Poll: Defending your property.

[Shpongled]

Sounds li

*snip*

Ignorance is not a defense. Not knowing, doesn't make it not evil.

And it's harder to steal when you can't walk properly

Ok, so by this logic lions are evil, apes are evil, crocodiles are evil, sharks are evil, dolphins (!!!) are evil. They all prey on the weak to survive, they can only be evil, right? No, it's how they've been brought up, its how they survive.

 

[jpoon]

Once the jackass actually broke in, all of it is pretty much fair game where I live. I would definitely shoot the asshole in the leg or arm. I would not attempt to kill the person unless my life was certainly in danger but I would leave him/her some serious trauma to deal with.

 

[DarkLordofDevon]

A GUN?! NO SIR, I WOULD VANQUISH THE THEIF WITH MY CELTIC BROADSWORD!

Any idiot can use a gun. A gentleman uses a blade!

 

[Veleste]

*snip*

Ok, so by this logic lions are evil, apes are evil, crocodiles are evil, sharks are evil, dolphins (!!!) are evil. They all prey on the weak to survive, they can only be evil, right? No, it's how they've been brought up, its how they survive.

A) My entire argument has been based on the fact that this attack was out of want and not need. Lions don't attack antelope for giggles.
B) In my very first post I mentioned that we are beings capable of higher thought. I'll even quote it below since you seem to have forgotten / not read what I wrote.

"Some people might argue that preying on the weak is human nature but higher consciousness is meant to help us overcome this. These people know what they're doing is wrong, they have to accept the consequences."

 

[Treefingers]

Maybe like... in the leg...

 

[kurupt87]

An iPad isn't worth a life. A smack round the head, a knee to the bollocks or a headbutt sure. A bullet? Not so much.

 

[Shpongled]

*snip*

Ok, so by this logic lions are evil, apes are evil, crocodiles are evil, sharks are evil, dolphins (!!!) are evil. They all prey on the weak to survive, they can only be evil, right? No, it's how they've been brought up, its how they survive.

A) My entire argument has been based on the fact that this attack was out of want and not need. Lions don't attack antelope for giggles.
B) In my very first post I mentioned that we are beings capable of higher thought. I'll even quote it below since you seem to have forgotten / not read what I wrote.

"Some people might argue that preying on the weak is human nature but higher consciousness is meant to help us overcome this. These people know what they're doing is wrong, they have to accept the consequences."

A) No one would steal an iPad for their own personal use. Thieves steal shit to sell it. When you take this into account need and want become the same thing. To him he needs his next hit of horse, so he wants that iPad.
B) In what way is this fabled "higher thought" going to help him "overcome" his troubles. You have to understand that when you've grown up stealing, stopping stealing is not as simple as thinking; this shits wrong. A lion doesn't see taking down an antelope as wrong because, well... thats what he does. A petty criminal doesn't see stealing an iPad as necessarily wrong because, well... thats what he does. I dont know how else i can say this. You just have to change your way of looking at things. You HAVE (as have i) had a privileged life in comparison to many, you need to accept that not everyone can have the same perspective on right and wrong. We can say its wrong to steal an iPad because we've grown up being taught that we should get a job and pay for the things we want with our own money. When someone doesn't grow up like this there's no reason to assume they'd act the same.

Again, I'm not saying its okay that they do this stuff and that they should go unpunished, but damn, what help does killing someone do anyone.

 

[Banana Phone Man]

I was having a talk about something like this with my mum a while ago. It was "if someone comes into your home what can you do to defend your self?" I was thinking what I could use to hurt them with (non-weapon weapons) like a chair or something but then i watched on the news that man was sentenced to some jail time because he stabbed two thieves that entered his property. One of the thieves dies which is sad but I'm not sorry for the thief because he knew the risks. The really sad thing is, is that it seem that I can't even defend myself in my own home without being arrested.

 

[Veleste]

*snip*

Ok, so by this logic lions are evil, apes are evil, crocodiles are evil, sharks are evil, dolphins (!!!) are evil. They all prey on the weak to survive, they can only be evil, right? No, it's how they've been brought up, its how they survive.

A) My entire argument has been based on the fact that this attack was out of want and not need. Lions don't attack antelope for giggles.
B) In my very first post I mentioned that we are beings capable of higher thought. I'll even quote it below since you seem to have forgotten / not read what I wrote.

"Some people might argue that preying on the weak is human nature but higher consciousness is meant to help us overcome this. These people know what they're doing is wrong, they have to accept the consequences."

