Poll: Do we nice guys still stand a chance?

[Aranialis]

what do you define as a nice guy? and what do you define as a jerk?
To say the truth after taking a lot of brain cells into this matter, (probably for the same reason of the Thread creator), I found what seemed like a logical answer.
Its not about girls liking jerks, is that women find agressiveness, and the ability to be mean or bad towards something, masculine and thus atractive, doesn't mean by any means that they like douche bags. I found out this later on as i grew up and developed a more agressive nature towards the things and people that made me angry. thats probably why I'm engaged right now to a wonderful girl.
Ultimately girls will prefer a guy who is nice to them and children and cute pets, but who is a total asshole and rambo on other guys or mean people, or just people they dislike. Women find those kind of guys to usualy to be the perfect type.
There is another situation though, its when a woman tell you you are "too nice", she is lying. Its not because she thinks you are too nice its because of your passive nature she sees you as a matress or a wimp and she wants a man to rule her life and take on the reigns of the couple life without having to pay attention to problems, because the strong agressive fighting male will work it out for her and keep them living well.

Anyway this is merely my opinion on the matter and how i ended up perceiving things after looking into it my self all these years.

how to solve your situation is simply by finding the right girl for you, one that has the same interests then you and that will match your personality. I know i did. good luck

 

[La Barata]

Let me give you a bit of an analogy. Remember the story about The Grasshopper and the Ant? How while the ant spent all his time working hard, making sure he was well provided for, being responsible while the grasshopper dicked around and did whatever he felt like? Then, winter came, and the grasshopper's completely fucked. So he comes crawling to the ant, who, depending on the version of the story, either took him in or said "go die in a hole". The grasshopper is a woman, and the ant is a nice guy. The women run about doing whatever and whoever the fuck they feel like while the nice guy does his best to be productive and prepare for the future. Then, all of a sudden, winter will come. The woman will realize she's gotten older, or her douchebag boyfriend will break up with her, or something like that. Then where does she turn? She comes crawling back to the nice guy, who, being a nice guy, will be there for her, be comforting, let her ***** and moan about her ex, or how much everything sucks for little old her. He'll take it and he won't complain, because he's a nice guy. At this point, one of two things will happen. Either she'll finally realize it's a bad fucking idea to date douchebags and assholes and might get together with him (this usually only happens after age 30) or she'll friend zone him so hard his balls fall off, then run off again next spring (new douchebag or old one takes her back), only to do it all over again the next year.

Way to clump all women together...

My 2 cents, if a woman says you'd make for the perfect boyfriend/husband, don't even bother.

EDIT: I see the irony in my own post, don't bother quoting me.

Not quoting you for that reason, quoting you for a different one. Note I said *A* woman, as opposed to women. I'm saying that this is the way that some people act. I was originally thinking on pluralizing it, but I decided that'd be an unfair generalization, so I just put *A* woman.

 

[Razgrizaces]

I might be a little too young to throw in my $0.02, but I'll go ahead and do it.

I've been "nice" pretty much most of my life. I've have what some people might call, a kind heart, I help my friends out vigorously, even if it means sacrificing my own time or money, all that kind of things. I've also been called sweet, by a bunch of other girls as well. But I've been completely puzzled by this as well. I see people who treat women/girls with disrespect actually have girlfriends of their own.

I'll tell you a story. I used to like this girl in middle school (last year, actually). I made it pretty obvious that I liked her, I even told her quite a few times (by text messages). In the beginning of when I liked her, she told me that she might hurt me emotionally. I didn't really care. I was trying to be especially nice for her. She told me that she liked somebody else. I didn't mind, rather, I tried to help her with him. Even though I didn't even know the guy, I wanted to just be good friends with her. This had worked the last time I did this for a girl, and I thought this would work with her. She mentioned that her parents wouldn't let her go out with anybody, which I could understand. So I end up being a great motivational speaker, telling her what I think she should do, and being there for her when she needed help, trying to be a great friend. In about a month or maybe two to three weeks, she tells me saying that we can't be friends anymore. Why? Because apparently we're total opposites. She tells me that she was a cynical b-tch, and that she didn't really want to be friends with me through high school (we were separating at this point). I tried to make amends with her, as best as I could, and it was to no avail. She even went so far as to not talk to me, and she severed all ties with me. I was furious at the time, but now I'm a better person for it. And last August, I sent a message to her Facebook after she deleted me from her friends list (not something that's a major offense, but it's pretty bad)about the entire situation and what was going through my mind. She ends up blocking me from Facebook and having her dad threaten me. In the middle of all of this, she said something about one of the people in our middle school, and about him being an asshole, but he had a sweet side apparently... from what I heard, she's going out with him.

