Poll: Men and women being freinds
- Thread starter Vault101
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Well, of course people from oppostie sexes can be friends... and damn good ones at that. To be honest most of my friends are of the opposit sex (that being male) and I have no sexual disires for any of them, and as far as i know and am pretty damn cerain about they have no sexual feelings for me.
To be fair though, one of the guys i consider to be my closest friend, was a kinda weird on-off booti-call for a while. that was at the very start of our friendship when we first started hanging out, we would get drunk together and well one thing would have lead to another. That went on for about 2-3 months. But it was never anything more than that.
We soon came to our senses and now we are best friends, with literally no secrets. We laugh about our crazy period. But it made our friendship stronger. We have no disires for each-other just a love for our friendship.
But honestly i don't get this idea that men and women can't be friends. Granted there may be times when ones feelings may grow. But if you are mature and adult about it then there should be no problem.
To be fair though, one of the guys i consider to be my closest friend, was a kinda weird on-off booti-call for a while. that was at the very start of our friendship when we first started hanging out, we would get drunk together and well one thing would have lead to another. That went on for about 2-3 months. But it was never anything more than that.
We soon came to our senses and now we are best friends, with literally no secrets. We laugh about our crazy period. But it made our friendship stronger. We have no disires for each-other just a love for our friendship.
But honestly i don't get this idea that men and women can't be friends. Granted there may be times when ones feelings may grow. But if you are mature and adult about it then there should be no problem.
I have female friends I have no sexual attraction towards because I do not find them sexually attractive and I have female friends that (should I not be in a long-term relationship) I would have sexual intercourse in a "friends with benefits" fashion or even a romantic fashion should the opportunity present itself.
I view female friends as potential romantic partners. Friendship is not a... "hindrance" to romance, there is nothing so special about it that it should be considered "disrespectful" to approach your friends with romantic proposition.
In fact, I find the whole "it would ruin our friendship" excuse to be despicable and disingenuous. The reason should be "I am not sexually attracted to you".
I view female friends as potential romantic partners. Friendship is not a... "hindrance" to romance, there is nothing so special about it that it should be considered "disrespectful" to approach your friends with romantic proposition.
In fact, I find the whole "it would ruin our friendship" excuse to be despicable and disingenuous. The reason should be "I am not sexually attracted to you".
So if I get a bunch of people to stand in front of a camera and say that men and women CAN be friends, it's totally legit?rhizhim said:
Men and women can obviously be friends.
I feel genuinely sad for those who think they cant, they must be cutting themselves off from some potentially really good friendships.
Does this also mean gay people can't be friends with their gender?
Bisexual people can't be friends with anyone?
Here is a post on this topic I enjoy: http://captainawkward.com/2013/01/25/can-men-and-women-be-friends-an-essay-and-a-website-launch/
Implying men and women can't be friends cuz sex, is like saying a gay man can't be friends with a straight man cuz sex.
That...doesn't sound right at all. I guess if both parties are equally invested it's not a problem, but the general conundrum I think the topic is trying to address is when one is attracted and the other is not. Because if both are attracted and open enough about it, it wouldn't have started as a friendship in the first place. It would have developed as a regular sexual relationship. In theory.AstroSmash said:
And don't stop reading here, because I'm not done with you.
mabye some women do that but....nah I still dont get itVault101 said:
unless she's said "mabye....I dont want to rush things" <-or somthing to that then honestly she's just freinds with the guy, and mabye its all in his head?[/quote]
And you've got it, Vault
The "friendzone," in its simplest and least skewed form, is when two people are friends and one of them is romantically attracted to the other, but the other doesn't feel the same way.I had a problem like this once, actually--a friend of mine liked me, but I didn't like him back. He kept flirting with me, and I thought I was making it pretty clear I didn't feel the same. But he kept on persisting, and for a while I was scared to approach the matter because I wasn't sure how much clearer I could make it without being rude and totally breaking his heart. Finally, I took the most cowardly way out and sent him a Facebook message, laying it all out clear. Now we're just fine. Things are back to the way they were before, as far as I can tell. If there are any more problems on his end, he's not telling me.
However, when someone talks of the friendzone like AstroSmash there, then that changes the situation a bit. The way AstroSmash has put it, apparently the girl is making a conscious decision to keep him as a friend because she wants nothing more to torment him. I don't doubt some girls find it amusing to mess with insecure guys, but someone who is friends with you suddenly becoming a manipulative witch? That seems highly unlikely.
Because see, in that situation what is really going on is a breakdown in communication. Because as you can imagine, the situation Astro described can be solved by the guy in a variety of ways. If he hasn't confessed to the girl he likes directly, then he can end the suspense by just asking her. If she rejects him and it's too painful for him to stay around her (which is perfectly understandable), then he is perfectly capable of telling her it might be best if he avoided her. The only way you can remain in the friendzone is if you don't do anything to get yourself out of it. Even though girls are known for communicating with more subtlety, that doesn't necessarily mean they are going to pick up on subtle flirting when it's being used on them. So unless you have done everything in your power to get out of the situation yet somehow you are still friends and somehow she is forcing you to be around her, you have the power to get yourself out of the friendzone.
Other times, the person is in the friend zone is there for worse reasons. The first post in this thread [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/538.400140-Relationship-problems] (the post recieved a warning so you'll have to reveal it) illustrates this scary place. Sometimes, a person can be so clingy that even when the girl outright tells them no, they won't take that for an answer. They think that because they have been so nice to her and such a good friend for so long, they've got some sort of a claim on her. If she is interested in someone else, then that person isn't good enough for her, and he tries to convince her of that.
As you can see, that version of the friend zone isn't driven by love or a simple misunderstanding. That is selfishness driven by desperation. If the guy has been told no and still remains friends with her and still tries to go after her, he has nobody but himself to blame for the pain he feels. He got his answer, and refusing to accept that answer and deal with it does not make him a victim. And it certainly doesn't excuse trying to convince the girl the only path to her happiness is through him. That right there is manipulation.
So no, the "friendzone" is not strictly a situation where the boy is being purposefully tormented by the girl. Sometimes the girl can freeze up and drag it on for longer than it should, as is what happened in my case, but at no time is the guy completely powerless to do something about it.
I'll admit that for a vast majority of my female friends, I've had sexual attraction for them at some point, whether it's because of their looks or their personality, but I think friendships can still work.
There's only been one female friend I have that I never have nor ever will have sexual feelings for, but that's mainly because I'm about 4 years older than her. But at the same time I treat her more like a sister than as a friend, so I don't know if that'd be some sort of exception.
Really though, if you're that worried your partner will cheat on you with one of your friends (or one of their friends), you probably should rethink having a relationship at the moment.
Just my two cents.
There's only been one female friend I have that I never have nor ever will have sexual feelings for, but that's mainly because I'm about 4 years older than her. But at the same time I treat her more like a sister than as a friend, so I don't know if that'd be some sort of exception.
Really though, if you're that worried your partner will cheat on you with one of your friends (or one of their friends), you probably should rethink having a relationship at the moment.
Just my two cents.
I don't think they can work, but I'm jaded on the matter. When a girl you love cheats on you several times and then goes "I'm sorry, let's be friends! " and then the next girl I liked flips shit on me when I apologise for the crush and then she has Vietnam style flashbacks to being molested by her stepfather and then BLAMES ME for the molestation...so yeah, I don't think guys and girls can be friends, but like I said, personal reasons .
" and then the next girl I liked flips shit on me when I apologise for the crush and then she has Vietnam style flashbacks to being molested by her stepfather and then BLAMES ME for the molestation...so yeah, I don't think guys and girls can be friends, but like I said, personal reasons .
I'm in my twenties and living with my current girlfriend. My closest friends are girls. Though I have dated a few of them at some point in my early life, I have no desire to go down that road again, and I believe they feel the same.
Personally, I prefer to have friends of the female gender. Guys are great, and I have many guy friends, but I never feel as close to them.
Personally, I prefer to have friends of the female gender. Guys are great, and I have many guy friends, but I never feel as close to them.
It all depends on how you define "just friends". The interviews posted by DevilWithAHalo are fairly instructive in the differences between the genders here. A woman can spend time with a man knowing full well he wants to have sex with her, and that relationship qualifies as "just friendship" to her - but not for the man. Another man, say her boyfriend, doesn't see it that way either. He can approximate and mimic the thoughts of another man better than his girlfriend ever could, so he knows the true character of this "friendship".
Last year two of my closest friends were female. The other was a dude. That's normal for me. Would I have gone for any of them? Nope. They were all good looking people, but the bloke was married with two kids, one of the girls had two kids and the other girl I genuinely valued my friendship a lot more.
My best friend throughout sixth form (Who would still be my friend if it were not for distance) was in love with me. Totally and utterly. He knew it, I knew it, my girlfriend knew it, we just left it at that. He would never do anything (Cause he knew I was in love, he knew my girlfriend was in love and he didn't want to fuck shit up) and I would never do anything. Feelings were not hurt.
Part of growing up is accepting that not all love is mutual, that not all attraction is mutual and that you can move on. Cutting all ties and burning all bridges just because you are facing unrequited love is insane!
It doesn't matter if you feel an attraction. It matters if you know what is appropriate. I am still attracted to some of my friends (Despite being in a loving relationship) and I know some of those people are attracted to me. Doesn't mean I will cut them out of my life.
You, ser, have a worldview that I disagree with wholeheartedly. Shameful? Staying friends with people who have feelings for your is shameful?SimpleThunda said:
My best friend throughout sixth form (Who would still be my friend if it were not for distance) was in love with me. Totally and utterly. He knew it, I knew it, my girlfriend knew it, we just left it at that. He would never do anything (Cause he knew I was in love, he knew my girlfriend was in love and he didn't want to fuck shit up) and I would never do anything. Feelings were not hurt.
Part of growing up is accepting that not all love is mutual, that not all attraction is mutual and that you can move on. Cutting all ties and burning all bridges just because you are facing unrequited love is insane!
It doesn't matter if you feel an attraction. It matters if you know what is appropriate. I am still attracted to some of my friends (Despite being in a loving relationship) and I know some of those people are attracted to me. Doesn't mean I will cut them out of my life.
I need to tick multiple options, it varies quite significantly depending on which friends I'm talking about.
I do find it much easier to make friends with people when I'm not attracted to them though. Being attracted to someone whilst trying to maintain friendship adds a barrier and an extra level of self censorship because there are suddenly significant topics I want to avoid around them. I find this especially when trying to stay friends with my ex girlfriend.
I do find it much easier to make friends with people when I'm not attracted to them though. Being attracted to someone whilst trying to maintain friendship adds a barrier and an extra level of self censorship because there are suddenly significant topics I want to avoid around them. I find this especially when trying to stay friends with my ex girlfriend.
I think `always` is a tad strong there.rhizhim said:
MOST of my friends are guys. I have no feelings for them and they have no feelings for me.
It is very uncomplicated.
I have had friends who had feelings for me, both that I shared and that I didn't.
And I've had feelings for a friend who didn't share them.
But it doesn't mean that I can't be friends with someone of the opposite gender and not have any `tension`.
Oh noes, we were friends.rhizhim said:
Flirty friends who always had something between them, not friends who were platonic with secret pining on any side.
You know, this reminds me of when a friend of mine came out at school.
I went to an all-girls school, and there was this one girl there who as soon as she heard my friend liked girls was convinced that my friend had a crush on her.
I remember saying to her `How vain can you get? Just because she likes girls doesn't automatically mean she likes YOU`.
Not all friends are attracted to each other, it's pretty simple.
EDIT: Fixed a derpy quote.
I've also got more..."agressive" veiw on the freindzone than that XD but I know it would be wise to hold offLilani said:And you've got it, Vault
I mean it rings alarm bell when some guy describes himself as a "nice" guy.Oh so your nice? well everyones nice, the guy who served me at EB games was nice, my boss is nice, the guy from amnesty bailing me up in the street was nice. Oh sure they all have motives...but don't you? whats yours? you want to get with me...you dont want to be my freind and you think just by virtue of being nice thats gonna happen and when it doesnt its everyones fault but yours, girls go for jerks? how do you know they are jerks? mabye that "jerk" is actually really nice AND can also play the piano, what can you do? no one is going to find the fact that your nice to be a turn on...nice is bare mimumum...you cant skate by on bare minimum
What I think a lot of people who come down on the "no" side of this argument are trying to say is that most friendships between men and women are simply not the same as those between two straight people of the same gender. If there is sexual tension, even one-sided, then the character of the relationship and its interactions are just different. That doesn't mean it shouldn't be or isn't sustainable, but it's obviously a lot more complex than traditional heterosexual same-sex friendships - and potentially a lot less healthy.
I also believe, very fervently, that the majority of women who say "I don't have any feelings for my many guy friends, and they don't have any feelings for me" are pathetically naive. I once challenged such a girl with a hypothetical that went as follows: if you very subtly flirted with all of your guy friends, more or less indicating that you were holding some feelings for them, how many would reciprocate in such a way as to pursue sex? I asked her to really, really think about, and to her credit, she said most of them would probably sleep with her at the drop of a hat.
Finally, I think this forum is very atypical in terms of demographics with respect to this issue. It's a very liberal group, a very progressive group, and a very nerdy group. Lots of girls with mostly guy friends, who will obviously answer yes to this question even if they know, deep down, that a ton of their "just friends" would bone them. And even here, where you'd probably expect to find, on average, a different sort of man than would represent the general population, a bunch are saying they either have banged most of their female friends or gladly would.
As someone else already pointed out, it boils down mostly to semantics.
I also believe, very fervently, that the majority of women who say "I don't have any feelings for my many guy friends, and they don't have any feelings for me" are pathetically naive. I once challenged such a girl with a hypothetical that went as follows: if you very subtly flirted with all of your guy friends, more or less indicating that you were holding some feelings for them, how many would reciprocate in such a way as to pursue sex? I asked her to really, really think about, and to her credit, she said most of them would probably sleep with her at the drop of a hat.
Finally, I think this forum is very atypical in terms of demographics with respect to this issue. It's a very liberal group, a very progressive group, and a very nerdy group. Lots of girls with mostly guy friends, who will obviously answer yes to this question even if they know, deep down, that a ton of their "just friends" would bone them. And even here, where you'd probably expect to find, on average, a different sort of man than would represent the general population, a bunch are saying they either have banged most of their female friends or gladly would.
As someone else already pointed out, it boils down mostly to semantics.
I agree with everything you said, and I think it goes a long way to explain where the misunderstanding that the friend zone comes from. I know a lot of insecure guys, just because a lot of my friends are nerds and nerdy guys tend to be more on the insecure side of the spectrum when it comes to romance. And people who are insecure tend to be ultra sensitive to attention from people they even think they might like. So if a girl is being "nice" to them, they can mistake that for flirting. And in turn, they think that being "nice" is the way to flirt back. In reality they are just being kind people, but in the guy's head he is flirting and--for all intents and purposes--she seems to like him back. So if he confesses rejection comes, he is absolutely dumbfounded, and the conclusion he draws is that it was all a lie and she was just manipulating him for shiggles.Vault101 said: