Poll: American?s disillusion with WW2

[Thebiggestpanda]

So I guess the OP diddn't like the Band of Brothers series? Seriously though, America played its part when it had to. It was our kickass industry that helped supply the other countries with the means to fight the war.

I'm seeing a lot of people saying that the war against Japan wasn't important, or that Japan wasn't a force to be recconed with. Do a little research and you'll find that the Japanese were many times more brutal than the Germans. For the most part, the Germans wouldn't shoot medics, provided brief pauses to collect the dead, and more or less fought a gentelman's war. The Japanese slaughtered more of their own people than the American's did and did absolutely everything they could possibly do to kill the enemy(kamikaze). The atomic bomb was dropped only as a last resort because it was very evident that millions of more people would have died if the bombs weren't dropped.

In fact, the Japanese fought so brutally and were so merceliss in combat; they aren't even allowed to have an official military anymore.

 

[emeraldrafael]

The Americans almost single-handedly won the Pacific theatre, so we can be as humble as we want or brag as much as we want.


As for the European theatre, Its because its the last time America really "won" a war. Korea was almost like the War of 1812, where nothing really even got done. Vietnam was just a mistake on the part of the people that ran it. If America had gone total war on that, it would have been over much quicker.

However, being an American, I will say I quite frankly dont credit alot to America. Britain was the only "democratic" ally that didnt turn out to bite us in the ass after, but they were losing the war. you can say they werent, but when your capital is pretty much bombed to the ground, you're losing the war.

France was traitorous for the most part. They folded like a stack of cards. Yes, the villagers did try to rebel, but the central government for all its credit was severely lacking.

I'd give all my appreciation to the Russians. They pretty much stopped the German War machine cold (figuratively and literally), so my hat is off to them in the European theatre.

 

[maddawg IAJI]

I have no doubt in my mind that America played a big role in WW2, unfortunately, we tend to over dramatize it. I can easily say thought that we turn the tide in the Pacific theater and in turn, saved Russia from having to fight on two fronts. We played a big role in Africa and in Europe as well, but so did England and Russia, the former of which kept the Allied forces alive until we joined and the latter dealt the finishing blow to Germany.

You also got to remember that we put a lot of our own money into the reconstruction of Europe following the war as well and that we were supplying England, The USSR and France with weaponry before we joined.

 

[Nieroshai]

Just bring up Vietnam. That usually shuts them up.

1. Define "loss." I just looked it up, and the war between North and South Vietnam in which the US supplied aid to the Southended with a ceasefire, which was the ultimate goal anyway.
2. The US involvement in Vietnam was a single downhill portion of the Cold War overall, in which the Capitalist West came out on top. One may surmise that the Cold War isn't ENTIRELY over, but if it is then it was won by the West despite Vietnam.

Before you mention the Korean War, that wasn't even the US. That was the United Nations, which made use of US troops. Once again, this cannot be called a loss because it ended in ceasefire instead of North Korean conquest.

Funny how Yahtzee mentioned these wars as America's shame, and funny how he and the world and even our own citizens don't remember more about history than the five-minute blurbs we hear in class.

 

[Nieroshai]

We did indeed simply help out in Europe, but I'm certain the Asian front was all us. I may be wrong, but I have a source who was alive then that is FAR from senile and was in the war.

 

[Wintermute_]

Not to sound like a pompous American here, but without the US, I feel Germany would have won.

Honestly, Britain was going down. You guys survived to the bloody end and whatnot, but were not fairing to well, and without American industrial production and support, Britain wouldn't have had the war machines to fight with. And btw...

... but more so the French, those who faught the war from the bloody begining to the bloody end. Their country is a living memento to the fallen, all over and I mean all over France you can find graveyards and a memorials to all the men whom fought and died in that horrendous war.

Not to hate on the French, but they surrendered in TWO WEEKS and then what? They did not supply shit in the way of a counter offensive. American forces led the way. And let us not forget the war in the Pacific. Japan? Ya, remember them? American navy had that handled.
But the real deciding factor was Russia. Without them, the Allies were going down hard, considering they were the ones that took down over half the German forces.

