Poll: Health Bar or Regenerating Health, what is your stance on this new trend?
- Thread starter ElArabDeMagnifico
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I agree. I HATED to regenerate system in the later call of duty games, especially in multiplayer, just ruined it for me. While in most games I find myself playing, regenerating health seems like a stupid Idea there are also a LOT of games where it makes sense and makes it overall more fun. It just dependso on the game. I like the system used in medal of honour: airbourne and farcry 2 where if you're injured you take extra "shock" damamaged, on top of regular damage and that will heall up to the top of the next "bar" in your health.EnzoHonda said:
JMeganSnow said:
Before I forget this, fully automatic weapons aren't accurate. That's a given. Firing a gun full auto from the shoulder should cause the fire to angle up and to the right or left, depending on which shoulder it's up against. Blindfiring, the typical means of providing covering fire, should be extremely inaccurate. In Vegas 2 it's very inaccurate. Providing mainly a means of trying to hit a nearby enemy who you don't want to expose yourself to.
Vegas 2's AI works kind of like that. You'll have five or six dudes coming at you. As they run and shoot, they'll be highly inaccurate, but when they stop for a second they're typically spot on. Next, if you're in cover and they're laying surpressive fire over your head, if you pop up, you die. The only thing you can do is toss a grenade over your head, but if you want to pop out and blast them, you're going to have move or manage to turn on godmode. Unfortunately, once they do start shooting they have a really bad tendency to not stop until their out of ammo in the magazine so you'll be very easy to kill them. But, then again, they have to make it possible for you to win.
It's also a fine example of wasted ammo. You'll find yourself far more lethal on single shot (outside of CQB 'fuck fuck fuck' situations) and enemies go down in a few shots. I'd like to see a FPS with a lot more custom and realistic animations, as the AI characters in Vegas 2 tend to look, well, a bit computerized in their movements.
I wouldn't mind an enemy AI that would focus on it's survival, however it'd make fighting it a bit more difficult if the bastard was too damn cowardly to come out and fight. It might also take a bit of the fun out if every fight just became 'spray at enemy, make him hide, shoot if possible, otherwise move, repeat." The AI would have to be able to know to move up. It would be nice to have such situations where the AI would have a sniper or heavy gunner covering the approach of guys with smaller arms, but it might also get a wee bit old. It's fun fighting stupid AI enemies, becuase, well, their stupid.
It'd be nice to have a tactical shooter wherein enemies have to use real means of communication. If they were close enough they could follow hand signals, other wise they'd need voice commands and if they didn't have radios, the commander would have to yell them out. So if you aced the boss man, someone else would have to take over, or they'd all get confused and lost, or really cowardly.
The system works well in most games it's used in, and I enjoy it in some, but not in others. I don't mind an in-universe explanation like a special super-soldier suit or something, so long as the healing isn't too quick as to make the game easy. Crysis is a nice example, where since you're out in the jungle it doesn't really make sense to stumble upon health kits every few seconds, and your shield power is also used to fuel other special abilities you have. On the other hand, it's completely unwarranted in a game like Call of Duty 4. I don't mind a mild health regeneration, but in that game you literally go from near-dead to just fine in the span of about five seconds. It's ridiculous. I think you should be able to sustain a hit or two before healing up, but a "critical" hit should permanently lower your movement speed, accuracy, etc., similar to Rainbow Six. It would encourage a more realistic sort of play-style with better use of cover and leaning, something I think needs to be emphasised a bit more in the gameplay - there just isn't enough risk to standing in the open. Additionally, Modern Warfare is mostly focused on squad combat. Give the team a medic who can heal you up if you're critically wounded, but make it take several seconds.
I think Far Cry 2 deals with player health really nicely compared to most games, and does a good job of providing health regeneration without it being overpowered. Your health bar is split into segments, which each will refill up to a certain point. You can heal at any point if you have a syrette in your inventory, but they can be limited and will run out in more intense firefights if you're not careful. Critical damage requires a long healing animation to play out, which leaves you very exposed to enemy fire. Having a buddy rescue you on death is pretty cool, too. Overall, probably one of the best health systems I've seen in a game recently. It works well, keeps things flowing quickly, adds a good sense of risk/reward to combat, and leaves you just mortal enough so that you can't go running around like a headless chicken, but can still soak up a reasonable amount of damage. It's also fairly realistic, especially when on higher difficulties you can't take too many direct hits.
