Poll: 10 year old murders baby brother

[Littlee300]

Also, not every bad thing a person does is because of negative influences in their youth. There are a lot of bad people who were not abused mentally/physically when young and still ended up doing a lot of bad things. A lot of crime done by people is because they were never reprimanded for the bad things they did when young and then because they didnt not learn about consecuences to their actions they in their older years think that they can do what ever they want.

Yes they do. Every single "criminal" who has either stolen or murdered has done so because they were either coerced, abused as a child or mentally ill. Oh, and ignoring your child is still considered abuse.

Wanting to do evil is a mental illness? I didn't know that human nature is considered a mental illness.

 

[Isnack]

seriously the girl that did this this should be held to blame, anyone who says she doesnt know any better at the age of ten obviously doesnt remember being ten, my sister is nine and she knows that it isnt a good idea to shake your brother until he stops moving. hell, she knew this at age 6 and most other kids do too. the first poster thinks kids shouldnt be held accountable for their actions until 20, this is just moronic. im fourteen, but by this guys logic it would be alright for me to go some kids house and stab him repeatedly, because its 'accidental' and apparently everyone under the age of 20 has severe mental defects. I mean really, give me one reason any of this makes sense.

 

[artanis_neravar]

Also, not every bad thing a person does is because of negative influences in their youth. There are a lot of bad people who were not abused mentally/physically when young and still ended up doing a lot of bad things. A lot of crime done by people is because they were never reprimanded for the bad things they did when young and then because they didnt not learn about consecuences to their actions they in their older years think that they can do what ever they want.

Yes they do. Every single "criminal" who has either stolen or murdered has done so because they were either coerced, abused as a child or mentally ill. Oh, and ignoring your child is still considered abuse.

Wanting to do evil is a mental illness? I didn't know that human nature is considered a mental illness.

No not caring that you are doing evil and not being sorry for it is though

 

[MASTACHIEFPWN]

Yeah, It's partially the caretakers fault, but it is mostly the child's fault. I knew not to do dumb shit like that sense I was like 6! Hell, probably even younger than that! If I were evil, I would want the murderer to feel the exact pain of the baby! Why was this evil being even aloud near a small child in the first place?

But still- If the kid was mentally sane, this would have never happened. Mental people are still fully accountable for their actions, but possible lightly toned down. So yeah this child should be put in prison, for a long time... The sitter should not be allowed around children, and possibley put in prison for like a year or so...

I would disown the child if I were the parents...

 

[MrGalactus]

The kid probably didn't know that shaking a baby would cause it to die, and the babysitter might not have known either. A lot of people don't.

 

[Quaidis]

From reading the other comments on this thread, I thought the girl was a deranged psycho and the babysitter was just 'too late' to save the baby.. After reading it, many factors could have changed the situation.

Let's get this straight. A 10 year old girl with no previous behavioral issues takes her baby bro, shakes him, then throws him into a crib.

Then the babysitter, instead of taking the baby to a hospital, acts like nothing happened. Days later the baby dies.


There are many facts missing in there. How long was the babysitter looking after the children? A day? A few days? Did she know about what the girl did ahead of time? Or did the girl confess after the baby died? Did the girl actually have huge temper tantrums and the parents simply didn't warn the baby sitter?


And there are two things that confuse me:

One is that, when I was a child, my mother put my sister in charge of baby sitting me. She was only 3 years older than me and knew about being gentle, being motherly, and taking care of my needs. I thought this was something that went universal in the world of siblings. Especially when there's such a huge age gap between the girl and boy.

The second is how obvious it was that there was a problem with the baby. Babies under a year old can't exactly tell you something's up outside of, say, crying. If the baby sitter only took care of the baby for a few hours and the girl did this without telling anyone, maybe she just thought the baby was sleeping. And if that's the case, then wouldn't someone notice something was up after day 2 or 3, when it's too late as it is? There's no clear distinction between 'baby is shaken' and 'baby ends up in hospital/dead.' We just don't know.



This news article is simply lacking too many crucial facts.

 

[Spartan448]

What I'm more upset about here is that the girl got away with 3rd degree. 3rd degree would barely be acceptable if the girl was half her age, and the babysitter should share no blame in this. Since when is failing to seek medical treatment for someone a crime?!?

Point is, our justice system is being soft on the girl because she's 10. By 10, a child should know what death is, and she probably did. She knew what she did, she knew what would happen, and she knew the potential consequenses. This was murder in the first degree, and that psyco 10-year-old should get locked up.

