Poll: RPG Cliches you want to destroy
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Protaganists always having a vandetta/personal motivation for fighting the main villain/leigons of terror, why can't we have a protaganist who's in it for the money/promise of women, fame and glory?
The Evil Overlord of the People's Republic of Evil will always send progressively stronger minions to destroy the valiant hero, thus allowing him to gain useful wisdom and experience rather than instantly sending his most elite 'Doom squad' to dispatch them quickly and efficiantly.
The main villian is only vulnerable to a very rare and specific weapon/power/spell/character which our hero just so happens to posess.
Women are always either fragile, womanly and beautiful spellcasters (fragile, womanly and beautiful scientist/psychic if it's sci-fi) or hard-as-nails, 'overies on the outside' warriors (grizzled, veteran space marines if it's sci-fi).
The Evil Overlord of the People's Republic of Evil will always send progressively stronger minions to destroy the valiant hero, thus allowing him to gain useful wisdom and experience rather than instantly sending his most elite 'Doom squad' to dispatch them quickly and efficiantly.
The main villian is only vulnerable to a very rare and specific weapon/power/spell/character which our hero just so happens to posess.
Women are always either fragile, womanly and beautiful spellcasters (fragile, womanly and beautiful scientist/psychic if it's sci-fi) or hard-as-nails, 'overies on the outside' warriors (grizzled, veteran space marines if it's sci-fi).
The emotionless badass warrior character, if he/she is done wrong (see: Zola from Blue Dragon).
I want a chance to be evil. No, not kill a town evil, actually join the evil faction kind of evil.
Evil Leader: "Join us!"
You: "K"
EviL Leader: "We shall rule the wor- wait, seriously?"
You: "Buddy, the "good" faction of this game has a metric fuckton of soldiers and weaponry to throw at you, but instead, they think it's smarter to rely on a lone hero or a small group of vagabonds to defeat an entire empire. THEY DESERVE TO DIE!"
Evil Leader: "Join us!"
You: "K"
EviL Leader: "We shall rule the wor- wait, seriously?"
You: "Buddy, the "good" faction of this game has a metric fuckton of soldiers and weaponry to throw at you, but instead, they think it's smarter to rely on a lone hero or a small group of vagabonds to defeat an entire empire. THEY DESERVE TO DIE!"
I hate it when I spend the entire fucking game gathering some mystical plot-important items, and then the bad guy takes them all away and gets to use them for evil. I spent a lot of time gathering those! They're mine you asshole!
Yes, I too am becoming sick of text boxes. Much like button-pressing, voice acting, and graphics, these cliches have gone on for far too long.jakefongloo221 said:
I'm actually kind of glad that RPG leads end up being sorta special. Think about a game where the main character isn't especially strong...
Ver. 1:
*Boom*
Main guy: Oh my lord! A dragon just burst through my wall! I've gotta fight it! Here I go!
*Squish*
GAME OVER
Ver. 2:
Main guy: Oh no! Goblins are attacking my village! I have to stop them!
*Stab*
GAME OVER
Ver. 1:
*Boom*
Main guy: Oh my lord! A dragon just burst through my wall! I've gotta fight it! Here I go!
*Squish*
GAME OVER
Ver. 2:
Main guy: Oh no! Goblins are attacking my village! I have to stop them!
*Stab*
GAME OVER
RPG elements tainting the other genres. Oh, its a first-person/action/adventure/fighting/racing/puzzle/music...RPG 
Whatever happened to getting better powers/abilities thru progression of the game's story? Seriously, if I want RPG in my game, I'd go play one. Nowadays, if you want to make sure your gun or sword or fist can cause your enemy to defecate its internal organs, you have to make sure you have enough experience/currency.
Whatever happened to getting better powers/abilities thru progression of the game's story? Seriously, if I want RPG in my game, I'd go play one. Nowadays, if you want to make sure your gun or sword or fist can cause your enemy to defecate its internal organs, you have to make sure you have enough experience/currency.
Sorry if this has been posted before, but what I hate is, you're finally heroes and everyone knows you're the last hope to defeat (insert villain here) and save the world, but the shops still insist on charging you for essentials like potions, weapons, armor, etc. (but by that point you should already have so much money it's irrelevant)
Also, you're able to hold exactly 99 of any item, even if it's something like a feather or a full suit of armor. (Not really anything wrong with this, it's just another cliché)
Also, you're able to hold exactly 99 of any item, even if it's something like a feather or a full suit of armor. (Not really anything wrong with this, it's just another cliché)
Well, no, I was summarising this thread, thus becoming, er, totally accurate as it turns out, since the majority of the cliches people have been complaining about are endemic in JRPGs. The fact that I agree with them is purely coincidental.Onmi said:
Because this isn't a thread about combat, graphics or sound, it's a thread about cliches, and JRPGs are some of the most cliche-ridden games around. Virtually every character in any given JRPG is one of about a dozen basic archetypes: Cutesy Eternally-Optimistic Girl (secretly hiding a sad heart!), Surly Teenage Misanthrope (secretly hiding a loving heart!), Touchy Girl Who Over-Reacts To Everything (secretly hiding an insecure/socially-conservative heart!), Cheerful Rogue Who Only Looks Out For Himself (secretly hiding a caring heart!), Just Plain Wacky/Crazy Fool (secretly hiding a sane brain!), Plucky Big-Eyed Waif Child Who Tries Real Hard (secretly... wait, no, this one's pretty much all surface), etc. This wouldn't be so bad in a genre that didn't depend so much on narrative and empathy for the characters, but it can be hard to feel like the NPCs are real people when nearly any of them could be swapped with the equivalent character from any other JRPG without making a difference.Avida said:
JRPG plots are just as bad - does this sound familiar? "Many years ago an ancient dark power threatened to destroy all life, but it was stopped in a very dramatic fashion by ancient heroes and bottled up somehow. Since then the world has flourished into a fantasy-medieval agricultural paradise. Now the ancient evil has escaped its confinement and is threatening to destroy the world again. For some reason, the only one who can stop it is an anti-social/happy-go-lucky teenage boy."
And the storylines in most JRPGs aren't deep, they're just complicated. Ray Huling's Escapist article from a few weeks ago, The Battleship Final Fantasy [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_179/5544-The-Battleship-Final-Fantasy], explains it better than I could:
[blockquote]Much of the acclaim for FFIV's plot focuses on its complexity. At least six major betrayals occur. Four playable characters suffer amnesia or mind control. Five playable characters commit suicide for noble ends. Four of them recover. Cecil's best friend, Kain, supports him, betrays him, supports him again, betrays him again, then, finally, supports him once more. Three playable characters turn out to be related. Seven turn out to be nobility.
What both fans and the developers of Final Fantasy have misunderstood is that no one enjoys this plot for itself. In its own right, the plot of FFIV is idiotic. It just seems good because we mistake the fun of playing a varied game for delight in a winding narrative. FFIV has such risible convolutions because these betrayals and deaths and family ties justify the constant rotation of the party roster. They vary gameplay. It's one thing to face down challenges with a Dark Knight and a Dragoon; it's something quite different with a Paladin, two kid magicians and an old wizard. The plot serves merely to explain why the player has one set of options rather than another.[/blockquote]
Another common trick JRPGs use to simulate depth is to always be giving out "profound" life lessons. Hence the double-sided characters: the sarcastic kid who hates everyone learns the value of friendship, the touchy girl who's always yelling at boys learns to open her heart to love, the egocentric one learns to respect their family, blah blah blah. But these lessons are always presented with the depth and skill of a television soap opera's Christmas special. It's embarassing.
Admittedly, the cliches in JRPGs stand out more to Westerners because they're standards of a different culture. There are plenty of cliches in Western games - because the world needs more grizzled macho space marines, apparently - which aren't as distinctive because they fit into the rest of the culture we're used to (e.g. action films starring grizzled macho muscle men). That doesn't make the Japanese games any less repetitive, though.
EDIT: I nearly forgot! Why does every Japanese game have to have a boy who looks like a girl?
Ver. 3Damien the Pigeon said:
Main guy: Oh no! Slimes are attacking my grandmother in her tiny mountainside shack! I have to stop them!
*Blork*
You are now a lvl. 2 slime.
The Suikoden Series kills a lot of the cliche's people here hate you know...
Anyway...
Ones I really want to see die?
JRPG Cliches...
Random Encounters
The Amnesiatic Hero
The "Alas my poor peasant village" trope
The girly emo lead (Yuri Lowell looks like a girly man, Yuri Hyuga on the other hand is awesome)
The japanese feminine ideal female lead (Yuna, Estelle, Polka, Aerith etc. you get the idea)
The "no gameplay outside of battle" formula that so many JRPG's are locked into
WRPG Cliches...
The "Lone" Hero without any real companions
Poorly done Moral Choice Systems where you can pick between "Saint" and "Baby Eater"
Storyless Dungeon Crawls
Anyway...
Ones I really want to see die?
JRPG Cliches...
Random Encounters
The Amnesiatic Hero
The "Alas my poor peasant village" trope
The girly emo lead (Yuri Lowell looks like a girly man, Yuri Hyuga on the other hand is awesome)
The japanese feminine ideal female lead (Yuna, Estelle, Polka, Aerith etc. you get the idea)
The "no gameplay outside of battle" formula that so many JRPG's are locked into
WRPG Cliches...
The "Lone" Hero without any real companions
Poorly done Moral Choice Systems where you can pick between "Saint" and "Baby Eater"
Storyless Dungeon Crawls
The evil villain trying to "Destroy the world" ones are always one that made no sense.
Or how about the villain(s) almost always being evil immoral assholes for no reason.
Or how about the villain(s) almost always being evil immoral assholes for no reason.
Non-humans in fantasy, fuck it, even in sci-fi often feels a little lazy to me.
The "curse your inevitable betrayal moments".
I know its a minor thing but the lack of realistic economic structures in games. I love Morowind but what the hell did everyone eat? There were like three farms and no discernible trade routes.
The "curse your inevitable betrayal moments".
I know its a minor thing but the lack of realistic economic structures in games. I love Morowind but what the hell did everyone eat? There were like three farms and no discernible trade routes.
Thanks for pointing that out rossatdi it made me remember this one:
Unrealistic Worlds with...
1 City/Town Countries
No notable Farms/Farmland or even places where it "could" exist.
A lack of history (most JRPG's really suffer from this)
Unrealistic Worlds with...
1 City/Town Countries
No notable Farms/Farmland or even places where it "could" exist.
A lack of history (most JRPG's really suffer from this)
The main protagonist is an angsty teen boy with spiky hair
Females' seeming inability to wear actual clothing
Lack of selection of weapons available for characters specializing in "unarmed" combat (e.g. brass knuckles)
Final bosses somehow reincarnating every time you defeat them
Grinding
Stories starting after someone either moved or transferred schools
Anti-establishment vibes
Perky girls who won't shut the hell up
But the one that pisses me off the most often is the JRPG refusal to use anything but turn-based combat.
Females' seeming inability to wear actual clothing
Lack of selection of weapons available for characters specializing in "unarmed" combat (e.g. brass knuckles)
Final bosses somehow reincarnating every time you defeat them
Grinding
Stories starting after someone either moved or transferred schools
Anti-establishment vibes
Perky girls who won't shut the hell up
But the one that pisses me off the most often is the JRPG refusal to use anything but turn-based combat.
Armor and weapons that "you're not powerful enough to use yet". When did this ever make sense?
Females wearing enough armor to barely cover a baby.
The whole world seeming to revolve around the protagonist. I really, really hate this one. It makes the plot make almost no sense.
Example: Titan Quest.
"Hey you, person who looks like a normal citizen! Go fight those freaky looking monsters, and if you come back alive, we'll make you do it again!"
Females wearing enough armor to barely cover a baby.
The whole world seeming to revolve around the protagonist. I really, really hate this one. It makes the plot make almost no sense.
Example: Titan Quest.
"Hey you, person who looks like a normal citizen! Go fight those freaky looking monsters, and if you come back alive, we'll make you do it again!"
I wish more people died and stayed dead in RPG's. This was why FFT and Tactics Ogre was so awesome...when a character died (or was turned into a crystal) they weer dead.
In FFT if you looked up a famous characters BIO it would tell you where exactly they died.
In FFT if you looked up a famous characters BIO it would tell you where exactly they died.