Poll: Sexism and your gender
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I don't find half naked female characters with big boobs sexist, I find it amusing. However, I do find it a little lazy from a development perspective, is it really that hard to create an original female character?
Female.
Female.
Much more sexism toward men these days. But the fact is nobody actually cares that it's sexist. And if i'm honest, neither do I.
But women constantly say that it's literally them. For example, my girlfriend was screaming about how women always have to take their top off, to which I replied "well, how many times have you seen men take their top off?" and she said it "wasn't the same."
Why isn't it the same? She then replied with "Well, women always have to go out of their way to look good with their tops off!" To which I reply, "so do men, they are always ripped and handsome. Do you think they got to that state naturally? No."
So yeah...
Male here.
But women constantly say that it's literally them. For example, my girlfriend was screaming about how women always have to take their top off, to which I replied "well, how many times have you seen men take their top off?" and she said it "wasn't the same."
Why isn't it the same? She then replied with "Well, women always have to go out of their way to look good with their tops off!" To which I reply, "so do men, they are always ripped and handsome. Do you think they got to that state naturally? No."
So yeah...
Male here.
Well, one thing I often look into when something is being labbeled as mysoginistic is; are the men actually portrayed any better? If no and the male cast is made up of nothing but loathesome, lumbering, belligerent, troglodyte's for whom you would not dispense a modicum of sympathy than I'll chock that one up to bad writing as opposed to sexism, which isn't necessarily great either, but hey at least they aren't propagating bigotry. Obviously it's not that simple and you have to take everything in context when looking at a particular game, it's this question seems to be rather vague and I'm merely putting forward that you have to look at the portrayal's of both genders before decrying something of sexism. One thing that I will opine on is that I simply don't understand the mentality of the marketers and consumers alike who fall prey to the 'sex sells' mindset. Now I'm not saying you can't have attractive characters, but why do you feel the need to insult my fucking intelligence by trying to allure me with the promise of some vapid obsequious bombshell's static pixellated cleavage who's only purpose is to serve as eyecandy? I truly don't understand it, why in the hell are you looking for titillation in a game? Doesn't this kind of blatant pandering just seem desperate? As if they're trying to compensate for some crappy mechanics by appealing toward the lowest common demoninator? Seriously, I know this is an obvious platitude, but if you want porn, then the Internet is a fucking fountain of lecherous indulgence and it continues to elude me as to why you would front your cash for a more censored version of something that is of far more plentiful supply for free on the web? But really, you don't need to put someone in a string bikini to make them seem attractive and you don't have to shoehorn them into a relationship to give them a sense of worth; see Bonnie McFarlane for an example. And I don't actually believe that many people actually will buy a game, or have their decision heavily influenced by the prospect of sex appeal; that's not what I and fucking well hope many others actually buy a game for. Once we can move past this perception that the core gaming audience is encompassed by impetuous, horny, adolescent boys, then perhaps we'll see a significant drop in this pandering to their desires. With that jumbled, incoherent rant on something vaguely relevant out of the way, I'll mention that I'm male.
Female here...
I don't really notice. If big FPS games had playable female characters, I can see ONLY men using them.
I can't stand the crap from guys online, female characters just draws more attention.
But seriously, you can't really imagine and evil nuclear scientist with a lust for power to be a female.
Female version of Niko Belic?
Nope.
Female Makarov?
Nope.
Female Master Chief?
mabeh...
I don't really notice. If big FPS games had playable female characters, I can see ONLY men using them.
I can't stand the crap from guys online, female characters just draws more attention.
But seriously, you can't really imagine and evil nuclear scientist with a lust for power to be a female.
Female version of Niko Belic?
Nope.
Female Makarov?
Nope.
Female Master Chief?
mabeh...
My favourite racing game (Need for Speed SHIFT), features scantily clad women wandering around the start line at race where the cars start from a stop. Not hard to guess why they're there.kman123 said:
I don't really care about sexism in games that much, since I'm male, and games are targeted at me. However, it does bother me when a game developer thinks I'm gonna buy it simply because it has some hot girl wearing a pair of metal bra and panties. Not only is that just stupid (from a combat perspective), I feel like the game is saying "Hey, you! You're a fat nerd, who happens to be a 40-year-old virgin, right? Boy will you ever like what I have for you!" Thanks crappy MMO, now you really have me interested...
Oh, and I'm male, in case you couldn't figure that one out.
EVERYTHING is sexist to some degree in this modern media world. This is why Psycho Mantis went crazy. Sex, sexuality, sexist attitudes, homosexuality, gender roles, gender stereotypes, transgender issues...
Sometimes it's enough to make you want to scream!
Sometimes it's enough to make you want to scream!
Female here.
I think Skullgirls looks fun and cartoony and portrays sexy looking women being badass. I'm kind of all for that.
The Witcher pisses me off more. That's got cleavages by the dozens and you get achievements for being a man-whore - it's like an RPG with a sex mini-game tacked on. I went and talked to the elf girl who I like during the night (because she seems vaguely demure unlike witch Booby McCleavage you're supposed to bang at the start - guess what? Turned the whore down) and she sleeps in see-through lingerie ... and was fine talking to Geralt in said lingerie with her nipples showing.
