Poll: Dilemma. What will you do to protect yourself?

[LetalisK]

Personally, I would just get up and walk out of the movie theater. I hate Saw movies.

 

[Darken12]

I don't see how any of that makes sense...
First of all, it's not the safest choice, it's simply the choice with the best possible outcome as well as the highest risk. A IS the gambling choice. Next choosing A may bring friends and family into this and I'm pretty sure that's how pyramid schemes work... Did you mix up A and B?

What people are doing here? Calculating odds and saying one choice is better than the other? Trying to 'cheat the system' as it were? That's what people who gamble do. When you're a con man (or salesman), that's the kind of thing you're taught to prey on. Everyone wants to feel smarter than everyone else, wants to feel like they'll be the special ones that will figure everything out and come out ahead.

If everyone picks option A, we all win and come out unscathed. And it's the best chance at stopping whoever's behind it, since they're probably doing it for entertainment and choosing the safest, most boring option every time will be a sure-fire way of boring them out of kidnapping any more people.

Option B and the multiple outcomes are exactly the kind of high-risk, high-reward gambles that tempt people into being morons. They get dazzled with the potential of immediate gratification that they don't realise that if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is. Most people underestimate the intelligence of their surrounding fellows (look at me, I did it for two posts in a row), and don't realise that everyone else is probably thinking the exact same thing. All you're getting out of trying to outsmart the system is a bunch of legless, one-armed people.

 

[blazearmoru]

It's an interesting observation that a torrent of abuse has been coming from the A side, who have castigated B's as "dick heads", "morons", "idiots", "assholes", "cavemen", "Missing Links", or unable to think critically or are even what's wrong with humanity. On the other hand from the B side has been almost perfectly calm, with at the most one heated reply after repeated insults from an A.

A telling example of which side is truly in the right, perhaps?

The "torrent of abuse" from the "A side" is basically me. I'm the one calling the B side idiots because I'm confident in doing so. As my good friend SpartanNUMBERS has demonstrated, there are apparently a large portion of the population who will go into a situation that has a clear option that guarantees victory for everyone if only everyone applies a little thought to the scenario and will instead sacrifice their own limbs in an attempt to find one of those reasonable people so they can fuck them over to the maximum degree to save themselves, and call themselves top thinkers for going for it. Even when it can be clearly demonstrated to them that if only everyone chooses A, then everyone gets off scott free.

So yeah. Having the options clear in front of you: One option that can solidify victory for everyone with maximum profit, or one option that guarantees harm every time it's chosen, and choosing the latter makes that individual a knuckle-dragging moron. The argument of "well, other dumb people are gonna screw it up, so I need to join them to save myself!" only demonstrates why it seems today that intellectual discourse is a race to the bottom.

If you start juggling hammers in a china shop, screw up, and break some china, and I come out and yell at you for being a dummy, it doesn't make what you did the right thing just because I'm insulting your intelligence. Similarly, it doesn't make the A choice any less completely correct and sensible because I'm disparaging the selfish morons for being selfish morons in choosing B.

As I've said before, it's entirely possible that on my way home from work today, I could be hit and killed by a drunk driver. It doesn't matter how responsibly I drive; some ignoramus can still switch me off with his stupid caveman antics. That doesn't make him right, that I'm calling him an idiot. It also doesn't mean I should drive like I'm in Mad Max to save myself at all costs to anyone else around me. It's just a demonstration that we all live in a world populated by idiots who can and will screw you over with their idiocy, and that much has been artfully revealed in this goofy, poorly-thought-out "prisoner's dilemma" that is in fact no such thing.

I have now said everything I can on the subject; it's getting boring. You kids have fun. I'm going to relish in my intellectual triumph of having easily figured out what is apparently a deeply challenging question for some.

Is this guy gona be ok? >-> He sounds deeply hurt.

 

[2xDouble]

It's an interesting observation that a torrent of abuse has been coming from the A side, who have castigated B's as "dick heads", "morons", "idiots", "assholes", "cavemen", "Missing Links", or unable to think critically or are even what's wrong with humanity. On the other hand from the B side has been almost perfectly calm, with at the most one heated reply after repeated insults from an A.

A telling example of which side is truly in the right, perhaps?

That's an interesting interpretation of the data, with some very interesting generalizations and illusions (delusions?) of community... among people who are unequivocally stating their intentions to maim you or outright kill you, without hesitation or forethought.

Ladies and gentlemen, the "umad?" argument.

 

[JoJo]

It's an interesting observation that a torrent of abuse has been coming from the A side, who have castigated B's as "dick heads", "morons", "idiots", "assholes", "cavemen", "Missing Links", or unable to think critically or are even what's wrong with humanity. On the other hand from the B side has been almost perfectly calm, with at the most one heated reply after repeated insults from an A.

A telling example of which side is truly in the right, perhaps?

That's an interesting interpretation of the data, with some very interesting generalizations and illusions (delusions?) of community... among people who are unequivocally stating their intentions to maim you or outright kill you, without hesitation or forethought.

