Poll: Is treating women in Gentlemanly way Sexist?

[theultimateend]

So, afew people on here have called me sexist. What for? For suggesting that men treat women in a gentlemanly manner. Now, I can see that too a certain extent, like the whole "The world is unsafe for women, So I will keep you away from the world" style of gentleman-re IS sexist. However, what I was refering too was holding the door open for a women, pulling out her chair for her, offering her your jacket if it is cold, things like that. THAT is what I fail to see as being sexist.

So escapist, does the fact I want to be a gentleman make me sexist?

Yes.

Doesn't mean it is bad.

Treating women special or women treating men special is perfectly fine.

It's when you are treating them like shit for being women then it is bad.

Just like racism, if people want to give me backrubs because I'm white I'll never be up in arms demanding they stop being racist towards me.

Nobody does though...I wish this was a common racist thing .

If chivalry is considered sexist, then I truly have lost all respect for society. I'm not saying one sex is better than another, and as far as rights go we should all be equal, but when it comes to social etiquette, a man should always be more respectful of a woman. It's not sexism, it's just how we should act.

Sexism and Racism are treating people special for either reason. Special doesn't necessarily mean good or bad.

Society has kinda butchered these terms, I hope the official definition doesn't end up being "negative" treatment because then "reverse racism" will suddenly be a real word and frankly...I love language and new language but that sounds batshit stupid.

 

[tensorproduct]

It matters because if you think it's sexist for a man to only hire women to be a babysitter or a secretary, than you must also think it's sexist for a woman to only hire men to move furniture or be a security guard. I, however, don't think either one is sexist.

(emphasis mine)
Your argument seems to be based on inherent gender differences making members of one demographic less capable of certain tasks than others. I think that I've seen or can guess at your reasoning behind babysitting, furniture moving and guarding security, but I wonder if you could explain what feminine trait makes for better secretaries?

It's so nice to get such a fair and reasonable question proposed in such a fair and reasonable way.....Mortai Gravesend can learn a thing or two.

I would imagine that women are better at organization. I would also assume that they're better at dealing with people.....communication, empathy, that sort of thing.

This argument implies that women would be better at... almost everything. Or at least at almost everything that would require the assistance of a secretary. Communication, empathy and organizational skills are the most important parts of any commercial endeavour. So, do you think that it would be sexist for businesses to simply cease hiring men?

Some people might think it's sexist of me to say, but there's also the fact that most men would prefer to be greeted by a woman for the reason of physical attractiveness. On the flip side though, I have no problem with an office that deals with a demographic of mostly women employing an attractive male as a secretary.

Given how many more women there would be in business under this plan, I think that hot guys had better start working on their typing skills!

 

[Sunrider]

You should change the name of this thread to "Loaded Questions - The Thread".

OT: No, it's not sexist. Sexism is a word generally loaded with negativity, and this is not something negative. People who think it is just seems like people who want the door opened for them.

I think that this argument is extremely silly. If a woman calls you put on holding a door open for her than use that for a jumping off point about all the real sexism she in all likelihood experiences. If she just gets annoyed and storms off in a huff, she probably shouldn't be throwing a fit over you holding a door open for her.

If class has become sexist, then I am becoming a misanthrope.

People need to lighten the hell up and enjoy life.

I feel like we can be friends!

 

[Slayer_2]

"Sexism" is usually a negative term, and while you are treating someone better because they are in possession of a vagina, it is not a "bad" thing, in my eyes. We aren't identical, despite what some activists might seem to think.

 

[Thyunda]

OT: no it's not sexist , it's being fucking nice . Can't a man be nice to a woman without being called sexist ? Fine , i'ma start slamming doors in their faces , let them freeze if it's cold and not give them a hand if they ask for help . Theres your equality.

So is that how you usually treat men? Because if you bothered to read at all the reason its sexist is that it treats them differently for no real reason. Gender being irrelevant to door opening and shit, thus not a real reason.

You...actually make me ill. There's no other word for it. I feel the poetic flair in my heart dying every time I read something you say.

OT: Yeah it's sexist. By...definition it's sexist. But I couldn't care less. I'm a gentleman and I'm damn proud of it. Not sure why this is such an issue with people. Gentlemanship, as you call it, is one of the things that makes life for living and not for existing.

It makes you ill that I say it's sexist and imply the obvious, that sexism is bad? I don't see why that idea is so terrible to some people. Sexism is unjustified and bad. How threatening. I don't see why it would be something that makes life worth living.

In the same way that nettles hurt my ass but nettle soup tastes pretty good.

Yes, because sexism tastes great in soup. Discriminating towards people just gets such a horrible rap for no reason. Yeah.

Your capacity for metaphor is astounding.

Your analogy was rather empty. There was no real link to the actual situation and why it would be comparable to nettle soup as opposed to nettles in your ass.

Sexism is the nettles.
Gentlemanship is the soup.

Did the bold parts turn invisible when you tried to read my post or are you just deliberately ignoring them?

Sorry I gave you credit for intelligence you apparently don't have.

So sexism as a whole is a bad thing. Like nettles as a whole are quite painful.

However. If you choose the right parts and boil them just right, mix 'em with some other nice things and you get good-tasting soup. Gentlemanship is taking the right parts of a bad thing, mixing them with common decency and good manners, and turning it into a fairly good thing.

Are you getting the picture now?

You seem to be missing the part where you actually show that it is a good thing. You know, the part that would actually validate the analogy.

Well I never met a girl who didn't like to have her chair pulled out for her, or to have the door held open for her. Y'know? Something to make her feel a little special, even if it IS just a tiny thing.

Well the topic already has examples of some girls not liking it so... Also not sure why liking sexism would be good.

And on the flipside - I don't know many guys who appreciate another guy making them feel special.

Well I do. But. I tend not to take them out to dinner.

Why exactly does this need to be about making someone feel special? Are you doing it to flirt with every girl you meet or something?

Yes. Kinda. Not intentionally. Like, I'm not doing it to flirt, but it comes as naturally as flirting.

Comes as naturally isn't the same thing. Either you're claiming your behavior is sexually based like flirting you're denying it.

And I just like making people smile. Terribly sorry that this doesn't fit into your perfect world.

Yes, with sexism. I'm sure the leader of the KKK would smile if I made a racist joke about Obama.

AND. Wait. What was that other thing? Oh yeah - some girls not liking it. Yeah, well, I accidentally flirt with some guys, doesn't make me gay. The minority does not prove the majority.

A poor example since that isn't what makes someone gay.

Wait, why is flirting sexually based? Are you that socially dense?

And no. It's...you're an idiot. I have tried to be polite about this, but now you're comparing being nice to a girl to making racist jokes with the KKK. I've never had a complaint out there in the real world.

Or in here. Just you. Just...you. You fucking robot.

And I'm fairly sure if I flirted exclusively with guys I would actually be gay.

If you flirted exclusively with guys that would not make you gay. It'd be a hint you were, but that isn't how it is defined.

The rest of your post... that's not for me to deal with.

Yeah, that's a hint at being reported. Well if you don't want to be criticised for your behaviour, stop behaving like it.

Hm? I'm just expecting it to remain civil enough. I can't exactly reply as I'd like so I only have one thing to resort to.

Your view doesn't make any sense. It's the view of somebody whose concept of society is from their bedroom window with a news story about rape on the TV. Like...we're all supposed to be identical. That's just not right.

No, it really isn't. You're not supposed to be identical. Give me a break. Since when was gender the only difference in people? If anything you would sound like you're expecting us to be pretty identical if you think treating genders the same would result in that. As if that was our major defining difference from one another.

You're asking us to treat each other identically, not equally.

 

[theultimateend]

Some people might think it's sexist of me to say, but there's also the fact that most men would prefer to be greeted by a woman for the reason of physical attractiveness. On the flip side though, I have no problem with an office that deals with a demographic of mostly women employing an attractive male as a secretary.

Given how many more women there would be in business under this plan, I think that hot guys had better start working on their typing skills!

I enjoy pretty people, get a sexy male secretary at our office and I'd be just as happy to see them as a sexy female one.

Then again I'm married so its not like my odds of getting down with either is any different. That might play a part.

Once you take out the sex aspect of both genders the beauty of either side becomes more or less equally valid. But that might just be me, I have a weird way of looking at the world I suppose.

 

[Joccaren]

If chivalry is considered sexist, then I truly have lost all respect for society. I'm not saying one sex is better than another, and as far as rights go we should all be equal, but when it comes to social etiquette, a man should always be more respectful of a woman. It's not sexism, it's just how we should act.

