Please help me Escapists!! I need to stop pretending to be religious; I need advice
- Thread starter DesiPrinceX09
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If I recall correctly, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but Muhammad taught that all religions throughout history are reflections of the one true faith, however badly the original message may have been distorted, and that furthermore, these faiths were to be respected.
Another teaching stated that Allah was the judge, his followers were not. A Muslim's duty is to keep to the five pillars for themselves, while teaching others who are willing to listen, not to judge those that fail to live up to those standards.
Assuming the above is accurate, I would suggest reminding your father of this, and simply stating that you have a different way of respecting Allah. Won't stop him from attempting to convince you, but it might halt the "less than human" criticisms.
Another teaching stated that Allah was the judge, his followers were not. A Muslim's duty is to keep to the five pillars for themselves, while teaching others who are willing to listen, not to judge those that fail to live up to those standards.
Assuming the above is accurate, I would suggest reminding your father of this, and simply stating that you have a different way of respecting Allah. Won't stop him from attempting to convince you, but it might halt the "less than human" criticisms.
If he doesn't listen to what you have to say, then just don't say anything to him. Believe what you want to believe, and don't let him bother you. And if he tries to force you to say/do something religious that you don't want to do, then just ignore it.
If he doesn't want to know about your real beliefs, then that's his problem, not yours.
If he doesn't want to know about your real beliefs, then that's his problem, not yours.
It seems that a lot of people here are suggesting that you lay low until you move out. In the end, this may be the only option available to you, but it doesn't seem that way. At least from what you've said so far. So I'm going to have to agree with walrusaurus's above posts.DesiPrinceX09 said:
If you lay low until you move out, and then just "move on" with your life, you will sacrifice some of your relationship with your dad. And it seems like you have a decent relationship with him, notwithstanding this particular dispute. It seems a waste to potentially let that relationship wither up by just shutting down and biding your time until you can distance yourself physically from him.
It's not surprising that he believes that you are just in a phase now. The way to change that belief is to simply prove him wrong. Stand by your own beliefs, but do so in a way that emphasizes your respect for him and that you value your relationship with him. The important thing is that your dad know that you aren't trying to distance yourself from him, and that you still want him in your life despite any theological differences you may have. The funny thing about parents sometimes is that they're not really that much different from kids, in terms of what they need emotionally. It also wouldn't hurt to really think through your own positions so that you can offer him an informed position when he finally does realize that you're serious about your beliefs. Any common ground you can find - anything he can identify with theologically - should be emphasized.
In the end, the outcome may be up to your dad. As hard as it is, it will be up to him whether he accepts or rejects your religious decision. But you can make it easier for him by finding as much common ground as possible. And if he doesn't, at least you'll know that you did everything you could to preserve the relationship.
I myself am not religious, neither are my parents, but I do have a lot of muslim friends though. All of them are regular, chill dudes and dudettes and have never tried force their religion on me in any way (For example, I've met muslims who were offended if I ate pork in their company).
I once asked a good friend of mine if he was religious because of his parents' influence, and he responded: "Of course, They raised me after all. But I am muslim right now because I want to be. I can make my own decisions now." He isn't overly religious either, he just goes along with the basic customs. This applies to many people I know. Save few minor things, their religion does not interfere with their everyday life in comparison with someone like me, who is not religious.
But even then there can be some complications. I dated a muslim girl about a year or so ago. She was just like I explained, apart from some customs, she was just like any other areligious person. But. The same could not be said about her parents. Her parents demanded that I'd turn muslim to see their daughter. --Drama Omitted-- This ultimately resulted in me breaking up with her. I don't know if this was just overprotectiveness in the guise of religion, but lets not go there, shall we?
OP I understand your situation, and at the same time I do not. I understand in theory, but its like learning to swim with just a theory book in hand. For now, it might be best to stay low, try to be as "little" muslim as possible. That is, if you are really facing problems that are interfering with your lifestyle that would otherwise be morefun productive. Try consulting other relatives, if they can be of any help.
