Poll: MMO's don't require skill.

[Danny Ocean]

I don't maul! I slash! Jeez, how about you don't speak for a while, hmm?

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Don't fight the system messages! You can't fight the system maaan. Don't do it! We'll They'll destroy you! [sup][/crazed hippy voice][/sup]

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[Marv21]

Unless your a hunter *send pet* Arcane shot, Viper shot(For those healers), auto shot auto shot, YOU WIN!!

 

[sequio]

I can't generalize all MMO because i'm reminded of GunZ.

 

[Veekter]

i don't count thought/strategy as skill, so i say they don't

 

[Altorin]

WoW takes 0 skill, WoW is a retard check game and if you can't get anything done in that game your a tard. Unfortunately most the people who do play WoW are tards and raiding with them isn't pretty.

If it required no skill then the tards would be indistinguishable from the pros

 

[KaZZaP]

If it required no skill then the tards would be indistinguishable from the pros

It doesn't take skill it does however require brains, honestly nothing in that game takes skill and anyone SHOULD be able to play. Some people are just total retards, I remember one guy I played with would put one point into everything thing in his spec and only one point for the multiple level moves. These people don't need skill they need a brain.

 

[Da_Schwartz]

DDO requires some skill. The combat is more then just click ur enemy then clikc your power. I mean if you really know what your doing i suppose all MMO's require some sort of "Stratergy" rather then "skill" persay. But no mmo imo comes down to true teamwork and reliance on your other party members more so then ddo.

 

[Flying-Emu]

i don't count thought/strategy as skill, so i say they don't

Thought and strategy is the basis OF skill...

@topic

Management and mathematics skill; I.E. Will this +16 strength increase my attack power more than these gloves which give +34 melee attack power?

 

[O maestre]

are we talking all mmo's or just mmorpg's ? because the latter one requires no skill from what i have seen, all you need to know is how to get a successful build, or get lucky and have a good build, games like WoW, city of heroes, conan and anarchy online

 

[Silver]

What you're talking about is abusing a game's mechanics, or even bending a game's mechanics to suit the computer "player". That's not what I'm talking about.

A computer can do everything the player can do within the game they're playing. What you described in the original post was how a computer can micromanage and set up a character within an MMO when the computer can micromanage and set up stats in every game it's computed with.

These "exploits" are how the computer was designed to play against you, enemy AI, and wether that's "fair" or not is up to the computer. You want examples that arn't "exploits"? Fine, the computer can aim, shot, run, punch, and do everything the player can do. The only thing that's keeping the computer from whooping your sorry ass is the difficulty settings you put it on. The computer always knows where you are and what you're doing, wether you're sneaking behind a guard or setting up the charges, but it's forced to be "fair" to a human person who doesn't know all these things.

Example: You're sneaking behind a guard, and you throw a soda can to distract it. The computer knows you're there, but it is programmed to say "what was that noise?" and act stupid. It's the programing AI. You cannot "outsmart" the computer because the computer already knows what you're doing. It's just trying to defeat you within the rules.

You can go on about how a computer can "never adapt with creativness" or whatever, but the only reason why it isn't grating your nipples with a cheese grater is because the programers want to make AI like a human so it's more "fair".

No, you're just being an idiot about it. I'm not talking about a bot.

I'm talking about a computer given the same (and nothing more) input as the player of the game. Do you understand this sentence, it's kind of crucial? If you don't, then please don't respond with anything but "please explain that sentence".

In that case a computer doesn't know everything, that's why you can outsmart it. I'm talking about an external computer on equal terms with the player. It won't know everything that's happening. It can't. Because the player can't.

Then you can beat it, then you can outsmart it. Unless you're playing an mmorpg. Perhaps if you're playing some regular rpgs, but most likely not in that case either. It'd come down to pure stats in that case, and thus pure luck.

 

[littlemira]

MMO's don't require much skills at all really. Just click on the mob and hope it dies before you do. I play FFXI and the only skills you need is to know are always fight in a party and paladin is overall the best and safest job to solo as. Ok ok there also the encyclopedic knowledge required to abuse enemy weaknesses but almost nobody does that unless there a Black Mage in FFXI.

You sir suck. Now I don't play anymore and haven't for 3 years. But, I mean common seriously.. Paladin as the best solo job? Are you retarded? Have you never heard of beast master which basically solo's all of it's levels until around 65? Or maybe a Red Mage/Ninja Soloing many of the Notorious Monsters? Hell Paladin is an alright tank but even in most cases it's better to have a Ninja/Warrior. So please before you start saying something requires no skill, at least know something about the game. Every line in your post is absolute gold to anyone who's played for a fair while.

First of all Mister Benoit, Your sir need to calm the frick down and keep your aggresive opinon to yourself. PLD can solo. There are certain styles of soloing. Not all of them have to be about "best balanced damage output". And since you haven't played in the past 3 years, there have been some major additions/expansions that you have missed out on. I'm trying not to raz, but your reply was outright meaningless.

On to the point of the forum. No. MMO's do not require skill. It's all knowledge. I do disagree with ultimasupersaiyan on how in FFXI only 1 job needs to know how to exploit mobs weaknesses, but it proves that having the knowledge ALLOWS you to exploit it. Yes, you learn timing/events for the skills/spells/whatever, but the knowledge helps to know when to use them and why. I guess you can argue that the timing factor is something you perfect, and that can relate to skill, but without the knowledge, there is no skill.


Don't think I've used the word knowledge enough ...


knowledge knowledge knowledge knowledge knowledge knowledge knowledge knowledge knowledge.

 

[runtheplacered]

It requires the skill to use a keyboard and mouse, which believe it or not, some people don't have. Other then that, most MMO's just require lots of patience and trial and error.

 

[kommando367]

most mmos require that the player know how to strategically build their characters (something that can easily be looked up in a walkthrough or a forum), and have a rudimentary knowledge of battle strategy. it is becuase of this that i stopped playing mmos about 10 months ago. the main problem is that there is no gain from mmos, with fighting games comes faster reflexes, with puzzle games comes an enhanced thought process, with mmos come 3+ months wasted maxing out one's character

 

[Jumplion]

What you're talking about is abusing a game's mechanics, or even bending a game's mechanics to suit the computer "player". That's not what I'm talking about.

A computer can do everything the player can do within the game they're playing. What you described in the original post was how a computer can micromanage and set up a character within an MMO when the computer can micromanage and set up stats in every game it's computed with.

These "exploits" are how the computer was designed to play against you, enemy AI, and wether that's "fair" or not is up to the computer. You want examples that arn't "exploits"? Fine, the computer can aim, shot, run, punch, and do everything the player can do. The only thing that's keeping the computer from whooping your sorry ass is the difficulty settings you put it on. The computer always knows where you are and what you're doing, wether you're sneaking behind a guard or setting up the charges, but it's forced to be "fair" to a human person who doesn't know all these things.

Example: You're sneaking behind a guard, and you throw a soda can to distract it. The computer knows you're there, but it is programmed to say "what was that noise?" and act stupid. It's the programing AI. You cannot "outsmart" the computer because the computer already knows what you're doing. It's just trying to defeat you within the rules.

You can go on about how a computer can "never adapt with creativness" or whatever, but the only reason why it isn't grating your nipples with a cheese grater is because the programers want to make AI like a human so it's more "fair".

No, you're just being an idiot about it. I'm not talking about a bot.

I'm talking about a computer given the same (and nothing more) input as the player of the game. Do you understand this sentence, it's kind of crucial? If you don't, then please don't respond with anything but "please explain that sentence".

In that case a computer doesn't know everything, that's why you can outsmart it. I'm talking about an external computer on equal terms with the player. It won't know everything that's happening. It can't. Because the player can't.

Then you can beat it, then you can outsmart it. Unless you're playing an mmorpg. Perhaps if you're playing some regular rpgs, but most likely not in that case either. It'd come down to pure stats in that case, and thus pure luck.

Don't lower yourself to petty name-calling, it undermines your whole point that you're trying to say.

Other than that, I don't have anything nor to I feel like adding anything to this argument. You've put up your side I've put up mine.

 

[Zephirius]

These kids on WoW these days would get schooled in 2Fort. The real one, not the TF2 Toy Story knockoff.

Good heavens, no! People who are not great at an FPS! Quick, shut down all MMO's!

Also, Planetside and Tabula Rasa.

 

[GothmogII]

NO GAMES REQUIRE SKILL!!!!

Nothing -requires- skill. It's just easier on the person who's got it. That is: Anyone can write a novel, it takes the person who is skilled to write a good one. Gaming is no different from any other pastime, job or vocation in this regard.

Some things require skill, you just think about stuff to much, I mean a person who didn't have a brain couldn't write a novel.

Hehe, not true at all. It probably wouldn't contain anything worth reading, or even be legible, but, yes, a person with limited intelligence could indeed write a book. Although, I fail to see your point if we take it that said person literally does not have a brain, in which case said person would well, dead -_^


So fine, here's the definition of 'skill' :

skill
Noun
1. special ability or expertise enabling one to perform an activity very well
2. something, such as a trade, requiring special training or expertise [Old Norse skil distinction]
skilled adj

1. Proficiency, facility, or dexterity that is acquired or developed through training or experience. See Synonyms at ability.
2.
a. An art, trade, or technique, particularly one requiring use of the hands or body.
b. A developed talent or ability: writing skills.

People rarely start off with any notion of how to do a thing, they only get better by doing. Those that excel with less effort are usually referred to as talented, those that work hard and become skilled are the others.

A better argument for this topic would be: Do games/mmos require little skill to play?
Not as it is, as -all- games no matter the difficulty, do have things you learn while playing, and thus increase your own 'skill' at them.

 

[Veekter]

i don't count thought/strategy as skill, so i say they don't

Thought and strategy is the basis OF skill...

@topic

Management and mathematics skill; I.E. Will this +16 strength increase my attack power more than these gloves which give +34 melee attack power?

true, but when i think gaming skill i think of the twitchy reflexes you get from playing excessive counter-strike

 

[Flying-Emu]

i don't count thought/strategy as skill, so i say they don't

Thought and strategy is the basis OF skill...

@topic

Management and mathematics skill; I.E. Will this +16 strength increase my attack power more than these gloves which give +34 melee attack power?

true, but when i think gaming skill i think of the twitchy reflexes you get from playing excessive counter-strike

I see. So strategic discipline and knowledge of tactics in, say, Starcraft and Dawn of War, doesn't constitute skill?