Poll: To the anime haters

[ex275w]

MY ARGUMENT IS GOD

I agree partially, since as Yahtzee said subtle details can have more impact than explicit details. Ghibli's animation is all about subtle movements whether in voice acting movement or facial expressions.

Though your criticism of Gurren Lagann makes you sound like a person with no suspension of disbelief, in my opinion. (which is right and yours is wrong by the way since this is the internet)

i only used gurren lagen as an example of the weird over the top things they say because i could think of anything else. I've seen the entire series, it was all right, loved them titties and all and the giant robots were fun, but it's still strictly something for japanese culture.

i'm sure you may have read somewhere about how bad japanese video games are doing recently. i'm flipping through my gameinformer here and there's several quotes in here from developers talking about japanese games;

"your games just suck" -Fez creater Phil Fish responding to a japanese developer regarding what he thought of modern japanese games.

"Back in the day our japanese games were used to winning and achieved major success. But at some point the winners became losers. By not accepting that fact we have arrived at the tragic state of japanese games. The japanese game industry has become very close-minded." -Mega Man creator Keiji Inafune

now when the guy who made Mega Man says japanese games suck, there's a problem. Mega Man was about a boy with a blaster arm and fought robots. today.....i think the only good animes are on adult swim like samurai champloo.

now i know games aren't anime, but in when it comes to japan, i can't see the f**king difference. look at the latter final fantasy games, it has all the components of a generic anime; over the top futuristic setting, over the top wardrobes, crazy hard to follow plots, cut and paste supporting cast, over the top but TOTALLY AWESOME ACTION SCENES, and of course, a crazy and 'best avoid if possible' kind of fanbase.

it's been a long time but if i hear one more kid squel about cloud or arif/aris or some bullshit or even scream about gay shipping the characters, i swear i'm going to do something so horrific to that person that their families will raise money to get a bench named after him/her to be put in the park, which i will then light on fire and run over with my car.

ok, now you know the OTHER reason i don't look to fondly to anime.

a lot of animes have these crazy fanbases that i just can't relate to. i know everything fanbase has it's bad eggs, something star trek fans and the hardest core of the whovians are well known for, but...i don't mean to be rude, but at least Doctor who is good and star trek was good in it's day. watching anime is like watching a show from another planet not because of how crazy whatever goes on in the show is but how crazy the characters act. the Doctor, currently matt smith, is odd, quirky, and doesn't pick up on clues like a lot of people but that's because he IS an ALIEN. (so as to your claim that i have no suspension of disbelief, i hope my fandom of Doctor who proved otherwise). But some characters in even the more serious animes act crazy for no reason, with the colored action background included. i'll bet you 200$ that normal people in Japan don't do that. hell, i'll bet you 300$ that there are a lot of people in Japan who hold my same opinion on the matter.

hopefully i've written enough here to keep you busy while i take a gander at this Ghibli you mentioned.

Speaking about cliches. Do you think that Hokuto No Ken and Jojo's Bizzare Adventure are to blame on the fact that most writers try to emulate all their shonen/seinen bullcrap into be like them? Lets put it this way, would the trope "Seinfeld is Unfunny" apply to the 2 grandfathers of shonen series? or is the thousands of copies that make the original two look like crap?

If that doesnt ring a bell because maybe you dont know those two then let me change a few names here...and....here.

Replace [Hokuto No Ken and Jojo's Bizzare Adventure] with [Warhammer 40K] and replace [shonen/seinen bullcrap] with [Halo/Space Marine bullcrap]

Does this have to do anything to do with your comment? maybe not, but i think i can just ask you this an get a honest opinion.

Yes, I've read that in Japanese culture, it is common for people to strive for perfection, so it is common and accepted that they borrow somebody else's project and try to improve it your own way.
Actually the series that are rip-offed the most are DBZ and Hokuto No Ken, since Jojo basically started as a Rip-off of Hokuto No Ken, but part 3 changed it to be the awesome series it is, and then everyone ripped that off.

 

[Lugbzurg]

I really couldn't tell you anything from the poll, as I've never heard of any of these shows at all, save for Coyboy Bebop. Hellsing also sounds familiar. But, I have never actually watched any of these shows. I suppose I've got a few more things to look up, now.

I'd say visual style like this doesn't have much of a need to debate over. It's the internal style that holds so much importance.

I'd say that I have really found a liking in Fullmetal Alchemist. That's been my favorite, so far. Kekkaishi has also been pretty good, and I've been rather inspired by Durarara!!

 

[Bloodtrozorx]

I voted other but that's because I lack knowledge, the only two anime shows I could sit down and watch were FLCL and Trigun. Otherwise, i say "Meh".

