If they've already had the child (the nasty lawbreakers them), then that's nothing a guillotine can't solve.antiwheat said:So... what would you do with the babies then? Take them away from their parents because they failed some test? Surely no parent has the answers when they first have a child, they learn a lot of it as they go along. That's how it's worked for thousands of years and we've still managed to progress so far, putting people into space and managing to establish systems of running whole countries.
How exactly would you go about testing whether somebody is a fit parent anyway. Someone who has had a criminal record may put much more effort into raising their kids than a doctor who prioritises their work above everything else. How would you determine things like this?
Oh wow... I was going to say no... but this makes me want to say yes...Kuchinawa212 said:I mean this is kind my case
What good can come of that
You kinda of need some sort a "license" for certain things already.zidine100 said:No way in hell this should happen, what next will you will need a licence to live? A licence to breathe? a licence to buy food and water? A licence to get an education? a Licence to own money? i could go on if you want. Why are we even suggesting that we take away someones natural right to have a child, just because they didnt pass a test. I would also like to bring in the great cliqe (sp?) human rights into this, you can probably guess what im going to say about it.
edit: hell, the amount of people who said yes to this make me loose some more faith in humanity already. Im biting my tounge on this matter........
I agree. Parents only get a general basis of how to be a "good" parent from their parents. Someone stated earlier that the only way we learn how to raise kids is through actually raising them. Cause and effect. If you've never had children on your own, how would you know what's "right or wrong"? Yeah, common sense can come into play, but that only can get half (if not more) of the job done.LockHeart said:. . .
Seriously, the majority of parents (in one aspect or another) are 'bad' - they let their kids get away with things, they spoil them, they don't supervise them properly, they trust them enough to deny accusations of poor behaviour etc. To all of the people who answered 'yes' - just think as to what would have happened if your parents had failed this test? Seem like such an attractive option now?
that is a decent argument, but from what i can tell you are more against the lack of ability of punishment, for children than wanting the license itself, that is if i understood your post right. Either way it is rather well thought out.Srsly said:You kinda of need some sort a "license" for certain things already.zidine100 said:No way in hell this should happen, what next will you will need a licence to live? A licence to breathe? a licence to buy food and water? A licence to get an education? a Licence to own money? i could go on if you want. Why are we even suggesting that we take away someones natural right to have a child, just because they didnt pass a test. I would also like to bring in the great cliqe (sp?) human rights into this, you can probably guess what im going to say about it.
edit: hell, the amount of people who said yes to this make me loose some more faith in humanity already. Im biting my tounge on this matter........
Don't have a job? No food, shelter, clothing and you leech off American taxpayers money.
Don't have a high school education? Good luck finding a job other than McDonalds.
Don't have a college degree? (including technical school) Good luck going into retail.
Don't have your Master's degree? Good luck trying to move up on the pay scale, especially in this economy.
Want to be in the medical field? You better have your medical license to prove that to me before hand.
Honestly, we all have choices in life. Having a job, education, etc. are necessary choices in life. Having a child is as much of a choice as it is a privilege. But just like getting a job, a license, a degree, we have to prove ourselves to someone that we deserve it. What makes the idea of proving you're a fit parent any different? Yes, I agree that this takes away SOME human rights and freedom. Yes, I agree that most of these "ideas" are seeming off the wall and just asinine, but don't think that this hasn't passed through other's minds. I'd personally would be much happier seeing a child in a home with anyone that is willing to put their lives' aside for their children. No matter how rich or poor you are, that doesn't determine good or bad parenting.
Some of the best parents are middle-class. I know my parents are. They're a little screwy, but they mean well and do the best they can for both my brother and I. Some bust their ass for their kids, making sure they give them whatever their kids needs. However, this all goes back psychologically. If the parents were never raised up correctly by their parents, what examples can they go off of? How many of us have said that "I never want to grow up like my mom/dad?" But we fall into the same cycle regardless due to exposure. I think educating EVERYONE would be better. Regardless of how much or little you make. Some of the poorest people do the best they can to help their child to the best of their abilities. While some parents are so focused on their careers, they tend to pay less attention to their families, but they can provide for them. How does that make them better parents? It doesn't. Parents are suppose to be CAREGIVERS. Not "I can give you the financial stability you need, but not the emotional support you need and deserve" people. That's just bullshit.
It sucks we can't brainwash people to be better people psychologically. It all start mentally then the physical aspects come into play. If we're screwed up in the head with a great job, doesn't mean you'd be a better parent than someone that grew up in a home environment that gave them the support they needed.
Yeah, we have human rights but we've been abusing it for centuries. A little modification to something isn't THAT bad. It's just wrong to put it in the hands of other people that are possibly just as screwed up as the rest of us. No one should have that much power, even if it would help us in the end.
On the point of child rearing, that's a whole other ball game. Just like you can't tell people they can or can't have kids, you can't tell people how to rear their kids. Everyone assumes they know what's best for their kids. But when you have bad ass little kids kicking on the back of my seat at a theater... Ugh. Parents should stop being so scared of their kids and start discipling them and teaching them respect. Child services give so much power to kids that it's ridiculous. Your parents swats your ass cause I told you not to touch it, some kids would claim they'll call DYFS on them. If you show your kid no fear like you're SUPPOSE to, then we wouldn't have a problem. Then DYFS wouldn't have to deal with child cases of kids that don't know how to listen to their parents and actually DEAL with parents that are neglecting their kids.
[sub]Go go Child Psych. classes![/sub]
i know this is not the best of counter arguments, but a job is only about money, whereas parenting and childbirth is about a life itself and the continuation of a family, forcing someone to destroy a life and deniying them a family is somewhat.... iffy, based on there intelegence and there suitablity, sure its a womans body therefore she has the right to decide what happens to it indefinently (before you mention abortion). I know the whole natural selection argument may come into play here, but that is a somewhat disturbing sentament in itself.But just like getting a job, a license, a degree, we have to prove ourselves to someone that we deserve it.
The job was just an example. But you still need to prove yourselves to your bosses/supervisors. Even if it mainly for the money, you still have to prove your proficiency to your boss to maintain your job. Lack of proficiency could mean lack of hours or lack of a job.zidine100 said:i know this is not the best of counter arguments, but a job is only about money, whereas parenting and childbirth is about a life itself and the continuation of a family, forcing someone to destroy a life and deniying them a family is somewhat.... iffy, based on there intelegence and there suitablity, sure its a womans body therefore she has the right to decide what happens to it indefinently (before you mention abortion). I know the whole natural selection argument may come into play here, but that is a somewhat disturbing sentament in itself.
I'm not saying to deny someone from having their kids, but to educate them before to have them. Suggesting good ways to raise kids rather than forcibly telling people how to raise kids. Some people take better to suggestion rather than a direct command.whereas parenting and childbirth is about a life itself and the continuation of a family, forcing someone to destroy a life and deniying them a family is somewhat.... iffy
I also agree that there have been cases that came from nothing and made something of their lives. That depends on the resilience of the individual. Many people are born innately with this. However, with lack of support (mainly emotionally), the resilience to do something better with your life would be slim. If no one's there to push you to do better, why should you? If you don't have enough self-confidence because no one told you, how would you know? Humans need validation in some sort of way. Whether it's a "good job" or a pat on the back, we need something.Also there has been many a good child coming from a bad background who from what i understand would have failed this test, my parients probably would have failed.... and i wouldnt exist because of this licence. Hence why i feel stongly about this.