I once asked a good friend of mine if he was religious because of his parents' influence, and he responded: "Of course, They raised me after all. But I am muslim right now because I want to be. I can make my own decisions now." He isn't overly religious either, he just goes along with the basic customs. This applies to many people I know. Save few minor things, their religion does not interfere with their everyday life in comparison with someone like me, who is not religious.
But even then there can be some complications. I dated a muslim girl about a year or so ago. She was just like I explained, apart from some customs, she was just like any other areligious person. But. The same could not be said about her parents. Her parents demanded that I'd turn muslim to see their daughter. --Drama Omitted-- This ultimately resulted in me breaking up with her. I don't know if this was just overprotectiveness in the guise of religion, but lets not go there, shall we?
OP I understand your situation, and at the same time I do not. I understand in theory, but its like learning to swim with just a theory book in hand. For now, it might be best to stay low, try to be as "little" muslim as possible. That is, if you are really facing problems that are interfering with your lifestyle that would otherwise be more
OP, you cannot change your beliefs (or lack of them). And I think you have accepted that. What I'm struggling to understand here is what you are trying to do. Are you trying to tell your dad that you no longer believe what he does? I tried the same thing, and my dad too believed that it was "just a phase".
I think the difference between us OP, is that I don't really care whether my dad thinks it's a phase or not. I'm not trying to convert him to my way of thinking so it doesn't matter. I'll believe what I believe, and I'll let him believe what he believes. If you dad is trying to force religion upon you, I don't see that as much of a problem either. For example:
(I apologise in advance for vagueness here I'm not particularly knowledgeable about Islam.)
Dad : "Hey, let's say our morning prayers."
You : "Hey, .... no."
And then you continue the rest of your day without religion.
I think the difference between us OP, is that I don't really care whether my dad thinks it's a phase or not. I'm not trying to convert him to my way of thinking so it doesn't matter. I'll believe what I believe, and I'll let him believe what he believes. If you dad is trying to force religion upon you, I don't see that as much of a problem either. For example:
(I apologise in advance for vagueness here I'm not particularly knowledgeable about Islam.)
Dad : "Hey, let's say our morning prayers."
You : "Hey, .... no."
And then you continue the rest of your day without religion.
Very well said, very well said indeed. I do want to make sure that he still knows that I love and respect him and I don't want difference in beliefs to ruin that and i really don't want to distance myself from him. I suppose i just need to stand up for my beliefs and tell him to not be so preachy and not try to get me back on "the right path".Agitated Owl said:
Yeah, even when I was more religious I was always very chill about religion. But I realized it more than that obviously. And your situation with that Muslim girl sounds like my brother in law (non religious) when he wanted to be with my sister; it was hard but he kind of sort converted but still stays with his own beliefs so he could be with my sister and it worked fine. I'm trying to make this as understandable as possible, so what do you not understand?ZehMadScientist said:
Being as little Muslim as possible is what I am doing so far, and right now it's working bu let's see. If only there were other relatives I could talk to, if only...
Just act like a Rebel teen, disagree with him and as he phobs it off as a phase. Just keep pushing your veiws over and over and eventualy some sort of middle ground will break were your father lets you act as you want and say its just phase for a while. Untill you 45 still saying the same things to him then he might fully beleave you.
Main thing is. If you are feeling suffocated then get yourself a little breathing room. Sure it would be perfect to have all the space you want. However that wont work. So just get a little room and expand slowly.
Main thing is. If you are feeling suffocated then get yourself a little breathing room. Sure it would be perfect to have all the space you want. However that wont work. So just get a little room and expand slowly.
Belief in a God does not make religion a necessity, the idea that you can either be a Christian or a heathen is insane. Personally, I call myself an Atheist because its something people can understand, that's not to say that they always do understand it, but you get the idea.
Assume for a moment that there exists a 'Parallel Dimension', for want of a better term, in which everything and everyone in the dimension we inhabit exists purely as energy. That's not limited to people and items either, this energy is not heat, or light, or movement, it is all of these things and a million things more, transcending numbers, logic, reason; everything that ties us to this world is lost in the other one.