 

[Elate]

Miyazaki style
Samurai Champloo style
Hellsing

In that order, and I'm someone who doesn't really like anime at all. The art styles aren't the problem for me, it's the voice acting/story lines, most have the feel of B action movies, without being hilariously bad.

 

[mega48man]

MY ARGUMENT IS GOD

SNIP

SNIPITY DO DAAH, SNIPITY DAAAAY, MYYYY OOOH MYYYY WHAT A FUCKIN BIG ESSAY

Speaking about cliches. Do you think that Hokuto No Ken and Jojo's Bizzare Adventure are to blame on the fact that most writers try to emulate all their shonen/seinen bullcrap into be like them? Lets put it this way, would the trope "Seinfeld is Unfunny" apply to the 2 grandfathers of shonen series? or is the thousands of copies that make the original two look like crap?

If that doesnt ring a bell because maybe you dont know those two then let me change a few names here...and....here.

Replace [Hokuto No Ken and Jojo's Bizzare Adventure] with [Warhammer 40K] and replace [shonen/seinen bullcrap] with [Halo/Space Marine bullcrap]

Does this have to do anything to do with your comment? maybe not, but i think i can just ask you this an get a honest opinion.

thanks for the analogy before going off to find videos of Hokuto No Ken and Jojo's Bizzare Adventure to make an informed opinion. but no i haven't heard of these series until today, that first one looked like fun, and the this second one seems pretty interesting so far.

for Jojo, i randomly found an enitre episode on youtube and i feel like i hit gold with Episode 10, right from the start the bad guy is a soul stealing gamblin man, it's cliche but i love it.

as to your question UMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

as far as the anime industry goes, there's probably a good chance that these two series inspire shonen writers given that you've brought it up. i'm seeing a lot of tough guy action scene cliches, but these shows were from the 90's and these cliches are more popularly known from the 80's. but i still feel like i can't really make an informed opinion one way or the other. what throws me off is your Warhammer 40k to Halo analogy. I don't see Halo getting many elements from Warhammer 40k. Halo CE was kinda the pioneer of Console FPS games, it had aliens, laser guns, space marines, cinematic cutscenes, HUD, good multiplayer, it was great. Warhammer 40K, however, had it's own very iconic art style that you don't see replicated anywhere but table top gaming. it's like War if it were a fantasy sci-fi, where as Halo was "what will man-kind and space travel look like in the distant future?" and shoot generic aliens, which have become iconic as well.

why the f**k do i always type so much?

 

[mega48man]

LOL. so long as that animes touches on social issues like LGBT bullying, self-discovery, possibly gay teen suicide (it's a serious problem), and social acceptance of people of different sexual orientation, sounds like fun to watch. but if you're talking about Boku no Pico, well sir, i have some bad news for you; you're a pedophile.

Luckily for you... me... well, both of us, I've never heard of Boku no Pico, and judging by your reaction, I wouldn't want to watch it either. I'm talking about Hourou Musuko, which addresses all the serious issues a kid would have, dealing with gender identity (two boys and a girl, with different circumstances and problems of their own). When I first heard about it, I wondered how in hell an anime could handle it, but fucking hell, it was a punch that wasn't pulled by any means...

i think you're right, i DON'T know where to look! but there is one anime that my one super cute and hot anime obessed friend who has already has a BF god damn him has gotten me to start watching called "Panty Stockings". i'm sure you've heard of it but i'll give a BRIEF description; drawn to be a parody of western cartoons (and sadly, it proves not only that imitation is a form of flattery but that it's better than normal anime) it's about two angels, panty and stocking, who fight ghosts because they were kicked out of heaven. it's wacky, vulgar, utterly insane, and i like it because it has an art style that reflects that cartoony tone.

Anyway, yeah, I've heard about Panty & Stocking (with Garterbelt), and eesh is it silly. 'Rrrrrrrrrrrruuurrrruu'! That said, I'm not a particular fan of that aesthetic, preferring more 'traditional' anime forms, except that I find anime comedies are rather pointless these days, action animes are repetitive and spout a never ending stream of memes, and harem animes are a combination of the above. This leaves the viewer with a still large (at least I think it's large), but still comparatively miniscule library to watch. Post 2010... shit, I take it back, there aren't that many worth watching... *snrk*

just googled Hourou Musuko, surprisingly looks interesting based off what you said.
and a big LOL, boku no pico is a hentai about...um...think loli but with all boys. it's used on 4chan to haze newcomers, you can see how it became viral in the underground here (SFW): http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/boku-no-pico

If i'm hearing word from the people who actually watch anime that anime is dying, it makes me want to buy a dildo sword, find my otaku ex-gf, and smack her in the face with it repeatedly while singing zippity do dah.

 

[mega48man]

MY ARGUMENT IS GOD

MY ARGUMENT IS ALLAH

^LOL

The Ghibli only appears to nice children who believe in the alot.

I think Japanese games are certainly in a decline. Namco, Capcom, Konami and Square who were previously pillars of the mainstream japanese industry have stagnated and become irrelevant. Nintendo and Atlus are in my opinion the only "big"japanese comapnies to still make quality titles.

Of course this is not the fault of anime itself but it represents that companies don't give a crap about striving to be original or different only safe, and blaming pirates or the economy isn't gonna cut it.

I don't know about the anime fanbase, I'm good at evading the weebs so I've only heard of this mystical creature. I decided to see if /a/ had decent taste in 4chan and only saw people hating everything and have decided never to interact with any "anime fan" online.

I think Japanese characters act crazy become Japanese people seem to be so serious all the time. So when given the opportunity to lighten up, they go all out.

xD when i saw 'allah' i was laughing my ass off harder than i've ever laughed while in the forums before, thank you.

I know Nintendo is the leading game company out there right now, but i feel like even their games are in the decline. their games are either for little kids on the DS or Wii or exclusively for long time Nintendo/Zelda fans, who a big part of this group are otakus/weebus. Skyword sword, as yahtzee reviewed it, was "meh" compared to zelda titles of the past. as for their other games, lets be honest, how psyched were you for their release of cooking mama 2? they're making serious money though, so they're doing something right.

I think anime does play a part in Japanese games's decline and here's why; the final fantasy games, when they first started out, were great for their time. you played as this little pixelated guys, you ran around and had random turn based fights like in pokemon, it was an rpg, great storyline, everything was great. then FF7 appeared and in-game animation took a step up. since then, the games had cutscenes with anime characters, the new technology and medium allowed Square Enix to become waaaaaay more artistic with their designs for the characters, setting, and fights, voice acting became a thing and we heard pretty voice acting that sounded like it was taken right out an anime, and i swear to god, just like any popular anime the fanbases shot up like like weeds in a garden.

almost all JRPG's or Japanese games out there (or at least the ones that are available in america) are similar to this Final Fantasy style of...being an anime, i guess. now the reason this doesn't catch on in america either easily or at all is because of that anime culture barrier. if you're at the store and you see someone eyeballing the White Knight Chronicles, odds are they're gonna look a little introverted and of that anime fanbase world. when you see another gamer, however, they'll probably be looking at assassin's creed, or gears of war, or CoD modern warfare, you know, the big titles in america. american games are more appealing than japanese games because....that very reason! they're made by americans who get us, know what we like, and put passion into their game. as for japan, DS game sales are up and that's all that's important.

that's an interesting idea about why anime characters act so crazy, but what i've seen from japan says otherwise about their serious nature (used panty vending machine?)

f**k, i typed too much again

 

[ex275w]

MY ARGUMENT IS GOD

MY ARGUMENT IS ALLAH

^LOL

Oh SNIP

xD when i saw 'allah' i was laughing my ass off harder than i've ever laughed while in the forums before, thank you.

I know Nintendo is the leading game company out there right now, but i feel like even their games are in the decline. their games are either for little kids on the DS or Wii or exclusively for long time Nintendo/Zelda fans, who a big part of this group are otakus/weebus. Skyword sword, as yahtzee reviewed it, was "meh" compared to zelda titles of the past. as for their other games, lets be honest, how psyched were you for their release of cooking mama 2? they're making serious money though, so they're doing something right.

I think anime does play a part in Japanese games's decline and here's why; the final fantasy games, when they first started out, were great for their time. you played as this little pixelated guys, you ran around and had random turn based fights like in pokemon, it was an rpg, great storyline, everything was great. then FF7 appeared and in-game animation took a step up. since then, the games had cutscenes with anime characters, the new technology and medium allowed Square Enix to become waaaaaay more artistic with their designs for the characters, setting, and fights, voice acting became a thing and we heard pretty voice acting that sounded like it was taken right out an anime, and i swear to god, just like any popular anime the fanbases shot up like like weeds in a garden.

almost all JRPG's or Japanese games out there (or at least the ones that are available in america) are similar to this Final Fantasy style of...being an anime, i guess. now the reason this doesn't catch on in america either easily or at all is because of that anime culture barrier. if you're at the store and you see someone eyeballing the White Knight Chronicles, odds are they're gonna look a little introverted and of that anime fanbase world. when you see another gamer, however, they'll probably be looking at assassin's creed, or gears of war, or CoD modern warfare, you know, the big titles in america. american games are more appealing than japanese games because....that very reason! they're made by americans who get us, know what we like, and put passion into their game. as for japan, DS game sales are up and that's all that's important.

that's an interesting idea about why anime characters act so crazy, but what i've seen from japan says otherwise about their serious nature (used panty vending machine?)

f**k, i typed too much again

I haven't finished Skyward Sword (What I played was very good but could've been better) and Yahtzee has extremely high standards for Nintendo. I am just waiting for the Wii to release its last 2 or 3 games and getting the Wii U, Nintendo just stopped releasing great games in 2011.