 

[Littlee300]

Also, not every bad thing a person does is because of negative influences in their youth. There are a lot of bad people who were not abused mentally/physically when young and still ended up doing a lot of bad things. A lot of crime done by people is because they were never reprimanded for the bad things they did when young and then because they didnt not learn about consecuences to their actions they in their older years think that they can do what ever they want.

Yes they do. Every single "criminal" who has either stolen or murdered has done so because they were either coerced, abused as a child or mentally ill. Oh, and ignoring your child is still considered abuse.

Wanting to do evil is a mental illness? I didn't know that human nature is considered a mental illness.

No not caring that you are doing evil and not being sorry for it is though

Add, brain not fully developed to your list than since most beatings to death are done by young kids.

 

[artanis_neravar]

Also, not every bad thing a person does is because of negative influences in their youth. There are a lot of bad people who were not abused mentally/physically when young and still ended up doing a lot of bad things. A lot of crime done by people is because they were never reprimanded for the bad things they did when young and then because they didnt not learn about consecuences to their actions they in their older years think that they can do what ever they want.

Yes they do. Every single "criminal" who has either stolen or murdered has done so because they were either coerced, abused as a child or mentally ill. Oh, and ignoring your child is still considered abuse.

Wanting to do evil is a mental illness? I didn't know that human nature is considered a mental illness.

No not caring that you are doing evil and not being sorry for it is though

Add, brain not fully developed to your list than since most beatings to death are done by young kids.

And guess what? most of those kids don't feel guilty after the fact

 

[II2]

-snip-
Edit:

In fact, I believe anything a person does well up until his 20's is accidental. A child's mind is to feeble to discern when it has done something wrong. Their sense of morality comes from someone else, usually the parents but they are easily influenced. By the time a person reaches teenagehood and they can actually discern from what is acceptable and what is not and at the same time use logic when making decisions their mind is extremely subsceptible to social influences. A teen who has done something that is considered "wrong" should be helped, not punished. In fact, this goes for every person who does not posses a mental illness. You can claim that once you legally become an adult you should discern from right and wrong but that's not true. Punishing a child for doing something they don't understand is wrong.

In fact, every single violent human behavior is due to negative influences during their early years.

On the "snipped" portion, describing your take on the girl in this situation, I follow you; my own analysis and intiution tells me it was just a stupid, unfortunate mistake, rather than cold blooded sibling murder. However on your larger statement regarding youngsters doing wrong...

Before I say my bit, gonna thow out some (scentifically recognized) fact, that we're on the level:

* Psychiatric terms like "mental illness" used commonly as a catch all, when in truth there is a difference between "mental illness" and "personality disorder".

* Mental Illness is an official classification used to describe neurological diseases; literally brain sicknesses the likes of which they can indentify both the causation of which on a neuro-chemical level and treat (with varying degrees of success) with psychotherapy and medication.

* Personality Disorders, while still considered to be under the preview of ongoing psychiatric study, are considered syndromes, as opposed to illnesses, because though diagnosable patterns of behavior are exhibited, the physical cause of them goes undetermined and they are *mostly* unresponsive to treatment. Some, like Antisocial (or "Sociopathic") personality disorders, actually get WORSE with treatment, as patents simply adapt to fake "recovery".

* The onset of Mental Illness is most often seen during or after the onset of puberty. Personality Disorders on the other hand are not exclusively, but far more often seen in children than mental illnesses.

* It has been established that in the debate of nature versus nurture, the 'weight' significance of either category is entirely moot, because both factors LITERALLY 'speak' the same language in terms of how the human brain develops through synaptic conditioning and the repeated patterns of neurotrasmittor release.

* Providing ancillary support to your sentiment that the actions taken by people under their 20's are accidental is another fact: the pre-frontal lobes of the human brain, which have been established to govern impulse and behavior control, are one of the last physical developments to occur during maturation; physically enlarging and opening neural pathways (approx) during a young persons 17-23 years of life. (18-21 average).


---

Now my anecdote:

No, every single violent human behavior is NOT due to negative influences during their early years. A lot of kids are vicious little raging bastards, perticularly the 9-12 middle school "band". They (mostly) understand the concepts of right from wrong, but often don't care, outside of what consequences they may face. I think Lord of the Flies spoke quite well on the human conditon, as it exists in children.

On the flip side, there are a lot of nice or at least ok, average kids, too. That kinda suggests to me that just like adults, kids are people - some of them are just fucking assholes.