I disagree. A man should always be more respectful to everyone he meets, same for women. Women are no more deserving of your respect than your fellow man. Likewise, men are no more deserving of your respect than a woman.
Its not the death of Chivalry per se - but its extending it to everyone, rather than just women. If you're trying to flirt with a woman - sure, be nicer to her than to other people. If its a situation with a person standing outside a door, and if its a woman you'll open it for them, but if its a man you'll leave them to open it themselves - I see that as wrong.

If you can give a good and reasonable explanation for why we must treat women as more important - go for it. Saying "Its just how we should act" is like saying all women should stay in the kitchen as "Its just how they should act". Old cultural stereotypes aren't necessarily valid in the present day - no matter which side they favour.

 

[Thyunda]

OT: no it's not sexist , it's being fucking nice . Can't a man be nice to a woman without being called sexist ? Fine , i'ma start slamming doors in their faces , let them freeze if it's cold and not give them a hand if they ask for help . Theres your equality.

So is that how you usually treat men? Because if you bothered to read at all the reason its sexist is that it treats them differently for no real reason. Gender being irrelevant to door opening and shit, thus not a real reason.

You...actually make me ill. There's no other word for it. I feel the poetic flair in my heart dying every time I read something you say.

OT: Yeah it's sexist. By...definition it's sexist. But I couldn't care less. I'm a gentleman and I'm damn proud of it. Not sure why this is such an issue with people. Gentlemanship, as you call it, is one of the things that makes life for living and not for existing.

It makes you ill that I say it's sexist and imply the obvious, that sexism is bad? I don't see why that idea is so terrible to some people. Sexism is unjustified and bad. How threatening. I don't see why it would be something that makes life worth living.

In the same way that nettles hurt my ass but nettle soup tastes pretty good.

Yes, because sexism tastes great in soup. Discriminating towards people just gets such a horrible rap for no reason. Yeah.

Your capacity for metaphor is astounding.

Your analogy was rather empty. There was no real link to the actual situation and why it would be comparable to nettle soup as opposed to nettles in your ass.

Sexism is the nettles.
Gentlemanship is the soup.

Did the bold parts turn invisible when you tried to read my post or are you just deliberately ignoring them?

Sorry I gave you credit for intelligence you apparently don't have.

So sexism as a whole is a bad thing. Like nettles as a whole are quite painful.

However. If you choose the right parts and boil them just right, mix 'em with some other nice things and you get good-tasting soup. Gentlemanship is taking the right parts of a bad thing, mixing them with common decency and good manners, and turning it into a fairly good thing.

Are you getting the picture now?

You seem to be missing the part where you actually show that it is a good thing. You know, the part that would actually validate the analogy.

Well I never met a girl who didn't like to have her chair pulled out for her, or to have the door held open for her. Y'know? Something to make her feel a little special, even if it IS just a tiny thing.

Well the topic already has examples of some girls not liking it so... Also not sure why liking sexism would be good.

And on the flipside - I don't know many guys who appreciate another guy making them feel special.

Well I do. But. I tend not to take them out to dinner.

Why exactly does this need to be about making someone feel special? Are you doing it to flirt with every girl you meet or something?

Yes. Kinda. Not intentionally. Like, I'm not doing it to flirt, but it comes as naturally as flirting.

Comes as naturally isn't the same thing. Either you're claiming your behavior is sexually based like flirting you're denying it.

And I just like making people smile. Terribly sorry that this doesn't fit into your perfect world.

Yes, with sexism. I'm sure the leader of the KKK would smile if I made a racist joke about Obama.

AND. Wait. What was that other thing? Oh yeah - some girls not liking it. Yeah, well, I accidentally flirt with some guys, doesn't make me gay. The minority does not prove the majority.

A poor example since that isn't what makes someone gay.

Wait, why is flirting sexually based? Are you that socially dense?

And no. It's...you're an idiot. I have tried to be polite about this, but now you're comparing being nice to a girl to making racist jokes with the KKK. I've never had a complaint out there in the real world.

Or in here. Just you. Just...you. You fucking robot.

And I'm fairly sure if I flirted exclusively with guys I would actually be gay.

If you flirted exclusively with guys that would not make you gay. It'd be a hint you were, but that isn't how it is defined.

The rest of your post... that's not for me to deal with.

Yeah, that's a hint at being reported. Well if you don't want to be criticised for your behaviour, stop behaving like it.

