buy games except for the oldest used games and then they're cheaper only by a little bit.
Valve has actually been doing research on the subject and offering discounts doesn't shave off profits. It increases it in all cases and in some cases multiplies it. They even earned money on selling Team Fortress 2 for $1.[/quote]
First off, that is what I said. Second, so when Valve does it, it is OK and a good deal but when Gamestop does it, it is because they are greedy and should not be looked at favorably? For me, the reward system is a positive because Gamestop is one of the best places to get my games, and I live in a large city with decent competition.

[quote]And ask yourself. Could GameStop exist without games? Nooooooope!
Could publishers exist without GameStop? Yes. In fact I was probably 15 the first time I ever saw a GameStop and it took 3 years after that until I saw the next one. There are many electronic stores and malls that sell games without selling used games. There are online stores that sell them cheaper than all retail stores because they don't need to spend money on anything but storage and enough employees to run, maintain the site and treat orders. There's Steam, there's Onlive, there's Origin, to a big extent there's XBL and PSN. GameStop is only a retailer and will be doomed without publishers. The opposite is not true.[/quote]
Gamestop houses traffic for a large amount of gamers in each community it is in. When people go in there to look around, it is an advertising haven for publishers. Like it or not, your argument doesn't hold as much weight as you think it does. The industry would feel an impact if Gamestop wasn't there tomorrow. That is a lot of physical copies they move for no other reason than they are one of the few specialty stores out there. That is why they bought EB. They bought a huge share of the market and thus weight in the market. People like me that want my physical copies want retailers and not digital services. The closest retailer that will aid my gaming habits is Best Buy with their "meh" rewards program I never really use. Gamestop pushes product like a drug dealer for publishers. No other retailers do that for publishers, they just rely on the desire. Your lucky if you see a poster in another retailer let alone a worker that knows about video games.

[quote]
[quote]The industry of selling used games hurt the publishers and developers just as much as piracy and you can't really debate that.[/quote]
This is a hot issue for debate for a year or two now. Turns out you can debate it. The guy that resold that game may have bought another one. You know what hurts sales? Telling people who paid hard earned money for a used copy of your game they are no better (actually worse) than thieves. Hell, that tells people it is "more honorable" to just steal it.[/quote]

Yeah, the guy with 60 bucks who bought a used game for 30 might buy another used game for 30. So if he buys 2 used games that makes all the difference in the world. The publisher will get no money which is twice as much as no money. Some of those who pirate end up buying the game if they like it (most don't) no-one of those who buy used have any need to buy it new since they already got it. Also you said that someone who buys a used game will have more money to buy another one. Wont the same apply to someone who pirate it? Since he used nothing he will still have just as much money as he had before he played the game and can still afford to pay full price.[/quote]
No, the guy that traded in his NEW game probably (Which becomes used) used the extra cash to buy more NEW games in my example. I have done it, friends have done it. It isn't a rare thing.

[quote]
[quote]If I were to download Deus Ex (I already bought it so I kinda did download it from Steam already), shoplift it from a nearby store or buy it used the publisher would actually earn the most if I shoplifted it (given that's a new copy).[/quote]
Wrong. The used copy they already made profit on once and now stand to make more money off of any DLC. A used game buyer proves they are willing to spend money on your game already. That may change if you start saying they are no better or worse than a dirty thief. They don't make the same money off of a stolen copy as they do a sold one. Nice try though.
[/quote]
Actually you're wrong. All the copies of one game you see in GameStop has already given the Publisher money. Every new copy is already paid for. If one of the new copies is stolen that's GameStop's loss not the Publisher's. So if new games are stolen then GameStop will have to order new copies form the publisher.
DLC works as a way to get profit from used games, sure. However not everyone buys DLC, not all games have DLC and some of those who pirate actually buy the DLC. Most Wii games lack DLC so Nintendo gains nothing from used sales at all. If I were to mod my Wii and download Super Mario Galaxy Nintendo would get no money. If I buy it used Nintendo would get no money.[/quote]

A lot of the time a stolen copy grants credit with dealers. I am not sure if this applies to software or not, probably not. Regardless, so your argument is stealing is better because Gamestop gets screwed over and has to pay for the stolen copy plus another one. What did Gamestop do to you to piss you off this bad? How is that justifiable? If anything, they have every right to sell used games because of that risk they are taking for publishers. Used games helps them recover any losses from shoplifting. (OR damaged product)


[quote]Also you seem to imply that I call everyone who buy used games thieves. I didn't say in one word that buying used games was just as bad as stealing games (either physically or digitally) I said it hurts the publisher/developer just as much. Can you seriously say that a publisher get any money from either scenario?[/quote]
Don't be so literal and read what is being placed in the subtext.
[quote]Some of those who pirate end up buying the game if they like it (most don't)[/quote] [quote]no-one of those who buy used have any need to buy it new since they already got it.[/quote]
Right there is a good example, pirates are more likely to buy than used games buyers. As well stop looking at individual puchases and look at grand scale. SOmeone who buys used games is showing they are willing to spend money on games. The pirate's behavior does not suggest this about them. Used games sales probably has to do with price point if $5 really means that much to them. Additionally, if a game is good enough, it will be very hard to find it used and they will have to shell out the extra $5. L.A. Noire is hard to find used in my area and a friend bought it new after waiting for almost 2 months for a used copy to show up. I am sure it is not the only case of that. Used game sales require a lot of product to move [i]and be discarded[/i] first. Piracy does not. If a game is being sold used over and over, the game probably isn't that good. Can you seriously say that a developer [i]deserves[/i] money for every transaction of people buying a game that looks interesting to be crap?

Used games are not a threat to the industry. Games like this are:
[img]http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRn7OsgDOGhzdr-cRLshn8bCrHBMeV7pZZcivn04Az1TD5He4P4
data:image/jpg;base64,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
 

RomanceIsDead

New member
Aug 19, 2011
176
0
0
Zyntoxic said:
I for one can't download, I'm too attatched to my games and love collecting them, and there is this special feeling of buying a game and open it for the first time, expectantly waiting infront of the screen as it installs and then finally comes the moment when you get to play the game you worked hard to pay for... the "mint experience" ^_^
Haha, I'm the same way. That's why it always saddens me to buy a game on steam. You don't get the box and that new game smell.
 

Yopaz

Sarcastic overlord
Jun 3, 2009
6,092
0
0
Savagezion said:
Yopaz said:
Square might have fucked over GameStop there, but haven't GameStop fucked over Square by selling their games to us where none of the money reaches Square for years as we speak? Square fucked GameStop over and GameStop fucks the consumer over. Is that fair to the consumer? Also GameStop didn't really lose anything on the OnLive coupons. They had already received money from the sale of a new copy of Deus Ex. Also GameStop wasn't kind and offered us an apology. GameStop saw that they had fucked up and that this would lead to a loss in customers and then decided to make it up to us. Note that this was after they had acted high and mighty and said they were taking a stand and even boycotted the PC version of Deus Ex.
Gamestop did not fuck over Square by selling the game used. That game could easily be sold used somewhere else. Gamestop just made sure it happened at their business, not another retailer, or amazon.com, or ebay. I hope you can see it from their perspective since you can easily see the SAME thing going on from the other perspective. Onlive is to Gamestop what publishers claim used games are to them. Gamestop is opposed to digital sales as, if everyone buys that way, they threaten business. Just like publishers argue used games sales do to them. The difference there though is that used games are perfectly legal and also a social norm. Only since the past couple years has selling used games been considered "unacceptable" and even with all this fuss being thrown it is still largely socially moral. (Most people see no problem with it.)
Square, sprang this onto retailers without their knowledge. It was not part of the deal when Gamestop made its orders. They placed an order for X copies of Dues Ex and the promotion was never mentioned. What if Pepsi packaged coupons in ALL their cases telling people to shop at Hy-Vee and give free coupons? Do you think other retailers wouldn't get upset and want to take those coupons out? Gamestop acted in a legal way to simply not promote what square wanted them to promote as it was not part of the original deal.

Oh, and GameStop offering us discount on new games if we've already bought new games there is simply a strategy to draw us back to buy from them again, not an act of kindness. At least where I am GameStop is the most expensive place to buy games except for the oldest used games and then they're cheaper only by a little bit.
Valve has actually been doing research on the subject and offering discounts doesn't shave off profits. It increases it in all cases and in some cases multiplies it. They even earned money on selling Team Fortress 2 for $1.
First off, that is what I said. Second, so when Valve does it, it is OK and a good deal but when Gamestop does it, it is because they are greedy and should not be looked at favorably? For me, the reward system is a positive because Gamestop is one of the best places to get my games, and I live in a large city with decent competition.