Would it not be reasonable to say that in a world where matter is not a necessity of existence, a being; that is to say, an entity of compound parts could evolve through freak chance to possess a consciousness, a personality, even self-awareness? This being is what I would call God, though the connotations of that term vastly undersell what it is. This isn't a creator, or a destroyer, it doesn't require worship, it didn't sacrifice it's son to save anyone. This 'God' is just as stupid, as flawed, as weak and as corrupt as anything that exists in the material universe, it doesn't have anything to teach us and it doesn't care whether we kill, make graven images, remember the Sabbath, nothing. It's essentially a normal bloke who likes celestial football and drinks in the star-pub with its universe-mates and then goes home to remorselessly beat its wife to within an inch of her life.
And the only weird thing about this being is that some idiots in this Universe have decided that it wants us to follow some pretend teachings about intolerance and homophobia.
That's God, and if you don't want to worship that being, then you may count yourself lucky that no-one forces you to.
Assume for a moment that there exists a 'Parallel Dimension', for want of a better term, in which everything and everyone in the dimension we inhabit exists purely as energy. That's not limited to people and items either, this energy is not heat, or light, or movement, it is all of these things and a million things more, transcending numbers, logic, reason; everything that ties us to this world is lost in the other one.
Would it not be reasonable to say that in a world where matter is not a necessity of existence, a being; that is to say, an entity of compound parts could evolve through freak chance to possess a consciousness, a personality, even self-awareness? This being is what I would call God, though the connotations of that term vastly undersell what it is. This isn't a creator, or a destroyer, it doesn't require worship, it didn't sacrifice it's son to save anyone. This 'God' is just as stupid, as flawed, as weak and as corrupt as anything that exists in the material universe, it doesn't have anything to teach us and it doesn't care whether we kill, make graven images, remember the Sabbath, nothing. It's essentially a normal bloke who likes celestial football and drinks in the star-pub with its universe-mates and then goes home to remorselessly beat its wife to within an inch of her life.
And the only weird thing about this being is that some idiots in this Universe have decided that it wants us to follow some pretend teachings about intolerance and homophobia.
That's God, and if you don't want to worship that being, then you may count yourself lucky that no-one forces you to.
From personal experience, I've got to agree with the 'It won't end well' crowd. There's no quick and easy way to make a hardcore religious believer accept that his beloved son/daughter has decided to go to hell.
If you can't continue to coast the way you have been doing, and you have to confront him with your real beliefs... you better accept that you may end up not speaking to your father, maybe for years. That's what happened to me. (Pro tip: arrange somewhere else to live before having this conversation.) Note, though, that 'for years' is not the same as 'forever'. People mellow with age. After about 6 or 7 years, two things happened:
a) he decided that he really really wanted to be a part of my life, even if it meant holding off on the preaching, and
b) I got a lot more secure in my beliefs and stopped being bothered by the odd 'praise God'
I think you should be clear with yourself about what's more important to you for the next couple years: expressing your beliefs or being in contact with your father. It may not be possible to have both. Just keep in mind that, either way, the sacrifice is not necessarily permanent.
Of course your mileage may vary. If your sister is willing to talk to him with you it might help him come around quicker. Good luck.
If you can't continue to coast the way you have been doing, and you have to confront him with your real beliefs... you better accept that you may end up not speaking to your father, maybe for years. That's what happened to me. (Pro tip: arrange somewhere else to live before having this conversation.) Note, though, that 'for years' is not the same as 'forever'. People mellow with age. After about 6 or 7 years, two things happened:
a) he decided that he really really wanted to be a part of my life, even if it meant holding off on the preaching, and
b) I got a lot more secure in my beliefs and stopped being bothered by the odd 'praise God'
I think you should be clear with yourself about what's more important to you for the next couple years: expressing your beliefs or being in contact with your father. It may not be possible to have both. Just keep in mind that, either way, the sacrifice is not necessarily permanent.
Of course your mileage may vary. If your sister is willing to talk to him with you it might help him come around quicker. Good luck.