Hm? I'm just expecting it to remain civil enough. I can't exactly reply as I'd like so I only have one thing to resort to.

Your view doesn't make any sense. It's the view of somebody whose concept of society is from their bedroom window with a news story about rape on the TV. Like...we're all supposed to be identical. That's just not right.

No, it really isn't. You're not supposed to be identical. Give me a break. Since when was gender the only difference in people? If anything you would sound like you're expecting us to be pretty identical if you think treating genders the same would result in that. As if that was our major defining difference from one another.

You're asking us to treat each other identically, not equally.

As opposed to separate but 'equal' treatment? Well gee, if you can show actual equality there maybe you'd have an argument.

You can't even define equality without resorting to identical treatment.

 

[Thyunda]

OT: no it's not sexist , it's being fucking nice . Can't a man be nice to a woman without being called sexist ? Fine , i'ma start slamming doors in their faces , let them freeze if it's cold and not give them a hand if they ask for help . Theres your equality.

So is that how you usually treat men? Because if you bothered to read at all the reason its sexist is that it treats them differently for no real reason. Gender being irrelevant to door opening and shit, thus not a real reason.

You...actually make me ill. There's no other word for it. I feel the poetic flair in my heart dying every time I read something you say.

OT: Yeah it's sexist. By...definition it's sexist. But I couldn't care less. I'm a gentleman and I'm damn proud of it. Not sure why this is such an issue with people. Gentlemanship, as you call it, is one of the things that makes life for living and not for existing.

It makes you ill that I say it's sexist and imply the obvious, that sexism is bad? I don't see why that idea is so terrible to some people. Sexism is unjustified and bad. How threatening. I don't see why it would be something that makes life worth living.

In the same way that nettles hurt my ass but nettle soup tastes pretty good.

Yes, because sexism tastes great in soup. Discriminating towards people just gets such a horrible rap for no reason. Yeah.

Your capacity for metaphor is astounding.

Your analogy was rather empty. There was no real link to the actual situation and why it would be comparable to nettle soup as opposed to nettles in your ass.

Sexism is the nettles.
Gentlemanship is the soup.

Did the bold parts turn invisible when you tried to read my post or are you just deliberately ignoring them?

Sorry I gave you credit for intelligence you apparently don't have.

So sexism as a whole is a bad thing. Like nettles as a whole are quite painful.

However. If you choose the right parts and boil them just right, mix 'em with some other nice things and you get good-tasting soup. Gentlemanship is taking the right parts of a bad thing, mixing them with common decency and good manners, and turning it into a fairly good thing.

Are you getting the picture now?

You seem to be missing the part where you actually show that it is a good thing. You know, the part that would actually validate the analogy.

Well I never met a girl who didn't like to have her chair pulled out for her, or to have the door held open for her. Y'know? Something to make her feel a little special, even if it IS just a tiny thing.

Well the topic already has examples of some girls not liking it so... Also not sure why liking sexism would be good.

And on the flipside - I don't know many guys who appreciate another guy making them feel special.

Well I do. But. I tend not to take them out to dinner.

Why exactly does this need to be about making someone feel special? Are you doing it to flirt with every girl you meet or something?

Yes. Kinda. Not intentionally. Like, I'm not doing it to flirt, but it comes as naturally as flirting.

Comes as naturally isn't the same thing. Either you're claiming your behavior is sexually based like flirting you're denying it.

And I just like making people smile. Terribly sorry that this doesn't fit into your perfect world.

Yes, with sexism. I'm sure the leader of the KKK would smile if I made a racist joke about Obama.

AND. Wait. What was that other thing? Oh yeah - some girls not liking it. Yeah, well, I accidentally flirt with some guys, doesn't make me gay. The minority does not prove the majority.

A poor example since that isn't what makes someone gay.

Wait, why is flirting sexually based? Are you that socially dense?

And no. It's...you're an idiot. I have tried to be polite about this, but now you're comparing being nice to a girl to making racist jokes with the KKK. I've never had a complaint out there in the real world.

Or in here. Just you. Just...you. You fucking robot.

And I'm fairly sure if I flirted exclusively with guys I would actually be gay.

If you flirted exclusively with guys that would not make you gay. It'd be a hint you were, but that isn't how it is defined.

The rest of your post... that's not for me to deal with.

