Poll: Is rap/hip-hop really bad for kids?

[jpoon]

Rap & hip hop is definitely bad for my ears, so I'm sure somehow it's bad for kids too. They need to be fed a strict diet of rock...and metal!

 

[TehCookie]

P.S: I feel I should mention this woman was probably the whitest person I've ever seen, excluding albinos. Just thought I'd throw that info out there.

Does being pale and hating rap makes it worse than someone who is tan or black? Then I must be one of the worst offenders behind albinos.

Also rap is a terrible influence on kids, it gives them a terrible taste in music.*

*Disclaimer: That is my opinion, and before posting how rap is awesome and try to convince me otherwise, if I posted why I hate rap would it change your opinion? If not, don't bother try to change mine, people are different. Also to clarify I am not saying we should prevent kids from listening to rap.

 

[William Dickbringer]

So Escapists, do you think rap/hip-hop music is really that bad for kids to listen to? Yeah it's not appropriate, obviously, but I don't personally think it's "bad for them". But what do you think.

not really good for kids but then again what is these days the woman needs to get over herself though because there are worst songs out there you could have been listening to some metal music

 

[StriderShinryu]

I wouldn't personally say that it's bad for kids, but I would definitely say that it's not for kids (depending on what the exact content of the exact song is anyway). Just as with any other sort of mature content in any entertainment medium, it should be up to the parent to decide what's appropriate for their children. At 8ish years of age, I would certainly say that most rap is probably not appropriate.

That said, I don't feel the parent in the given scenario really has much to say simply because of the limited and accidental exposure. It's not like the OP waited until she had turned her back and then forced his earbuds into the kids ears then forced him to listen.

 

[Davey Woo]

I'm more worried about the fact that your music was audible to other people, seriously dude, turn it down.

 

[CrazyCapnMorgan]

Is rap bad? Hmm, must consult a comedian about this...

(Warning: Adult language)

(Warning: Adult language...and the mentioning of Elton John)

 

[BonsaiK]

So Escapists, do you think rap/hip-hop music is really that bad for kids to listen to?.

Fuck no. In fact, I think kids should be forced to listen to it in schools and take classes in it (which would be a great way to turn the douchebags off it, come to think of it). Hip-hop as a cultural movement has only blossomed since it came out, and the reason why is because there's a lot of good things people can draw from it.

Firstly it's very egocentric and self-promoting, or to look at it another way it's music that promotes self-esteem and confidence in people who often don't have much of either. Can't count how many times I've given people relationship advice on here that really just boiled down to a self-esteem and confidence issue. Maybe if some of you guys listened to more rap music and read between the lines there a bit, you'd be more emotionally equipped to deal with your personal problems.

Secondly, it's very materialistic music which is important. Most people reading this are probably not lucky enough to live in a society where people get given free food, accomodation and transport. I know I'm certainly not. The sooner young people learn that commerce is important and that in the eyes of many people, money has more value than human life, the better they'll be equipped to deal with the harsh realities of life when they move out of home. Incidentally, most rap doesn't teach you that Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny is real either, although if someone posted an exception in reply to this thread, that would amuse me.

Thirdly, there's a lot of cultural knowledge buried in that stuff. I'm not talking about the "politial" or "conscious" rap (which I think is all puke and those guys should just get into politics and leave music alone), but even the most violent and seemingly socially irresonsible rap music I can think of is loaded with shit which can actually be used to educate people.


There's a bona-fide video for this but it's probably a bit explicit to post here. Search it if you feel like it. Anyway, most people don't even know that what's described in this song is actually a real thing that does happen to thousands of people. He's talking about not just brazen abductions, but being "romatically schemed on" - girls in poor countries will get approached by rich charming foreigners at bars and clubs who will charm their way into a relationship with the girls, then a few months later offer them a trip overseas to see their home country. It looks fine and legit until they're given a fake passport, but by the the girl is usually in way too deep. Once they get there, as the song says "shit flipped" - they instantly become untraceable human slaves with no rights, no freedom and no citizenship. This is a huge problem in Europe right now. Congratulations, you just gained actual useful knowledge about the world you live in from a violent, sexually explicit rap song.

