Poll: Do you think Esports should be taken as serious as traditional sports?

[Giuglea]

I'm actually involved in the launch of a new, Australian eSports News website. as I'm fairy sure I can't just link to it here, PM me if you want the details We're growing fast!

why not?escapist magazine is all about spreading pop-culture..esports being a part of it..plus the escapist isn`t involved in esports so you wouldn`t harm them...so i think its fine to post your link..

Well then, it's www.esportsdaily.com.au

Check us out!

cool..too bad its not ready yet...its always nice to see people promoting this..hope to see activity on the site in the future..

 

[Verlander]

In all recognised Starcraft leagues (GSL, IEM for sc2, OSL, MSL, Dream League and Proleague for sc1)the players do not sit at home playing. They are inigans.connection to real sports, that games just don't get. That, and all you need to be good at games is practic So no, you can't hack. This isn't like playing some random on the other side of the world on Xbox Live.

As to the perception of games in society, which society are you talking about precisely? In Korea the fanclubs of players are in the hundreds of thousands. All the top internet searches are for Starcraft. Hell, even Parliament use it to explain military strategy [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.247814-Korean-Ex-Defense-Minister-Says-Crisis-Isnt-StarCraft]. These players are revered much more than any other figures in the country. The OP mentioned HuskyStarcraft on Youtube, an American. He has been repeatedly ranked top 10 for most watched youtube channel weekly GLOBALLY. More people are playing games than ever before in Western countries as well, it isn't just an Asian gimmick.

No-one wants to watch? WCG in China last year had a packed stadium with over 20,000 people, which is about the same size as Lord's cricket ground. IEM in Europe regularly pulls in excess of 5000 [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddeDAnXW99o]. There are 2 regular TV stations in Korea that only show video games, there are THOUSANDS of shows and streams on the internet for various games. Sure watching games isn't as big as the English Premier League or National Football League yet but this stuff has only just started. The NASL, an American Starcraft 2 league has just been announced with a $400,000 first prize. This is slowly becoming big business.

You say esports have no physical element. These guys NEED gym training to do what they do. The average Korean Starcraft progamer has an apm of about 350. You try it. Grab your mouse. Click 6 times per second for half an hour without a break. Repeat this 15-20 times in one day, which they do for practice. Your arm will be fucked afterwards, I promise you.

And finally as to your assertion that no skill is required and it's only practice. This is absolutely hilarious. There are people in Starcraft 2 Battle.net with over 4000 games played and they are still in the bottom division. You need reflexes, good strategic thinking and blazingly fast, precise control to be successful in any popular esports game. Go download a pro brood war replay of Flash or Jaedong off Team Liquid and watch it from their first person view. Then come back and say that it takes no skill.

It is true that esports are not currently as big as "real" sports. It is unlikely that they will grow to be as big as the Superbowl, or the EPL, or the NBA. You however have completely written them off as having no market and no potential with no justification, and your arguments show that you quite clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

Bless, it appears that I have touched a nerve. The original question, which asked for an opinion, was do I think that they should be taken as seriously as real sports. My answer is no. It's big in South Korea, a country where there is two thirds of the population of the UK alone? Big whoop. I never said that it wasn't popular, I said that it shouldn't be taken as seriously.

The physical skill required in playing these tournaments is minimal. I'm not saying that I'm better, but they aren't pushing the boat out exactly. The fact that there are tournaments that have cash prizes? There are butchery tournaments for Gods sake, with cash prizes. There are also beauty and hairstyling competitions, and I doubt that a gamer can just walk into one of those and win it. They may not have the physical strength, nor knowledge to win these competitions, so due to their specialised nature, do they constitute sport? What about a "battle of the bands" event, or gigs in general? Hundreds of thousands of people turn up to see gigs, and there's no denying that's a massive physical ordeal. Hell, there even pretty good money in music. Is that a sport? No.

Not every competitive event qualifies as a sport.

The question was quite simple, so let me talk you slowly through my answer. I claimed "no" because it is nothing like the majority of sports. To define "sport" let me highlight what sport is commonly considered to be, by viewing figures:

The top 5 most popular sports in the world are: Association Football, Cricket, Field Hockey, Tennis and Volleyball. All physical activities. Playing games, while having a physical interaction, are not physical activities. Simple.

Enjoy gaming competitions, have fun, take part, and watch them. Just don't try to classify them as something they are not.

Oh, and viewing figures on youtube and suchlike don't mean anything. I've watched them before, it doesn't mean I'm interested in them. An idiot slating off Obama might get a lot of views, but a savvy political commentator he ain't. I have to be honest, it seems like you are the one who doesn't know what he is talking about. Please stop throwing your toys out of the pram, and respect people's ability to have a opinion.