Yeah, that's a hint at being reported. Well if you don't want to be criticised for your behaviour, stop behaving like it.

Hm? I'm just expecting it to remain civil enough. I can't exactly reply as I'd like so I only have one thing to resort to.

Your view doesn't make any sense. It's the view of somebody whose concept of society is from their bedroom window with a news story about rape on the TV. Like...we're all supposed to be identical. That's just not right.

No, it really isn't. You're not supposed to be identical. Give me a break. Since when was gender the only difference in people? If anything you would sound like you're expecting us to be pretty identical if you think treating genders the same would result in that. As if that was our major defining difference from one another.

You're asking us to treat each other identically, not equally.

As opposed to separate but 'equal' treatment? Well gee, if you can show actual equality there maybe you'd have an argument.

You can't even define equality without resorting to identical treatment.

I'll note that you have yet to actually show how it is equal.

Because it's a nice thing to do. You don't need to justify nice things. They are their own justification.

 

[The Good Doctor]

Because it's a nice thing to do. You don't need to justify nice things. They are their own justification.

Yeah, seriously, whatever happened to being nice to someone? I don't see why anyone would have a problem with someone else being nice to them.

Seriously, wtf?

 

[shintakie10]

So, we're supposed to treat both genders completely equal, right? It doesn't tend to work that way in the real world. You nipple-twist a male, it hurts like hell. You nipple-twist a female, you get sexual harassment charges.

You realize that a male can just as easily file charges for sexual harassment under those circumstances...right? If someone I didn't know did that to me, I'd file charges in a heartbeat whether they were male or female. If it was someone I knew I'd probably just get pissed off.

 

[Thyunda]

OT: no it's not sexist , it's being fucking nice . Can't a man be nice to a woman without being called sexist ? Fine , i'ma start slamming doors in their faces , let them freeze if it's cold and not give them a hand if they ask for help . Theres your equality.

So is that how you usually treat men? Because if you bothered to read at all the reason its sexist is that it treats them differently for no real reason. Gender being irrelevant to door opening and shit, thus not a real reason.

You...actually make me ill. There's no other word for it. I feel the poetic flair in my heart dying every time I read something you say.

OT: Yeah it's sexist. By...definition it's sexist. But I couldn't care less. I'm a gentleman and I'm damn proud of it. Not sure why this is such an issue with people. Gentlemanship, as you call it, is one of the things that makes life for living and not for existing.

It makes you ill that I say it's sexist and imply the obvious, that sexism is bad? I don't see why that idea is so terrible to some people. Sexism is unjustified and bad. How threatening. I don't see why it would be something that makes life worth living.

In the same way that nettles hurt my ass but nettle soup tastes pretty good.

Yes, because sexism tastes great in soup. Discriminating towards people just gets such a horrible rap for no reason. Yeah.

Your capacity for metaphor is astounding.

Your analogy was rather empty. There was no real link to the actual situation and why it would be comparable to nettle soup as opposed to nettles in your ass.

Sexism is the nettles.
Gentlemanship is the soup.

Did the bold parts turn invisible when you tried to read my post or are you just deliberately ignoring them?

Sorry I gave you credit for intelligence you apparently don't have.

So sexism as a whole is a bad thing. Like nettles as a whole are quite painful.

However. If you choose the right parts and boil them just right, mix 'em with some other nice things and you get good-tasting soup. Gentlemanship is taking the right parts of a bad thing, mixing them with common decency and good manners, and turning it into a fairly good thing.

Are you getting the picture now?

You seem to be missing the part where you actually show that it is a good thing. You know, the part that would actually validate the analogy.

Well I never met a girl who didn't like to have her chair pulled out for her, or to have the door held open for her. Y'know? Something to make her feel a little special, even if it IS just a tiny thing.

Well the topic already has examples of some girls not liking it so... Also not sure why liking sexism would be good.

And on the flipside - I don't know many guys who appreciate another guy making them feel special.

Well I do. But. I tend not to take them out to dinner.

Why exactly does this need to be about making someone feel special? Are you doing it to flirt with every girl you meet or something?

Yes. Kinda. Not intentionally. Like, I'm not doing it to flirt, but it comes as naturally as flirting.

Comes as naturally isn't the same thing. Either you're claiming your behavior is sexually based like flirting you're denying it.

And I just like making people smile. Terribly sorry that this doesn't fit into your perfect world.

Yes, with sexism. I'm sure the leader of the KKK would smile if I made a racist joke about Obama.

AND. Wait. What was that other thing? Oh yeah - some girls not liking it. Yeah, well, I accidentally flirt with some guys, doesn't make me gay. The minority does not prove the majority.

A poor example since that isn't what makes someone gay.

Wait, why is flirting sexually based? Are you that socially dense?

And no. It's...you're an idiot. I have tried to be polite about this, but now you're comparing being nice to a girl to making racist jokes with the KKK. I've never had a complaint out there in the real world.

Or in here. Just you. Just...you. You fucking robot.

And I'm fairly sure if I flirted exclusively with guys I would actually be gay.

If you flirted exclusively with guys that would not make you gay. It'd be a hint you were, but that isn't how it is defined.

The rest of your post... that's not for me to deal with.

Yeah, that's a hint at being reported. Well if you don't want to be criticised for your behaviour, stop behaving like it.

Hm? I'm just expecting it to remain civil enough. I can't exactly reply as I'd like so I only have one thing to resort to.

Your view doesn't make any sense. It's the view of somebody whose concept of society is from their bedroom window with a news story about rape on the TV. Like...we're all supposed to be identical. That's just not right.

No, it really isn't. You're not supposed to be identical. Give me a break. Since when was gender the only difference in people? If anything you would sound like you're expecting us to be pretty identical if you think treating genders the same would result in that. As if that was our major defining difference from one another.

You're asking us to treat each other identically, not equally.

As opposed to separate but 'equal' treatment? Well gee, if you can show actual equality there maybe you'd have an argument.

You can't even define equality without resorting to identical treatment.

I'll note that you have yet to actually show how it is equal.

Because it's a nice thing to do. You don't need to justify nice things. They are their own justification.

If you want to claim it is equal, then yeah you kind of do need to justify it. If I help up exclusively white dudes who fell down and ignore black dudes, well that's nice for the white guys but it isn't equal and its niceness doesn't absolve it from needing an explanation.

Well no, helping the inconvenienced/unfortunate/injured is universal. It's more of...holding the door open for white middle class men and ignoring it for Pakistani lower-class teenagers. It's not a societal obligation to actually do it, and nobody really has the right to tell you that you're wrong for being picky.

 

[Thyunda]

OT: no it's not sexist , it's being fucking nice . Can't a man be nice to a woman without being called sexist ? Fine , i'ma start slamming doors in their faces , let them freeze if it's cold and not give them a hand if they ask for help . Theres your equality.

So is that how you usually treat men? Because if you bothered to read at all the reason its sexist is that it treats them differently for no real reason. Gender being irrelevant to door opening and shit, thus not a real reason.

You...actually make me ill. There's no other word for it. I feel the poetic flair in my heart dying every time I read something you say.

OT: Yeah it's sexist. By...definition it's sexist. But I couldn't care less. I'm a gentleman and I'm damn proud of it. Not sure why this is such an issue with people. Gentlemanship, as you call it, is one of the things that makes life for living and not for existing.

It makes you ill that I say it's sexist and imply the obvious, that sexism is bad? I don't see why that idea is so terrible to some people. Sexism is unjustified and bad. How threatening. I don't see why it would be something that makes life worth living.

In the same way that nettles hurt my ass but nettle soup tastes pretty good.

Yes, because sexism tastes great in soup. Discriminating towards people just gets such a horrible rap for no reason. Yeah.

Your capacity for metaphor is astounding.

Your analogy was rather empty. There was no real link to the actual situation and why it would be comparable to nettle soup as opposed to nettles in your ass.

Sexism is the nettles.
Gentlemanship is the soup.

Did the bold parts turn invisible when you tried to read my post or are you just deliberately ignoring them?

Sorry I gave you credit for intelligence you apparently don't have.

So sexism as a whole is a bad thing. Like nettles as a whole are quite painful.

However. If you choose the right parts and boil them just right, mix 'em with some other nice things and you get good-tasting soup. Gentlemanship is taking the right parts of a bad thing, mixing them with common decency and good manners, and turning it into a fairly good thing.

Are you getting the picture now?

You seem to be missing the part where you actually show that it is a good thing. You know, the part that would actually validate the analogy.

Well I never met a girl who didn't like to have her chair pulled out for her, or to have the door held open for her. Y'know? Something to make her feel a little special, even if it IS just a tiny thing.

Well the topic already has examples of some girls not liking it so... Also not sure why liking sexism would be good.

And on the flipside - I don't know many guys who appreciate another guy making them feel special.

Well I do. But. I tend not to take them out to dinner.

Why exactly does this need to be about making someone feel special? Are you doing it to flirt with every girl you meet or something?

Yes. Kinda. Not intentionally. Like, I'm not doing it to flirt, but it comes as naturally as flirting.

Comes as naturally isn't the same thing. Either you're claiming your behavior is sexually based like flirting you're denying it.

And I just like making people smile. Terribly sorry that this doesn't fit into your perfect world.

Yes, with sexism. I'm sure the leader of the KKK would smile if I made a racist joke about Obama.

AND. Wait. What was that other thing? Oh yeah - some girls not liking it. Yeah, well, I accidentally flirt with some guys, doesn't make me gay. The minority does not prove the majority.

A poor example since that isn't what makes someone gay.

Wait, why is flirting sexually based? Are you that socially dense?

And no. It's...you're an idiot. I have tried to be polite about this, but now you're comparing being nice to a girl to making racist jokes with the KKK. I've never had a complaint out there in the real world.

Or in here. Just you. Just...you. You fucking robot.

And I'm fairly sure if I flirted exclusively with guys I would actually be gay.

If you flirted exclusively with guys that would not make you gay. It'd be a hint you were, but that isn't how it is defined.

The rest of your post... that's not for me to deal with.

Yeah, that's a hint at being reported. Well if you don't want to be criticised for your behaviour, stop behaving like it.

Hm? I'm just expecting it to remain civil enough. I can't exactly reply as I'd like so I only have one thing to resort to.

Your view doesn't make any sense. It's the view of somebody whose concept of society is from their bedroom window with a news story about rape on the TV. Like...we're all supposed to be identical. That's just not right.

No, it really isn't. You're not supposed to be identical. Give me a break. Since when was gender the only difference in people? If anything you would sound like you're expecting us to be pretty identical if you think treating genders the same would result in that. As if that was our major defining difference from one another.

You're asking us to treat each other identically, not equally.

As opposed to separate but 'equal' treatment? Well gee, if you can show actual equality there maybe you'd have an argument.

You can't even define equality without resorting to identical treatment.

I'll note that you have yet to actually show how it is equal.

Because it's a nice thing to do. You don't need to justify nice things. They are their own justification.

If you want to claim it is equal, then yeah you kind of do need to justify it. If I help up exclusively white dudes who fell down and ignore black dudes, well that's nice for the white guys but it isn't equal and its niceness doesn't absolve it from needing an explanation.

Well no, helping the inconvenienced/unfortunate/injured is universal. It's more of...holding the door open for white middle class men and ignoring it for Pakistani lower-class teenagers. It's not a societal obligation to actually do it, and nobody really has the right to tell you that you're wrong for being picky.

How picky you does say something about you though. For one, it doesn't show equality. In your stated case it might very well show racism, though there are other issues involved.

You read too much into my analogies. I'm too lazy for racism. Prejudice takes effort that I'm not prepared to put out.

 

[Thyunda]

OT: no it's not sexist , it's being fucking nice . Can't a man be nice to a woman without being called sexist ? Fine , i'ma start slamming doors in their faces , let them freeze if it's cold and not give them a hand if they ask for help . Theres your equality.

So is that how you usually treat men? Because if you bothered to read at all the reason its sexist is that it treats them differently for no real reason. Gender being irrelevant to door opening and shit, thus not a real reason.

You...actually make me ill. There's no other word for it. I feel the poetic flair in my heart dying every time I read something you say.

OT: Yeah it's sexist. By...definition it's sexist. But I couldn't care less. I'm a gentleman and I'm damn proud of it. Not sure why this is such an issue with people. Gentlemanship, as you call it, is one of the things that makes life for living and not for existing.

It makes you ill that I say it's sexist and imply the obvious, that sexism is bad? I don't see why that idea is so terrible to some people. Sexism is unjustified and bad. How threatening. I don't see why it would be something that makes life worth living.

In the same way that nettles hurt my ass but nettle soup tastes pretty good.

Yes, because sexism tastes great in soup. Discriminating towards people just gets such a horrible rap for no reason. Yeah.

Your capacity for metaphor is astounding.

Your analogy was rather empty. There was no real link to the actual situation and why it would be comparable to nettle soup as opposed to nettles in your ass.

Sexism is the nettles.
Gentlemanship is the soup.

Did the bold parts turn invisible when you tried to read my post or are you just deliberately ignoring them?

Sorry I gave you credit for intelligence you apparently don't have.

So sexism as a whole is a bad thing. Like nettles as a whole are quite painful.

However. If you choose the right parts and boil them just right, mix 'em with some other nice things and you get good-tasting soup. Gentlemanship is taking the right parts of a bad thing, mixing them with common decency and good manners, and turning it into a fairly good thing.

Are you getting the picture now?

You seem to be missing the part where you actually show that it is a good thing. You know, the part that would actually validate the analogy.

Well I never met a girl who didn't like to have her chair pulled out for her, or to have the door held open for her. Y'know? Something to make her feel a little special, even if it IS just a tiny thing.

Well the topic already has examples of some girls not liking it so... Also not sure why liking sexism would be good.

And on the flipside - I don't know many guys who appreciate another guy making them feel special.

Well I do. But. I tend not to take them out to dinner.

Why exactly does this need to be about making someone feel special? Are you doing it to flirt with every girl you meet or something?

Yes. Kinda. Not intentionally. Like, I'm not doing it to flirt, but it comes as naturally as flirting.

Comes as naturally isn't the same thing. Either you're claiming your behavior is sexually based like flirting you're denying it.

And I just like making people smile. Terribly sorry that this doesn't fit into your perfect world.

Yes, with sexism. I'm sure the leader of the KKK would smile if I made a racist joke about Obama.

AND. Wait. What was that other thing? Oh yeah - some girls not liking it. Yeah, well, I accidentally flirt with some guys, doesn't make me gay. The minority does not prove the majority.

A poor example since that isn't what makes someone gay.

Wait, why is flirting sexually based? Are you that socially dense?

And no. It's...you're an idiot. I have tried to be polite about this, but now you're comparing being nice to a girl to making racist jokes with the KKK. I've never had a complaint out there in the real world.

Or in here. Just you. Just...you. You fucking robot.

And I'm fairly sure if I flirted exclusively with guys I would actually be gay.

If you flirted exclusively with guys that would not make you gay. It'd be a hint you were, but that isn't how it is defined.

The rest of your post... that's not for me to deal with.

Yeah, that's a hint at being reported. Well if you don't want to be criticised for your behaviour, stop behaving like it.

Hm? I'm just expecting it to remain civil enough. I can't exactly reply as I'd like so I only have one thing to resort to.

Your view doesn't make any sense. It's the view of somebody whose concept of society is from their bedroom window with a news story about rape on the TV. Like...we're all supposed to be identical. That's just not right.

No, it really isn't. You're not supposed to be identical. Give me a break. Since when was gender the only difference in people? If anything you would sound like you're expecting us to be pretty identical if you think treating genders the same would result in that. As if that was our major defining difference from one another.

You're asking us to treat each other identically, not equally.

As opposed to separate but 'equal' treatment? Well gee, if you can show actual equality there maybe you'd have an argument.

You can't even define equality without resorting to identical treatment.

I'll note that you have yet to actually show how it is equal.

Because it's a nice thing to do. You don't need to justify nice things. They are their own justification.

If you want to claim it is equal, then yeah you kind of do need to justify it. If I help up exclusively white dudes who fell down and ignore black dudes, well that's nice for the white guys but it isn't equal and its niceness doesn't absolve it from needing an explanation.

Well no, helping the inconvenienced/unfortunate/injured is universal. It's more of...holding the door open for white middle class men and ignoring it for Pakistani lower-class teenagers. It's not a societal obligation to actually do it, and nobody really has the right to tell you that you're wrong for being picky.

How picky you does say something about you though. For one, it doesn't show equality. In your stated case it might very well show racism, though there are other issues involved.

You read too much into my analogies. I'm too lazy for racism. Prejudice takes effort that I'm not prepared to put out.

No, I really didn't read too much into that, it's quite possibly the issue. And you don't seem to be too lazy to engage in this 'gentleman' stuff that is quite sexist so...

Because THAT comes naturally. I don't put effort into that, it just sorta flows. And you're doing that thing again. The comparing murder to petty theft thing again.