That's my story. I'm a much better person for what she did though, and much more cautious to people like that again.

Can you clear up a few things for me? What exactly is middle school? and how did her dad threaten you?

Middle school is the school after elementary school and before high school. So this is from 8th grade. And her dad told me never to talk to her again, not sure if he threatened me with pain though.(I deleted the message like straight afterwards). What's funny is my mom was friends with her mom... I don't know if they ever talked about this though.

 

[La Barata]

Let me give you a bit of an analogy. Remember the story about The Grasshopper and the Ant? How while the ant spent all his time working hard, making sure he was well provided for, being responsible while the grasshopper dicked around and did whatever he felt like? Then, winter came, and the grasshopper's completely fucked. So he comes crawling to the ant, who, depending on the version of the story, either took him in or said "go die in a hole". The grasshopper is a woman, and the ant is a nice guy. The women run about doing whatever and whoever the fuck they feel like while the nice guy does his best to be productive and prepare for the future. Then, all of a sudden, winter will come. The woman will realize she's gotten older, or her douchebag boyfriend will break up with her, or something like that. Then where does she turn? She comes crawling back to the nice guy, who, being a nice guy, will be there for her, be comforting, let her ***** and moan about her ex, or how much everything sucks for little old her. He'll take it and he won't complain, because he's a nice guy. At this point, one of two things will happen. Either she'll finally realize it's a bad fucking idea to date douchebags and assholes and might get together with him (this usually only happens after age 30) or she'll friend zone him so hard his balls fall off, then run off again next spring (new douchebag or old one takes her back), only to do it all over again the next year.

That just sounds like some kind of wishful thinking 'karma' story for some person who felt entitled to a girl's affection since he was being 'nice' (manipulative) and didn't get it.

That was rather unfair and uncalled for. Entirely so. You don't particularly agree with something I've said, so you immediately begin to try and brush it all off by saying I must be a manipulative person who feels entitled to having people's affection? That's really quite petty of you.

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

you can be the nicest guy on the planet, it is all about how you present yourself, if you've got the motive, the confidence, and the independence, then things will fall into place

people/girls attract to guys who are confident/independent, clingy nice guys (not that most nice guys are clingy, it's just thats how they appear to be because of their niceness) tend to finish last/in the friend zone because of this, if you appear to be nice, but at the same time don't need her/she is but a mere fraction of your amazing life, then she will come after you like a fat kid at a cake convention.

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

I might be a little too young to throw in my $0.02, but I'll go ahead and do it.

I've been "nice" pretty much most of my life. I've have what some people might call, a kind heart, I help my friends out vigorously, even if it means sacrificing my own time or money, all that kind of things. I've also been called sweet, by a bunch of other girls as well. But I've been completely puzzled by this as well. I see people who treat women/girls with disrespect actually have girlfriends of their own.

I'll tell you a story. I used to like this girl in middle school (last year, actually). I made it pretty obvious that I liked her, I even told her quite a few times (by text messages). In the beginning of when I liked her, she told me that she might hurt me emotionally. I didn't really care. I was trying to be especially nice for her. She told me that she liked somebody else. I didn't mind, rather, I tried to help her with him. Even though I didn't even know the guy, I wanted to just be good friends with her. This had worked the last time I did this for a girl, and I thought this would work with her. She mentioned that her parents wouldn't let her go out with anybody, which I could understand. So I end up being a great motivational speaker, telling her what I think she should do, and being there for her when she needed help, trying to be a great friend. In about a month or maybe two to three weeks, she tells me saying that we can't be friends anymore. Why? Because apparently we're total opposites. She tells me that she was a cynical b-tch, and that she didn't really want to be friends with me through high school (we were separating at this point). I tried to make amends with her, as best as I could, and it was to no avail. She even went so far as to not talk to me, and she severed all ties with me. I was furious at the time, but now I'm a better person for it. And last August, I sent a message to her Facebook after she deleted me from her friends list (not something that's a major offense, but it's pretty bad)about the entire situation and what was going through my mind. She ends up blocking me from Facebook and having her dad threaten me. In the middle of all of this, she said something about one of the people in our middle school, and about him being an asshole, but he had a sweet side apparently... from what I heard, she's going out with him.

That's my story. I'm a much better person for what she did though, and much more cautious to people like that again.

Can you clear up a few things for me? What exactly is middle school? and how did her dad threaten you?

not trying to sound offensive, but where do you live where there is not a middle school?

just curious. i know other countries call it differently, but if you are in the U.S. i am in utter shock.

 

[Eponet]

besides. isnt it a double standard? girl is androphobic shes awarded for being courageous in a "male dominant society" a guy has gynophobia and hes considered a freak

No, she's concidered to be a vicious man hating straw feminist and hated by both men, liberarians, and true feminists.

I'm sure that if you looked hard enough you could find people that sympathise with misogynists, but they're all just in hiding.

 

[artanis_neravar]

I might be a little too young to throw in my $0.02, but I'll go ahead and do it.

I've been "nice" pretty much most of my life. I've have what some people might call, a kind heart, I help my friends out vigorously, even if it means sacrificing my own time or money, all that kind of things. I've also been called sweet, by a bunch of other girls as well. But I've been completely puzzled by this as well. I see people who treat women/girls with disrespect actually have girlfriends of their own.

I'll tell you a story. I used to like this girl in middle school (last year, actually). I made it pretty obvious that I liked her, I even told her quite a few times (by text messages). In the beginning of when I liked her, she told me that she might hurt me emotionally. I didn't really care. I was trying to be especially nice for her. She told me that she liked somebody else. I didn't mind, rather, I tried to help her with him. Even though I didn't even know the guy, I wanted to just be good friends with her. This had worked the last time I did this for a girl, and I thought this would work with her. She mentioned that her parents wouldn't let her go out with anybody, which I could understand. So I end up being a great motivational speaker, telling her what I think she should do, and being there for her when she needed help, trying to be a great friend. In about a month or maybe two to three weeks, she tells me saying that we can't be friends anymore. Why? Because apparently we're total opposites. She tells me that she was a cynical b-tch, and that she didn't really want to be friends with me through high school (we were separating at this point). I tried to make amends with her, as best as I could, and it was to no avail. She even went so far as to not talk to me, and she severed all ties with me. I was furious at the time, but now I'm a better person for it. And last August, I sent a message to her Facebook after she deleted me from her friends list (not something that's a major offense, but it's pretty bad)about the entire situation and what was going through my mind. She ends up blocking me from Facebook and having her dad threaten me. In the middle of all of this, she said something about one of the people in our middle school, and about him being an asshole, but he had a sweet side apparently... from what I heard, she's going out with him.

That's my story. I'm a much better person for what she did though, and much more cautious to people like that again.

Can you clear up a few things for me? What exactly is middle school? and how did her dad threaten you?

Middle school is the school after elementary school and before high school. So this is from 8th grade. And her dad told me never to talk to her again, not sure if he threatened me with pain though.(I deleted the message like straight afterwards). What's funny is my mom was friends with her mom... I don't know if they ever talked about this though.

Ok it makes more sense now (When I read middle school I think 4,5,6th grades) but I agree with you, you are better off now

 

[artanis_neravar]

I might be a little too young to throw in my $0.02, but I'll go ahead and do it.

I've been "nice" pretty much most of my life. I've have what some people might call, a kind heart, I help my friends out vigorously, even if it means sacrificing my own time or money, all that kind of things. I've also been called sweet, by a bunch of other girls as well. But I've been completely puzzled by this as well. I see people who treat women/girls with disrespect actually have girlfriends of their own.

