Poll: Doctor Who Could Be Better

[joshuaayt]

I'd love a female Doctor- we already know time lords can change gender, let's give it a shot. Hell, he thought he *had* changed gender when he first woke up as 11. It'd be rad if he actually became a woman while still with a companion, just to see the dynamic shift around.

 

[Sir Thomas Sean Connery]

So I saw this [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-23570354]the other day...and sighed. Another white, male Doctor to the rescue.

It's exactly this kind of stuff that makes people sour to the idea of a diverse doctor. They feel like it would just be pandering to irritating people.

I'll always be of the same mind as Moffat on this one. In an interview he was asked the very question "Why not a female/black doctor?" and his answer was essentially this "When we look for a new doctor, we don't think 'Which white male would be the best doctor?' We think 'Is this actor good as the doctor?'"

In the business of film, the ability to act is and hopefully always will be the driving force behind casting decisions. If even a single scene would be made worse by having a more diverse cast, it shouldn't be done.

Now, that's not to say it can't. As Moffat also mentioned, there's all the chance in the world that the right actor could have girly parts. I can think of several non white male actors that would make a good doctor, but if the producers feel Capaldi is better, then they're probably right as a result of being more knowledgeable about the writing and stories to come.
Acting first, skin/genitalia second.

 

[Albino Boo]

100% agree, but you can't tell me that there are NO black or female actors/actresses that could kick this role's ass. Helen Mirren anyone? I think you can aim for something that breaks the mold without choosing a minority for its own sake. Hell, their only requirement could be "not a white male." That leaves PLENTY.

You forget one thing they can't afford a big name. The Dr has always been a character actor and not the guy that plays the lead. Its always been a the case of its what his name from that thing.

Well, not to open a can of worms, but Torchwood was done by Russell T. Davies iirc, and he was big into gay rights and such. He stopped writing for Doctor Who, and Moffat took over. Plus, I have already conceded that Doctor Who is good about espousing equality, hence my shock at the nondiverse Doctor.

That worked so well that it got cancelled after 3 series. One of the reason why old who got canceled was because the writers were using the show as soap box for their own opinions rather than writing good plots. Its noticeable after Russell T Davis left, the number of viewers in the States went up. This coincided with reduced emphasis on gay rights. If the show doesn't get bums on seats then it gets cancelled again and being all preachy and diverse is good way to cut the viewing figures.

 

[Something Amyss]

I'm as bothered by a white Doctor as I am by Kirk being white in the Star Trek reboot. That being said....

the population of the UK is over 90% white so yeah

While it's a touch nitpicky, the most recent demographics I've seen say 87, which is less than "over 90%."

Don't know why people need to hypberolise a majority.

[quoteSex is a different kettle of fish however, since that does affect character and I personally would prefer the Doctor stays male since I feel it's an important part of his character, even if it has been canonically confirmed that Time Lords can change sex.[/quote]

Okay, seriously. I don't give a crap about the Doctor's sex, but how the hell does it actually serve as an important part of his character?

I prefer The Doctor to be a white male.

Being a white male, it just easier to relate.
I mean, who would want a white Shaft?

Yes, a white blacksloitation character would be quite weird.

I'm not sure how you can think that would be a viable parallel.

I mean, could be totally bullshit, but it sounds alright to me.

Well, considering the show itself, I would call that bullshit. But, of course, DW fans have spent 50 years trying to retcon and rationalise what they do and don't like, so I'm neither surprised that it exists nor saying you can't choose to subscribe to it.

Honestly, I don't get the need on any level, be it the diversity quota or he technology or even the historicity of events within the Whoniverse. It's a 50 year old show. If it was just as it was envisioned in 1613, it would be weird and dated, rather than just weird.

I'm also rather amused at the notion that a black actor might deprive us of the 'best' actor for the role. The image in my mind is that people believe there is one mystical person out there who is objectively best for a role. I'm sure at any given moment there are numerous phenomenally talented people available for the role, and I doubt that there's any actual shortage of non-white (or non-male) actors who fit there, so this concern for the show seems like a thin veneer.

It also assumes they're actively looking for the best, and last I knew they at the very least were not looking for women. surely, by the specious reasoning of "the best actor for the job," they're already potentially harming the show?

Unless the real reasoning isn't concern for the fate of the show, mind. I mean, at least the dude who said he found white dudes easier to relate to comes off as honest. It's hard to take the "most qualified" argument anywhere near serious.

 

[HannesPascal]

Just under 90%, apparently, but you're close.

