Your right. We will get what we are given. And We will be grateful for it.krazykidd said:
I think constructive criticism is mandatory for everything to improve.
Persona 5: hopes for the game...
- Thread starter verdant monkai
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I think constructive criticism is mandatory for everything to improve.
I would rather that the main character for P5 be just a girl and not a choice left to the player. P3P was great and all, but I wouldn't want to play largely the same game twice but as a different sex.
1 and 4 are the other ones that I would agree with. For me, I guess I would like to see characters from the previous games show up as party members. Y'know, sort of like Digimon Adventure 2.
1 and 4 are the other ones that I would agree with. For me, I guess I would like to see characters from the previous games show up as party members. Y'know, sort of like Digimon Adventure 2.
Well I would just like them to make the dungeons interesting because in P3 and 4 they were incredibly dull (never played 1 and 2 and probably never will).
Storywise I wouldnt mind them wrapping up 3 and 4 especially after the events of P4A it all just feels like its coming to a conclusion just like it did in 2 from what I can gather, then they can start a new arc again.
Also after Elizabeths ending in P4A I really want to see more of her shes already totally badass so I think she could be the character to change things after the events of P4A especially with who could be behind her.
I was interested in the name they gave the main character for P4 in P4A Yu Narukami which I suppose could be read as you become god but thats pure speculation.
Otherwise a completely new game and cast would be good but I would prefer them to finish what was started in P4A, preferably with another fighting game.
Storywise I wouldnt mind them wrapping up 3 and 4 especially after the events of P4A it all just feels like its coming to a conclusion just like it did in 2 from what I can gather, then they can start a new arc again.
Also after Elizabeths ending in P4A I really want to see more of her shes already totally badass so I think she could be the character to change things after the events of P4A especially with who could be behind her.
I was interested in the name they gave the main character for P4 in P4A Yu Narukami which I suppose could be read as you become god but thats pure speculation.
Otherwise a completely new game and cast would be good but I would prefer them to finish what was started in P4A, preferably with another fighting game.
I would agree with #5 but I'd also add the option of deciding your sexual orientation, I know I'm not the only one that playing through Golden said "hey I want to date Kanji" or that while playing as the femMC in P3P wanted to date Yukari. LET ME CHOOSE!!!
another thing I'd add to your list is the setting Persona 1-4 are all in high school and while I understand Japans fascination with high school I'd like a change of setting, maybe it's just me but the idea of college freshmen seems a better fit for the mature themes the series often goes for
another thing I'd add to your list is the setting Persona 1-4 are all in high school and while I understand Japans fascination with high school I'd like a change of setting, maybe it's just me but the idea of college freshmen seems a better fit for the mature themes the series often goes for
My view on the points of the OP:
1.) An actual relationship system.
Nope, if I wanted a dating sim, I'd buy a dating sim (which is not gonna happen).
2.) A singer who can actually speak English.
I wasn't really bothered by this.
3.) Less grind.
Really? Because this game is rather low on my list of "JRPGs that require you to grind".
4.) Boring dungeons.
Yes, just, yes!
5.) The option to be a girl.
I wasn't really bothered by this. Then again, I'm a guy, so...
6.) the OPTION to quick save.
Again, not really bothered by this. Even if you have to reload because you gave a wrong answer, it's not like you have to go through some incredibly long, arduous task again.
My personal preferences:
1.) Talk to demons like in SMT: Lucifer's Call, I've always liked that feature. Notice I said Lucifer's Call and NOT Persona 1 and 2 (and the other 2), because in their case, it just became tedious.
2.) Not only should they fixed the boring dungeons, they should think about stepping away from the "random generation"-concept. In fact, why not throw some actual puzzles in there? You know, like Lucifer's Call did. And while they're at it, why not make the town bigger, or introduce other towns you can travel to?
3.) The ability to change everyone's Persona, not just the one of the main character. I want customization options, dammit! Just like in the first Persona games. Or Lucifer's Call.
Okay, I'm starting to notice that I just want a Shin Megami Tensei: Lucifer's Call game, but with the "social" aspect...
1.) An actual relationship system.
Nope, if I wanted a dating sim, I'd buy a dating sim (which is not gonna happen).
2.) A singer who can actually speak English.
I wasn't really bothered by this.
3.) Less grind.
Really? Because this game is rather low on my list of "JRPGs that require you to grind".
4.) Boring dungeons.
Yes, just, yes!
5.) The option to be a girl.
I wasn't really bothered by this. Then again, I'm a guy, so...
6.) the OPTION to quick save.
Again, not really bothered by this. Even if you have to reload because you gave a wrong answer, it's not like you have to go through some incredibly long, arduous task again.
My personal preferences:
1.) Talk to demons like in SMT: Lucifer's Call, I've always liked that feature. Notice I said Lucifer's Call and NOT Persona 1 and 2 (and the other 2), because in their case, it just became tedious.
2.) Not only should they fixed the boring dungeons, they should think about stepping away from the "random generation"-concept. In fact, why not throw some actual puzzles in there? You know, like Lucifer's Call did. And while they're at it, why not make the town bigger, or introduce other towns you can travel to?
3.) The ability to change everyone's Persona, not just the one of the main character. I want customization options, dammit! Just like in the first Persona games. Or Lucifer's Call.
Okay, I'm starting to notice that I just want a Shin Megami Tensei: Lucifer's Call game, but with the "social" aspect...
Still a little surprised about complaints of grind. It's pretty easy to fuse a Persona early on with at least three of the four basic elemental spells, which makes abusing One More and All Out Attacks much easier. And focusing on Social Links and associated XP bonuses in fusion reduces a lot of the grind.
I can understand the appeal of getting more to with with romances, but even on a second replay with maxed social attributes you run on a pretty tight schedule if you want to complete every Social Link in one run.
Though I have to say that leaving the high school setting for something more grown up would be nice, I remember when adults used to save the world.
Random dungeons were fine, but I think the games would benefit more from dungeons with more thought put into them and personality of their own.
Persona 5 coming out is a forgone conclusion. What I would really like is a direct sequel to Nocturne/Lucifer's Call where you could team up with or do battle with the Demifiend/Hitoshura over the fate of your world. I would also like a strategy SMT game where the player commanded an army of demons and with a combination of force and diplomacy was able to triumph.
I can understand the appeal of getting more to with with romances, but even on a second replay with maxed social attributes you run on a pretty tight schedule if you want to complete every Social Link in one run.
Though I have to say that leaving the high school setting for something more grown up would be nice, I remember when adults used to save the world.
Random dungeons were fine, but I think the games would benefit more from dungeons with more thought put into them and personality of their own.
Persona 5 coming out is a forgone conclusion. What I would really like is a direct sequel to Nocturne/Lucifer's Call where you could team up with or do battle with the Demifiend/Hitoshura over the fate of your world. I would also like a strategy SMT game where the player commanded an army of demons and with a combination of force and diplomacy was able to triumph.
I want...
-Story and pacing more along the lines of Persona 2.
-More meaningful and rewarding social sim elements.
-If there must be a calendar system, use Devil Survivor's.
-Dungeons as deep and complex as Strange Journey.
-Customisable main character.
-More mythology, let Nyarly team up with an SMT deity like YHWH or Lucifer.
-Story and pacing more along the lines of Persona 2.
-More meaningful and rewarding social sim elements.
-If there must be a calendar system, use Devil Survivor's.
-Dungeons as deep and complex as Strange Journey.
-Customisable main character.
-More mythology, let Nyarly team up with an SMT deity like YHWH or Lucifer.
But constructive criticism is completly subjective . I think artists ( yes developpers are artists , of sorts ) , should stay true to who they are and shouldn't compromise their work . I mean especially the developpers of Atlus , they have MANY SMT games under their belt and have quite a following , i think they know wha they are doing . Compare their old games to their newer ones and things have changed quite a bit while staying true to their style . And all the things OP wants to change ( add or subtract ) are what makes their games Unique ( not including the female protagonist ).verdant monkai said:
I think we can trust them.
You know I never noticed that the Arcana characters had things in common... I always start games without really linking them to anything else unless it was a very direct sequel. What was the Magician in P3 again? Kenji? No he's from Katawa Shoujo... Or are they both Kenji? Didn't he date a teacher or something? I should play Persona 3 again once I get myself in the correct mindset for dealing with Minato. "I don't care" comes up far too often and far too late in the game for me to like him. The BroSwagtagonist in 4 gets like the first 2/3 hours to be a dick then they take most of the dick options away except some ones in Social Links. In P3 it's bloody constant, ugh character development please for the love of god.Captain Sunshine said:I think I'm with this most. Excluding a couple of weeks when I beat Persona 3 and couldn't bear to move on, I was really excited that Persona 4 was so different yet kind of familiar. And I think this is the most believable direction that the series will take in. I think there's a lot of subtle cues that won't be reappearing, because as different as Persona 4 is tonally there was SO MUCH of the previous game in there, that it's no wonder they got paired off in Persona 4 Arena.The Wykydtron said:I would prefer it if they started Persona 5 from scratch completely with new locations, characters and enemies. As much I love 4 there's not much left they can go to because (at least in my opinion) Persona 4 was never really about the overarching story specifically (though that was brilliant) it was about seeing characters evolve through both Social Links and the main story. Also the game was perfect fuck you and your list of "flaws"
There was no grind for me really. I started the game determined to beat the game with as little combat as I could get away with. Sure it was hard but the only proper grinding I did was half an hour in the second to last dungeon.
After Arena we pretty much have a 100% grasp on all the characters except maybe Labrys. Because Labrys is the one trick tragedy pony of Arena and once she gets over it they end the game before she does much more character defining stuff.
What i'm saying is keep all the Persona 4 stuff in Persona 4:Insert Subtitle Here games, whereas Persona 5 is fully new and they could keep swapping between the two or something. Y'know I could agree if they decided to keep the next Persona a fighting game if it starred the same cast. Maybe shove Yukari into it or something.
And no, quick saving is just not SMT enough. Plus the entire point of the game is knowing when you have to leave the dungeon for the day lest you run into something difficult, get hit badly so they get the free enemy turns and instakill you.
Take little recurring bits of Arcanas like how priestess characters can't cook, magician characters have relationship catastrophes, the two history teachers obsessed with certain eras wearing helmet/hat from the time, the exam systems, the way social links work... Persona 4 polished the concepts amazingly and found its own space, but I feel Persona 5 would benefit from trying to break some of these things before you can say that there's a definite 'pattern' to how a Persona game works. Because weirdly, even though the other Persona games were so different, it already feels like 3 and 4 have set a pattern in place for how it'll work from here on out.
You know the ZP Alpha Protocol review? "No matter how you play him, Mike Thorton is the ponciest ponce etc etc" yeah, that's how I feel about Minato.
*insert favourite P3 girl here* gives you a present:
> Thanks
> 'S ok I guess
> Fuck you
EMOTE DAMN YOU!
Then in P4 you be a dick to Ai ONCE and you irreversibly break the... Moon? Arcana for the rest of the game. Fuck it, Ai deserves the Wild Card attribute all on her own. She's all over the fucking place.
Anyway I like how Yosuke is both more and less of a relationship disaster area in Arena. Manages to get a date with Labrys while somehow being incredibly charming, finds out she's a robot a few hours after... You can see him shut down when she changes, it's great
Just a gigantic "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO" in his mind.I don't mind keeping the school setting to be honest. It helps give the game structure and keeping track of time and shit is important. Especially in 4.
I've only played through about half of P4 (and loved it) until having to give to my sister, who then left. I did spend quite some time grinding, but a lot of people said they didn't need to, so maybe I'm just shit at games.
I also really enjoyed the anime cutscenes. They were new to me, and they worked well with the game. I'd like more of those.
I also really enjoyed the anime cutscenes. They were new to me, and they worked well with the game. I'd like more of those.
Don't change the music at all! It's perfect the way it is!
I am personally hoping that they do college students or something in the next game. Maybe even an adult working a standard Japanese office job. Could make for an interesting dynamic.
I am personally hoping that they do college students or something in the next game. Maybe even an adult working a standard Japanese office job. Could make for an interesting dynamic.
