Poll: New forum rules - Yay or Nay?

[Knight Templar]

UPDATE

As of right now, we have implemented a new system due to community feedback and to continually make these forums a better place. From now on, every 6 months a strike will be taken off your forum health meter for good behavior (meaning you have no infractions). After 2 years of no infractions, your infractions will be completely cleared.

Please note, this does not mean that every 6 months you can afford an infraction. If we see that you are playing the system, our moderators will hold you accountable.

You will see these changes taking place over the next 24 hours for those of your with no infractions over the last 6 months or 2 years.

That addresses my issue. I doubt that issues with the rules themselves will be more than minor complaints.

I feel the exact same way. I'm anxious enough about what I consider past mistakes without having them counted and marked against me forever here.

 

[A Pious Cultist]

Edit: Seems the "I AGREE" thing causes me to accidentally submit this twice.

 

[A Pious Cultist]

* Ad Blockers

Wow.. Am I the only one who thinks this is a bit messed up?

Not really, up until the introduction of Pub Club memberships (and possibly still) ad revenue was the Escapist's main source of income. So it's the equivalent of talking about torrent sites on a video game, film, or music producer's website.

With this in mind I've never installed or enabled an ad blocker.

 

[Caliostro]

Why did I get a warning for this? I was agreeing with them instead of posting the same thing.

Please read the rules [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/codeofconduct]. Particularly the part about "Low Content Posts". A reason is, also, always included in the warning/probation/suspension, so you can refer to that.

 

[exampleAccount]

There are new rules?

I've never liked the fact that I can't insult people on here, I know we can't have everyone flaming all the time but some people need to be put down sometimes.

 

[Yureina]

It seems very hypocritical to me and thank you for bringing this to my attention. I was not aware of this, but yes, it does appear you're correct. God I love the double standards on this site...
-.-
-Tabs<3-

Yeah, I know. The average forum poster risks loosing posting privileges, but it's our jobs that could potentially be on the line. Where's my equal treatment!

You are at risk of being fired because of forum moderation issues?

Somehow I doubt that...

Part of working here, as with many jobs, means adhering to a our employee handbook. Penalties for continued problems at failing to act in a professional manner leads up to and include termination of employment.

That makes sense to me, except that I still doubt that these forum moderation issues would be your problem. They would seem like Spinwhiz' problem, if anyone's.

Color me confused as to why events on these forums could potentially affect you personally.

 

[subtlefuge]

* Ad Blockers

Wow.. Am I the only one who thinks this is a bit messed up?

Not really, up until the introduction of Pub Club memberships (and possibly still) ad revenue was the Escapist's main source of income. So it's the equivalent of talking about torrent sites on a video game, film, or music producer's website.

With this in mind I've never installed or enabled an ad blocker.

Indeed, not many people are going to like hearing this, but:

Using an ad-blocker is pirating the Escapist. You get payed to look at ads, you give that money to the Escapist, and then they use it to buy food. Think of it that way if it makes it easier.

If everyone used ad-blockers, there would be no Escapist.

On that note, shameless plug for the Pub Club...it's like leaving a tip but you get a bunch of cool stuff. We have more fun.

 

[Leg End]

Don't forget, we know what kind of people will have a problem under the new system and end up getting banned because of it. We expect those people to get banned. It's not something that we didn't already think about.

You expect people to have problems with this and expect to ban them? Just because they have a problem with it? What the fuck?

Basically, this. I was hoping I read it wrong in some way, but I don't think I have. Now I see that I am not going blind. :L

 

[Ice Car]

I'm assuming this "forum health meter" is measuring how "low your health was" and this feature just added the ability to see it, but if not, I dislike it.

One thing I don't understand is how you are supposed to raise your health meter again. After addition it showed my meter at a "Probation permanent" mode I believe? The rules aren't even specific enough to tell me how to raise health, or what the exact point is that you lose the ability to.

And even if this meter changed nothing in terms of how close to a ban I was, I still dislike it as I've only just found out I am about 3 points away from a ban and had no chance to make a serious change in behavior, or in other words, get out of casual mode and start being paranoid about everything I post. At least then I could maintain a high health meter. I like to be able to measure how close to a ban or perma I am, so I know when to start being careful, but the new system only just allowed me to see that, and too late as well...

tl;dr: When are you unable to get points back? How do you get them back? Why was this only instituted now, I would have liked to be able to track my infractions so I know when to really get serious about the rules, instead of keeping the rules in my head and just posting like I normally do... I'd really like to get my points back down.

