Personal Opinion on Religion (Atheist View)
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"It feels like I'm the only Christian on this forum" - Berithil
No, you're not. There are a few of us on here. We tend to keep quiet because if we actually say something in a religion thread we get 7 pages of 'You suck' and so on. It's why I don't post very often and why I'm leaving the religion threads alone, they tend to end in a theist-bash session.
"We are all here, on a small, spinning piece of grit orbiting an explosion, and nobody thinks that's kinda odd?" - Cuddly Tomato
Cuddly Tomato, you've made my day with that. Thanks for defending us theists by the way.
No, you're not. There are a few of us on here. We tend to keep quiet because if we actually say something in a religion thread we get 7 pages of 'You suck' and so on. It's why I don't post very often and why I'm leaving the religion threads alone, they tend to end in a theist-bash session.
"We are all here, on a small, spinning piece of grit orbiting an explosion, and nobody thinks that's kinda odd?" - Cuddly Tomato
Cuddly Tomato, you've made my day with that. Thanks for defending us theists by the way.
Absolutely right. Anti-theists seem to me to too hastily ignore anything good that can be said of religion, too ignorantly identify religion as the sole cause for all the world's ills and too readily gloss-over the complexity of human psychological, social and political processes. I may not believe in any god, but I do believe that broad, sweeping statements like 'Religion = bad' doesn't help. At all.Baby Tea said:
Anti-theism too often these days smacks of a radicalism and fanaticism too similar to some believers of the past (and present).
My personal view on religion is that I don't know enough. Yes, often my instinct of late pulls me towards a negative one. But my limitations are many and my years of experience too few to give any kind of measured judgement.
Thats the problem with these threads, militant atheists and theists acting like the victims thats why theres no real discussion, no idea how it is in america but from what I hear its 90% christian? cant imagne hoe that is Scotlands generaly mostly atheist/agnostic.
Anyway no sides need defending debates should operate soley on facts/discussion if you feel offended or like you need defending why even open a thread discussing religion? If your that confident in youre beleifs you should be able to discuss them without cheap bashing (common amongst atheists) or averting the question (lookin at you theists)
Anyway no sides need defending debates should operate soley on facts/discussion if you feel offended or like you need defending why even open a thread discussing religion? If your that confident in youre beleifs you should be able to discuss them without cheap bashing (common amongst atheists) or averting the question (lookin at you theists)
Oh hallelujah! We've got someone who can just be normal!latenightapplepie said:
Welcome indeed, friend! I'm glad to see there are people who are willing to get along without having to agree. Cuddly Tomato is an atheist and I am a Christian, but we get along fine! And we're more than willing to have others among the Escapists who can show a little respect despite different, or even opposing, worldviews.
I believe that religion as an idea is a great one. In essence its just a set of rules for people to live by; honor thy mother and father, treat thy neighbor as thy self, do no harm to living creature. Simple rules that follow a good moral code. Most religions anyway.
But its become a double edged sword. Biggest issue is that there are so many differnet religions and many different Gods and the one thing they have in common is that they say they're the only right one. I think the problem is when people take their religion too seriously and start getting caught up in the specific characters and people in the stories in religions. Now the lessons the stories are trying to teach are second to making everyone think the same thing as you. Where your God is the one true God and his teachings are the only true teachings. So you wind up with abortion clinics getting bombed and planes flying into buildings.
Personally i believe there is a god. I think he/she is up there, watching us, but they aren't doing anything. And why would they? God doesn't make people suffer; people do. Despite how advanced we are a good chunk of our minds are ruled by instinct and ambition for personal fulfilment. Things like fear and greed and lust and all that other stuff storied like Dark Knight and Watchmen bang on about.
To conclude I think religion is good to a point, the problem is humans. In the days when everyday was a quest for survival societies could have needed an overbearing and unexplainable parent figure to keep everyone in line. But now we've got food markets and airconditioning and global positioning. I don't think people need God for much of anything anymore. If anything religions need to degrade even more so that we, human beings everywhere, can figure out that working together is the only way to advance and make a better world to live in, rather than be held back by waring factions who function under different Gods. I dout thats going to happen in my life time tho.
But its become a double edged sword. Biggest issue is that there are so many differnet religions and many different Gods and the one thing they have in common is that they say they're the only right one. I think the problem is when people take their religion too seriously and start getting caught up in the specific characters and people in the stories in religions. Now the lessons the stories are trying to teach are second to making everyone think the same thing as you. Where your God is the one true God and his teachings are the only true teachings. So you wind up with abortion clinics getting bombed and planes flying into buildings.
Personally i believe there is a god. I think he/she is up there, watching us, but they aren't doing anything. And why would they? God doesn't make people suffer; people do. Despite how advanced we are a good chunk of our minds are ruled by instinct and ambition for personal fulfilment. Things like fear and greed and lust and all that other stuff storied like Dark Knight and Watchmen bang on about.
To conclude I think religion is good to a point, the problem is humans. In the days when everyday was a quest for survival societies could have needed an overbearing and unexplainable parent figure to keep everyone in line. But now we've got food markets and airconditioning and global positioning. I don't think people need God for much of anything anymore. If anything religions need to degrade even more so that we, human beings everywhere, can figure out that working together is the only way to advance and make a better world to live in, rather than be held back by waring factions who function under different Gods. I dout thats going to happen in my life time tho.
