Poll: There is no justifiable reason for civilians to own modern weapons.

[TheSeventhLoneWolf]

No, i recall a story of a man going into a school one day and shooting all the young children inside. People would be able to commit to crime more and everyone will be a basic threat. For home defence, you're more likely to be shot with your own gun.

 

[GBlair88]

I find the whole idea of having to own a weapon stupid.
Seriously, what do you need a freaking shotgun for at home? If someone breaks into your house you're better off just calling the cops anyway.

no, your fucking dead long before the cops arrive.

Ah but if you phone them up and say 'My house is being robbed and I'm going to defend my home with my [Insert name of melee weapon here]' they'll be around to arrest you before you can put the receiver down. You'll probably have to pay the burglar compensation for injuries sustained on your property, loss of earnings and stress.

Eh, more people die from falling down stairs than from accidental gun deaths. Should we outlaw stairs? Stop the stair menace! End the tragedy!

...Oh my god you're right. One hundred percent of domestic accidents happen in the home, so perhaps it's time we outlawed homes too.

 

[Grampy_bone]

I find the whole idea of having to own a weapon stupid.
Seriously, what do you need a freaking shotgun for at home? If someone breaks into your house you're better off just calling the cops anyway.

no, your fucking dead long before the cops arrive.

Ah but if you phone them up and say 'My house is being robbed and I'm going to defend my home with my [Insert name of melee weapon here]' they'll be around to arrest you before you can put the receiver down. You'll probably have to pay the burglar compensation for injuries sustained on your property, loss of earnings and stress.

That reminds me of a story I once heard, though I suspect it isn't true. It goes like this:

A man wakes up at night and sees strangers outside breaking into his garage. He calls the cops and they tell him they have no units in the area but they will try to send someone as soon as they can. In the meantime he should hide. The man waits for a few minutes and then calls the cops back. He tells them, "Don't worry about the burglars, I shot them."

Minutes later the cops come speeding to his house, encounter the intruders, and arrest them. They ask the man, "I thought you said you shot them?"

And the man replies, "I thought you said you couldn't get here on time?"

 

[DayDark]

I'm don't particularly have anything against guns, or people owning them, but I don't see a reason for the public to own guns, it seems it would only make it much easier for criminals to get them, and give them an reason to shoot you if they ever hold you up. A thief or a burglar is not out for your life, he's after your money, if he knows the general public is likely to carry a gun, It would be in he's best interest to shoot first, and loot your corps, rather then make you surrender your goods. Here in Denmark, only organised criminals would have the network to get illegal guns, and because guns aren't growing on the trees, they use them against each other, instead of wasting bullets on civilians. Criminal vs. civilian gun hold ups are pretty rare, and almost never deadly. We have civilians dying from being in the line of fire, when gangs go at it against each other though, but owning a gun wont save you from such a situation.

 

[Cmwissy]

Honestly - all guns should be destroyed and we should make our soldiers fight with grenades and knives.

That would be sweet.

 

[TheBoulder]

Well, you see, 'civilians' arent as trained with deadly weaponry as military personel are. Guns are an abomination, at least there mostly restricted to the military.

 

[Robby Foxfur]

No, i recall a story of a man going into a school one day and shooting all the young children inside. People would be able to commit to crime more and everyone will be a basic threat. For home defence, you're more likely to be shot with your own gun.

Not true my good man, if someone wants you dead and they want it to happen really badly chances are nothing you can do will stop them from thus putting and end to you, and yes for home defense if you break into my house you'll have to get past quiet a few modern thing like locks the fact that i stay up till 6 am and YES my gun which i keep safe and can load very quickly and while i may not have a chance to get to it if you are there to kill me, i do have a chance if you are there to try and rob me and think nothing of the people inside the house. i think you'll find it hard to prove that people get shot with their own guns. I also recall a man sitting on a clock tower with a sniper rifle, a story of 2 teens in a school, a man at and army base (Fort Hood) i hate to say it but everyone is the basic threat, did your parents ever tell you to "watch for the other driver?" that sort of implores that even if your the best driver EVER that your not safe from your follow man.

 

[Midnight Voyager]

*odd look*

So people should only own... muzzle-loaders? I have to ask what on earth you're going on about. They're SAFER? There is a reason that people don't use muzzle-loaders anymore, you know. They're not as easy to load, increasing the "blowing up in your goddamn face" factor. Good bloody luck reloading them, too, if you miss the first shot. And seeing as how they take so long to load, you'd be much more likely to leave one loaded. And safeties? Forget about safeties. They increase every single factor of danger in using a gun. Modern weapons are MUCH safer.