Final Fantasy VII was important in that it allowed a lot of Japanese games for good or harm to come to Western culture. Square, Capcom, Konami, and Namco have lost their way by losing creative people like Sakguchi, Ifaune and their old successful management as they have started to retire due to their age. The companies are running like headless chickens.

Other companies tried to also capture Final Fantasy VII's and Kingdom Hearts success and it became a war of attrition for who could create the most ANIME game.

Anime I believe attracts such a fanbase because it fulfills the needs of teenagers, capturing their love of cartoons and of "mature" themes. (They are rarely mature) So basically they become the step between Disney and Stuff adults like.

I am not actually from the United States, but more than capturing "American" values, the United States values individuality and seeing Assassin's Creed they can feel it was made by a person with their own vision, so they like that. Japanese games are usually made to "improve" on the past, so ripping off other games is OK, as long as the new product is better. Since Final Fantasy VII, Sailor Moon and DBZ were so successful in America and Japan they rip the style and people eventually grow tired of repetition, causing the backlash against shooters and anime.

Used panty machines I believe prove my point, organizing and getting girls to sell their undergarments, creating and distributing machines to sell the panties is something who wouldn't do if you weren't serious about the business.

I can type even more text.

 

[CruisingForBiddies]

I would have liked to choose the 'I hate it all' option, but I do have a soft spot for Miyazaki's work so I will choose that instead. As for why i don't like it. Rule of thumb I do not like the;
- animations or often lack there of.
- often bland humour
- and the tropes the genre are often teeth-gringingly painful.

Teeth. Grindingly. Painful.
[sub]Im so sorry I had to post that. Really I am.[/sub]

 

[Snotnarok]

I don't hate anime but there's a lot of animes I hate. A lot of them do simply irritating and stupid things.

Mascot charters- Because a serious anime needs a stuffed lion doll for comedy relief.

Kids- No the Transformers nor Sonic need help from any kids or teenagers.

Retarded anime girls- Because a strong male lead must be complemented by an absolute clueless idiot of a girl with a busty body and doing random things makes things better.

Awkward love triangles- They always try and shove this into every anime. Guy and girl are interested but will never admit it, they're about to kiss then WOAH something wacky happens! Then the guy gets hit they both pose the guy with a lump with his eyes closed the girl blushing with her fist cocked.

My favorite anime is Outlaw Star, a great sci-fi/fantasy mix with spaceships, magic, lasers, comedy and seriousness and able/unable characters being likeable.

I just watched Hellsing Ultimate through to 9, what a fantastic series minus the weird bits that happened, makes up for the really dumb original series.

Just about every anime I've tried to watch recently does something with the above listed and just becomes totally unlikable. I don't need serious for it to be great, Excel Saga proves that, but Excel Saga at least knew it was stupid vs Bleach which is just did stupid things all the time. I can't fathom what makes people like a show that dumb with that cast of characters.

Likes: Outlaw Star, Cowboy Bebop, Trigun, Spriggan, Flame of Recca, Excel Saga, Puni Puni Poemi, Hellsing Ultimate, Full Metal Alchemist (both I guess?), Samurai X, Akira, Berserk, Evangelion (liked/disliked), G-Gundam, 08th MS Team Gundam, Ranma 1/2, Fist of the North Star, Ninja Scroll, etc.

Dislikes: Bleach, Kenshin (where he has the pink gi), Naruto, half the new Gundams wing/seed etc, Inuyasha, .Hack, Witch Hunter Robin, etc.

Well that was rant-y :|

 

[Condiments]

I very rarely watch anime/read manga unless I find something where the premise interests me. It usually disappoints, but such is life I suppose.

I actually just got done reading a manga series after discovering and binging on it the past couple days. If you want a good mix of action, and disturbing mindfuck plotlines I'd go ahead and read the manga Freesia. Its fucked up, and definitely NSFW, but its good stuff.

 

[axlryder]

they're about to kiss then WOAH something wacky happens!