Ok so I still like The Witcher ... but the obvious pandering to male gratification pisses me off every time I stumble over it.
I don't find it sexist though I guess ... just annoying. Where are my buff men to oogle?
Unless someone says or does something truly believing that men/women are inferior to women/men then I take it all in jest. If they're serious ... they're dumbasses and should be ignored.
I think Skullgirls looks fun and cartoony and portrays sexy looking women being badass. I'm kind of all for that.
The Witcher pisses me off more. That's got cleavages by the dozens and you get achievements for being a man-whore - it's like an RPG with a sex mini-game tacked on. I went and talked to the elf girl who I like during the night (because she seems vaguely demure unlike witch Booby McCleavage you're supposed to bang at the start - guess what? Turned the whore down) and she sleeps in see-through lingerie ... and was fine talking to Geralt in said lingerie with her nipples showing.
Ok so I still like The Witcher ... but the obvious pandering to male gratification pisses me off every time I stumble over it.
I don't find it sexist though I guess ... just annoying. Where are my buff men to oogle?
Unless someone says or does something truly believing that men/women are inferior to women/men then I take it all in jest. If they're serious ... they're dumbasses and should be ignored.
Male here.
I worry about lack of diversity. I don't mind the exxistence of games like Rumble Roses or Angelique. I worry that there is only games like Rumble Roses or Angelique.
Some of the mainstream plagues include: fanservice girls, muscled machos (west) OR feminine men (east), FPSs and sequels, movie.
If it was mandatory that all games should be assexual it would be equally bad.
BTW, gonna play Skullgirls. Sexy, cool girls with background and personality. But a game with a main female protagonist with a humble figure wouldn't hurt.
I worry about lack of diversity. I don't mind the exxistence of games like Rumble Roses or Angelique. I worry that there is only games like Rumble Roses or Angelique.
Some of the mainstream plagues include: fanservice girls, muscled machos (west) OR feminine men (east), FPSs and sequels, movie.
If it was mandatory that all games should be assexual it would be equally bad.
BTW, gonna play Skullgirls. Sexy, cool girls with background and personality. But a game with a main female protagonist with a humble figure wouldn't hurt.
Because the male characters have various heroic poses that show of their abilities and character they are heroic while Black Widow is there to show of her bum. There are other posters where she is in a sexy pose aswell which is what pushed the artist to make this spoof picture.Whatthe said:Is there a reason that this is considered sexist? I know that you say that this indicates the attitude toward female characters but that does not mean it has the quality of sexism. Female characters are posed in a way that is most appealing to the demographic but does that indicate inferiority?xXxJessicaxXx said:This is what women have to put up with everyday in games, movies and comics. Female characters are put on display for men while male characters have relevant character based poses. It's pretty indicative of the attitude towards female characters.
(particularly love Iron Man in the usual Samus pose...)
By the way I only ask this to see if you have a good reason for this belief not because of my belief that this is or is not sexist. I just want to know why people genuinely think this is wrong.
The female character is clearly there to just look pretty and isn't represented as an equal alongside the other characters. That's why it's sexist.
There isn't any reason they couldn't have her doing a karate kick or something representing her combat ability.
The demographic argument is one that comes up a lot and frankly it's a circular argument you see maybe comic books would be more accessible to women if the demographic wasn't pandered to so much and so the demographic would change.
Female here. Some things piss me off yes, not with specific games or characters generally but with the games industry as a whole. tho I think the issue is often exagertaed and whether or not something pisses me off depends on context. There is little diversity with female characters and the emphasis in promos is often more on how "sexy" they look rather than their abilities. If you?re female you have to be young, pretty and drop off the face of the earth at 30. It?s not just main characters either, most male main character are at least decent looking but with girls its minor characters too. Female villains tend to be sluty and female side characters usually seem to be either damsels in distress or damsels in distress in disguise and almost always get ?light? combat roles.
But hey at least I can find a number of RPGs and MMO?s that actually have decent armour for female characters rather than miniskirts, underwear and metal bikinis now and there are some decent female characters so I guess things are improving.
But hey at least I can find a number of RPGs and MMO?s that actually have decent armour for female characters rather than miniskirts, underwear and metal bikinis now and there are some decent female characters so I guess things are improving.
This right here is my idea of equality (yeh main dude could be considered more important by being centrally placed but cmon, gimme a break xD).SeanSeanston said:I mean... wut?
I dunno about sexism as it tends to confuse the hell out of me (see the whole skullgirls debacle, that in my book is not sexist unless you really want it to be) and usually seems like one sided fanservice most of the time rather then actual "one gender is clearly inferior" banter that I always thought sexism is. Things like revealing clothes for example i dont view as sexist in itself, rather it tends to become a norm for female characters and their sole characteristic/contribution to the product they are involved in.