I think Far Cry 2 deals with player health really nicely compared to most games, and does a good job of providing health regeneration without it being overpowered. Your health bar is split into segments, which each will refill up to a certain point. You can heal at any point if you have a syrette in your inventory, but they can be limited and will run out in more intense firefights if you're not careful. Critical damage requires a long healing animation to play out, which leaves you very exposed to enemy fire. Having a buddy rescue you on death is pretty cool, too. Overall, probably one of the best health systems I've seen in a game recently. It works well, keeps things flowing quickly, adds a good sense of risk/reward to combat, and leaves you just mortal enough so that you can't go running around like a headless chicken, but can still soak up a reasonable amount of damage. It's also fairly realistic, especially when on higher difficulties you can't take too many direct hits.
Yeah, because we all can access a numerical representation of how resistant we are to physical harm. Jokes aside you are rather accurate if you're comparing to regen health.tthor said:
Anyway, based on all your comments I have a health system in mind that should satisfy everyone. I won't tell you though, I plan to apply it in the future.
Regen health if it makes sense. Regen health would not have worked for a game like Far Cry: Instincts. It would give players the option of just running into the thick of combat and spraying bullets, but since your health could be reduced to zero in about in about 5 rounds, it forced the player to use stealth.
Depends on the game, if you want a really team based game health bars.forces players to act as a team eg medic and damage sponge.) If you want a a game based on the individual, regen as it means you have to be better to win and you can't say well I had low health.
I don't care which, as long as the game isn't too easy, and if it is too easy, it had better be fun.
Agree 100%. Regenerating health can sense for some games (if done sensibly), but not as the standard. I like health bars too, but there is nothing worse than surviving a massive onslaught of goliaths and scrape by with a sliver of health, only to get killed by a aggravated mosquito right after.Fire Daemon said:
On the flip side, regenerating health is a little lame too since all you have to do is hide and wait for a few seconds. Dealing with the consequences of boldly or stupidly facing a barrage of bullets should have more of a tenure than a few moments.
After reading through this a bit, I think there is some confusion about regeneration and health bars(I think this is because people are thinking in terms of the specific games and not the generalized game mechanic element). They really aren't comparable things because they don't have the same purpose. Health regeneration is a mechanism by which the player is able to heal and maintain survivability, as compared to healing items, healing stations, and checkpoints. A health bar, on the other hand, is a mechanism for informing the player of his current survivability, compared to showing number of hit points or qualitative conditioning(such as the screen going bloody with severe damage taken or displaying words like "hurt", "wounded", "badly wounded", or "dying"). Having one does not, by necessity, exclude the other(for instance, you can have a regenerating health bar). So the real questions should be do people prefer seeing a health bar, hit point number, or having some qualitative marker to display their health, and do people prefer healing damage via regeneration, health items, health stations, or checkpoints.
The choice of combination of elements should depend on the design and intent of the game, not a universal fiat. In some cases, regeneration works best for healing, while in others, items work better. In some cases, displaying a health bar works better for reporting status, while in others, hits points or qualitative markers work better. It all depends on the game.
Personally, I like the health bar for displaying current conditioning because, assuming it's prominently displayed, it is the fastest for me to interpret, understand, and build a strategy around; however, I have no real preference about whether my health is healed by regeneration or healing items.
The choice of combination of elements should depend on the design and intent of the game, not a universal fiat. In some cases, regeneration works best for healing, while in others, items work better. In some cases, displaying a health bar works better for reporting status, while in others, hits points or qualitative markers work better. It all depends on the game.
Personally, I like the health bar for displaying current conditioning because, assuming it's prominently displayed, it is the fastest for me to interpret, understand, and build a strategy around; however, I have no real preference about whether my health is healed by regeneration or healing items.