 

[ResonanceSD]

I'm actually involved in the launch of a new, Australian eSports News website. as I'm fairy sure I can't just link to it here, PM me if you want the details We're growing fast!

why not?escapist magazine is all about spreading pop-culture..esports being a part of it..plus the escapist isn`t involved in esports so you wouldn`t harm them...so i think its fine to post your link..

Well then, it's www.esportsdaily.com.au

Check us out!

cool..too bad its not ready yet...its always nice to see people promoting this..hope to see activity on the site in the future..

Indeed. We expect to be fully operational in the next few weeks so if you follow competitive eSports in the Australia/ Asia Pacific region, be sure to check us out!

 

[fundayz]

No, they should not be treated as sports because they do not involve any physical prowess. Even the least active of sports such as golf, darts, etc still require physical dexterity.(and I do not consider Chess anymore a sport than I consider Clue or Monopoly to be a sport)

Now, i think e-sports should and can, garner the same type of attention and following but that can only be proven by the fans.

No. Just no. Sports usually involve physical skill, a lot of physical skill. E-sports are more along the lines of Chess. A sport in another category.

Why should feats of the mind be regarded as inferior to feats of the body when the former is vastly more important for 99% of the population in western societies?

I don't understand where you get the "inferior" part; is your insecurity poking out its head?

Just because someone states (correctly) that video games cannot be classified as a "sport" due to their very nature doesn't imply them being less or inferior.

 

[Giuglea]

No, they should not be treated as sports because they do not involve any physical prowess. Even the least active of sports such as golf, darts, etc still require physical dexterity.

Now, i think e-sports should and can, garner the same type of attention and following but that can only be proven by the fans.

No. Just no. Sports usually involve physical skill, a lot of physical skill. E-sports are more along the lines of Chess. A sport in another category.

Why should feats of the mind be regarded as inferior to feats of the body when the former is vastly more important for 99% of the population in western societies?

I don't understand where you get the "inferior" part; is your insecurity poking out its head?

Just because someone states (correctly) that video games cannot be classified as a "sport" due to their very nature doesn't imply them being less or inferior.

i didn`t want them to be as traditional sports..god forbid..but i want them to be more accepted and respected around the world..

 

[fundayz]

i didn`t want them to be as traditional sports..god forbid..but i want them to be more accepted and respected around the world..

Don't get me wrong, I'm not AGAINST e-sports. It's just that some people apparently believe that anything that is both competitive and requires skill can be classified as a sport.

And it is all up to you, and the other fans, to push e-sports from the niche where it is right now to the mainstream.

 

[GeorgW]

It should definitely be taken more seriously, but it's understandable that it's not as popular as the "regular" sports. The thing is, they don't need to be taken seriously. The people that enjoy them take it seriously, and it's the same with "regular" sports, there are just more of them. It would be nice if they got some air time on international TV and such, but we'll always have the internet and isn't that enough?

 

[Therumancer]

I said "no"

Unless the nature of gaming changes signifigantly it should not be considered a sport. Perhaps down the road with things like VR or a direct neural interface this might change.

I do however think it can be considered in the same league as professional or semi-pro board gaming however. By this I mean things like chess, backgammon, cribbage, and the like. Assuming things can be balanced perfectly, I can see things like "Starcraft" being taken as seriously as Chess if they manage to survive for a few more decades more or less unchanged. The game relying on understanding the variables, and a mental exercise in terms of strategy and tactics. The biggest differance being between the board being electroic of physical.

To be honest, just because something requires skill does not mean it should be considered a sport, or at least not in my opinion. I think "motorsports" is almost an oxymoron, and while it can be entertaining I don't think things like "NASCAR" deserve to be considered sports, even as fringe sports. I also don't think golfers deserve credit as serious athletes despite the skill involved. Of course, like anything opinions on this kind of thing are entirely subjective. I think a lot of things that are called "sports" get the label to give them a greater veneer of respectaibility, irregardless of what they actually involve.

When it comes to gaming, I will also say again for something like "Starcraft" to become akin to chess at some point it needs to remain unchanged for a long period of time. One of the reasons why collectible card games like "Magic The Gathering" will never become similar to Poker or other games, even with money involved, and a "professional" tournament circuit is because the game is always in flux, it's rife with game balance issues, and the cards themselves are the primary business involved, with all of the competitions and such designed to facilitate their sale for the good of the company running things, rather than the actual promotion of the game itself or a desire to turn it into a serious competitive practice.

 

[Kavachi]

What people here are arguing about is not if E-sports is serious or not, but what the definition of a "real" sport is.
So I'm not going to argue with people's view on the world, because that is pointless, but I'll just make clear what my definition of a sport is.

For me, a sport is a clash of 2 or more teams (or players) in a competitive match. For example football, which is a physical and endurance testing competition. The definiton of a pro-sport is the same thing for me, only with having a large fanbase.
So let's take Starcraft. I really enjoy starcraft, and alot of others do (there are many tournaments every week), so it has a fanbase. The real diffrence here is is that it doesn't involve a competition of physical attributes, but a competition of strategy and dexterity (the average apm of pro-gamers needs faster finger-speed than most rock solo's on guitar). So yes, I do believe it should be taken as seriously as Football.

Also, for everyone who wonders why some games are better suited for competition than others, just ask yourself why football is professional but not banana throwing (for example).

 

[Frankster]

pro SC gamers have to be fit..have physical training sessions..and they play at 300-500 actions per minute...that almost 10 actions per second..i think that involves a lot of thinking..just saying..

If i recall correctly there was an article on the escapist on this subject.
Doctors found the pro sc gamers had reactions of fighter pilots.
But when they checked their insides they found that despite having a normal outwardly appearance, the insides of the sc pros were that of 50 yr olds.

 

[Lyri]

but is does he in any way look unfit..what did u expect??a 150 kilo meat head ready to tackle a small hill??do u think the snooker players such as O`Sullivan wouldn`t break in half by the wind...what about curling athletes?or darts extreme players...:|

I'm not expecting anything, I'm saying you're wrong. They simply do not do that, the GSL players have very little time to themselves for such activities.
The only weights they'd ever use would be for their wrists, so they can play faster when they take them off.

 

[OtherSideofSky]

No. For the record, I don't take "real" sports very seriously either. Although there are some people that I respect for having honed their physical abilities to the limit, the games themselves are not as inherently worthy of respect and adoration (or even interest) as everyone seems to take for granted.

"esports" don't require significant physical skill and therefore must be contests and demonstrations of mental achievement, but games like Starcraft don't possess anywhere near the same level of balance and depth in this regard as, for instance, a more traditional game like Go or Chess which has been refined for hundreds of years.

 

[Blaster395]

E-Sports mostly come down to strategy, mathematics and meta-game. It is very similar to chess.
Chess is a recognized sport of the International Olympic Committee.
If Chess gets to be a sport, then so does E-Sports.

 

[Zorg Machine]

It should be taken just as seriously as chess and other games of the mind.

 

[Abengoshis]

Is esport just a crappy name for video games?

Hell no.

e-Sports aren't sports by any means. They're not physical activities and I think the term used should be something like "competitive gaming".

sport: an active diversion requiring physical exertion and competition.

then why are chess, darts, and poker considered sports?or nascar)

Well they aren't always. In fact I think Nascar is so silly, I don't even count it as a proper motor sport.

They're just completely different things. And it's a subjective matter what you want to call a sport. Whether the only requirements are "competitive, requires skill" or "physical, competitive, requires skill". Or "scaly, evil, breaths fire".

I use a mouse and keyboard. Thats physical movement, right?

 

[Jesus Phish]

No. They should be taken seriously as a contest. Just like poker (anyone who says/thinks this is a sport wake up), chess or darts. Those are contests. People can make a living off these contests.

They're not sports. The arguments made in favour of e-sports such as "but they think so fast its like a mind sport!", in the heat of things soccer players think fast. Think how fast a soccer ball gets punted at a goal. The keeper has to have made up his mind where he needs to have his hands in order to stop it.

American football requires perfect timing between different players to pull off passes.

These people are mentally and physically fit.

Additionally, it seems e-sports favour the "shout caster". I hate shout casters so much.

 

[Lucifron]

No. Just no. Sports usually involve physical skill, a lot of physical skill. E-sports are more along the lines of Chess. A sport in another category.

Why should feats of the mind be regarded as inferior to feats of the body when the former is vastly more important for 99% of the population in western societies?

I don't understand where you get the "inferior" part; is your insecurity poking out its head?

Just because someone states (correctly) that video games cannot be classified as a "sport" due to their very nature doesn't imply them being less or inferior.

I don't understand why some people feel the need to throw completely baseless accusations against people they know absolutely nothing about. Perhaps their insecurities are poking out of their heads?
I also don't understand why people feel the need to misunderstand the premise of a forum topic. The issue at hand is whether e-sports (notice the "e-" in front (this makes it a different word)) should be taken as seriously as traditional sports. Not whether videogames should be classified as a traditional sport, which would be nonsensical. Refusing to equate the value of e-sports with athletic sports would make e-sports inferior.
A person who would contend such must be very insecure indeed, and should perhaps seek counseling before his insecurities begin poking out of his head.

 

[almostgold]

What?? No. We love sports because it provides a contest that test a combination of intelligence, skill, and physical power. Once you take the athletic component out, it loses all appeal to most people.