Ladies and gentlemen, the "umad?" argument.

Well, you can't deny it's quite entertaining when the supposedly morally superior side is foaming at the mouth with insults and name-calling before promptly declaring their "victory" and leaving when called out on it.

 

[Twilight_guy]

Choose option A three times and hope that people are smart enough to realize that doing so three times gets you out with nothing happening.

 

[blazearmoru]

It's an interesting observation that a torrent of abuse has been coming from the A side, who have castigated B's as "dick heads", "morons", "idiots", "assholes", "cavemen", "Missing Links", or unable to think critically or are even what's wrong with humanity. On the other hand from the B side has been almost perfectly calm, with at the most one heated reply after repeated insults from an A.

A telling example of which side is truly in the right, perhaps?

That's an interesting interpretation of the data, with some very interesting generalizations and illusions (delusions?) of community... among people who are unequivocally stating their intentions to maim you or outright kill you, without hesitation or forethought.

Ladies and gentlemen, the "umad?" argument.

Whoever said there wasn't hesitation or forethought? Everyone who chose B and stated it, said that if there were any less on the line, they would of chosen A. The majority of the people who chose B chose it, not for themselves but instead chose their friends and family over strangers. And what does A people say? Some say they don't have the heart to choose B, others say it's the best choice for everyone and without hesitation(don't take my word for it, go scroll and read) gave no fucks about their friends or family. When those who chose B decide to choose B, they will live with that decision. I don't see that from A. I really don't.

 

[blazearmoru]

Choose option A three times and hope that people are smart enough to realize that doing so three times gets you out with nothing happening.

I think everyone's smart enough to realize that if everyone chooses A 3 times it's the best possible outcome for everyone. It's on the very top >_<. But that doesn't make it the smartest choice, it makes it the most utilitarian choice though I think.

 

[Twilight_guy]

Choose option A three times and hope that people are smart enough to realize that doing so three times gets you out with nothing happening.

I think everyone's smart enough to realize that if everyone chooses A 3 times it's the best possible outcome for everyone. It's on the very top >_<. But that doesn't make it the smartest choice, it makes it the most utilitarian choice though I think.

So0 the best possible outcome for everyone is not the right choice? Does that mean that screwing someone over to slightly improve your situation (whoo, you get to leave two rounds earlier and only at the expense of the rest of someone's life) is a better choice?

 

[Lonewolfm16]

The only wise option is for everyone to choose only A.
Of course there will be some dickheads who choose B, but I won't let myself be one of them.

A, obviously. Who in their right mind wouldn't choose A? Everyone gets to go free, and we can find the psycopath who chained us up and beat the crap out of him with our fully functioning limbs.

For one, people who worry about their children or their wives might refrain from forcing them into the same position as themselves.

My issue with that is my utilitarian moral code. From my point of view my family friends, significant other ect are no more important than any other human beings. They are humans beings and therefore very valuble but no more than human beings, afterall everyone has someone they care about. It would be selfish and immoral of me to assume that my family and friends lives are any more important than the lives of the other human beings around me. My choice has to be the path of least suffering, the one where no one needs to get hurt. Obviously A.

 

[kickassfrog]

The only wise option is for everyone to choose only A.
Of course there will be some dickheads who choose B, but I won't let myself be one of them.

Yes, but it's game theory. Whatever the other guy picks, you're better off picking B.
But yeah, I'd have no real option but to pick A and blindly put my faith in another human, and just hope they're as optimistic about people as I am.
Also, we then have a fully health mob ready to go get OP.

 

[kickassfrog]

Choose A. It's the clear best option. If you get blown up, at least you'll be remembered as a hero by all the people that go free, and the guy who blew you up will have to go on multiple news programs to explain how he was such a moron that he couldn't figure out such a simple an obvious solution.

I like this explanation.
Ok, how about if I survive I make a costume out of random crap, and hunt down anyone who gets out by picking B?
Then the risks of the not picking B are outweighed by the risks of vigilante man. Or group. Or mob.

 

[Keoul]

If you're going to insult us for our choice, at-least have the guts to quote one of us when you do it.

Haha I wasn't paying attention, I'll quote you now.

I disagree, the rational option from an individual perspective is to choose B. I'll explain why.

From a group perspective, it makes sense for everyone to pick A, since then everyone will benefit to some extent. For any single individual however it is advantageous to cheat and pick B since if the other person picks A they'll get the benefit of an early escape with no chance of further dilemmas and there's no way for them to be punished for this choice. As humans are not the Borg and generally act in their own self-interest, you would expect a significant number of people to choose B. It therefore is rational to choose the self-interested option B rather than the altruistic option A and risk being screwed over.