If the game is already easy, then no to regenerating health. If the game is extremely tough, then I'm in favor of it.
Basically, whatever balances the difficulty. For example, Project Snowblind uses a typical health bar system, but it's a Sci-Fi game. While it would make SENSE to use a regen system, the game is too easy to need it. You can carry a massive arsenal of firearms and even cast all kinds of cyberpunk buffs on your character (like limited invincibility or invisibility.)
In contrast, Black also uses a health system. However, it can be ridiculously hard on later difficulties, and your character can only stock 3 medipacks (which each heal half your health), carry 2 guns and store 9 grenades. Considering enemies can each often take an entire clip to take down (without headshotting, I mean), I think the game could have been better with an HP regen system.
Gungrave did the whole Halo 1 thing, and it worked out well. That was a 3rd person shooter, though.
When you get right down to it, any kind of HP system is unrealistic, so devs might as well use the right one for the situation. Whatever the game needs to bring balance, you know? And yeah, the typical health bar system means even the pros will go down over time, but so what? They'll have accrued enough kills in that time to easily rule the roost if they truly WERE pros, and it gives the weaklings hope that they can eventually bring him down if they're willing to lose enough times (which in turn will probably make them better players, because they'll keep learning as they fail). Anyway, there usually are health pickups around, too, if the pro is willing to leave his sniping point and do a little foraging.
Basically, whatever balances the difficulty. For example, Project Snowblind uses a typical health bar system, but it's a Sci-Fi game. While it would make SENSE to use a regen system, the game is too easy to need it. You can carry a massive arsenal of firearms and even cast all kinds of cyberpunk buffs on your character (like limited invincibility or invisibility.)
In contrast, Black also uses a health system. However, it can be ridiculously hard on later difficulties, and your character can only stock 3 medipacks (which each heal half your health), carry 2 guns and store 9 grenades. Considering enemies can each often take an entire clip to take down (without headshotting, I mean), I think the game could have been better with an HP regen system.
Gungrave did the whole Halo 1 thing, and it worked out well. That was a 3rd person shooter, though.
When you get right down to it, any kind of HP system is unrealistic, so devs might as well use the right one for the situation. Whatever the game needs to bring balance, you know? And yeah, the typical health bar system means even the pros will go down over time, but so what? They'll have accrued enough kills in that time to easily rule the roost if they truly WERE pros, and it gives the weaklings hope that they can eventually bring him down if they're willing to lose enough times (which in turn will probably make them better players, because they'll keep learning as they fail). Anyway, there usually are health pickups around, too, if the pro is willing to leave his sniping point and do a little foraging.
Here's my idea, there should be neither health packs or auto-regen but instead you start out with a certain amount of health,displayed in a health bar or elsewhere, and you can not regenerate that health period. No heath packs. No auto-heal. You have to fight through with the limited health until you hit the next checkpoint, placed frequently, where you automatically return to full health. No more searching for health packs and no more annoying waiting in cover. My system could do wonders for a games pacing.
Depends on the game really, if it's a fast-paced shooter, I think regeneration is a must.
However, if we're talking about something like an RPG or something, either slow regeneration or just potions and stuff.
Condemned did this well, hide a few health packs near or after a group of enemies, or just a handy one a few yards back.
However, if we're talking about something like an RPG or something, either slow regeneration or just potions and stuff.
Condemned did this well, hide a few health packs near or after a group of enemies, or just a handy one a few yards back.
Hey guys, I think they should have regenerating ammo. That would make the games totally better!
Wait, even better idea. Let's just get rid of ammo altogether, it's too much of a nuance anyways.
Also, you should be able to use all guns and all skills from the word go. I mean, who wants a challenge in a game anyways?
Wait, even better idea. Let's just get rid of ammo altogether, it's too much of a nuance anyways.
Also, you should be able to use all guns and all skills from the word go. I mean, who wants a challenge in a game anyways?
Yes it could ruin it because people would be spending too much time re-loading levels every time they got shot so much as once.dcheppy said: