Poll: The Latest AC controversy

[Newbonomicon]

The American Revolution was never about which side was morally justified. It was politics. Charismatic leaders managed to sway the colonists into thinking they'd be better off as their own country, and everyone shot everyone else until that happened. In fact, when you strip away the late justifications and patriotic fervor, the only difference between the American Revolution and the American Civil War was whether or not the separatists won.

However, in the context of Assassins and Templars, Ubisoft can vilify whatever historical figures they want. It's not real, and honestly, shouldn't be taken any more controversially than Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter.

 

[Richardplex]

I'm only potentially being annoyed at the potential 'Merica Fuck Yeah! because of how the founding fathers were Freemasons, which used to be Templars, and Mr Washington has a piece of Eden in AC2, and the potential awesomeness from this might be lost.

Otherwise I could care less.

 

[ProtoChimp]

Between Tomb Raider, Mass Effect and this, I really don't care anymore. I got behind the Mass Effect movement, but I am just so sick of controversy in every single game. "Oh this game is xenophobic." "Oh, this game is racist." "Oh this game is sexist" I JUST WANT TO PLAY MY FREAKING VIDEO GAME! God, I am just sick of all the fucking drama.

Some issues need to be addressed.

 

[jollybarracuda]

Why is this such a big deal? Is it bad to have a game set in America during the Revolutionary War be, oh, i dunno, on America's side? Granted, with Connor being half Native American, I'd expecting a lot of conflicting feelings between his two origins, and Ubisoft has repeatedly stated they don't want to make it "hoorah america!", but i will admit, their advertisements lately have had a very...well...patriotic ring to them. Not that it's bad, but it's like saying you aren't patriotic while you wear an Uncle Sam hat and wave an American flag.

But the game itself i do not believe will be as Pro-America as their advertising leads on, especially if the game goes into the realistic history of America's historical figures and how they weren't exactly idols of perfection and godliness.

 

[Joshey Woshey]

ITT: Oversensitive Brits argue with American who are willfully ignorant of their own state's imperialist tendencies.

Well you've won the thread. Well done, here. *Gives cookie*

 

[DRes82]

i dont understand why so many people have become butthurt over killing british in AC3 ?.. i dont get it... for how many YEARS have we been killing germans, russians, middle-eastern people? i dont get it.. :/

A Dane scolding the British for being too hostile. See what its come to, UK?

I'm still confused as to why its such a thing now to hate Americans. I dare anyone to quote middle east interference or war. I didn't dispatch the US military. I voted against that sort of thing. I'm more in favor of Space Exploration than I am international involvement. I think it would be fine if we just curled up and became isolationists. Focused our efforts on science. Yep.

Can you imagine a world where the US just decided to withdrawal from any involvement outside its borders? It would be special. I'll leave you all to ponder that.

 

[McMullen]

Really?

In AC1 the trailers showed Altair going after Crusaders for the most part, yet both the Saracens and Crusaders were enemies of the Assassins. And though it wasn't made clear until the second game, the Templars were just the continuation of an order established well before the Crusades, well before human civilization in fact.

In Ezio's story arc (I haven't played Revelations yet so I'm unsure of how the Byzantines fit in), it is shown that the church wasn't dominated by the Templars at the beginning; Rodrigo Borgia's rise to power mirrored Ezios, and it wasn't until Brotherhood that the Church was fully a tool of the templars. Even then, there were members of the Church who didn't want to play along, but weren't in a position to do much without getting disappeared. Indeed it's implied that many of the Borgia's poisonings (which did happen in RL) were against priests who wouldn't fall in line. Yes, almost everyone you fight is allied with the Church, but not everyone in the Church is allied with the Borgia. Again, you can't really see this in the trailers.

So I'm not expecting a "'Murica, Fuck Yeah!" storyline. In fact, the trailers themselves contain lines like "They talk of freedom, but for who?" that, if one is paying attention, specifically state that Connor does not fully trust the Continentals. The Templars would obviously benefit from having members in key positions in the resistance and in the various governments of the Colonies and later the United States. Yes there's a bias in the most recent trailer, but what else did you expect on July 4th?

