Poll: So... Diablo 3 or Torchlight 2?

[Vigormortis]

My point is, you don't have to always be online with Steam. You can access and play all of your games without an internet connection. But with Diablo 3, you have no choice. It's online or not at all.

The hypocrisy comes from people bitching about Steam requiring online activation of games, but then defending Diablo 3 requiring a constant connection to the B.net servers. (not sure where you got the idea that I was implying Steam is always online too)

Out of curiosity, if I may ask, what grievances do you have with Steam if not the online aspect of it?

Your right steam isnt always online its either online its just that their offline mode is complete crap and doesnt work three quarters of the time.

As for why I dont like it well it runs like shit, its more expensive then anywhere else, its useless drm, their customer service sucks and they treat their customers like shit.

Sorry to hear you've had such problems. From my experience, and that of most people I know, those issues have never come up.

The offline mode works every time for me, so long as I make sure my games are up-to-date since the last Steam Client update. (easily done by just loading up the games I want to play in offline mode, just one time, prior to going offline) The client runs just fine for me and barely touches my system resources; save for the few times I ran it in beta mode. (during feature update tests. there were a few times it became a resource hog.)

As for prices, they have been almost universally cheaper for me than any place else, especially compared to retail. Granted, I am in the US, and I know the currency conversion woes of users over-seas (something that is pretty stupid), but for me it's almost always been cheaper.

I've never had issue with their customer service. They've certainly never treated me "like shit", anyway. The few times I've had to contact them I received expedient responses and had my issues cleared up in no time. I know my case isn't the same for everyone. I know some people have had trouble. But then again, what companies customer service is perfect? (that doesn't excuse bad customer service, of course)

It's a shame your experience hasn't been similar to mine.

 

[ecoho]

As always, I hope chopping up your post doesn't lead you to perceive a tone of condescension. It helps me organize my thoughts.

Pay to win implies it's spawned into the game.

No, it implies exactly what it sounds like. Paying money for an in-game advantage is pay-to-win.

You cannot argue that point.

Then I'll die in the attempt!

Those same items can be bought by in game currency, and still involve a player investing the time into attaining those items.

The seller invest his time as per usual, but the buyer has not invested his. He invests dollars instead. That's the definition of pay-to-win if there ever was such a thing.

Pay to win is spawning items into the game that did not exist prior to this: in this case, they already exist in that another player spent the time or crafting necessary to make it, and then chose to sell it for an alternative currency rather then the in-game one.

This is a totally arbitrary distinction contrived specifically to bend the definition of pay-to-win around Blizzard's RMAH and defend their practices. These contrivances are becoming ever more absurd to keep pace with Blizzard's policies.

If anything, it's pay to be lazy. Which already existed in these games anyways. The "advantage" is available to any player willing to put the time in, not just those willing to slap down money. And clearly anyone can obtain, because someone has to first unlock/find/create the item before it can even appear on the AH.

The same applies to many games which use a more standard and uncontroversially 'pay-to-win' model.

Don't get rude, when clearly you don't understand the concept yourself, you just jump on the hate train.

ALL ABOARD THAT'S COMIN' ABOARD!!! HATE TRAIN IS LEAVING THE STATION!!!

Even if I'm wrong about an auction house that accepts real money falling under the definition of pay-to-win, the point is it sucks. Games are more fun when they have a sense of fair play- when the rules are the same for everyone. Especially when collecting loot is a big part of the game's draw and challenge, the real money auction house ruins that. It's about as satisfying as mailing the items out to players randomly. It ruins the game's sense of fair play, it's sense of challenge, as well as the concept of the auction house itself. It's no fun.

For years, if you bought gold or items in games like World of Warcraft you couldn't show your face on a gaming site like this one. Now Blizzard is doing something even worse and everyone thinks it's wonderful. It's a really remarkable reversal of widely held opinions.

thank you. you did a much better job explaining this to that guy then I did, i just hope he actually reads it.

 

[Adultism]

From the pros and cons you listed Diablo 3 will probably be more fun for you. I have Diablo 3 and I just RECENTLY as in YESTERDAY became a huge fan of the diablo series lol. Its pretty much perfection in my eyes.

It is not however, the best game ever made.

Also a lot of the points people are making towards con are rediculous and any sane person would not worry about it. Oh no real life money for weapons. What do you think happens in EVERY GAME? They just decided to embrace it rather than outlaw and ban people for it. I see gold sellers in every game. Always online? Well as long as you don't have garbage internet you should be fine. I mean the game is AWESOME the classes are fun playing with people is fun. I have not met a SINGLE PERSON IRL who did not like Diablo 3 AFTER they played it.

AND if you have NOT played the game then you have NO right to complain about features for a game that you do not even own.

 

[Rooster Cogburn]

From the pros and cons you listed Diablo 3 will probably be more fun for you. I have Diablo 3 and I just RECENTLY as in YESTERDAY became a huge fan of the diablo series lol. Its pretty much perfection in my eyes.

It is not however, the best game ever made.

Also a lot of the points people are making towards con are rediculous and any sane person would not worry about it. Oh no real life money for weapons. What do you think happens in EVERY GAME? They just decided to embrace it rather than outlaw and ban people for it. I see gold sellers in every game. Always online? Well as long as you don't have garbage internet you should be fine. I mean the game is AWESOME the classes are fun playing with people is fun. I have not met a SINGLE PERSON IRL who did not like Diablo 3 AFTER they played it.

AND if you have NOT played the game then you have NO right to complain about features for a game that you do not even own.

I'm itching to know what game is better than perfect, lol. Just joshin' ya.

I know other games have suffered from gold and item sellers. I hated it then just like I hate it now. The day before we learned about the real money auction house, that was a pretty widely held opinion. Blizzard's shit doesn't stink less than some Chinese gold farmer's as far as I'm concerned. Instead of fixing the problem, they have embraced it. I see how that is better for Blizzard but I don't see how it is better for me.