Yeah, the allies not being able to change personas was unnecessary streamlining.Arqus_Zed said:
lol Yeah, that's the guy in 3, Kenji who dates the teacher. And Junpei's magician too, falls into the same pattern, without naming anything directly in case of ohgodspoilers. Haha, you're right, maybe that's something for the Persona 5 Protagonist to take away; either have a complete character, or let them open up to the player a bit more. I found Minato's laziness kind of appealling in that it was always funny to under-react to every situation, like how they played Yu in the animé for Persona 4, but they could always do something more interesting. Heck, Vincent in Catherine had a full personality and you still got to make choices.The Wykydtron said:You know I never noticed that the Arcana characters had things in common... I always start games without really linking them to anything else unless it was a very direct sequel. What was the Magician in P3 again? Kenji? No he's from Katawa Shoujo... Or are they both Kenji? Didn't he date a teacher or something? I should play Persona 3 again once I get myself in the correct mindset for dealing with Minato. "I don't care" comes up far too often and far too late in the game for me to like him. The BroSwagtagonist in 4 gets like the first 2/3 hours to be a dick then they take most of the dick options away except some ones in Social Links. In P3 it's bloody constant, ugh character development please for the love of god.
You know the ZP Alpha Protocol review? "No matter how you play him, Mike Thorton is the ponciest ponce etc etc" yeah, that's how I feel about Minato.
*insert favourite P3 girl here* gives you a present:
> Thanks
> 'S ok I guess
> Fuck you
EMOTE DAMN YOU!
Then in P4 you be a dick to Ai ONCE and you irreversibly break the... Moon? Arcana for the rest of the game. Fuck it, Ai deserves the Wild Card attribute all on her own. She's all over the fucking place.
Anyway I like how Yosuke is both more and less of a relationship disaster area in Arena. Manages to get a date with Labrys while somehow being incredibly charming, finds out she's a robot a few hours after... You can see him shut down when she changes, it's great
I don't mind keeping the school setting to be honest. It helps give the game structure and keeping track of time and shit is important. Especially in 4.
I loved how much of a dick you could be in 4. Especially if you did a New Game+ and you got to open up all those conversation options that required you to somehow have max courage at the beginning of a game, and tell lots of people to suck it up. Actually there weren't enough of those.
Oh god yeah, Ai. There aren't solid links to all the social link characters in both games, but heck, Ai and the fat moon kid from 3 must definitely just come under 'crazy town'. I wonder if that's just from 'moon' related to 'lunacy', no, reading into it too much, lol, they're just terrifying and weird.
High-five for Yosuke appreciation. Actually... having a protagonist in Persona 4 Arena that could give you their thoughts and opinions on scenarios and changed and reacted in certain ways was really, really refreshing. It made it hard to complete Yosuke's story first and then go to Yu's story (or Yukiko's, which somehow had no personality and just told you the events of what was happening... eesh). Just another point for a stronger personality in a protagonist.
I disagree with you so much it hurts.krazykidd said:
They can change what OP (I) suggested and stay true to themselves easily. But you think that bad English lyrics and monotonous dungeons are what make smt games unique? I am literally flabbergasted you think that.
It boils down to how many copies do they want to sell, games are products as well as art. The Jrpg community is unique in the fact that what they want is generally sensible and not shit. Notice how things like multiplayer and online rankings were not on my list.
In this much though you can stuff your opinion because you are flat out wrong. A poorly implemented dating system does not make Persona 4 unique. It means they need a better one in Persona 5. I can see what you mean if you like the grind and the dungeons. But P4 wasn't perfect and telling them what wasn't perfect will improve the next one.
I can understand that you are the type to just watch and let stuff play out, but with todays technology most people want some input. Hell I may post a link to this thread on Atlus' facebook so they can have a look if they want to.
OP's view on Zeds points.Arqus_Zed said:
1.) Yeah I would like to chat with Personas (not demons) we could have social links with them and a whole new range of charcters, I think that would be amazing.
2.) Not too complex please I hate block pushing. But yes puzzles in dungeons would liven them up.
3.) I dont enjoy persona management that much. So yes but as long as its easy to use and well implemented.
I just want Persona 5.
I'd agree with you on all of those points except the difficulty and grind. I didn't have to grind at all in Persona 4, unlike, say, Devil Survivor 2 (piece of shit final boss) and Digital Devil Saga (the karma tower is a huge difficulty spike). The game is also not that hard on the normal mode, at least by SMT standards (and in golden they nerfed the two hardest bosses, shadow kanji and shadow yukiko).
