ditto on this guy, I believe that if people want equality they have to actually take the bad parts too.CactiComplex said:
Poll: Do you consider yourself a feminist?
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Damn, my view has already been claimed by anotherAccursedTheory said:
Feminism is not interested in equality for all, it is interested in equality for women. To clarify, no feminist is attempting to make equal areas in which women hold the advantage, only areas in which men do
I also like the term equalist, as I feel that anyone should have an equal chance at doing anything, depending on their own merits. Basically, as long as people aren't discriminated against based on their genetic make-up, it's all good
I very much consider myself a feminist for two reasons: my personal beliefs and my field of study. as a Master's student in English, I have focused most of my time and energy on feminist theory and applied it throughout the work I have presented and the classes I teach.
I also agree with this person, but I also admit that I take it a bit further in that I purposefully defend and advocate women specifically because, let's face it, they need it a great deal more than everyone else. Not only do they have to deal with whatever their religion and/or ethnicity is and the problems that it may present, but they have to be a woman too. That could potentially mean discrimination on three levels. It's still very much a man's world in many countries and so I want to point out things for women's support in particular.innocentEX said:
Certainly not. I don't think we should all be treated the same because we aren't all the same. I do, however, think that opportunities should not be denied to anyone for something they have no control over (except in ridiculous cases such as trying to teach a legless person to operate a bicycle).
Besides the opportunities thing I don't want us treated all the same, I wanted us all treated as well as our situations allow it, whatever that means.
Besides the opportunities thing I don't want us treated all the same, I wanted us all treated as well as our situations allow it, whatever that means.
OH sure I'd like equal rights.
But I hate any group that puts their own rights ahead of the rights of everyone else.
But I hate any group that puts their own rights ahead of the rights of everyone else.
Women need to have extra rights to make up for the fact that a generation or two ago people still treated them different. Yep thats how you create equality by giving out special treatment to a select group of people. That way they know they are the same.
(just kidding, I think everyone should be treated equally but I find a lot of Feminism groups nowadays seems to want not balance but female favoritism)
(just kidding, I think everyone should be treated equally but I find a lot of Feminism groups nowadays seems to want not balance but female favoritism)
I personally was brought up to have a high respect for women, mainly because my family were all females when i was growing up.
So yeah, you could call me a feminist.
It's also the reason why i'm much more interested, and confident in talking to females than males as well.
So yeah, you could call me a feminist.
It's also the reason why i'm much more interested, and confident in talking to females than males as well.
I'd agree with that.CloakedOne said:
I'd also add that being in favour of women's rights (IE, being a feminist) doesn't mean being opposed to men's rights, except when those rights are infringing on women's rights.
Not at all.
I'm all for gender equality and such, but i'm ALWAYS annoyed when feminists come up with something new to be angry about.
And i'm especially annoyed about the concept of women quotas, wich is currently a topic again here in germany ( http://www.spiegel.de/international/business/0,1518,742708,00.html ). Forcing something like that does not give me the impression that it's just a different kind of discrimination/seperation, and kind of ridiculous if you think about it logically.
(Although i admit that it doesn't help that Ursula Von der Leyen is spearheading this whole thing for me personally)
I'm all for gender equality and such, but i'm ALWAYS annoyed when feminists come up with something new to be angry about.
And i'm especially annoyed about the concept of women quotas, wich is currently a topic again here in germany ( http://www.spiegel.de/international/business/0,1518,742708,00.html ). Forcing something like that does not give me the impression that it's just a different kind of discrimination/seperation, and kind of ridiculous if you think about it logically.
(Although i admit that it doesn't help that Ursula Von der Leyen is spearheading this whole thing for me personally)
I support equality, but never to the point where there's a certain quota. Also, women are better at some things, and vice versa. This subject should be studied more, but unfortunately in modern days it's considered as sexist, with all the political correctness gone mad: a well respected scientist who had done breakthrough research for over 20 years, decided to research this subject, and after the results got out; he got sacked and the results weren't released in the normal manner, because feminism was an extremely hot subject at the time.
Both sexes should have equal rights. Feminist acts often go towards just increasing female rights, not to equalize. I know that's not what feminism means, but that's how it often works. If men would be asking the same thing on professions/industries/areas where they aren't equal, they'd be thought as being chauvinist.
Both sexes should have equal rights. Feminist acts often go towards just increasing female rights, not to equalize. I know that's not what feminism means, but that's how it often works. If men would be asking the same thing on professions/industries/areas where they aren't equal, they'd be thought as being chauvinist.
For most of the western and some of the eastern world, the issue isn't equality in a system. Currently, on paper and if not on paper, then in practice, Women do have equal "rights" to men.
If anything, the feminist movements are a bygone era that succeeded in getting equality in the eyes of a system. However, society is a totally different (and far more ancient) monster. Society is currently not restricting Womens rights directly (not erecting physical or judicial barriers at least), but it's doing something far more subtle (although probably well known at this stage or studied at the least).
Gender roles. From day 1 of a persons birth, they are bombarded with stimuli that encourage a specific mental (and in some cases, physical) development. These stimuli pile on pre-conceived notions about how a man or woman should act (men shouldn't cry, women shouldn't fight etc). It shapes the way we aesthetically present ourselves, our demeanour, our personality, our lifestyle, the way we think (partially)... virtually everything. People have far less freedom then they would like to think they have (taking economical and physical limitations as a given).
