That's having your cake and eating it. You're fooling yourself, mate.Christopher N said:
You need to make a choice - your belief in god or your common sense, which is rather uncommon these days.
Poll: Evolution Yay or Nah?
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You need to make a choice - your belief in god or your common sense, which is rather uncommon these days.
I find evolution a lot more believable. I takes a scientific stance and doesn't claim to have all the answers. A far better than the hopelessly outdated "a big man did it in 7 days and then never showed his face again".
Yes....that was a gross oversimplification, but i don't care much for theological solutions and dogma. Evolution is not afraid to be proven inaccurate. It does research puts forth it's findings and gives plausible answers. I am aware of course of Christian based "science" and intelligent design. But once again, I'm not a fan of the whole big guy phenomena. Put him on Oprah and then I will consider believing. (Yes i know that Oprah is defunct)
Yes....that was a gross oversimplification, but i don't care much for theological solutions and dogma. Evolution is not afraid to be proven inaccurate. It does research puts forth it's findings and gives plausible answers. I am aware of course of Christian based "science" and intelligent design. But once again, I'm not a fan of the whole big guy phenomena. Put him on Oprah and then I will consider believing. (Yes i know that Oprah is defunct)
I think he has a hard time understanding that all men are equal and that Europeans aren't better than Africans. Or something like that.creationis apostate said:
Africa at the time was the cradle of our species, that's about it. From there we spread to almost every continenet.
Staunch Darwinist here, and Creationists are one of the only groups of people that I have no qualms about making fun of.
I believe in evolution but I am still open to the idea that there is something behind it. Evolution makes logical sense and follows to a logical conclusion. This doesn't mean that there can't be some form of God who got it started seeing as we still don't know exactly where everything came from that caused the big bang.
People don't "believe" in evolution, they agree with it. Evolution is a theory. It is put forward, an outsider looks at it, weighs it on its benefits and either agrees or disagrees with it. I don't see how anyone couldn't look at the theory of evolution along with the associated evidence and disagree with it, it is utterly illogical.
I don't mean to be demeaning to Creationists, (although I don't really care if I am,) but the general "disbelief" in evolution doesn't come from logic or rationality, it comes from flat-out denial, misunderstanding and ignorance. Evolution is far too solid a theory to be cast aside as incorrect, you may as well not believe in gravity.
I don't mean to be demeaning to Creationists, (although I don't really care if I am,) but the general "disbelief" in evolution doesn't come from logic or rationality, it comes from flat-out denial, misunderstanding and ignorance. Evolution is far too solid a theory to be cast aside as incorrect, you may as well not believe in gravity.
So much semantic confusion...
Science doesn't give us absolute truths. There's no way of absolutely objectively proving that the world we live in isn't some matrix style fantasy land. Science tells us what is most likely to be true based on the best available evidence and observations. If new evidence comes to light, scientists change their ideas. That's the greatest strength of science as a process for discerning how the world around us works.
The fact of evolution and the theory are two separate things. Species HAVE changed over time, that's a fact. Much like the fact that things fall to Earth, the fact of gravity. In science a theory isn't some half-baked, diet, evidence-lite version of a fact. In scientific terminology, a theory is BETTER than a fact. A fact is just an observation; a figure, a point of data. A strong theory unites many facts and observations and explains, lays them out in a coherent framework, and most importantly MAKES PREDICTIONS. Darwin's theory of evolution by natural selection explains the many FACTS of evolution (the fossil record, DNA hierarchies, etc). Facts are the flour and eggs that make up the moist, delicious cake that is a well formed theory.
I accept both the obvious fact of evolution and the modern interpretation of Darwin's theory of evolution.
Science doesn't give us absolute truths. There's no way of absolutely objectively proving that the world we live in isn't some matrix style fantasy land. Science tells us what is most likely to be true based on the best available evidence and observations. If new evidence comes to light, scientists change their ideas. That's the greatest strength of science as a process for discerning how the world around us works.
The fact of evolution and the theory are two separate things. Species HAVE changed over time, that's a fact. Much like the fact that things fall to Earth, the fact of gravity. In science a theory isn't some half-baked, diet, evidence-lite version of a fact. In scientific terminology, a theory is BETTER than a fact. A fact is just an observation; a figure, a point of data. A strong theory unites many facts and observations and explains, lays them out in a coherent framework, and most importantly MAKES PREDICTIONS. Darwin's theory of evolution by natural selection explains the many FACTS of evolution (the fossil record, DNA hierarchies, etc). Facts are the flour and eggs that make up the moist, delicious cake that is a well formed theory.
I accept both the obvious fact of evolution and the modern interpretation of Darwin's theory of evolution.
Why is this even a discussion? Before I had access to the internet at home, I had no idea that people stupid enough to believe that creationism is true exist. Ok, maybe I should change stupid to just plain ignorant. But some people just don't want to learn or look at any evidence (which is overwhelming), those people are stupid.
When I hear how people don't even hear about evolution in schools, I just don't get it. How is this possible? This is absolutely ridiculous!