Also the shadow designs from the games are fairly boring compared to other SMT games enemies. I get that it's because the demons are your personas, but it would be nice to see some more interesting enemy designs. This goes for the final boss too. Nyx Avatar was much cooler looking than that giant floaty eyeball thing, although the battle background was cooler.
Also the shadow designs from the games are fairly boring compared to other SMT games enemies. I get that it's because the demons are your personas, but it would be nice to see some more interesting enemy designs. This goes for the final boss too. Nyx Avatar was much cooler looking than that giant floaty eyeball thing, although the battle background was cooler.
I must be a masochist or something cause I loved the grinding in that game! I agree with 1 and 5 for the most part. Though I argue that the persona series has one the most meaningful character relationship systems of any game out there (Aside From Fire Emblem Awakening.) At least it isn't like Skyrim where you go get two mammoth tusks and a ring and "Now we are married bleep bloop." I also think that the option of playing a female would be benificial. I have talked to girls before who like Persona 4, but didn't like the fact that they could only play as a dude, so they gravitated more towards P3P. So it would definitely expand the audience. Plus it is just fun to see how much the story slightly changes with a female protagonist. I love the music in the game and while the Engrish singing did weird me out at first, I now think its kind of charming. Kind of like how "Take On Me" isn't perfect english, but it still works regardless. I am soooo psyched for Persona 5, mainly because persona 4 is my favorite game in the history of man. (On third play through currently, all Izanagi.) But my only fear is that they decide to make the characters from P4 and P3 the main characters like how they did in P4 Arena. Now I am not bashing P4 Arena, that is a spectacular fighting game, I just think that P4 and P3 weren't games that neccessarily neeeded a direct sequel. They were good self contained stories that had good endings and we don't need to go farther. Oh and I thought of this. If P3 took place in the city, and P4 took place in the boondocks, P5 needs to take place in the suburbs! But there I go on a tangent. There is one thing I would want though. NO INVESTIGATION PERIOD! It kills me cause it helps with the immersion and the story, but at the same time it brings the game to a grinding halt. "Hey Teddie Lets go Save Kanji!" "Sorry, But I need to know more about what he is like before I can help you find him." "Well he is a freshmen at our school, his familiy owns a textile shop, he was on tv because he..." "We dont know jack!" "Gee thats to bad! I guess you will have to run around town asking NPC's for vague hints we already knew." That needs to stop.
I'm pretty far into P4G at this point (mid-November) and it is the only Persona game or any SMT game I have played. So keep that in mind for my responses to the OP's points.
1) I would prefer a better relationship system. I am dating Chie and have managed to keep all other relationships platonic, but ever since maxing out the social link, I feel like I've only had one opportunity to spend time with her. I'm not looking for any kind of sex scenes or anything like that, but still, if she's my girlfriend, we should go on dates. I also find it weird and kind of stupid that the relationship seems to be secret from the rest of the group. Sure, I could see in real life how it could negatively impact your social links with the rest of the girls, but this is just a game and does not have to go that far.
2) I have no problem with the music except for the repetitiveness. I wouldn't mind a bit of a change in music from time to time. I admit, I don't understand much of the lyrics, but then again I'm not really trying to. The Engrish does not bother me at all, compared to hearing the same three songs over and over and over.
3) I don't feel like I've really had to grind at all. All my characters are levelled into the 60's with a couple in the 70's. I keep changing up the team regularly, usually keeping one "battle pair" together for the bonus attack they can provide. Going back through every level to defeat the powerful shadow that takes residence (which is nearly always harder than the shadow persona originally present) and going back to retrieve items for Quests is all I've done as far as grinding, and I'm not having much difficulty at all, except for the occasional boss.
4) The dungeons could definitely be more interesting. Not sure how though. I'm trying to recall what other RPG's have done to make their dungeons interesting, but I'm drawing a blank. I have no problem with the random layouts, but that's probably from playing too much Diablo 2 back in the day.
5) Totally agree with this. I think my wife would really enjoy P4, even if playing as a guy, but I know she would prefer to play as a girl. I'm sure this is true for many female gamers, and while it would involve quite a bit of writing to change the character dynamics depending on the protagonist's gender, I think the effort would really pay off for the player. Admittedly, I don't think every character should have the option of being in a relationship with the protagonist regardless of sex, but there should be the option for at least one or more. I think I would just find it too unbelievable if I played as a girl yet could date any female character and same if I was a guy with the guy characters. But one or two of each being willing I would find believable.
6) Since I have been playing on my Vita, this is not an issue for me, but I can definitely see how it would be convenient to have on a PS2. Even if it was just a save at the start of each floor of a dungeon. For me, though, I can just put the Vita to sleep and go on my way without needing to worry about it. I don't have one, but the 3DS is capable of this as well. Depending on what systems P5 comes to, a quicksave may not be needed at all. Additionally, the PS4 is supposed to have this kind of functionality, so if you need to leave, just put the system to sleep and pick up right where you left off when you return.
I'm going to have to echo Eric Neu above me though, the Investigation period is nothing but frustrating. Having to wait for a particular day in order to meet the right person you need to talk to in order to get information about who to talk to next is annoying! I feel like I have wasted weeks of game time because I couldn't go in the TV without more information, no one was interested in just hanging out to let me upgrade my social links, and there was just nothing to do. After each day verifying that the person I needed to speak to wasn't available, I'd just spend the afternoon time studying in the library or similar so at least something constructive happened. I liked the rescues that I could take care of right after the person went missing, since I always felt a sense of urgency and wanted to get them out as fast as possible.
1) I would prefer a better relationship system. I am dating Chie and have managed to keep all other relationships platonic, but ever since maxing out the social link, I feel like I've only had one opportunity to spend time with her. I'm not looking for any kind of sex scenes or anything like that, but still, if she's my girlfriend, we should go on dates. I also find it weird and kind of stupid that the relationship seems to be secret from the rest of the group. Sure, I could see in real life how it could negatively impact your social links with the rest of the girls, but this is just a game and does not have to go that far.
2) I have no problem with the music except for the repetitiveness. I wouldn't mind a bit of a change in music from time to time. I admit, I don't understand much of the lyrics, but then again I'm not really trying to. The Engrish does not bother me at all, compared to hearing the same three songs over and over and over.
3) I don't feel like I've really had to grind at all. All my characters are levelled into the 60's with a couple in the 70's. I keep changing up the team regularly, usually keeping one "battle pair" together for the bonus attack they can provide. Going back through every level to defeat the powerful shadow that takes residence (which is nearly always harder than the shadow persona originally present) and going back to retrieve items for Quests is all I've done as far as grinding, and I'm not having much difficulty at all, except for the occasional boss.
4) The dungeons could definitely be more interesting. Not sure how though. I'm trying to recall what other RPG's have done to make their dungeons interesting, but I'm drawing a blank. I have no problem with the random layouts, but that's probably from playing too much Diablo 2 back in the day.
5) Totally agree with this. I think my wife would really enjoy P4, even if playing as a guy, but I know she would prefer to play as a girl. I'm sure this is true for many female gamers, and while it would involve quite a bit of writing to change the character dynamics depending on the protagonist's gender, I think the effort would really pay off for the player. Admittedly, I don't think every character should have the option of being in a relationship with the protagonist regardless of sex, but there should be the option for at least one or more. I think I would just find it too unbelievable if I played as a girl yet could date any female character and same if I was a guy with the guy characters. But one or two of each being willing I would find believable.
6) Since I have been playing on my Vita, this is not an issue for me, but I can definitely see how it would be convenient to have on a PS2. Even if it was just a save at the start of each floor of a dungeon. For me, though, I can just put the Vita to sleep and go on my way without needing to worry about it. I don't have one, but the 3DS is capable of this as well. Depending on what systems P5 comes to, a quicksave may not be needed at all. Additionally, the PS4 is supposed to have this kind of functionality, so if you need to leave, just put the system to sleep and pick up right where you left off when you return.
I'm going to have to echo Eric Neu above me though, the Investigation period is nothing but frustrating. Having to wait for a particular day in order to meet the right person you need to talk to in order to get information about who to talk to next is annoying! I feel like I have wasted weeks of game time because I couldn't go in the TV without more information, no one was interested in just hanging out to let me upgrade my social links, and there was just nothing to do. After each day verifying that the person I needed to speak to wasn't available, I'd just spend the afternoon time studying in the library or similar so at least something constructive happened. I liked the rescues that I could take care of right after the person went missing, since I always felt a sense of urgency and wanted to get them out as fast as possible.