Rap has tremendous power in terms of transmitting cultural knowledge that doesn't get the media spotlight. Here's a more down to earth example of one of the most lyrically "extreme" rappers in the history of the form with some cautionary tales (one per verse) teaching his audience about simple streetwise behaviour that school probably never bothered to tell you:


Rap, bad for kids? No way - fucking MAKE those little shits listen to it, whether they want to or not, that's what I think. I wish my dad was half as switched-on as Ice Cube, would have saved me learning a lot of life's lessons the hard way...

 

[eternal-chaplain]

I will agree that I haven't seen it affect much of our youth drastically, but having three younger siblings all under the age of 13, I feel a bit worried when that kind of music is played to them on the radio on the way home from school.

EDIT: It's really the things the "artists" as they are inappropriately called say or imply doing in a song are mildly disturbing.

 

[noobium]

I don't know about rap being a bad influence but it's about as appealing as listening to someones wet flatulence

 

[campofapproval]

No it's not "bad" for kids. People said the same thing about jazz, and then blues, and then rock and roll, and then punk, and then pop, and then metal, and then.......you get the point. This has been happening throughout music history, a newer genre of music pops up, the older people don't like it being different, they protest it.

well jazz artists (despite being involved w/ some shady subcultures) don't tend to verbally advocate things like rape or killing that ************ who's out to get me in their songs. lots of rappers condone (or at least depict) shitty poor people drug culture and tony montana shit, much like a lot of black metal dudes talk about nazi bullshit and do a lot of tremolo picking to blast beats. it'd be safe to assume random moms would hate both roughly the same for similar reasons.

Well you can't just say it's a rap thing. There's ton of death metal that talks about suicide and killing people. And 40-50 years ago when Black Sabbath was talking about the Devil that was today's equivalent of condoning murder in the eyes of the older generation. You can't just generalize rap music into talking about murder and gang wars. That's just the stuff that sold based on the principle of controversy

if you read the rest of my post you'd know i wasn't just saying it's a "rap thing." and i was just giving those things as examples. i said a lot of rappers have condoned (or at least have not outright condemned) terrible acts in their lyrics; it is what it is. there's this thing called context that i don't think you're getting here; rather than discussing the minutia of what i didn't leave out in my comprehensive thesis statement, i made the point that there haven't been big movements of jazz or blues musicians expressing ideas that espouse really shitty things (that have always been shitty things, like, say, shooting public servants or, once again, rape) as an essential component of the product they sell. a lot of punk subgenres back shitty shit and a lot of metal does too (though black sabbath, if anything, was AGAINST devil worship if you knew what they were talking about.) there is much to be said about shock value selling records, but what has made rap, metal or punk successful has little in common with jazz, blues or soul in that regard.

 

[Regular Guy]

So much ignorance/blind hatred toward rap/hip hop here. I would have thought a community that thinks itself more mature than other forums would be more open-minded.

 

[campofapproval]

So Escapists, do you think rap/hip-hop music is really that bad for kids to listen to?.

Fuck no. In fact, I think kids should be forced to listen to it in schools and take classes in it (which would be a great way to turn the douchebags off it, come to think of it). Hip-hop as a cultural movement has only blossomed since it came out, and the reason why is because there's a lot of good things people can draw from it.

Firstly it's very egocentric and self-promoting, or to look at it another way it's music that promotes self-esteem and confidence in people who often don't have much of either. Can't count how many times I've given people relationship advice on here that really just boiled down to a self-esteem and confidence issue. Maybe if some of you guys listened to more rap music and read between the lines there a bit, you'd be more emotionally equipped to deal with your personal problems.

Secondly, it's very materialistic music which is important. Most people reading this are probably not lucky enough to live in a society where people get given free food, accomodation and transport. I know I'm certainly not. The sooner young people learn that commerce is important and that in the eyes of many people, money has more value than human life, the better they'll be equipped to deal with the harsh realities of life when they move out of home. Incidentally, most rap doesn't teach you that Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny is real either, although if someone posted an exception in reply to this thread, that would amuse me.

Thirdly, there's a lot of cultural knowledge buried in that stuff. I'm not talking about the "politial" or "conscious" rap (which I think is all puke and those guys should just get into politics and leave music alone), but even the most violent and seemingly socially irresonsible rap music I can think of is loaded with shit which can actually be used to educate people.


There's a bona-fide video for this but it's probably a bit explicit to post here. Search it if you feel like it. Anyway, most people don't even know that what's described in this song is actually a real thing that does happen to thousands of people. He's talking about not just brazen abductions, but being "romatically schemed on" - girls in poor countries will get approached by rich charming foreigners at bars and clubs who will charm their way into a relationship with the girls, then a few months later offer them a trip overseas to see their home country. It looks fine and legit until they're given a fake passport, but by the the girl is usually in way too deep. Once they get there, as the song says "shit flipped" - they instantly become untraceable human slaves with no rights, no freedom and no citizenship. This is a huge problem in Europe right now. Congratulations, you just gained actual useful knowledge about the world you live in from a violent, sexually explicit rap song.

Rap has tremendous power in terms of transmitting cultural knowledge that doesn't get the media spotlight. Here's a more down to earth example of one of the most lyrically "extreme" rappers in the history of the form with some cautionary tales (one per verse) teaching his audience about simple streetwise behaviour that school probably never bothered to tell you:


Rap, bad for kids? No way - fucking MAKE those little shits listen to it, whether they want to or not, that's what I think. I wish my dad was half as switched-on as Ice Cube, would have saved me learning a lot of life's lessons the hard way...

this is nice and all, but it boils down to a clever way of trying to ignore all the negative messages a lot of more modern hip-hop expresses and gleaning a couple "good" points out of it. the op's question is clearly a loaded question, but teaching questionable "values" out of the ones you named is sketchy at best. i don't mean this in a moralistic way (nor am i dissing a type of music i myself enjoy immensely) by any means but it'd be like feeding out of a dumpster cause someone might've thrown out something still fresh. it's a hard sell to say this is particularly worthwhile in, say, a k-12 context when there's plenty of other media that express the same concerns (sex slavery awareness for instance) but in a more efficient and less potentially offensive way.

 

[campofapproval]

So much ignorance/blind hatred toward rap/hip hop here. I would have thought a community that thinks itself more mature than other forums would be more open-minded.

care to elaborate? you're not contributing much to the discussion by just attacking everyone in the room willy-nilly for not liking music you happen to like.

 

[BonsaiK]

this is nice and all, but it boils down to a clever way of trying to ignore all the negative messages a lot of more modern hip-hop expresses and gleaning a couple "good" points out of it. the op's question is clearly a loaded question, but teaching questionable "values" out of the ones you named is sketchy at best. i don't mean this in a moralistic way (nor am i dissing a type of music i myself enjoy immensely) by any means but it'd be like feeding out of a dumpster cause someone might've thrown out something still fresh. it's a hard sell to say this is particularly worthwhile in, say, a k-12 context when there's plenty of other media that express the same concerns (sex slavery awareness for instance) but in a more efficient and less potentially offensive way.

Yeah there are many ways you can make people aware of things like (for example) sex slavery but the big question is how do you get kids to actually fucking listen? The answer is, instead of giving them an assignment or a textbook, you present your message in a format that actually appeals to them, where they want to listen.

Fuck "moralism", people can make up their own minds about what is good or bad - rap is, and always has been - more about sharing information than sharing moral values. That's why it's good. As soon as I hear some stupid singer telling me right from wrong in a song, I want that singer to fuck off and die. Rather, I'd prefer that the artist present their point of view and let me decide right from wrong for myself.

Sure, this format may offend parents or whatever - but that's okay, the music isn't for them anyway.

 

[campofapproval]

this is nice and all, but it boils down to a clever way of trying to ignore all the negative messages a lot of more modern hip-hop expresses and gleaning a couple "good" points out of it. the op's question is clearly a loaded question, but teaching questionable "values" out of the ones you named is sketchy at best. i don't mean this in a moralistic way (nor am i dissing a type of music i myself enjoy immensely) by any means but it'd be like feeding out of a dumpster cause someone might've thrown out something still fresh. it's a hard sell to say this is particularly worthwhile in, say, a k-12 context when there's plenty of other media that express the same concerns (sex slavery awareness for instance) but in a more efficient and less potentially offensive way.

Yeah there are many ways you can make people aware of things like (for example) sex slavery but the big question is how do you get kids to actually fucking listen? The answer is, instead of giving them an assignment or a textbook, you present your message in a format that actually appeals to them, where they want to listen.

Fuck "moralism", people can make up their own minds about what is good or bad - rap is, and always has been - more about sharing information than sharing moral values. That's why it's good. As soon as I hear some stupid singer telling me right from wrong in a song, I want that singer to fuck off and die. Rather, I'd prefer that the artist present their point of view and let me decide right from wrong for myself.

Sure, this format may offend parents or whatever - but that's okay, the music isn't for them anyway.

i'm saying a lot of the same music that presents information on this is a) incomplete, b) part of a presentation that doesn't necessarily exist specifically to inform and is c) in reality not going to exist SOLELY to inform on social issues without coming off wack as fuck. you can argue finding a way to "connect with the kids" but that still doesn't mean rap music has any more place in schools than students against drunk driving should be pushing shitty straight edge hardcore punk bands at kids during school assemblies.
i agree there's real analysis to be made from hip-hop but there's also a lot of extraneous shit that only serves to distract in a primary/secondary school classroom. oftentimes the latter exists joined to the former, sort of like the matrix films and discussions about, say, religion.

 

[bushwhacker2k]

Nope. Everyone knows the difference between right and wrong if you do something wrong that is your fault and no one elses.

Funnily enough, I don't think everyone does.

In psychology I've learned that the way people become and act are a result of their environment and their genes. Not everyone turns out okay.

It's probably bad for kids the way drugs, cigarettes, alcohol and swearing are, or at least some rap, I don't listen to nearly enough to judge rap as a whole. I don't like most rap of today but I do occasionally listen to Outkast and Run DMC.

 

[campofapproval]

Nope. Everyone knows the difference between right and wrong if you do something wrong that is your fault and no one elses.

Funnily enough, I don't think everyone does.

In psychology I've learned that the way people become and act are a result of their environment and their genes. Not everyone turns out okay.

It's probably bad for kids the way drugs, cigarettes, alcohol and swearing are, or at least some rap, I don't listen to nearly enough to judge rap as a whole. I don't like most rap of today but I do occasionally listen to Outkast and Run DMC.

i think that might be oversimplifying. as a society to a certain degree we HAVE to operate under the assumption people know what's "right" and "wrong". things/actions that only serve to perpetuate social ills rather than do anything to solve them or analyze them are typically shunned if not outright banned. i don't really get how swearing fits into the same categories as alcohol/tobacco considering the latter two aren't defined by one's language/culture as much as things that are fundamentally addictive and/or chemically-altering. it's like lumping in thinking about women's boobies into a category with violent crime.

 

[hexFrank202]

I think it is generally considered rude to have your music playing loud in certain public areas. So I would said they are both wrong. If he kept to himself, he wouldn't have someone else's opinion to defend against. I think that is called karma, or cause-and-effect.
Also, she may have a valid point. At the end of the day she is guardian to the child and decided how to look after him/her. Can you blame her? Most mainstream rap has strong/mature content and she doesn't agree with it. Yeah, when the kid is a bit older... who the fuck cares.

He was playing it on headphones, and they accidently popped out. So he says...