I just... Sorry, but that is the most utterly mad argument I have ever heard in relation to gun control in my life. Muzzle-loaders... of all things...

 

[TheBoulder]

What makes governments so special that they should have thousands of people armed with them but "civilians" should be completely denied access to them? Governments are made up of people and their actions. They're not magic.

Well, you see, 'civilians' arent as trained with deadly weaponry as military personel are. Guns are an abomination, at least there mostly restricted to the military.

 

[TheSeventhLoneWolf]

No, i recall a story of a man going into a school one day and shooting all the young children inside. People would be able to commit to crime more and everyone will be a basic threat. For home defence, you're more likely to be shot with your own gun.

Not true my good man, if someone wants you dead and they want it to happen really badly chances are nothing you can do will stop them from thus putting and end to you, and yes for home defense if you break into my house you'll have to get past quiet a few modern thing like locks the fact that i stay up till 6 am and YES my gun which i keep safe and can load very quickly and while i may not have a chance to get to it if you are there to kill me, i do have a chance if you are there to try and rob me and think nothing of the people inside the house. i think you'll find it hard to prove that people get shot with their own guns. I also recall a man sitting on a clock tower with a sniper rifle, a story of 2 teens in a school, a man at and army base (Fort Hood) i hate to say it but everyone is the basic threat, did your parents ever tell you to "watch for the other driver?" that sort of implores that even if your the best driver EVER that your not safe from your follow man.

If the civils are going to get weapons, i'd say keep it under restrictions, I'm just a bit jittered of that story of the 8 year old who shot himself with an uzi.

 

[PhiMed]

What makes governments so special that they should have thousands of people armed with them but "civilians" should be completely denied access to them? Governments are made up of people and their actions. They're not magic.

Why do you think you need a weapon?

If anyone is able to access them, everyone should be able to access them. Are the individuals in the military and police forces you trust with them more trustworthy, intelligent, and benevolent than the average person on the street?

 

[The Hairminator]

But is it worth this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

I refer you to a rather famous quote from Benjamin Franklin:

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

That's all good and well, but liberty does not equal guns in my book. I don't see how I would be liberated by being afraid of people since they might carry guns.

 

[Aunel]

I think it would be more interesting if civilians had to use flint-lock guns instead of magazine-fed modern handguns.
It could lead to some hilarity.
And robbing banks would become harder. loading time would be a *****.

finally somebody that sees things the way I do,
if your bank gets robbed, just throw someone else in their way "oh don't mind, it's just Carl, he is new anyway"

 

[Robby Foxfur]

I'm don't particularly have anything against guns, or people owning them, but I don't see a reason for the public to own guns, it seems it would only make it much easier for criminals to get them, and give them an reason to shoot you if they ever hold you up. A thief or a burglar is not out for your life, he's after your money, if he knows the general public is likely to carry a gun, It would be in he's best interest to shoot first, and loot your corps, rather then make you surrender your goods. Here in Denmark, only organised criminals would have the network to get illegal guns, and because guns aren't growing on the trees, they use them against each other, instead of wasting bullets on civilians. Criminal vs. civilian gun hold ups are pretty rare, and almost never deadly. We have civilians dying from being in the line of fire, when gangs go at it against each other though, but owning a gun wont save you from such a situation.

This reminds me of the movie Lord of War in that 1 man was able to get thousands upon thousands of AKs grenades pistols and the like out of an army facility, yes it is a movie but its not hard to imagine how far money will go. No one is saying a gun is a magic you not get killed shield, and I'd like to think that if your at gun point there is nothing stopping the guy with the gun from shooting you and taking your money anyway so why not have a fair chance at not dieing? There are people that are that messed up that they will shot you after taking your money, because they can. I don't live in Denmark so i don't know what its like, butif your organized crime gets to bad and say they start robbing people or just killing them then are you guys shit out of luck? (and that's a dodgy question i know so don't answer if you don't want)

 

[PhiMed]

What makes governments so special that they should have thousands of people armed with them but "civilians" should be completely denied access to them? Governments are made up of people and their actions. They're not magic.

Well, you see, 'civilians' arent as trained with deadly weaponry as military personel are. Guns are an abomination, at least there mostly restricted to the military.