There was a guy I grew up with, from kindergarten through high school. He came from a wealthy, loving family, great grades and a sharp mind, popularity, a large social circle who supported him always through every fuckup. From the word go, he was a bully. Every kind of minor disciplary infraction in grade school, to fighting to vandalism to, by grade 6, knifing a kid, break and enter, stealing a few thousand dollars in cash and posessions. We went to different highschools (thankfully), but I'd still regularly hear what shit he'd gotten into: stealing and maxing out his parents credit cards to rent an apartment to sell drugs and weapons out of w/ his girlfriend at 14 or 15 or so. Burning some kid with an incendiary explosive he made. More fighting and theft and bullying and extortion. Finally put a few people in the hospital and went to adult jail after years of this crap and got a great lawyer from his rich parents and bail and all sorted out and then moved away. Haven't heard of him since.

He was a textbook definition of a sociopath. He was very smart and got excellent grades and was probably lectured on right vs wrong until his ears bled, but this was with him since he was a toddler and not traceable back to any 'had it rough' development in youth. He was simply an asshole. The problems he had he made himself and then just got back on his feet and made more and made a lot of people's lives living hell. I've spoken a lot on the major criminal attention 'worthy' points, but not even gotten into the fucked up shit he did to people as a bully and school ground tormentor.

.....

Now he's a perticularly extreme, if useful, example, but a lot of kids have worse problems than him and don't act like that: and as a youngster, I was well behaved and knew right from wrong (often thinking how wrong a lot of his behavior, as it happened) and I knew so did he. I was observant enough to be able to tell most other kids knew basic right from wrong too, but some of them just didn't care, despite the fact that all of us dealt with problems, of all stripes. Learning RESPONSIBILTY for you actions is at the core of development for everyone.

So, AndyFromMonday, if you want to reply to this, I'll read and consider what you say.

For everyone else:

TL;DR - The girl in the OP case probably just caused a stupid thoughtless accident, rather than being the bride of chucky, like the news is spinning it, but even if you're a kid, you still have to OWN what you do, even and ESPECIALLY, if you're an ASSHOLE... and some people, kid or adult are just Bad Seeds.

 

[Moromillas]

You have got to be kidding me.

A 9 year old child with no behavioral problems is not going to suddenly decide to kill her baby brother. The fact that both children were not being supervised shows negligence by the person who was supposed to be looking after them, the babysitter.

 

[CupboardNinja]

Can't we just write this one off as a tragic accident and be done with it?
Or does somebody have to be responsible for everything?

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

Blaming the babysitter for this is absolutely fucking stupid and it's bullshit. You don't expect 10 year old children to murder their siblings. When I was a kid and left to play with my little cousin, who is four years younger than me, and 8 years younger than her brother, we sure as hell weren't trying to kill her or engaging in any kind of dangerous or violent activity. In fact, anyone who has a younger sibling must surely know that there are times where you're left alone to play together, or left alone with your baby sibling for a few minutes. That's not your parents being negligent or failing to provide supervision, that's FUCKING NORMAL BEHAVIOUR.

That ten year old is seriously fucked up in the head to do something like that. Ten year olds definitely know better at that stage in life. I wouldn't charge her as an adult or anything, but she must have some kind of serious emotional issues. She should probably be being treated for mental illness.

By the time I was 10, I could tell right from wrong, and life from death, so I don't know what the fuck y'all are talking about.

Anyways, my feelings on this are, well, exactly what Onyx and Zantos said.

Precisely. Does no one remember being a kid themselves? Everyone always acts like children are born mentally retarded and are completely incapable of any kind of thought and reasoning. The answer to that is no. Children aren't like that. For fuck's sake, she's ten, not two.

absolutely this, wtf people, were you retarded 10 year olds or what? by the time you are 10 you good and well know what the fuck is going on and what to do and what not to do, hell every damn summer from age 10-14 i'd watch my brothers and take care of them daily, taking them to the park and having fun, and not once did shit like that ever happen (granted they would get mad at me occasionally but a quick "i'm calling dad" shut them right up)

babysitter obviously has some slight blame..but that child should not be off free, i'm not saying charge her as an adult or anything, but man she needs some massive rehabilitation meetings or something.

 

[TheFinalFantasyWolf]

Just imagine the situation......That 10 year old was shaking that baby so violently that it died.....
That 10 year old kept shaking the baby even when the baby (im sure) was crying....yet she continued shaking it knowing that she was hurting the baby or at least making it upset.....

10 year old that doesn't understand not to shake the baby? doesn't know life and death?...please i knew about life and death when i was 6 for gods sake! my understanding at that age was if pple were too old or hurt too badly (eg car crash) they would die.

I have a 10 year old brother now....and he even understands everything a 12-13 year old would....he understands what things are dangerous, and what is againest the law, and what is moraly wrong....and yes of course he understands death as well.....Dont tell that 10 year didnt understand what life and death is.....even the most simple minded child can grasp that certain things are bad to do...

Besides whenever I have a new sibling or cousin or whatever i heard the same things from the parents....dont try to hold the baby, he/shes too heavy...watch the babys head....be gentle when ur holding the babys hand or kissing the baby, try to be soft....and yes of course DO NOT SHAKE THE BABY....dont u think the parents had this talk with the child? and if they didnt, then they themselves are ignorant and neglegent.....but i doubt they didnt mention all this to the child already...im sure they told her and im sure she knew it was wrong....

seriously this 10 year old must be sick or something.....no ten yr old would purposely shake the baby and not think that they are hurting it....the kid has some serious problems....while i dont think she should be charged (she's only ten) I do think she should be monitered by pychiatrists or something....those parents need to make sure that child is not mentally challenged, or developing into a disturbed individdual....

Oh and I dont think the babysitter should be charged.....she didnt commit the crime and while I think she should have been more watchful...I wouldnt really charge her for neglegence....kids are left to play together all the time....who has a fear of leaving children together on the risk that they might kill eachother?

 

[Moromillas]

You have got to be kidding me.

A 9 year old child with no behavioral problems is not going to suddenly decide to kill her baby brother. The fact that both children were not being supervised shows negligence by the person who was supposed to be looking after them, the babysitter.

part of a babysitters job is feeding them, cleaning up after them, putting them to bed, and CARING for them. To do these things they are not always with the child and at some point a baby might get left alone in its crib while the sitter went about her job.

We don't know the time of the incident. Time could place the sitter doing one of her chores thinking both kids are asleep; thinking one is playing, the other napping, and her prepping lunch. We don't know these things so we need to withhold judgment.

We do know that the child had the opportunity to pick up the baby, unsupervised. That should not be happening, at all. You do not let a 9 year old child pick up a baby unsupervised, saying that you were preparing lunch is no excuse.

 

[GrimHeaper]

Precisely. Does no one remember being a kid themselves? Everyone always acts like children are born mentally retarded and are completely incapable of any kind of thought and reasoning. The answer to that is no. Children aren't like that. For fuck's sake, she's ten, not two.

So what? 10 is not the new 20 for fucks sake. You do not discern right from wrong at that age, you simply follow what you're told. You cannot reason, you cannot use logical thought. In fact, you're pretty much a blank page on which very little has been written. Only by the time you actually understand why A is wrong and B is right can you really be held accountable. The girl is 10 years old. She has an entire life ahead of her and you people want her punished for this? I mean for fucks sake, she didn't exactly take a knife and stabbed the baby. You people disgust me.

Maybe you were so incompetent in not being able to follow logic and reason at age 10, but I for one remember that age and that I wasn't a complete idiot, as do many other people here I'm sure.

I know, right?

According to this guy I never decided at age 8, against what I was being taught in my religious primary school and by my religious grandparents, that I didn't believe that the stories I was being told in the Bible were true, having thought for myself that they didn't make any more sense to me or seem any more realistic than the fictional stories I read in books, or saw on TV or in movies. Apparently it's impossible that without anyone ever telling me anything about atheism, I decided for myself that I didn't believe in God any more than I believed in the Tooth Fairy. And apparently my classmates were too stupid to debate with me about this and come up with reasons for why they believed in God without any coaching from anyone else in what they should say to me to counter my arguments.

Either I and everyone in my class was a super genius or MY WHOLE LIFE IS A LIE! D:

If we're to believe him, then every child in the world is the exact same as the one's that are exclusive to his life. Truly a genius.

He also believes children can't have personality or psychological problems because apparently abuse doesn't affect children until they're teenagers because children have no personality that can be affected by any kind of problems.

My best friend in preschool had been adopted out of an abusive household when she was three and she was already thoroughly traumatised by the experiences with her mother, to the point where she would wet herself from anxiety and cry anytime her adoptive parents drove off because she was scared of being abandoned again like she had been by her mother. Saying that a ten year old can't have emotional or psychological problems is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard anywhere. That's like saying molesting little children doesn't affect them because they don't understand what's happening. I don't know whether to laugh at that guy or be sickened by him, to be honest.

I think he is just a really good troll.
No one is this stupid right?

...Wait don't answer that.