And thank you all by posting this cuz i was bored I got 2 badges and I keep seeing people say "This is pushing religious hate" I DON'T WANT THAT ead my original post read the name MY PERSONAL OPINION and its getting annoying having everyone say I'm pushing it on others, Im merely making my views public and will therefore accept any flaming you can dish. Oh and I'm a smart-ass with good logic skills so if you argue my beliefs I can probably argue yours if I feel like it.
Religion is a very touchy issue. I guess i'm atheist, I find the concept of an almighty being too fantastical to comprehend. This may incline that I am too weak minded and choose not to think about religion, this is not the case. There are certain things that I question which...really make sense. I mean, from a christian point of view, God gave us free will, but to follow the story of Adam and Eve, technically it was Satan who gave us free will, for free will requires knowledge of good and evil, which we as humans would not have had if Satan had not persuaded them to take the fruit, and nobody can say that taking the fruit was an act of evil, because all we knew before eating the fruit was good, therefore everything was good and there was no evil, so how were we supposed to know that we were doing something wrong?
If any Christian has an answer, I will listen. I'm not trying to flame, merely trying to understand.
If any Christian has an answer, I will listen. I'm not trying to flame, merely trying to understand.
Allow me to rephrase then. If you're a Christian I'm not going to have a go at you, if you're a Jew I don't care. But I don't have to agree or like it and I have the right to abuse the fuck out an outdated, moronic, misogynistic system.Baby Tea said:
I'm a Wiccan, and quite honestly, I could care less what religion you are. If I consider you not a douche-box, asshole, rude, and annoying, then I have no problem with you. And yes, I will discuss my religion with those of other religions, but merely to inform. I will never break out the whole my gods can beat-up your gods crap. When someone tells me, or walks around trying to say everyone else is wrong without anything to back it up, I just want to punch them in the face. Simply put, no matter what religion, we can all get along. Its the fanatical 'You are a evil heathen' shitheads that screw it up and put a bad light on his or her religion.
Hell, even if you are the same religion as I, if you go around saying everyone else is wrong, go eat a dick. No one has the right to tell someone else what to believe, and that they are wrong.
Hell, even if you are the same religion as I, if you go around saying everyone else is wrong, go eat a dick. No one has the right to tell someone else what to believe, and that they are wrong.
What the hell are you talking about? No one is "attacking" religion, some people have expressed negative views of religion but that's all it is and we are not specifically talking about Christianity, beside this thread is about the atheist view of religion and I'm getting annoyed with people who are just arguing and not answering the god damned question. (yes I realise the irony of me arguing this person's post and not answering the question in this post but I've already answered it).Redlac said:
Yes, the system, not the religion.LooK iTz Jinjo said:
You want to fight against religion in the law or in the government or in education then fine. You want to call people up the wall for believing something you don't then you have a severe case of sociopathic narcissisim. If you want to attack the culture of religious people then you are essentially racist.
Interesting.traceur_ said:
If someone wanted to make a thread about black people, but only let white opinions count, and then a bunch of people expressed "negative opinions", how would you then react?
If someone started a thread on homosexuality, told gay people to not respond, and a bunch of straight people expressed "negative opinions", what would you think of that?
once again you're arguing and not answering the question, no one said religious people can't respond but since this is a thread about the atheist view of religion, the views of religious people are hardly relevant in this discussion. As for how I would react in the situations you suggested, I would react in exactly the same way, if it was the theists view of atheism I wouldn't post anything since my atheism would make my post irrelevant. Once again no one was told to not respond.cuddly_tomato said:
1. The op never asked a question.traceur_ said:
2. The op never stated this was about the atheist view of religion, he stated it was his personal view of religion. In fact he specifically stated he was open to all views, so the views of religious people are "relevant".
3. A bunch of people (who are not atheists) come in and make a few ignorant and insulting posts about religion, and you are asking religious people to just sit there and take it?!
How very true.Spacelord said:
I'm beginning to see an oh so familiar pattern emerging, you get some debate, a lot of flaming, and then everyone just agree's to disagree. Normally I would say "well, at least it generates debate, and debate leads to progress",
I can't actually finish that sentance, because on further reflection my own religious opinions have adapted over time based on things discussed on this, a gaming forum.
I'm not a huge fan of religion, I tend to focus on the negative aspects; the wars, the manipulation of people. But, I accept that it also gives people hope, and helps to teach people moral values I would agree with. Meh. Its an extremely complicated subject, which can never have a resolution, unless something extraordinary happens in the near future.
I'll end on a tangent which has been bugging me for a while, maybe someone could help me out by adding a religious point of view to this thought process:
So, God is supposedly omnipotent, omniscient and wholly benevolent. Omnipotence means he can create a perfect universe in which there are absolutely no problems whatsoever and all manner of life live together in peaceful harmony. Omniscience means he knows how to do this. Absolute benovelence means He should do this. So why isn't this the case? The way I currently see it, because of the way the world is at the moment, at least one of the three main factors that make up God can't be true? If one of them has to be false, then why should any of the others be true; the whole belief in God is based on a lie?
I realise that my last sentance is crazy-bad, but its kinda hard to articulate, and thats a very simple way that sort of shows where this thought process is going.
Apologies for the ramblings, I've been awake far too long to think straight