I'll tell you a story. I used to like this girl in middle school (last year, actually). I made it pretty obvious that I liked her, I even told her quite a few times (by text messages). In the beginning of when I liked her, she told me that she might hurt me emotionally. I didn't really care. I was trying to be especially nice for her. She told me that she liked somebody else. I didn't mind, rather, I tried to help her with him. Even though I didn't even know the guy, I wanted to just be good friends with her. This had worked the last time I did this for a girl, and I thought this would work with her. She mentioned that her parents wouldn't let her go out with anybody, which I could understand. So I end up being a great motivational speaker, telling her what I think she should do, and being there for her when she needed help, trying to be a great friend. In about a month or maybe two to three weeks, she tells me saying that we can't be friends anymore. Why? Because apparently we're total opposites. She tells me that she was a cynical b-tch, and that she didn't really want to be friends with me through high school (we were separating at this point). I tried to make amends with her, as best as I could, and it was to no avail. She even went so far as to not talk to me, and she severed all ties with me. I was furious at the time, but now I'm a better person for it. And last August, I sent a message to her Facebook after she deleted me from her friends list (not something that's a major offense, but it's pretty bad)about the entire situation and what was going through my mind. She ends up blocking me from Facebook and having her dad threaten me. In the middle of all of this, she said something about one of the people in our middle school, and about him being an asshole, but he had a sweet side apparently... from what I heard, she's going out with him.

That's my story. I'm a much better person for what she did though, and much more cautious to people like that again.

Can you clear up a few things for me? What exactly is middle school? and how did her dad threaten you?

not trying to sound offensive, but where do you live where there is not a middle school?

just curious. i know other countries call it differently, but if you are in the U.S. i am in utter shock.

Middle school for me is 4,5,6 and Junior High School is 7,8. However I know that other places have different grades in middle school so I try to clarify. This make more sense knowing its a 15-16ish year old rather than a 9-12 year old

EDIT: I am from the US, I was raised in Maine

 

[La Barata]

Let me give you a bit of an analogy. Remember the story about The Grasshopper and the Ant? How while the ant spent all his time working hard, making sure he was well provided for, being responsible while the grasshopper dicked around and did whatever he felt like? Then, winter came, and the grasshopper's completely fucked. So he comes crawling to the ant, who, depending on the version of the story, either took him in or said "go die in a hole". The grasshopper is a woman, and the ant is a nice guy. The women run about doing whatever and whoever the fuck they feel like while the nice guy does his best to be productive and prepare for the future. Then, all of a sudden, winter will come. The woman will realize she's gotten older, or her douchebag boyfriend will break up with her, or something like that. Then where does she turn? She comes crawling back to the nice guy, who, being a nice guy, will be there for her, be comforting, let her ***** and moan about her ex, or how much everything sucks for little old her. He'll take it and he won't complain, because he's a nice guy. At this point, one of two things will happen. Either she'll finally realize it's a bad fucking idea to date douchebags and assholes and might get together with him (this usually only happens after age 30) or she'll friend zone him so hard his balls fall off, then run off again next spring (new douchebag or old one takes her back), only to do it all over again the next year.

That just sounds like some kind of wishful thinking 'karma' story for some person who felt entitled to a girl's affection since he was being 'nice' (manipulative) and didn't get it.

That was rather unfair and uncalled for. Entirely so. You don't particularly agree with something I've said, so you immediately begin to try and brush it all off by saying I must be a manipulative person who feels entitled to having people's affection? That's really quite petty of you.

I'm basing it off of the way the thing is presented. She comes crawling back? The whole scenario practically seems to imply that she somehow wronged the guy. But all she did was date someone else. I'm not sure how that's gonna work out unless he was somehow entitled to her affection.

Hm, I see your point. I can definitely see how it'd come off that way, I suppose. I probably should have worded that differently. And yes, while I HAVE been in several bad relationships (the stories I could tell...) none of them were like that. I merely meant to say how some girls tend to use legitimately nice guys who make it very clear that they're interested in them on a regular basis, leading them on between dating jerks. Because you have to admit, that happens far more often than is fair.

 

[Zaik]

Not unless you have obscene amounts of cash or a nice enough body that you can get women regardless of your attitude.

If you're just nice, they can get what they want(attention) from you without needing to initiate a relationship. Why should they?

As many a 25 year old has said before, why buy the milk when the cow is free? It works the other way too.

Edit: Wow I screwed that up. I think I was trying to say "Why buy the cow when the milk is free". I think. I'm still not sure.

 

[mikev7.0]

This question is for all the ladies (especially the Dutch ones):
Are girls still interested in nice guys or is there really no more hope for us?

It has recently (past 17 years) come to my attention that a lot of men act like jerks in front of women, and the women seem to be enjoying it. Which leads me to think that women nowadays are attracted to complete douches.

(Un)fortunately, I don't belong to that specific group, and I consider myself to be a nice and confident guy.
In fact, my last date said it wasn't gonna work out because I was too nice.
Now I've tried to be a jerk, but I don't like myself anymore when I do that.
And neither do other people, so it would seem I am doing something terribly wrong.

Is there still any chance for us? We are just regular guys, except for that we aren't complete douches.

Also I've noticed that especially city girls are attracted to jerks, please comment on that too

Ok, I've read the replies and I'd like to delve deeper in the "some do like nice guys, some like jerks" thing. Now I believe that. Problem is I can't seem to find the ones that like nice guys. I just run into jerk-loving girls OR girls that already are in relations with other nice guys.

From personal experience and having a lot of friends who are "nice guys" I can tell you that yes, psychologically speaking it is easier to attract women not if you are a jerk, but if you don't act as if they hung the freakin' moon. Just be your normal, nice self and don't act as if whether she says yes or no matters so damned much okay? Just go up, ask her out and remember some do, some don't, so what? There's only like 5 billion of them anyway....

Also (again from occasionally painful experience) most girls who go for jerks are either issue or baggage laden and you don't want to attempt to persue anything meaningful with them anyway.

Best of wishes in your (and others) search, and so long as your looking in the right places just remember something that we all learn from our beloved video games: Panic Fire Works. In other words? If you can't aim? Shoot LOTS.

 

[Zaverexus]

Actually, as a nice (to nice girls) guy I can say I usually don't have too much trouble with girls I like. For the main reason that I don't like the kind of girl who likes jerks. The thing is that dating is never easy, no matter who you are you will have some issues, just relax about it.
That said, I acknowledge that there are some girls who like jerks, but they aren't the girls you want to go out with.

 

[La Barata]

Let me give you a bit of an analogy. Remember the story about The Grasshopper and the Ant? How while the ant spent all his time working hard, making sure he was well provided for, being responsible while the grasshopper dicked around and did whatever he felt like? Then, winter came, and the grasshopper's completely fucked. So he comes crawling to the ant, who, depending on the version of the story, either took him in or said "go die in a hole". The grasshopper is a woman, and the ant is a nice guy. The women run about doing whatever and whoever the fuck they feel like while the nice guy does his best to be productive and prepare for the future. Then, all of a sudden, winter will come. The woman will realize she's gotten older, or her douchebag boyfriend will break up with her, or something like that. Then where does she turn? She comes crawling back to the nice guy, who, being a nice guy, will be there for her, be comforting, let her ***** and moan about her ex, or how much everything sucks for little old her. He'll take it and he won't complain, because he's a nice guy. At this point, one of two things will happen. Either she'll finally realize it's a bad fucking idea to date douchebags and assholes and might get together with him (this usually only happens after age 30) or she'll friend zone him so hard his balls fall off, then run off again next spring (new douchebag or old one takes her back), only to do it all over again the next year.

That just sounds like some kind of wishful thinking 'karma' story for some person who felt entitled to a girl's affection since he was being 'nice' (manipulative) and didn't get it.

That was rather unfair and uncalled for. Entirely so. You don't particularly agree with something I've said, so you immediately begin to try and brush it all off by saying I must be a manipulative person who feels entitled to having people's affection? That's really quite petty of you.