Shouldn't that mean that if they were being proportionate, which you seem to be suggesting, one should be non-white?

I know a couple of people has responded to this already, but I recently took a course in mathematical statistics and want use my acquired knowledge. So the question is whether how high the probability of the Doctor only being white is given that there is a 90% probability that one Doctor is white and there has been 13 Doctors (counting both John Hurt and Peter Capaldi).
This is something called a binomial distribution and the number of white Doctors are Bin(0.9,13) distributed if it corresponds to the ratio of white people in Britain. I'm going to test this against the hypothesis that the probability that the doctor is white is higher than 90% by calculating the probability that 13 Doctors (or more but there can't be more than 13) are white given that the number of white Doctors are Bin(0.9,13) distributed by calculating 0.9^13*(1-0.9)^(13-13)*nCr(13,13)=0.25. So there is a 25% chance that all the 13 Doctors are white given that there's a 90% chance that one Doctor is white, which I personally would say is high enough.

On topic
No I actually think like a lot of others that the Doctor should be whoever the producers (or writers or whoever makes that call) chooses and they shouldn't be forced to choose an actor that is not a white male. There are plenty of areas where the number of non-white or non-male is too low but a British children/family tv show shouldn't be a concern.

 

[Thaluikhain]

While that's an issue, I think PoC as other cast members or working on the show tends to get overlooked.

Much as I didn't like RTD's run, he didn't feel the need to make everyone a straight white male (or white female stereotype).

 

[Kingjackl]

I don't care. If he or she is good in the role, then he or she is good in the role. Diversity is never a bad thing, but the previous white male Doctors have all been generally good and the upcoming one is Malcolm Tucker, so we should be in for a good run.

I think the only really important thing is that s/he should always be played by a British actor. It's just too iconic a British role to go to anyone else.

 

[The_Echo]

I'm also rather amused at the notion that a black actor might deprive us of the 'best' actor for the role. The image in my mind is that people believe there is one mystical person out there who is objectively best for a role. I'm sure at any given moment there are numerous phenomenally talented people available for the role, and I doubt that there's any actual shortage of non-white (or non-male) actors who fit there, so this concern for the show seems like a thin veneer.

I mean, that's what I was talking about with "diversity for the sake of diversity."

Like how in the US some companies will hire a minority over someone more qualified to fill a quota.

I don't doubt there are plenty of non-whites/non-males out there who could do a mean Doctor, but if I were given the choice between a good black Doctor and a great white Doctor, I would choose the great one. However, the inverse is also true.

Though, maybe the BBC is just afraid to change the Doctor too much. I mean, it has been half a century now...

 

[Battenberg]

I think you have channelled the spirit of OTT PC admirably.

This and then some.

It's not like the show only uses white male actors for all its roles, I think they've done a decent job of having a diverse cast across their many series while consistenly picking the right person for each part. Plus if you're desperate to criticise the show there are many other areas you could focus on (areas I thought this thread would be about based on the title).

Also at least as far as the gender thing goes I'm not sure the doctor can regenerate into different genders? I thought that was part of the reason his companions have predominantly been female, to give some kind of balance.

 

[Thaluikhain]

It's not like the show only uses white male actors for all its roles, I think they've done a decent job of having a diverse cast across their many series

Hey? The show has been overwhelmingly white. They've had one (or two if you count Mickey) black companions in 50 years, everyone else was white (or passed for, in some cases). They've had one companion that was openly not straight (or 3 if you count the lizardwoman and her maid as companions).

 

[Knight Captain Kerr]

I would be lying if I said I wouldn't like to see a non-male and/or non-white doctor for a change. And keep in mind, non-white doesn't necessarily mean black. There are other ethnicities apart from black and white, not that I have an issue with the Doctor being either of those. It is just that for example an Asian doctor, male or female could be interesting.

Also when it comes to the idea of nobody listening to a non-white male doctor, well, people listened to the 6th Doctor and have you seen how he dressed [http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/b1/Sixth_Doctor.jpg/200px-Sixth_Doctor.jpg]?

But really as long as they pick a good actor and remember they are still the Doctor then I don't mind what race or sex they are. Just pick whoever is best for the role. What the Doctor ends up as in regards to race and sex is random. But you could flip a coin 13 times and have it be tails 13 times.

Really the best argument I've heard against a female doctor is that Moffat would be likely to screw it up.

 

[Albino Boo]

I would be lying if I said I wouldn't like to see a non-male and/or non-white doctor for a change. And non-white doesn't necessarily mean black, you could always have an Asian doctor, male or female.

Also when it comes to the idea of nobody listening to a non-white male doctor, well, people listened to the 6th Doctor and have you seen how he dressed [http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/b1/Sixth_Doctor.jpg/200px-Sixth_Doctor.jpg]?

But really as long as they pick a good actor and remember they are still the Doctor then I don't mind what race or sex they are. What the Doctors ends up as in regards to race and sex is random. But you could flip a coin 13 times and have it be tails 13 times.

The 6th Dr is bad choice, he got the job because the then producer, Jonathan Nathan Turner met him at wedding. The 6th Dr is when things started to go down hill.

 

[Knight Captain Kerr]

The 6th Dr is bad choice, he got the job because the then producer, Jonathan Nathan Turner met him at wedding. The 6th Dr is when things started to go down hill.

I don't think Colin Baker was bad. But at the same time I don't think he is many people's favourite. But his clothes are hilarious.

 

[JoJo]

While it's a touch nitpicky, the most recent demographics I've seen say 87, which is less than "over 90%."

Don't know why people need to hypberolise a majority.

Just saying, this is a casual discussion of Doctor Who on a gaming website, not a college dissertation paper. A couple of percentage points here and there doesn't change my argument and it certainly wasn't an attempt at hyperbole.

Okay, seriously. I don't give a crap about the Doctor's sex, but how the hell does it actually serve as an important part of his character?

Males and females aren't the same inside or out, you may feel differently but I've always felt that the Doctor is an inherently male character in the way he thinks and acts and in his relationships with others and so I don't think changing his sex would be a good idea.

 

[BrotherRool]

I want to chime in on the demographic thing. The UK's make-up is really different than the US so it would take some positive-discrimination probably to roll a non-white Doctor. But even more than that, the first different Doctor is 250% more likely to Asian than Black, asian people probably face more racism in the UK too.


The gender thing is pretty bad though, I would like to see that change. It's a pretty common topic but some walls are well worth breaking down, especially since the Doctor would be a perfect role model for young-teenage girls (and already has a big chunk of that demographic). It's been proven that weaknesses in stuff like maths, science and engineering completely go away if women don't expect to be worse and in general they do better in life the more they see active women figures in society and media around them. How well placed is the Doctor to change that sort of belief?

 

[DementedSheep]

While it's a touch nitpicky, the most recent demographics I've seen say 87, which is less than "over 90%."

Don't know why people need to hypberolise a majority.

Just saying, this is a casual discussion of Doctor Who on a gaming website, not a college dissertation paper. A couple of percentage points here and there doesn't change my argument and it certainly wasn't an attempt at hyperbole.

Okay, seriously. I don't give a crap about the Doctor's sex, but how the hell does it actually serve as an important part of his character?

Males and females aren't the same inside or out, you may feel differently but I've always felt that the Doctor is an inherently male character in the way he thinks and acts and in his relationships with others and so I don't think changing his sex would be a good idea.

That a cop out answer. I'm sick of seeing this vague "but men and woman are different" bullshit everytime people don't want a woman to be in a role. It even more stupid here being that his personality changes a bit with each regeneration as well. What specific trait is inherently male about the doctor and unable to be trait of a woman?

 

[Psychobabble]

I honestly couldn't give a shit. My apathy has nothing to do with any positive or negative feelings towards racial or gender diversity, but due to my feelings that the show has become a tired and uninteresting self mockery and should be allowed to die with what little dignity it still retains intact.

My feelings are that the next Doctor could be a microcephalic, hermaphroditic baboon and it wouldn't make one iota of difference as the story lines are nothing but campy nostalgic fan base pandering horse shit. Due to the writer's disinterest to strive to further the show and only exist to justify "look look at how Doctor Who like we're being."

Say what you want about the earlier shoestring budget days of the series, but at least back then the writers had some ideas how to move the show forward and have the universe evolve, rather than the ones today who seem to put the biggest effort into what they can change to make the show stay exactly the same.

 

[Vigormortis]

I'd rather have the most qualified actor for the job. If that means another white male Doctor then so be it.

Pretty much my thoughts as well.

The gender or race of the actor playing the Doctor makes no difference to me. I'm more interested in the producers picking an actor or actress that's not only quite talented but one that can bring something interesting to the role. Someone who can inject their own style, personality, and sense of unique charisma into the character. Those are the only qualities that matter to me.

That said, I'm somewhat disappointed they didn't go with someone like Helen Mirren, Naomie Harris, or Ruth Wilson. They would have made for an interesting change-up in the role. That and I think any of them would have been fanta...sorry, I mean brilliant...as the Doctor.