And ask yourself. Could GameStop exist without games? Nooooooope!
Could publishers exist without GameStop? Yes. In fact I was probably 15 the first time I ever saw a GameStop and it took 3 years after that until I saw the next one. There are many electronic stores and malls that sell games without selling used games. There are online stores that sell them cheaper than all retail stores because they don't need to spend money on anything but storage and enough employees to run, maintain the site and treat orders. There's Steam, there's Onlive, there's Origin, to a big extent there's XBL and PSN. GameStop is only a retailer and will be doomed without publishers. The opposite is not true.
Gamestop houses traffic for a large amount of gamers in each community it is in. When people go in there to look around, it is an advertising haven for publishers. Like it or not, your argument doesn't hold as much weight as you think it does. The industry would feel an impact if Gamestop wasn't there tomorrow. That is a lot of physical copies they move for no other reason than they are one of the few specialty stores out there. That is why they bought EB. They bought a huge share of the market and thus weight in the market. People like me that want my physical copies want retailers and not digital services. The closest retailer that will aid my gaming habits is Best Buy with their "meh" rewards program I never really use. Gamestop pushes product like a drug dealer for publishers. No other retailers do that for publishers, they just rely on the desire. Your lucky if you see a poster in another retailer let alone a worker that knows about video games.

The industry of selling used games hurt the publishers and developers just as much as piracy and you can't really debate that.
This is a hot issue for debate for a year or two now. Turns out you can debate it. The guy that resold that game may have bought another one. You know what hurts sales? Telling people who paid hard earned money for a used copy of your game they are no better (actually worse) than thieves. Hell, that tells people it is "more honorable" to just steal it.
Yeah, the guy with 60 bucks who bought a used game for 30 might buy another used game for 30. So if he buys 2 used games that makes all the difference in the world. The publisher will get no money which is twice as much as no money. Some of those who pirate end up buying the game if they like it (most don't) no-one of those who buy used have any need to buy it new since they already got it. Also you said that someone who buys a used game will have more money to buy another one. Wont the same apply to someone who pirate it? Since he used nothing he will still have just as much money as he had before he played the game and can still afford to pay full price.
No, the guy that traded in his NEW game probably (Which becomes used) used the extra cash to buy more NEW games in my example. I have done it, friends have done it. It isn't a rare thing.

If I were to download Deus Ex (I already bought it so I kinda did download it from Steam already), shoplift it from a nearby store or buy it used the publisher would actually earn the most if I shoplifted it (given that's a new copy).
Wrong. The used copy they already made profit on once and now stand to make more money off of any DLC. A used game buyer proves they are willing to spend money on your game already. That may change if you start saying they are no better or worse than a dirty thief. They don't make the same money off of a stolen copy as they do a sold one. Nice try though.
Actually you're wrong. All the copies of one game you see in GameStop has already given the Publisher money. Every new copy is already paid for. If one of the new copies is stolen that's GameStop's loss not the Publisher's. So if new games are stolen then GameStop will have to order new copies form the publisher.
DLC works as a way to get profit from used games, sure. However not everyone buys DLC, not all games have DLC and some of those who pirate actually buy the DLC. Most Wii games lack DLC so Nintendo gains nothing from used sales at all. If I were to mod my Wii and download Super Mario Galaxy Nintendo would get no money. If I buy it used Nintendo would get no money.[/quote]

A lot of the time a stolen copy grants credit with dealers. I am not sure if this applies to software or not, probably not. Regardless, so your argument is stealing is better because Gamestop gets screwed over and has to pay for the stolen copy plus another one. What did Gamestop do to you to piss you off this bad? How is that justifiable? If anything, they have every right to sell used games because of that risk they are taking for publishers. Used games helps them recover any losses from shoplifting. (OR damaged product)


Also you seem to imply that I call everyone who buy used games thieves. I didn't say in one word that buying used games was just as bad as stealing games (either physically or digitally) I said it hurts the publisher/developer just as much. Can you seriously say that a publisher get any money from either scenario?
Don't be so literal and read what is being placed in the subtext.
Some of those who pirate end up buying the game if they like it (most don't)
no-one of those who buy used have any need to buy it new since they already got it.
Right there is a good example, pirates are more likely to buy than used games buyers. As well stop looking at individual puchases and look at grand scale. SOmeone who buys used games is showing they are willing to spend money on games. The pirate's behavior does not suggest this about them. Used games sales probably has to do with price point if $5 really means that much to them. Additionally, if a game is good enough, it will be very hard to find it used and they will have to shell out the extra $5. L.A. Noire is hard to find used in my area and a friend bought it new after waiting for almost 2 months for a used copy to show up. I am sure it is not the only case of that. Used game sales require a lot of product to move and be discarded first. Piracy does not. If a game is being sold used over and over, the game probably isn't that good. Can you seriously say that a developer deserves money for every transaction of people buying a game that looks interesting to be crap?

Used games are not a threat to the industry. Games like this are:
[QUOTE=Yopaz]Square might have fucked over GameStop there, but haven't GameStop fucked over Square by selling their games to us where none of the money reaches Square for years as we speak? Square fucked GameStop over and GameStop fucks the consumer over. Is that fair to the consumer? Also GameStop didn't really lose anything on the OnLive coupons. They had already received money from the sale of a new copy of Deus Ex. Also GameStop wasn't kind and offered us an apology. GameStop saw that they had fucked up and that this would lead to a loss in customers and then decided to make it up to us. Note that this was after they had acted high and mighty and said they were taking a stand and even boycotted the PC version of Deus Ex.[/QUOTE]
Gamestop did not fuck over Square by selling the game used. That game could [i]easily[/i] be sold used somewhere else. Gamestop just made sure it happened at their business, not another retailer, or amazon.com, or ebay. I hope you can see it from their perspective since you can easily see the SAME thing going on from the other perspective. Onlive is to Gamestop what publishers claim used games are to them. Gamestop is opposed to digital sales as, if everyone buys that way, they threaten business. Just like publishers argue used games sales do to them. The difference there though is that used games are perfectly legal and also a social norm. Only since the past couple years has selling used games been considered "unacceptable" and even with all this fuss being thrown it is still largely socially moral. (Most people see no problem with it.)
Square, sprang this onto retailers without their knowledge. It was not part of the deal when Gamestop made its orders. They placed an order for X copies of Dues Ex and the promotion was never mentioned. What if Pepsi packaged coupons in ALL their cases telling people to shop at Hy-Vee and give free coupons? Do you think other retailers wouldn't get upset and want to take those coupons out? Gamestop acted in a legal way to simply not promote what square wanted them to promote as it was not part of the original deal.

[quote]Oh, and GameStop offering us discount on new games if we've already bought new games there is simply a strategy to draw us back to buy from them again, not an act of kindness. At least where I am GameStop is the most expensive place to buy games except for the oldest used games and then they're cheaper only by a little bit.
Valve has actually been doing research on the subject and offering discounts doesn't shave off profits. It increases it in all cases and in some cases multiplies it. They even earned money on selling Team Fortress 2 for $1.[/quote]
First off, that is what I said. Second, so when Valve does it, it is OK and a good deal but when Gamestop does it, it is because they are greedy and should not be looked at favorably? For me, the reward system is a positive because Gamestop is one of the best places to get my games, and I live in a large city with decent competition.

[quote]And ask yourself. Could GameStop exist without games? Nooooooope!
Could publishers exist without GameStop? Yes. In fact I was probably 15 the first time I ever saw a GameStop and it took 3 years after that until I saw the next one. There are many electronic stores and malls that sell games without selling used games. There are online stores that sell them cheaper than all retail stores because they don't need to spend money on anything but storage and enough employees to run, maintain the site and treat orders. There's Steam, there's Onlive, there's Origin, to a big extent there's XBL and PSN. GameStop is only a retailer and will be doomed without publishers. The opposite is not true.[/quote]
Gamestop houses traffic for a large amount of gamers in each community it is in. When people go in there to look around, it is an advertising haven for publishers. Like it or not, your argument doesn't hold as much weight as you think it does. The industry would feel an impact if Gamestop wasn't there tomorrow. That is a lot of physical copies they move for no other reason than they are one of the few specialty stores out there. That is why they bought EB. They bought a huge share of the market and thus weight in the market. People like me that want my physical copies want retailers and not digital services. The closest retailer that will aid my gaming habits is Best Buy with their "meh" rewards program I never really use. Gamestop pushes product like a drug dealer for publishers. No other retailers do that for publishers, they just rely on the desire. Your lucky if you see a poster in another retailer let alone a worker that knows about video games.

[quote]
[quote]The industry of selling used games hurt the publishers and developers just as much as piracy and you can't really debate that.[/quote]
This is a hot issue for debate for a year or two now. Turns out you can debate it. The guy that resold that game may have bought another one. You know what hurts sales? Telling people who paid hard earned money for a used copy of your game they are no better (actually worse) than thieves. Hell, that tells people it is "more honorable" to just steal it.[/quote]

Yeah, the guy with 60 bucks who bought a used game for 30 might buy another used game for 30. So if he buys 2 used games that makes all the difference in the world. The publisher will get no money which is twice as much as no money. Some of those who pirate end up buying the game if they like it (most don't) no-one of those who buy used have any need to buy it new since they already got it. Also you said that someone who buys a used game will have more money to buy another one. Wont the same apply to someone who pirate it? Since he used nothing he will still have just as much money as he had before he played the game and can still afford to pay full price.[/quote]
No, the guy that traded in his NEW game probably (Which becomes used) used the extra cash to buy more NEW games in my example. I have done it, friends have done it. It isn't a rare thing.

[quote]
[quote]If I were to download Deus Ex (I already bought it so I kinda did download it from Steam already), shoplift it from a nearby store or buy it used the publisher would actually earn the most if I shoplifted it (given that's a new copy).[/quote]
Wrong. The used copy they already made profit on once and now stand to make more money off of any DLC. A used game buyer proves they are willing to spend money on your game already. That may change if you start saying they are no better or worse than a dirty thief. They don't make the same money off of a stolen copy as they do a sold one. Nice try though.
[/quote]
Actually you're wrong. All the copies of one game you see in GameStop has already given the Publisher money. Every new copy is already paid for. If one of the new copies is stolen that's GameStop's loss not the Publisher's. So if new games are stolen then GameStop will have to order new copies form the publisher.
DLC works as a way to get profit from used games, sure. However not everyone buys DLC, not all games have DLC and some of those who pirate actually buy the DLC. Most Wii games lack DLC so Nintendo gains nothing from used sales at all. If I were to mod my Wii and download Super Mario Galaxy Nintendo would get no money. If I buy it used Nintendo would get no money.[/quote]

A lot of the time a stolen copy grants credit with dealers. I am not sure if this applies to software or not, probably not. Regardless, so your argument is stealing is better because Gamestop gets screwed over and has to pay for the stolen copy plus another one. What did Gamestop do to you to piss you off this bad? How is that justifiable? If anything, they have every right to sell used games because of that risk they are taking for publishers. Used games helps them recover any losses from shoplifting. (OR damaged product)


[quote]Also you seem to imply that I call everyone who buy used games thieves. I didn't say in one word that buying used games was just as bad as stealing games (either physically or digitally) I said it hurts the publisher/developer just as much. Can you seriously say that a publisher get any money from either scenario?[/quote]
Don't be so literal and read what is being placed in the subtext.
[quote]Some of those who pirate end up buying the game if they like it (most don't)[/quote] [quote]no-one of those who buy used have any need to buy it new since they already got it.[/quote]
Right there is a good example, pirates are more likely to buy than used games buyers. As well stop looking at individual puchases and look at grand scale. SOmeone who buys used games is showing they are willing to spend money on games. The pirate's behavior does not suggest this about them. Used games sales probably has to do with price point if $5 really means that much to them. Additionally, if a game is good enough, it will be very hard to find it used and they will have to shell out the extra $5. L.A. Noire is hard to find used in my area and a friend bought it new after waiting for almost 2 months for a used copy to show up. I am sure it is not the only case of that. Used game sales require a lot of product to move [i]and be discarded[/i] first. Piracy does not. If a game is being sold used over and over, the game probably isn't that good. Can you seriously say that a developer [i]deserves[/i] money for every transaction of people buying a game that looks interesting to be crap?

Used games are not a threat to the industry. Games like this are:
[img]http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRn7OsgDOGhzdr-cRLshn8bCrHBMeV7pZZcivn04Az1TD5He4P4
data:image/jpg;base64,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[/quote]'

OK, so I know this might be ahrd for you to understand, but get this. I said in my post, quite directly that I did not call anyone who buys used games thieves. Quote me wherever I said that and win a price. I dare you to.

Now because you wont listen to reason I wont care to write an elaborate post with several arguments for my case.

If we had no publishers and no developers, would GameStop exist?

Used game sales cut into sales records no matter what great example you and your friend set. No money to the publishers wont turn into money to the publisher in any world. Loss of sales might lead to games not getting sequels. This is not just the case of bad games.