I genuinely have no problem with either cover. Both would be marketing ploys designed to appeal to certain audiences more then others. If anything this female friendly version should have the male superheros with their top off, or at least thats what the twilight covers told me.xXxJessicaxXx said:
Male here:
I am going to take the position Jimquizition took. Take an RPG for example, notice how men get heavy armor while females get bikinis. Rather than just put the female in clad armor, why not just put the male in a speedo? equivalent exchange that both sides can enjoy. Plus there may be sexual themes spurring up around skull girls, but I say nobody complaining when dead or alive extreme beach volleyball 2 came around. There are dozens more games that I have seen that are more "offensive" than skull girls
I am going to take the position Jimquizition took. Take an RPG for example, notice how men get heavy armor while females get bikinis. Rather than just put the female in clad armor, why not just put the male in a speedo? equivalent exchange that both sides can enjoy. Plus there may be sexual themes spurring up around skull girls, but I say nobody complaining when dead or alive extreme beach volleyball 2 came around. There are dozens more games that I have seen that are more "offensive" than skull girls
Female here. (Also a lesbian)
And yeah, I'm annoyed at the lot of how women are represented in the media and I also complain about the sexism a lot.
It's not that I'm opposed to sexy female (or men, for you who prefer that) characters as such, (although I don't really find scantily-clad big-breasted women particularly sexy) but character development and personality would be nice.
And yeah, I'm annoyed at the lot of how women are represented in the media and I also complain about the sexism a lot.
It's not that I'm opposed to sexy female (or men, for you who prefer that) characters as such, (although I don't really find scantily-clad big-breasted women particularly sexy) but character development and personality would be nice.
I'm a male and tend to think that yeah, it can be sexist, but more often tan not it's due to laziness rather than sexism.
well the main games i have played in recent years were wow and rift. Male armour the higherhe level the more you got covered and the bulkier the armour. female armour the more you level the less arour you seem to wear until you wearing a chastity belt and a metal bra.
is this sexism or is it just knowing your target audience, in my expeience like 90% of rift is played by dudes who probably enjoy looking at skimpy dressed chicks.
male
is this sexism or is it just knowing your target audience, in my expeience like 90% of rift is played by dudes who probably enjoy looking at skimpy dressed chicks.
male
Thing about games is that players don't want to play as themselves (the average person). Players want to lose themselves in the story and get the feeling that they are awesome. So in the case of male players, they want to feel like powerful bad asses. So as they progress through the game their character gets bigger and bulkier and in general more bad ass (or if there is not advancement system they start off as relatively big and bad ass). This is from society's perspective that men SHOULD be big, strong, intelligent, handsome creatures with a variety of charming personalities (suave, protective, brave, you get the idea), and gives us our own personal image of the ideal man (what we wish we could become). Which subconsciously makes men want to play a game as someone of these qualities (the reasons for men playing as women vary though). So the fact that women don't see how men are portrayed in games is sexist, means they are obviously oblivious to the fact that they are holding the same ridiculous standard for men that men hold them to.
Female players are no different than male players in the sense that they don't want to play as themselves. The difference is, that women inherently want to feel beautiful. You females may deny it, but you all secretly want approval from the opposite gender (or in the case of lesbians the same gender). Society has given you too the idea of what the ideal woman is, which you subconsciously will model your character after. So while this could possibly be considered sexist, that's rather impossible since it's the same deal with men.
Now then, statistically men play a lot more video games than women (A LOT more). Since sex is a selling point, and the main audience is male, daintily clad females will sell more games. Meanwhile if it is taken out or daintily clad males are added; it will make women feel better and maybe add a few more sales, but in the end will either drive away male players or fail to attract the male players to the game. Since men make up a vast majority of the sales, that means that your losing a lot of sales.
BTW most men, although they like to look at these definitions of a barbie doll, would never want to be in a relationship with one of these women. (I said most because its not true of all and I realize that)
if you couldn't figure out, I am male...
Female players are no different than male players in the sense that they don't want to play as themselves. The difference is, that women inherently want to feel beautiful. You females may deny it, but you all secretly want approval from the opposite gender (or in the case of lesbians the same gender). Society has given you too the idea of what the ideal woman is, which you subconsciously will model your character after. So while this could possibly be considered sexist, that's rather impossible since it's the same deal with men.
Now then, statistically men play a lot more video games than women (A LOT more). Since sex is a selling point, and the main audience is male, daintily clad females will sell more games. Meanwhile if it is taken out or daintily clad males are added; it will make women feel better and maybe add a few more sales, but in the end will either drive away male players or fail to attract the male players to the game. Since men make up a vast majority of the sales, that means that your losing a lot of sales.
BTW most men, although they like to look at these definitions of a barbie doll, would never want to be in a relationship with one of these women. (I said most because its not true of all and I realize that)
if you couldn't figure out, I am male...
I'm against sexism no matter which gender it's directed towards. I cannot fathom to understand why people are so against racism but still tell sexist jokes and thinks they are alright. It's the same thing: instead of skin colour it's the the producing organs.
I'm male.
I'm male.