There are good reasons to be disgusted with Assassin's Creed, but they have more to do with bad gameplay design than their approach to history. I've described AC as the action games Neil Stephenson would probably make, and though he's now making an action game and it's not like AC, I still think it's a good description.

 

[GloatingSwine]

Y'know, I don't think I've ever seen any actual British people complaining about this. We don't give a fuck, really. It's all Americans that are upset that some French Canadians are stealing their patriotic thunder...

 

[Korten12]

Honestly... Though, how would you show the British not being evil? No offense but there whole reason for the war was: "We don't want you to separate from us! So we will force you!" after revolutionaries began to fight back.

I am not saying they can't villfy the Americans (They will most likely and good for them) but I can't really think of any way of making the British side sympathetic.

 

[RariShyZealot]

Am I the only one that remember that in Brotherhood they actually state that America's beloved capitalism was invented by the templars while the assassins supported communist revolutions?

 

[DionysusSnoopy]

I'm British it doesn't bother me i will probably spend and inordinate amount of time killing redcoats and colonists (or randomly killing colonist civvies if i can only kill redcoats to create my own balance). I hope it will be balanced like AC1 taking on both sides. I think alot of the american stuff is just PR using 4th July.

Edit: Its a french developer? Ye gods. I did not know that. I acknowledge my mistake, then, but as the primary market is American I still think vilification of the British is doubtlessly going to happen

I believe that makes it a bit worse the French would villify us more than the Americans.

 

[Skratt]

The British are some of history's worst tyrants. You can't keep hiding your past behind Shakespeare and proper pronunciation. I don't mind if they get their asses kicked a little bit.

*looks at avatar*


I bet you're completely unbiased

I'm not a "Cause 'Merica, fuck yeah!" type person at all. I just have that avatar because I'm a firefighter and that is on the side of my engine.

Now children, it's just a video game.

 

[Erttheking]

Between Tomb Raider, Mass Effect and this, I really don't care anymore. I got behind the Mass Effect movement, but I am just so sick of controversy in every single game. "Oh this game is xenophobic." "Oh, this game is racist." "Oh this game is sexist" I JUST WANT TO PLAY MY FREAKING VIDEO GAME! God, I am just sick of all the fucking drama.

Some issues need to be addressed.

And according to the escapist those "issues" are in every other game that comes out. I'm sorry, Ubisoft said that you would be killing people on both sides of the conflict and, if you don't trust them then we have bigger things to worry about. Also what is addressing it going to even do. "I'm offended by this so I'll complain about it on the internet, that'll show them" not going to solve anything. People are trying so hard to get video games taken seriously that they forget that sometimes people (like me) just want to sit down and play a game without having to deal with a metric shitload of drama. The Assassin's creed series has always included betrayal and killing people that you thought were on your side, I fail to see the reason they would stop here. The worst case scenario I see here is that advertisements are pandering to my country on account of us being bigger than most countries and therefore having more potential customers. Hell, these advertisements were on the fourth of July, who in their right minds makes a fourth of july ad where they make the Americans look morally ambiguous? Ubisoft is French, do you honestly believe that they honestly are going to make a game centered around "America fuck yeah"?

P.S. In a section in Assassin's creed brotherhood, you slaughter a bunch of French soldiers, how come no one had a problem with that?

 

[ElPatron]

Of course they will vilify the British. To be honest, it annoys me how the Americans describe British rule as something that was 'Slavery and tyranny'.

Portuguese here. I have no problems admitting that the discovery period was a clusterfudge of tyranny, slavery and other bad things. We did it, Spain did it, like it or not the British did it too.

Bonus points because my country also had to fight the A-rabs and then Spain to retain independence.

The "FIGHT DA POWA" attitude makes me feel good. I would definitely love playing a game about the Colonial War from both sides, even if that meant half the game would be spent fighting against my own country. I would like the feel of fighting for freedom, even if you're actually a pawn killing for the Communist interests. Now that would be a good game.

 

[johnnyLupine]

Ive never really liked the assasin creed games, I like stealth based games (as well as rpg's and the like of course), I used to enjoy playing games like Tenchu (2)and MGS (1-3) back when I was strictly a console gamer but swapped to RTS games and eventually WoW when I got a pc.

I had heard a fair bit about Assasins creed and thought I might have enjoyed it, expecting to be able to be able to time my movements and use cover effectivly so that I could get to my target completely unheard and unseen then finaly leap out of the shadows, slit the targets throat and drag their corpse into a pile of hay or something before slinking back to the shadows, climbing up to the rafters to make my escape, perhaps climb the cities rooftops to get the drop on some unsuspecting guard or tail my target, watch their movements and choose the best time to strike.

I was disapointed when I finally got arround to buying the game, I dont think it was built with a keyboard in mind and even worse it played like an action game which was trying to have a stealth aspect to it but couldnt really be bothered, there was an all out brawl every other minute when I explored the world map and while I could take down the ocasional tower without being seen moments like that were a rareity. The world was too large not to have to have to explore on horseback which meant avoiding combat was a challenge

I suppose a lack of subtlty is to be expected from a society of so called assasins who allow their enemies to not only know who they are but also that their a very real organisation and not just a whisper uttered by guards who swore they saw something out of the corner of their eye the night their charge was murdered.

At any rate the assasins creed series does not appeal to me, its no loss if a game I have no intention of playing decides it wants to appeal to the american market by bigging up their revolutionary ansestors and lets face it those revolutionaries certainly made history but a modern day american certainly have a right to feel proud of the achievements their predecesors made but they cant (and very much doubt any reasonable person would) confuse the achievments someone acomplished generations ago with their own achievments. What makes a nation great is not what people who happened to live on the same patch of land you happen to live on now acomplished beyond living memory but what they are capable of now.

 

[ProtoChimp]

Between Tomb Raider, Mass Effect and this, I really don't care anymore. I got behind the Mass Effect movement, but I am just so sick of controversy in every single game. "Oh this game is xenophobic." "Oh, this game is racist." "Oh this game is sexist" I JUST WANT TO PLAY MY FREAKING VIDEO GAME! God, I am just sick of all the fucking drama.

Some issues need to be addressed.

And according to the escapist those "issues" are in every other game that comes out. I'm sorry, Ubisoft said that you would be killing people on both sides of the conflict and, if you don't trust them then we have bigger things to worry about. Also what is addressing it going to even do. "I'm offended by this so I'll complain about it on the internet, that'll show them" not going to solve anything. People are trying so hard to get video games taken seriously that they forget that sometimes people (like me) just want to sit down and play a game without having to deal with a metric shitload of drama. The Assassin's creed series has always included betrayal and killing people that you thought were on your side, I fail to see the reason they would stop here. The worst case scenario I see here is that advertisements are pandering to my country on account of us being bigger than most countries and therefore having more potential customers. Hell, these advertisements were on the fourth of July, who in their right minds makes a fourth of july ad where they make the Americans look morally ambiguous? Ubisoft is French, do you honestly believe that they honestly are going to make a game centered around "America fuck yeah"?

P.S. In a section in Assassin's creed brotherhood, you slaughter a bunch of French soldiers, how come no one had a problem with that?

All I was saying is that these issues must be discussed. And its not just complaining on the internet people have taken these complaint's to Ubisoft. The thing that irritates me is just that it seems so one sided, something that despite what some people say, Assassins creed has never been about. While I will give you that Ezio did kill some french soldiers who were just dicks and there weren't any good ones, there were only a few and that was one villain character's private force, not the whole french army. This game makes the whole British army look evil, or at least the marketing. But I understand if you just want to play games, all I'm saying is that some discussion must be had about a controversial subject. Some people are just bitching yes, but others have something intelligent to say.