Here are the results from picking B
Either you both pick B (which according to you a significant amount of people will pick this thus it is the most likely outcome) and you lose a limb and you're forced to play another round or
you've just cut off all the limbs of a stranger and you get to walk free, and do note OP said that this stranger could be anyone, even your loved ones so it is quite possible you've just cut off the very limbs of the person you love the most or wanted to protect with your choice to press B.

When you realize that everyone continuously picking A would lead to the same thing as you picking B and the "opponent" picking A it really is the only logical choice for it's the only option where everybody survives intact.

 

[Keoul]

Edit 2: I really wonder how it would look like if there was a positive reward for choosing B if opponent chooses A... hmm (I haven't changed the damn rules ! D:<)

Psst, make the reward knowledge of who your opponent was!
His/Her Name, Address, Mobile, Home phone, EVERYTHING!
That'll shake things up a bit heh heh heh

 

[Keoul]

There. I fixed it for you.

Just because I'm not dumb enough to risk dragging my loved ones into this doesn't make me an asshole. Also, anyone picking A has just seen how many pick B so logically from here on out, you should all pick B. We may all get screwed over while playing the game, but we're not dragging others into it. Choosing A is playing Russian Roulette with your loved ones.

Also, what is with all the Saw-like games these days. Especially some of the ones with arbitrary rules?

Probably because saw was pretty popular.
Anyway picking B doesn't necessarily mean your love ones are safe, you just said anyone who picked B was a "selfish moron". These morons are the reason why you get to walk free. Here's what the real choice is A is salvation B is damnation, If you keep pressing A you can both be saved, if you keep pressing B chances are you'll damn SOMEONE, not necessarily you but you will condemn someone to suffering. A is the only option where no one gets hurt.

Also since by now EVERYBODY seems to be advocating pressing B, realise that contrary to button A, the more people pressing B the more you get to suffer since both pressing B means you get a limb cut off and you move on to the next round.

 

[blazearmoru]

Choose option A three times and hope that people are smart enough to realize that doing so three times gets you out with nothing happening.

I think everyone's smart enough to realize that if everyone chooses A 3 times it's the best possible outcome for everyone. It's on the very top >_<. But that doesn't make it the smartest choice, it makes it the most utilitarian choice though I think.

So0 the best possible outcome for everyone is not the right choice? Does that mean that screwing someone over to slightly improve your situation (whoo, you get to leave two rounds earlier and only at the expense of the rest of someone's life) is a better choice?

Because people have different values. Not everyone is utilitarian.

 

[Twilight_guy]

Choose option A three times and hope that people are smart enough to realize that doing so three times gets you out with nothing happening.

I think everyone's smart enough to realize that if everyone chooses A 3 times it's the best possible outcome for everyone. It's on the very top >_<. But that doesn't make it the smartest choice, it makes it the most utilitarian choice though I think.

So0 the best possible outcome for everyone is not the right choice? Does that mean that screwing someone over to slightly improve your situation (whoo, you get to leave two rounds earlier and only at the expense of the rest of someone's life) is a better choice?

Because people have different values. Not everyone is utilitarian.

I suppose you're right. Then again most of the people who didn't do the 'nice' thing here are people who I'd call assholes. I don't like assholes.

 

[2xDouble]

It's an interesting observation that a torrent of abuse has been coming from the A side, who have castigated B's as "dick heads", "morons", "idiots", "assholes", "cavemen", "Missing Links", or unable to think critically or are even what's wrong with humanity. On the other hand from the B side has been almost perfectly calm, with at the most one heated reply after repeated insults from an A.

A telling example of which side is truly in the right, perhaps?

That's an interesting interpretation of the data, with some very interesting generalizations and illusions (delusions?) of community... among people who are unequivocally stating their intentions to maim you or outright kill you, without hesitation or forethought.

Ladies and gentlemen, the "umad?" argument.

Well, you can't deny it's quite entertaining when the supposedly morally superior side is foaming at the mouth with insults and name-calling before promptly declaring their "victory" and leaving when called out on it.

That is indeed amusing for a time, though it ends up rather tedious when inevitably the supposedly (and, in this case, decidedly) morally bankrupt, "logical" side asserts their "findings" (read: beliefs) as their own moral high ground. Literally becoming that which they condemn through the act of condemning it... Net loss all around, I'd say. Fanboyism at its... worst [sub]nope, still not as bad as xbox live[/sub] best [sub]too positive[/sub] middlest [sub]not a word[/sub]... Simple fanboyism.

I want to post a video of A Puzzlement from The King and I, but youtube has failed me... if you know the song, you know the point. If you don't, look it up, it's pretty good.

 

[Owen Robertson]

How the fuck is anyone choosing A? Risk the self mutilation and go with it. How dare any of you endanger other human beings?! Am I really the only superhero here?

EDIT - I didn't really think this through. I thought we wouldn't have precise instructions. Obviously everyone chooses A. I don't know how I missed that, other than by not reading it clearly. Fuck I'm an idiot.

 

[CommanderL]

I would press A I would never pick b in the hopes of making some other guy suffer and its clear if every presses a we get out free