Whats even worse, it deludes the vast majority us from its own oppressive nature by its own structure. There are so many stimuli and influences out there that no 2 people will ever receive the same impact, and consequently will develop differently, a kind of pseudo-freedom one would say... however society still pigeon holes us into roles suited to our sex (and race/nationality too I would believe, but that's a different topic and I'm not well versed on that side of the topic). If we stray too far from the mould, we get chastised for it, even outcasted.
Some aspects of this social grooming are necessary for moral development and whatnot, but the greater share of it's aspects are what's causing the rift between how Women are perceived and how men are perceived.
This thing affects everyone and it's unbiased in doing so. Yet the fact is, society is nothing more then the people that comprises it. We don't let ourselves fall into it, we let our children. We ourselves have no control over our development until we hit early teens and by then we are too concerned with fitting in to even consider what we are becoming. I myself am unable to alter the way I think and the way I act... and as I muse about it, I realise I do hold prejudice against people who try to break away from these norms, I contribute to these Social bindings. I would guess that if I was to have kids, I probably would blindly condition my kids like my parents did to me, unable to instigate a change for the next generation.
I've got far more to say about this, but I'll leave it at that.
TL/DR: I don't believe that in practice women have any less rights then men. But we are conditioned to act in a certain way based on our gender, and are scolded for attempting to step outside of that.
EDIT: I guess there is a confusion in definitions... Equality between men and women is good. I'm not naive, I'm aware that equality is not the current state of things. But I also imagine feminism in a political sense, fighting for rights in the eyes of the law and state, and those angry women who turn it into sexism as getting the wrong idea.. I guess there are multiple interpretations to feminism.
If anything, the feminist movements are a bygone era that succeeded in getting equality in the eyes of a system. However, society is a totally different (and far more ancient) monster. Society is currently not restricting Womens rights directly (not erecting physical or judicial barriers at least), but it's doing something far more subtle (although probably well known at this stage or studied at the least).
Gender roles. From day 1 of a persons birth, they are bombarded with stimuli that encourage a specific mental (and in some cases, physical) development. These stimuli pile on pre-conceived notions about how a man or woman should act (men shouldn't cry, women shouldn't fight etc). It shapes the way we aesthetically present ourselves, our demeanour, our personality, our lifestyle, the way we think (partially)... virtually everything. People have far less freedom then they would like to think they have (taking economical and physical limitations as a given).
Whats even worse, it deludes the vast majority us from its own oppressive nature by its own structure. There are so many stimuli and influences out there that no 2 people will ever receive the same impact, and consequently will develop differently, a kind of pseudo-freedom one would say... however society still pigeon holes us into roles suited to our sex (and race/nationality too I would believe, but that's a different topic and I'm not well versed on that side of the topic). If we stray too far from the mould, we get chastised for it, even outcasted.
Some aspects of this social grooming are necessary for moral development and whatnot, but the greater share of it's aspects are what's causing the rift between how Women are perceived and how men are perceived.
This thing affects everyone and it's unbiased in doing so. Yet the fact is, society is nothing more then the people that comprises it. We don't let ourselves fall into it, we let our children. We ourselves have no control over our development until we hit early teens and by then we are too concerned with fitting in to even consider what we are becoming. I myself am unable to alter the way I think and the way I act... and as I muse about it, I realise I do hold prejudice against people who try to break away from these norms, I contribute to these Social bindings. I would guess that if I was to have kids, I probably would blindly condition my kids like my parents did to me, unable to instigate a change for the next generation.
I've got far more to say about this, but I'll leave it at that.
TL/DR: I don't believe that in practice women have any less rights then men. But we are conditioned to act in a certain way based on our gender, and are scolded for attempting to step outside of that.
EDIT: I guess there is a confusion in definitions... Equality between men and women is good. I'm not naive, I'm aware that equality is not the current state of things. But I also imagine feminism in a political sense, fighting for rights in the eyes of the law and state, and those angry women who turn it into sexism as getting the wrong idea.. I guess there are multiple interpretations to feminism.
I'm more about "equality" than "feminism". Even liberal feminism seems to believe the world should be a matriarchy instead of a patriarchy.
I reckon it's pretty much bullshit that a woman beating up a man is viewed as funny and shameful to the man, but when a man does the same it's sickening. Woman rapes a man, he should enjoy it, man rapes a woman, SCUM. Like, seriously, there are some fundamental things wrong with that.
It's as much of a bunch of fuckery for women as it is for men. It insinuates women are weak and can't actually cause any harm.
I reckon it's pretty much bullshit that a woman beating up a man is viewed as funny and shameful to the man, but when a man does the same it's sickening. Woman rapes a man, he should enjoy it, man rapes a woman, SCUM. Like, seriously, there are some fundamental things wrong with that.
It's as much of a bunch of fuckery for women as it is for men. It insinuates women are weak and can't actually cause any harm.
Finally! Someone else who thinks feminist is a weird way to describe it!AccursedTheory said:
But yeah, I like to think of myself as this.
According to that definition, yeah, but most feminists I know scare me (i.e. my mother). Things really should be equal. It's the 21st century, some people should get that into their heads (i.e. my father, my family's not looking so good at the moment XD).
No. Feminism means thinking that there needs to be political action to 'correct' a sexist agenda, not just that men and women are equal.
I also don't think women should be allowed to serve in combat infantry regiments.
I also don't think women should be allowed to serve in combat infantry regiments.