I'm basing it off of the way the thing is presented. She comes crawling back? The whole scenario practically seems to imply that she somehow wronged the guy. But all she did was date someone else. I'm not sure how that's gonna work out unless he was somehow entitled to her affection.

Hm, I see your point. I can definitely see how it'd come off that way, I suppose. I probably should have worded that differently. And yes, while I HAVE been in several bad relationships (the stories I could tell...) none of them were like that. I merely meant to say how some girls tend to use legitimately nice guys who make it very clear that they're interested in them on a regular basis, leading them on between dating jerks. Because you have to admit, that happens far more often than is fair.

From what I have seen, if a dude thinks a girl is "leading him on" for a long period of time,

A) (most likely) it's all in his head
or
B) she's not actually into him - she's into attention

Either way, the answer is to move on.

That's exactly the point I was trying to make, that some girls are just so wrapped up in themselves that they need to leech as much attention as they possibly can from the people around them, it doesn't matter who they hurt.

 

[RaikuFA]

besides. isnt it a double standard? girl is androphobic shes awarded for being courageous in a "male dominant society" a guy has gynophobia and hes considered a freak

No, she's concidered to be a vicious man hating straw feminist and hated by both men, liberarians, and true feminists.

I'm sure that if you looked hard enough you could find people that sympathise with misogynists, but they're all just in hiding.

yeah but theyre as rare as a shiny chansey

 

[La Barata]

Let me give you a bit of an analogy. Remember the story about The Grasshopper and the Ant? How while the ant spent all his time working hard, making sure he was well provided for, being responsible while the grasshopper dicked around and did whatever he felt like? Then, winter came, and the grasshopper's completely fucked. So he comes crawling to the ant, who, depending on the version of the story, either took him in or said "go die in a hole". The grasshopper is a woman, and the ant is a nice guy. The women run about doing whatever and whoever the fuck they feel like while the nice guy does his best to be productive and prepare for the future. Then, all of a sudden, winter will come. The woman will realize she's gotten older, or her douchebag boyfriend will break up with her, or something like that. Then where does she turn? She comes crawling back to the nice guy, who, being a nice guy, will be there for her, be comforting, let her ***** and moan about her ex, or how much everything sucks for little old her. He'll take it and he won't complain, because he's a nice guy. At this point, one of two things will happen. Either she'll finally realize it's a bad fucking idea to date douchebags and assholes and might get together with him (this usually only happens after age 30) or she'll friend zone him so hard his balls fall off, then run off again next spring (new douchebag or old one takes her back), only to do it all over again the next year.

That just sounds like some kind of wishful thinking 'karma' story for some person who felt entitled to a girl's affection since he was being 'nice' (manipulative) and didn't get it.

That was rather unfair and uncalled for. Entirely so. You don't particularly agree with something I've said, so you immediately begin to try and brush it all off by saying I must be a manipulative person who feels entitled to having people's affection? That's really quite petty of you.

I'm basing it off of the way the thing is presented. She comes crawling back? The whole scenario practically seems to imply that she somehow wronged the guy. But all she did was date someone else. I'm not sure how that's gonna work out unless he was somehow entitled to her affection.

Hm, I see your point. I can definitely see how it'd come off that way, I suppose. I probably should have worded that differently. And yes, while I HAVE been in several bad relationships (the stories I could tell...) none of them were like that. I merely meant to say how some girls tend to use legitimately nice guys who make it very clear that they're interested in them on a regular basis, leading them on between dating jerks. Because you have to admit, that happens far more often than is fair.

From what I have seen, if a dude thinks a girl is "leading him on" for a long period of time,

A) (most likely) it's all in his head
or
B) she's not actually into him - she's into attention

Either way, the answer is to move on.

That's exactly the point I was trying to make, that some girls are just so wrapped up in themselves that they need to leech as much attention as they possibly can from the people around them, it doesn't matter who they hurt.

But to be fair there are plenty of dudes like that too. Human beings in general love us some attention.

Oh god yes. Tying into what I said, there are god knows how many douchebags out there who want one thing and one thing only, and willing to do and say whatever they need to to get it.