A) No one would steal an iPad for their own personal use. Thieves steal shit to sell it. When you take this into account need and want become the same thing. To him he needs his next hit of horse, so he wants that iPad.
B) In what way is this fabled "higher thought" going to help him "overcome" his troubles. You have to understand that when you've grown up stealing, stopping stealing is not as simple as thinking; this shits wrong. A lion doesn't see taking down an antelope as wrong because, well... thats what he does. A petty criminal doesn't see stealing an iPad as necessarily wrong because, well... thats what he does. I dont know how else i can say this. You just have to change your way of looking at things. You HAVE (as have i) had a privileged life in comparison to many, you need to accept that not everyone can have the same perspective on right and wrong. We can say its wrong to steal an iPad because we've grown up being taught that we should get a job and pay for the things we want with our own money. When someone doesn't grow up like this there's no reason to assume they'd act the same.

Again, I'm not saying its okay that they do this stuff and that they should go unpunished, but damn, what help does killing someone do anyone.

Now you are just repeating points I refuted earlier. It's obvious we're not going to see eye to eye so I consider this discussion closed as it's come in a circle.

 

[Daverson]

You've put forth a far too simplified situation. If it came to it, then I'd shoot. Not to kill, obviously. (of course, I don't actually have a gun, but I might have, let's say... a cheeseburger... or a pack of cigarettes... both of those things can supposedly cause serious damage to someone!)

To be honest though, how often would it come to that? The big thing people always forget is that regardless of which side of the law they're on, when people have something dangerous pointed at them, they tend to... how can I put this elegantly... "loose their shit".

 

[Bobzer77]

No matter what gun-nuts may tell you, I'm afraid that shooting someone cannot replace the warm feeling that comes with giving someone the most violent beating of their life.

But if the gun was to substitute as a club....

 

[capnpupster]

I'd have to say probably not. It depends on specific circumstances though. If it were something like in the original story where the thief is completely unreasonable and obviously didn't care about the harm he was causing physically, then yes I'd likely shoot him, but otherwise I imagine a warning would do the trick.

I've seen a lot of people here say "I'm not a gun owner but I'd probably shoot him in the foot or something" and I have to say that that's not really a feasible option for them. Hitting center mass from fairly short range in a non-stressful situation the first time you fire a gun isn't terribly difficult, but aiming for a small, moving target while extremely pumped up on adrenaline, even at close range, can be a daunting challenge, even for someone with a fair amount of experience with firearms. There's a reason why police officers are taught to shoot for center mass.

 

[kickyourass]

Probably not because most people are easily discouraged by the prospect of hot lead tearing through their skull. Although I'd probably pistol whip them just for good measure.

 

[DefunctTheory]

Escalation of force. Start with verbal threats, pull pistol, shoot. In that order.

And I'm far too proud. I'd go up against a mugger armed with a machine gun using my bare hands if all he wanted was toe nail clippings.

 

[CultistRat]

Unfortunately, that is still murder in Canada. I really wish it wasn't, I'd draw a thief's death out too.

EDIT: I am sounding like a psychopath in these threads. I really am not trying to, but anyone who breaks in to my damn house with the intent of stealing/harming my property or harming me needs to die.

Oddly enough, I'd do the exact same thing. I'm extremely protective of my posessions, so they will suffer if they try to steal them.

 

[DefunctTheory]

Unfortunately, that is still murder in Canada. I really wish it wasn't, I'd draw a thief's death out too.

EDIT: I am sounding like a psychopath in these threads. I really am not trying to, but anyone who breaks in to my damn house with the intent of stealing/harming my property or harming me needs to die.

Oddly enough, I'd do the exact same thing. I'm extremely protective of my posessions, so they will suffer if they try to steal them.

Enjoy jail than. Kill them right away or not at all.

While I might be protective of myself, my things, and my friends, I would never purposefully torture someone, or maim them on purpose. Though I get a sick sense of perverse pleasure knowing that Major Nidal Malik Hasan is paralyzed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nidal_Malik_Hasan

 

[Kanima423]

Well I am not too sure myself, I am not a big fan of violence unless its in a game lol! I am not too sure part of me would wonder what I was doing with a gun if the first place much less spending money on a iPad but I'll act like I want one of those things for mere amusement.

When it comes to human nature we tend to rely on survival of the fittest in my opinion so if I were being threatened I would probably shoot. I would feel bad afterwards so yeah ... but I would shoot but not to kill.

 

[Ham_authority95]

Why would I buy a bloody iPad in the first place?

I second this.

As for defending my property, I wouldn't actually shoot the thief unless he was he was a danger to my life.

But I would definitely try to cripple/restrain him and call the police.

 

[Comma-Kazie]

1) Pull out gun and warn the thief
2) Load round into the chamber, warn them again
3) Disengage safety and give final warning
4) Fire warning shot into the air, tell them to leave
5) Aim at them and try to hit foot

Honestly if it gets to step 5 the guy is probably on drugs.

You're way too nice, dude--sight of a firearm is all the warning anyone should need.

True, but if there is one thing I have learned about concealed weapons is that you need to warn the guy a few times if you don't want him to sue your balls off.

If anyone tries to attack me I'm not concerned about a lawsuit--my priority is to stay alive by any means necessary. I just prefer lethal force to "playing nice."