 

[johnnyLupine]

Well. Now I see silly controversy surrounding...bias game trailers, and anachronistic argumentation.

Early Americans were colossal assholes.
The British Empire were colossal assholes.
Nazis were colossal assholes.

And each group accomplished great things within their society (yes, even the Nazis. Jet aircraft anyone?) even while being colossal assholes.

This is patently silly..
Back to lurking.

The Nazi party were not the first to design a working jet engine, the allys had the idea long before the Nazi's but did not think it was an idea worth persuing until their enemy started developing their own.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jet_engine
I wasnt aware of this myself until I read that article but It looks as though It was a norwegian who built the first working jet propulsion system and it says it was in 1903, which was many years before the Nazi party came into power

 

[Erttheking]

Between Tomb Raider, Mass Effect and this, I really don't care anymore. I got behind the Mass Effect movement, but I am just so sick of controversy in every single game. "Oh this game is xenophobic." "Oh, this game is racist." "Oh this game is sexist" I JUST WANT TO PLAY MY FREAKING VIDEO GAME! God, I am just sick of all the fucking drama.

Some issues need to be addressed.

And according to the escapist those "issues" are in every other game that comes out. I'm sorry, Ubisoft said that you would be killing people on both sides of the conflict and, if you don't trust them then we have bigger things to worry about. Also what is addressing it going to even do. "I'm offended by this so I'll complain about it on the internet, that'll show them" not going to solve anything. People are trying so hard to get video games taken seriously that they forget that sometimes people (like me) just want to sit down and play a game without having to deal with a metric shitload of drama. The Assassin's creed series has always included betrayal and killing people that you thought were on your side, I fail to see the reason they would stop here. The worst case scenario I see here is that advertisements are pandering to my country on account of us being bigger than most countries and therefore having more potential customers. Hell, these advertisements were on the fourth of July, who in their right minds makes a fourth of july ad where they make the Americans look morally ambiguous? Ubisoft is French, do you honestly believe that they honestly are going to make a game centered around "America fuck yeah"?

P.S. In a section in Assassin's creed brotherhood, you slaughter a bunch of French soldiers, how come no one had a problem with that?

All I was saying is that these issues must be discussed. And its not just complaining on the internet people have taken these complaint's to Ubisoft. The thing that irritates me is just that it seems so one sided, something that despite what some people say, Assassins creed has never been about. While I will give you that Ezio did kill some french soldiers who were just dicks and there weren't any good ones, there were only a few and that was one villain character's private force, not the whole french army. This game makes the whole British army look evil, or at least the marketing. But I understand if you just want to play games, all I'm saying is that some discussion must be had about a controversial subject. Some people are just bitching yes, but others have something intelligent to say.

I guess you have a good point, but in my opinion there are still bigger things to get worked up over in video games. Like I said this recent string of advertising is just pandering to the American audience, in the earlier stuff you see evidence to suggest that Conrad isn't exactly all in favor of the Americans, saying things like "They claim to fight for liberty, but for who?" and "Let the patriots fight their own battles, I'm here for the Templars" and one of those was actually from the game. I'm telling you, this is just pandering to reel in more American customers. I am willing to bet that by the end of the game you will stab one of the founding fathers in the throat...probably washington. He gives some funny looks in the E3 trailer.

 

[Toby Kitching]

God dammit, a lot of people here are missing the point as I see it:

It's not that the British don't want to accept that we did shitty things during the colonialist era, it's that the Americans did equally shitty things (hence why the majority of native american tribes including the Mohawks - of whom connor is a member - sided with the British during the war of independance) but because they are Americans they get a free pass. I'm expecting this game (and this is purely speculation based on the tone set up by the trailers) that the British are going to be tea-drinking barbaric buck-toothed inbred bastards whilst all the Americas will be chiselled-jawed perfect specimens of morality who shit apple pie, rather than allowing for a little examination of the deeply questionable acts the colonists engaged in.