 

[Nieroshai]

Please don't lump all of us in with loudmouthed, ignorant conservatives. They're just a vocal minority.

Specifically LOUDMOUTHED Conservatives? Or just Conservatives? Either way, that's a broad and prejudiced assumption. As is that Conservatives are a minority, by any means. But as this is technically the wrong thread to bring this up, I submit that America's biggest focus was against Japan both in the battle for territory and the attempt at liberation of China. American involvement in Europe was significant and helpful, but by no means an awe-inspiring red-white-and-blue blitzkrieg that purified Europe like the old jingoistic propaganda posters would imply.

 

[jojoemon]

I was actually interested in this thread because of the word "disillusion". I thought it was a new take on how American's saw world war II. Prehaps, whithout my noticing, our collective American brain now thought of the war as hellish and saddening. Alas, it was just some poster who meant to say "illusion" restating the same tired bullshit that "Americans believe they single-handedly turned the tide of the war". Allow me to let you in on a little secrect OP, there is NO collective American brain. Lots of people think lots of things. Some of the dumb ones think that America won World War II on their lonesome; some think that "illusion" and "disillusion" are interchangeable words. Just saying.

 

[nYuknYuknYuk]

Does Europe not teach about the Pacific Campaign in their schools? Or is it just about the injustices of people like Tom Hanks and Stephen Spielburg investing their own money into stories about certain US forces in WW2, that just happened to be in Europe?

not a lot about the pacific no, then again, it wasent that important in the end, taking all into acount. well, maybe to the australians XD, but not to us anyway.
i mean, its halfway across the globe..

Uh, having control over the Pacfic Ocean during WW2 was incredibly important to the entire war effort, it reduced Japan's entire capacity to wage war, and supply troops.

Yeah people(Europeans)seem to forget Japan was rearing to take over Asia. The consequences would have been just as dire for the Asian people as Germany taking over Europe would have been for the Europeans.

 

[UberNoodle]

WW2 was the last honest war that the USA was involved it. That's why the culture has been fixated on it for so long. The wars subsequent have all been grey and lacked support because of it.

 

[Judgedread]

Not to sound like a pompous American here, but without the US, I feel Germany would have won.

Honestly, Britain was going down. You guys survived to the bloody end and whatnot, but were not fairing to well, and without American industrial production and support, Britain wouldn't have had the war machines to fight with.

It's just a shame that being the isolationist country America was back then it took the bombing of Pearl Harbor to convince them to join the war. It is not an uncommon view that Churchill knew about the plans to bomb Pearl Harbor however, did nothing about it, as if the harbor had not been bombed America would have sat back and let Brittan fall.

It is true that without Americas support the war on the European front would have turned out much differently however, I do believe that the Soviets would have eventually beaten the Germans in the end. Had that happened the world we live in now would be a very fundamentally different place.

 

[Lonan]

American hate thread move along.

Would you move along if it was an American love thread or a hate thread for another country? Also, do you consider views that American's are ignorant so insignificant that you reduce such views to hate?

 

[Lonan]

Not to sound like a pompous American here, but without the US, I feel Germany would have won.

Honestly, Britain was going down. You guys survived to the bloody end and whatnot, but were not fairing to well, and without American industrial production and support, Britain wouldn't have had the war machines to fight with.

It's just a shame that being the isolationist country America was back then it took the bombing of Pearl Harbor to convince them to join the war. It is not an uncommon view that Churchill knew about the plans to bomb Pearl Harbor however, did nothing about it, as if the harbor had not been bombed America would have sat back and let Brittan fall.

It is true that without Americas support the war on the European front would have turned out much differently however, I do believe that the Soviets would have eventually beaten the Germans in the end. Had that happened the world we live in now would be a very fundamentally different place.

Actually, the U.S. only joined when Hitler declared war on it after Japan's bombings. The U.S. did not initially declare war. It was Hitler who directly brought it into the war.

 

[Double A]

Assuming all Americans think the same?

Nice.

You're right, though. You still might have won, but so many things could have happened. Hell, if Hitler actually listened to his generals more often, the Allies still might have lost.

 

[-Ulven-]

I would say that a large part of thw war goes to the different opposation groups in occupated countries. Like for example Norway, our country got handed out by our leaders (we got the king out and such though). If any of you have heard about the word Quisling, I want to add that he is one of our main reasons for being handed over to the Germans.

Anyways, all occupated countries did their best in the shadows. Norway, blew up a D2O factory. Sank the Donau transport ship, etc.

Also, for the Russian takover theory, was not going to happen. Norwegians even joined into the Nazi army to fight the Russians, afraid that they would take over to much and envelope our country, also we helped out alot in the Winter War (the finnish/russian) fighting against russians.

The forces of the shadows contributed alot more than that which they are credited, there are still stories found of resistances stopping things that could have tilted the scales.

But all in all, the fact that every country needs an army shows how feral we are. We are not civiliced, we have just made a new habit of how we live. We always have people ready, waiting, needing to defend themselves against the same race. And people wonders why I have no faith in the human race.

 

[Judgedread]

Not to sound like a pompous American here, but without the US, I feel Germany would have won.

Honestly, Britain was going down. You guys survived to the bloody end and whatnot, but were not fairing to well, and without American industrial production and support, Britain wouldn't have had the war machines to fight with.

It's just a shame that being the isolationist country America was back then it took the bombing of Pearl Harbor to convince them to join the war. It is not an uncommon view that Churchill knew about the plans to bomb Pearl Harbor however, did nothing about it, as if the harbor had not been bombed America would have sat back and let Brittan fall.

It is true that without Americas support the war on the European front would have turned out much differently however, I do believe that the Soviets would have eventually beaten the Germans in the end. Had that happened the world we live in now would be a very fundamentally different place.

Actually, the U.S. only joined when Hitler declared war on it after Japan's bombings. The U.S. did not initially declare war. It was Hitler who directly brought it into the war.

Wrong, the US declared war on December 7, 1941 when the Japanese attacked attacked, I'm not sure on the date when Hitler declared war on the US however, it was a few days after that, in response.

 

[Finebrew]

If you take anyone of the main allied countries out of the equation I doubt the allies would have won World War II.

Every country has its major contribution to WW2 and for The United States its mostly production, not to mention the P-51 Mustang. Britain was vital, a staging area for bombers and the entire Invasionary force and another huge aspect of the Air war. The Soviet Union of course made Germany fight a 2 front war. Not to mention Australia Canada and other countries that contributed to the entire war effort.


So basically if you didn't have the US you would have lost a huge amount of air power, without Britain you wouldn't be able to get anyone to Europe safetly and without Russia you have all the Germans fighting on the Western front.

I couldnt agree more. I know you mentioned Australia but I would like to point out that they were as vital a staging ground in the pacific as England was in Europe. And yes I am an American and proud of my nations contribution to the war but I know victory would not have happened without everyone else.

 

[Finebrew]

Assuming all Americans think the same?

Nice.

You're right, though. You still might have won, but so many things could have happened. Hell, if Hitler actually listened to his generals more often, the Allies still might have lost.

Scary to think what could have happend if Rommel was in charge.

 

[steampunk42]

let begin by saying this: i am american, let me continue by saying im an avid history buff and hope one day to make my living as a history teacher (the joke being i want to make a living as a teacher) and i can say from a future-proffesional view that while americans did play a huge part in the war, by no means were we big immortal badasses who one the war on their own adn with no help from others, just as americans we are only shown things we are interested in and most people believe we are not interested in others being the heroes....so most war movies only show maericans and therefor we believe that we did everything. really, in the next ten seconds name one other world war 2 movie that doesent feature americans as the main character....thats right only Enemy at the Gate.

For some reason I don't see teaching as a future career........

wait you dont see educating young minds and making sure they no whats nessesary as a career? get your head checked boy!

 

[Sir Thomas Sean Connery]

Hey, come on. Can't this shitty country have at least ONE moment of glory?

I agree that the British and others did the majority of the fighting, but without the massive amount of supplies and weapons the they sent, the other allied powers would have been nearly sunk. The ones who truly won WWII were still the Russians though. And besides, the reason for the Germans losing really didn't have nearly as much to do with Allied superiority, but rather Hitlers massive number of mistakes.