The quality of my connection doesn't matter. I want to be able to play single player on reasonable terms, wherever I may be, without lag (on their side), and with mods. I want to play it after their servers spontaneously combust and Kenyan socialism destroys civilization. And sure I have a right to complain. Or at least a right to criticize. I mean, what's stopping me? I would own the game if it had the features I wanted. Surely that's worth a mention.

I'm sure the game has a lot going for it. I believe every word you say about how fun it is, and I am not just saying this to patronize you. But I would prefer to play my games on terms more favorable to the player. And without fun-killers like the real money auction house.

 

[Adultism]

From the pros and cons you listed Diablo 3 will probably be more fun for you. I have Diablo 3 and I just RECENTLY as in YESTERDAY became a huge fan of the diablo series lol. Its pretty much perfection in my eyes.

It is not however, the best game ever made.

Also a lot of the points people are making towards con are rediculous and any sane person would not worry about it. Oh no real life money for weapons. What do you think happens in EVERY GAME? They just decided to embrace it rather than outlaw and ban people for it. I see gold sellers in every game. Always online? Well as long as you don't have garbage internet you should be fine. I mean the game is AWESOME the classes are fun playing with people is fun. I have not met a SINGLE PERSON IRL who did not like Diablo 3 AFTER they played it.

AND if you have NOT played the game then you have NO right to complain about features for a game that you do not even own.

I'm itching to know what game is better than perfect, lol. Just joshin' ya.

I know other games have suffered from gold and item sellers. I hated it then just like I hate it now. The day before we learned about the real money auction house, that was a pretty widely held opinion. Blizzard's shit doesn't stink less than some Chinese gold farmer's as far as I'm concerned. Instead of fixing the problem, they have embraced it. I see how that is better for Blizzard but I don't see how it is better for me.

The quality of my connection doesn't matter. I want to be able to play single player on reasonable terms, wherever I may be, without lag (on their side), and with mods. I want to play it after their servers spontaneously combust and Kenyan socialism destroys civilization. And sure I have a right to complain. Or at least a right to criticize. I mean, what's stopping me? I would own the game if it had the features I wanted. Surely that's worth a mention.

I'm sure the game has a lot going for it. I believe every word you say about how fun it is, and I am not just saying this to patronize you. But I would prefer to play my games on terms more favorable to the player. And without fun-killers like the real money auction house.

I understand where you are coming from. They need to nerf some stuff I'm pretty much immortal as a DEMON HUNTER on act 3. My gear is so OP I could probably PVP with a level 40 (i'm 25) There are plenty of problems but nothing that has bothered me. I ran into my first glitch an hour ago and I can't attack these stupid birds because they attack and then fly up where you cant hit them. But you can't even hit them when they come down to attack its pretty weird we eventually had like 20 of these birds following us around and they were pretty much one hitting one

 

[Snowblindblitz]

thank you. you did a much better job explaining this to that guy then I did, i just hope he actually reads it.

I did. I still don't share yours and his point of view on it. But I don't like continuing an argument unnecessarily, we both presented our points on the matter, and I still hold my view and him his.

On topic, I'm loving Diablo 3. Most of the story just screams of treat for long term players, and the classes have some interesting back story, that comes out through dialog with npcs, which I enjoy over "MY NAME IS VANN AND I WANNA BE A SKY PIRATE."

Sorry, FF12 fans, he bothers me lol.

 

[jehk]

I won't be picking up Torchlight 2 until someone mods out identify and town portal scrolls.

 

[PPB]

I bought Diablo 3 and will probably buy Torchlight 2 eventually, but mostly for playing on my laptop when I'm away from my desktop and a reliable connection. I played the TL2 beta last weekend and I was honestly not all that impressed. I liked TL1 but I think it had several problems, mostly with the characters and skills design (too many passive and overlapping skills between the classes) and the completely linear dungeons. TL2 really seems like it's more of the same, except in a larger world.

I'm not saying Diablo 3 is perfect, far from it, but I honestly don't see what Torchlight 2 has over it aside from the more modest requirements and offline play. I understand that some people would prefer the skill system but as far as I'm concerned I always thought that this approach was flawed. Again, D3's approach isn't perfect either, but at least they're trying something different. Also, mana for all classes and potion chugging strikes me as being an old mechanic that doesn't really deserve to be carried on forever.

 

[Norrdicus]

I won't be picking up Torchlight 2 until someone mods out identify and town portal scrolls.

I have to say, in the beta. I barely used either of those.

I think I found like 5 unidentified items and about 10 scrolls.

I also warped back to town like twice? You rely on your pet a lot more to pawn off the junk. And generally anything you want to stash can wait until you find a waypoint.

The beta already shows that Torchlight 2 is far better paced than Torchlight 1 was

 

[Norrdicus]

Hell yea, I loved it. I also put it on Veteran because I'd played the first Torchlight on normal and walked through without dyeing (except for Ordrak.... POS). And then played it on VH without dyeing (except for Ordrak.... POS). So I thought I'd walk this too.

But I actually died a few times when I got lured into a trap or was just unprepared. And the Act I end boss is insanely annoying. (atleast for the engineer build I'd made.) I just couldn't seem to hurt him.

So it looks like I'm going to actually have to pay attention to the stats in this game. And stock up on potions. Which I didn't do last game.

Got 2 deaths on normal as well. I nuked through most of it with my ice-elemental Embermage, but those exploding ice spirits and the Regent really caught me off guard.

Then I picked Veteran with one of my friends going "Hey, how bad could that be?"

Well the Mordrox fight (the giant puking zombie) took over 5 minutes and made me spend 20+ health potions