Evolution evidence: Fossil records, DNA, simple observation etc. Creation evidence: NOTHING. And yet people go about calling evolution "just a theory" when they have no idea what that word means. From scientific theories, evolution ranks among the highest for the number of evidence it has. It even has more evidence and is more proven than the Theory of Gravity itself.
I'm sorry but creationism just baffles me and makes my brain hurt for how incredibly stupid it is.
When I hear how people don't even hear about evolution in schools, I just don't get it. How is this possible? This is absolutely ridiculous!
Evolution evidence: Fossil records, DNA, simple observation etc. Creation evidence: NOTHING. And yet people go about calling evolution "just a theory" when they have no idea what that word means. From scientific theories, evolution ranks among the highest for the number of evidence it has. It even has more evidence and is more proven than the Theory of Gravity itself.
I'm sorry but creationism just baffles me and makes my brain hurt for how incredibly stupid it is.
Most of the things that are in the bible are supposed to be taken literally, except for the obvious parables, like the rise of the dead or of the trees in the book of Ezekiel.Nazz3 said:
At the time people didn't understand anything so the bible provided answers. Now that Science gives you answers, the priests sand rabbies say that you shouldn't take the bible literary. Bullshit, when it was written you believed that the world was created in 7 days because the rabbi told you so.
Its more like god wrote the laws dictating how matter behaves during certain conditions. Someone or something created the universe. This is god. Even if its just a process, random chance or whatever. Every system fits inside a bigger system. So who's to say that our universe isnt a system created by god for his vanity? Then again, this discussion is kinda silly ^^* Evolution is very strongly supported by our webs of fact. Disproving it would take a lot of our science with it. The statement god exist isnt related in any way to any scientific web of facts. If he pops up and waves it wouldn't change anything about our science. If he proves not to exist, then thats just another fact we can add to our net. Ofcourse, I'm rather sure the OP is trolling ^^* Or just trying to make a 200 post thread. Either way, religion and science can co-exist. They just have to be nice to eachotherAngloDoom said:
I am just going to mention that technically evolution is not a scientific fact.lawrie001 said:
As a fact is only true or false. But it is a Theory placing it in the same domain as Gravity, mathematics, quantum mechanics and the atomic theory.
If it were fact and we found that something was wrong with it we would be forced to dismiss the rest of it. But as evolution has the status of a theory this is not a problem as we can take into account this new concept and work it in with the rest of the theory. (similar to what would happen if we were to find an object that floated up-ward and not down)
This really is a silly argument.
You'll notice that the only opposition there is to evolution comes from the faith groups. Remove myth and superstition from the equation and there is no reason to oppose it, the evidence that is there is extremely strong, and can't be nullified by simple wish-thinking and/or thinly veiled political ploys.
People might say otherwise on an opinion poll, but when they go to get their vaccinations they seem to be suggesting that they think that Darwin fellow was probably right.
You'll notice that the only opposition there is to evolution comes from the faith groups. Remove myth and superstition from the equation and there is no reason to oppose it, the evidence that is there is extremely strong, and can't be nullified by simple wish-thinking and/or thinly veiled political ploys.
People might say otherwise on an opinion poll, but when they go to get their vaccinations they seem to be suggesting that they think that Darwin fellow was probably right.
My difficulty in fully accepting the Out of Africa theory is that I can't look at an African person, then compare them to all the other variations of human races and get my head around how all of humanity could have solely developed from one pair of common ancestors... it boggles my mind.creationis apostate said:
Even though I understand the evolutionary advantages of developing paler skin in environments with less sunlight or developing an epicanthic fold in the eyes to protect against harsh sunlight and arid air, the idea of an African turning into a Caucasian or Asian solely through environmental factors is something I can't fully grasp... perhaps due to my inability to fully appreciate the timespan involved in Human Evolution.
Another theory that makes more senses to me is the Multi-regional theory of Human Evolution, the notion that our ancestors from Africa interbred with other early Humans from other regions, such as Neanderthals. The idea that although we all share common ancestors from Africa, different humans also share different common ancestors from other parts of the world explains Human variation much more satisfactorily to me.
This being said, I only have a layman's understanding of the theories of Evolution, so no matter which theory, or parts of different theories I believe, I still have to take a lot of it on faith.
Two posts and you already deserve more respect for that than half the Escapist, well done good sir.Jamalam said:
In science, there is no higher tier than theory, because there is always something new to learn the exact specifics of. You actually have to go into mathematics to get anything that can physically possibly be of a higher level of support and importance than a theory. If the entire world knew and accepted this, there would be no support for creationism at all.
I have noticed something, people listen and accept help from those who know what they are talking about, proclaiming their brilliance / intelligence until the moment they disagree with them. People will listen to biologists when it comes down to life saving medicine when it helps them, but when the same level of expertise and knowledge is applied to evolution, suddenly they are deluded. I have seen it myself in debates, some of which I have been in, and people will turn their opinion suddenly simply because they do not like what is being said...