 

[Slycne]

That makes sense to me, except that I still doubt that these forum moderation issues would be your problem. They would seem like Spinwhiz' problem, if anyone's.

Color me confused as to why events on these forums could potentially affect you personally.

Ah, I think I see where the slip up is.

I was actually commenting in response to staff forum health meters being hidden being a double standard by saying that yes, in fact, there is a huge "double standard." If I, or another staff member, personally was to be a big enough jerk on the forums or otherwise violate the Code of Conduct repeatedly it could effect my employment, not just my posting ability.

 

[Yureina]

That makes sense to me, except that I still doubt that these forum moderation issues would be your problem. They would seem like Spinwhiz' problem, if anyone's.

Color me confused as to why events on these forums could potentially affect you personally.

Ah, I think I see where the slip up is.

I was actually commenting in response to staff forum health meters being hidden being a double standard by saying that yes, in fact, there is a huge "double standard." If I, or another staff member, personally was to be a big enough jerk on the forums or otherwise violate the Code of Conduct repeatedly it could effect my employment, not just my posting ability.

"With power comes responsibility"

Your higher position would mean you receive more serious consequences for doing wrong. That is exactly how it should be. It should also be like that for moderators on this site as well.

If such consequences did not exist, then what you have is despotism, plain and simple.

 

[itf cho]

tl;dr: When are you unable to get points back? How do you get them back? Why was this only instituted now, I would have liked to be able to track my infractions so I know when to really get serious about the rules, instead of keeping the rules in my head and just posting like I normally do... I'd really like to get my points back down.

Here's the link...

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/codeofconduct

And the relevant portion:

Amnesty
After every 6 months without any warnings, you will drop down one level on the Forum Health Meter. After 2 years without any warnings, your meter will be returned to 0, regardless of where it was before.

These adjustments don't apply to any users that have been permanently banned, and they don't remove the history that the moderators can see on your account. Anyone that is seen "gaming the system" will be held accountable for it.

 

[Ice Car]

tl;dr: When are you unable to get points back? How do you get them back? Why was this only instituted now, I would have liked to be able to track my infractions so I know when to really get serious about the rules, instead of keeping the rules in my head and just posting like I normally do... I'd really like to get my points back down.

Here's the link...

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/codeofconduct

And the relevant portion:

Amnesty
After every 6 months without any warnings, you will drop down one level on the Forum Health Meter. After 2 years without any warnings, your meter will be returned to 0, regardless of where it was before.

These adjustments don't apply to any users that have been permanently banned, and they don't remove the history that the moderators can see on your account. Anyone that is seen "gaming the system" will be held accountable for it.

Oh, I see. I guess that was added recently because yesterday I looked it over multiple times for something like such and couldn't find anything. I honestly think 6 months for a one point drop is too long, but then again, it's better than having no way of removing points...

So, I'm wondering, does it matter if you do not visit Escapist for a certain period of time? I may blank out for the few months on Summer Break with no access, and sometimes I get bored of a site and leave. Will it only count those days I post at least once or every day, whether I am active or not?

I have a feeling this is a "I never should have asked that" moment but I hope not...

 

[RUINER ACTUAL]

My "health meter" says I'm on probation, but I haven't been posting very much at all, and I don't remember why or when I was even put on it. If anything, they should've reset everyone and then implemented the health meter.

I think it will just make people worried about posting, not really make them think about what they are posting.

 

[DevilWolf47]

Uh... you CAN get strikes back! I actually like the new warning system, and honestly the fact that The Escapist not only gives you a few get out of jail free cards but lets you appeal to mistakes you've made and is generally relaxed in enforcement so long as you're not offensive or doing something illegal makes me feel supportive of it.

And i'm not just saying this because i already used up all my strikes because i keep forgetting to make it clear when i'm being sarcastic.

 

[NinjaTigerXIII]

I originally had a problem with it but Now that I have a clean slate, I don't care anymore

 

[Unhappy Crow]

This health bar things feels more like a rule breaker bar. The higher it is, the more people'll think of you as a rule breaker. have no problem with this, and have no care for it, but I understand how it feels to have that there. It can be scary.

 

[jboking]

snipd
Banning of advocating illegal activities should honestly be a given. They're illegal, and the escapist doesn't want to get caught up in any issues if their members are promoting those things.

the escapist has had, on average of one a week, polls "should marijuana be legal" with thousands of people posting "hurr durr smoke weed errday brah" without getting into a mote of trouble. In fact, I don't think any forum ever has ever got into litigation over things its members have posted. 4chan is the exception, but it literally has hundreds of child porn threads in a single day sometimes.

I've seen the 'should marijuana be legal' threads before, but I never see anyone posting blunt(ba-dum-tish) "SMOKE IT EVER DAY" comments in those threads that weren't moderated almost immediately. There are people who talk about what it does or why it isn't harmful, but that's honest discussion about it. I doubt the escapist will ever ban honest discussion about the topic, as I doubt they'll ever ban talking about piracy and its effects, but if someone is instructing others on its use or telling them ways to go about getting things, that is when the ban hammer will fall. I think that is the kind of advocacy they are talking about, as it is the kind of activity that would get you banned in any of those topics(here is what you do to ad block, here is what you do to get weed, here is what you do to pirate, etc.).

Have some faith in the Mods. I've only ever seen one start banning without good reason, and he was taken care of by the other mods.

Also, not many forums have been sent into court, but some have. You pointed one out yourself. That knowledge alone is enough to protect yourself and your community by setting clear boundaries.

No, the concern here is that things that are illegal should be able to be discussed. In order to have a balanced discussion, advocacy must be allowed. You shouldn't decide whether to smoke weed based solely on the college douchey "errday" viewpoint, but you certainly shouldn't just have the viewpoint of the writers of reefer madness presented. you take both viewpoints into consideration, figure that the answer is probably somewhere in the middle. the same is true of every illegal activity; if we don't allow rational, balanced discussion, we may as well be in a police state.

Here is the thing, Advocacy of piracy and marijuana use has always been a bannable offense, but we've still had discussions about it on here. Refer to the previous comment to see what kind of advocacy I'm thinking they are talking about.

While some might view that as a justified reason for piracy, it does not defeat the fact that piracy is an illegal activity and therefore, shouldn't be advocated

Actually... Banning someone for endorsing pirating an out-of-distribution game, or one that is simply not available in their country of origins would be pretty hypocritical.

The good folks at Extra Credits ENDORSED such a thing.

"This program does not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of the network."

It's not the escapist advocating it, it's extra credits. Hypocrisy is not there.

 

[Nephus]

Ok, not entirely sure how to read these new rules. Just posting something to see if I get the popup. Will edit with opinion afterwards.

Edit: Ok, yeah, that's kinda crap. I honestly have respected The Escapist as being one of the best gaming sites on the planet up until now. The entire package deal was incredible. Up to date news, funny comics, great video series, and some of the best forums I've ever run across.

Now though... I think this has gotten a bit out of hand. The moderation isn't even, it can't be since so much of it is subjective and depends on the particular mod. I mean, if I were a mod, there's things I would let slide that others wouldn't because it honestly isn't that big of a deal, but hit the wrong angle on a particular subject and your head would be spinning. That's just life. This is an attempt to "fix" that by making it universally draconian, as well as an attempt to justify the salary of the web programmers they keep on staff by giving them a new project.

Making something "fair" is a good goal, but making it fair by making it universally undesirable is the reason communism kinda fell flat on its face. Of course, I'm also that one person on most forums who reports the posts of mods when they get out of line too. Been banned more than once over that, but it's a matter of principal. Live by the banhammer, die by the banhammer.

This system is just really putting the power into the hands of a few people who've shown over time that they can be hotheads and giving us no recourse. I've got a warning on my account, and it's pitiful what it was over. Really, they used the moderation system to give me some advice about a situation. It should've just been a private message, but that takes too much effort I guess. So now here I am, one strike against me because the system was used differently in the past. If you're going to overhaul something so completely, you need to start over and then USE it consistently. That's not happening, and honestly, this'll probably be my last post for a long time, if not ever. I get too much of this crap dealing with actual law enforcement without having to be subjected to it on a forum.