"Well, you see," you're assuming that a person who chooses to purchase a weapon would not undergo training in the handling of one. You're also forgetting to include veterans, who have had just as much training as the people currently serving.

The idea that guns, in and of themselves, are an abomination is absurd. They are inanimate objects which serve as tools. What people do with them is what is important.

 

[Robby Foxfur]

But is it worth this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

I refer you to a rather famous quote from Benjamin Franklin:

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

That's all good and well, but liberty does not equal guns in my book. I don't see how I would be liberated by being afraid of people since they might carry guns.

The quote refers to the government and talks about terrorism in a sense, saying that giving up something because your afraid of the out come, just so you can have peace for a little bit means nothing. Freedom is worthless unless you are ready to fight for it, not to say you should always fight with guns.

 

[-Orgasmatron-]

There's plenty of reason. Proctecting yourself from crackheads, protecting your sheep from wolves, keeping the goverment polite, protecting yourself from crazed gunmen, becoming a crazed gunmen and pistol whipping bitches who get out of line. Well, atleast some of them justify gun ownership.

Now, living in the UK I don't get the privilege of owning a gun, but it is one of the things I admire about the USA, it seems to me like it makes people more equal, you wouldn't have to feel intimidated in your home or walking down your street if you're packing a nine in your underwear.

Did you know the USA has a violent crime rate 10 times lower than that of the UK? Admittedly the USA is higher for homicide and man slaughter, but in everything else the UK is much, much worse. Point is, you should enjoy your right to gun ownership.


http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/05cius/data/table_01.html - USA Violent Crime Rates 2003

http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs04/rdsolr1804.pdf - UK Violent Crime Rates 2003

"The British Crime Survey (BCS) estimated that there were 2,715,000
violent incidents experienced by adults in England and Wales, based on year ending December
2003 interviews, comprising 22 per cent of all BCS crime. Just over one million violent offences
were recorded by the police in 2003 (18 per cent of all recorded crime)."

Laying the stats down.

 

[Robby Foxfur]

What makes governments so special that they should have thousands of people armed with them but "civilians" should be completely denied access to them? Governments are made up of people and their actions. They're not magic.

Well, you see, 'civilians' arent as trained with deadly weaponry as military personel are. Guns are an abomination, at least there mostly restricted to the military.

"Well, you see," you're assuming that a person who chooses to purchase a weapon would not undergo training in the handling of one. You're also forgetting to include veterans, who have had just as much training as the people currently serving.

The idea that guns, in and of themselves, are an abomination is absurd. They are inanimate objects which serve as tools. What people do with them is what is important.

Sir i agree with you to no end this is a great statement though i dough it will have much impact in this thread.

 

[C117]

Of course not, the idea that anyone should be able to have guns and whatnot to 'protect' themselves is a stupid idea.

Why else would America have such a high gun crime rate? Cause everyone has guns, duh. Why are the gun crime rates so low in Britain? Cause NOBODY (policemen included) have guns.

Seconded. Totally.

 

[Robby Foxfur]

No, i recall a story of a man going into a school one day and shooting all the young children inside. People would be able to commit to crime more and everyone will be a basic threat. For home defence, you're more likely to be shot with your own gun.

Not true my good man, if someone wants you dead and they want it to happen really badly chances are nothing you can do will stop them from thus putting and end to you, and yes for home defense if you break into my house you'll have to get past quiet a few modern thing like locks the fact that i stay up till 6 am and YES my gun which i keep safe and can load very quickly and while i may not have a chance to get to it if you are there to kill me, i do have a chance if you are there to try and rob me and think nothing of the people inside the house. i think you'll find it hard to prove that people get shot with their own guns. I also recall a man sitting on a clock tower with a sniper rifle, a story of 2 teens in a school, a man at and army base (Fort Hood) i hate to say it but everyone is the basic threat, did your parents ever tell you to "watch for the other driver?" that sort of implores that even if your the best driver EVER that your not safe from your follow man.

If the civils are going to get weapons, i'd say keep it under restrictions, I'm just a bit jittered of that story of the 8 year old who shot himself with an uzi.

This is true i agree but again, were did the kid get the Uzi? they don't fall from the sky, or i would have one. The 8 yo story really doesn't top the one that i know that is quiet litteralty in my home town, but again involves kids and guns and improper storage of said gun.