That made me chuckle.

 

[Snotnarok]

they're about to kiss then WOAH something wacky happens!

That made me chuckle.

Is it because it's typically very true? Or because it's the ranting of an idiot? Haha. Again I like anime it's just not a lot of the newer stuff...

 

[SckizoBoy]

just googled Hourou Musuko, surprisingly looks interesting based off what you said.
and a big LOL, boku no pico is a hentai about...um...think loli but with all boys. it's used on 4chan to haze newcomers, you can see how it became viral in the underground here (SFW): http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/boku-no-pico

Even though I'm at work... don't think I'll go there. And I'll watch the series even less.

If i'm hearing word from the people who actually watch anime that anime is dying, it makes me want to buy a dildo sword, find my otaku ex-gf, and smack her in the face with it repeatedly while singing zippity do dah.

Have you considered seeing a therapist... and 'dildo sword' is wrong on many levels but as a piece of phallic imagery... yeah...

Still, I wouldn't say anime is dying per se, it's just that serious/innovative/thought provoking series are being marginalised/swamped by the expanding morass of the product of trope/meme factories. *le sigh* Anime output is growing, it's just that the output of good anime isn't growing with it... I will leave to rage (& eat).

Good day!

 

[xplosive59]

Im a fan of Cowboy Bebop style anime but my favourite style was the Akira style, the characters all look japanese and it looks amazing.

 

[DioWallachia]

thanks for the analogy before going off to find videos of Hokuto No Ken and Jojo's Bizzare Adventure to make an informed opinion. but no i haven't heard of these series until today, that first one looked like fun, and the this second one seems pretty interesting so far.

for Jojo, i randomly found an enitre episode on youtube and i feel like i hit gold with Episode 10, right from the start the bad guy is a soul stealing gamblin man, it's cliche but i love it.

as to your question UMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

as far as the anime industry goes, there's probably a good chance that these two series inspire shonen writers given that you've brought it up. i'm seeing a lot of tough guy action scene cliches, but these shows were from the 90's and these cliches are more popularly known from the 80's. but i still feel like i can't really make an informed opinion one way or the other. what throws me off is your Warhammer 40k to Halo analogy. I don't see Halo getting many elements from Warhammer 40k. Halo CE was kinda the pioneer of Console FPS games, it had aliens, laser guns, space marines, cinematic cutscenes, HUD, good multiplayer, it was great. Warhammer 40K, however, had it's own very iconic art style that you don't see replicated anywhere but table top gaming. it's like War if it were a fantasy sci-fi, where as Halo was "what will man-kind and space travel look like in the distant future?" and shoot generic aliens, which have become iconic as well.

why the f**k do i always type so much?

OH SHIT. I should have tell you that Jojo's doesnt have a proper anime other than the OVA you just saw. Kinda weird that a manga series THAT popular and old (it is STILL GOING ON TODAY) along HNK didnt have a proper adaptation.........Actually its not that difficult to understand anyway, its a BIZZARRE adventure after all. This will be the Japanese equivalent of the movie "Naked Lunch".

---

Now, for the WHY i used the Warhammer analogy with Halo is because the same question i did before: "Is it really the fault of (insert game/movie/show/book) for creating that concept that will be later added used to death by anyone else that isnt nearly as talented to pull it off correctly?"

With all the Space Marine bullshit going around in games, by the time a real adaptation of Warhammer 40K comes to gaming, people wont say this:

"Oh, Warhammer 40K, finally the franchise that has spawned the concept of Space Marine will have a place in the gaming world. Perhaps i can understand what is so popular about this franchise that spawned countless of stand alone stories"

Instead they will say this:

"AAH FUCK, ANOTHER space marine bullshit?? Worse of all, its the original piece of crap that started all this nonsense. And i dont want any of you fanboys to tell me that because it is the original it means its better, if that were true then the people "inspired" by this would have made the same thing but with expanded attributes instead of the shallow crap i see people play everyday. I am not going to bother paying for this thing"

Even if technically it isnt the fault of W40K for everyone else stupidity of trying to cash in on its concept. In fact, this sort of like hearing this words when someone describes a horror movie of today:
"There is this AWESOME movie that starts with 5 people, 1 nerd, 1 slut, 1 virgin, 1 funny stoner and 1 asshole that go to a cabin in the woods andWAIT, where are you going? i havent finish describing!! HEY, COME BACK!!"

 

[DioWallachia]

Milo Minderbender from Catch 22, Lucifer from the Sandman and Lucifer comics, Lord Vetinari from the Discworld novels, and Akio from Revolutionary Girl Utena are better Magnificent Bastards than Light or Lelouch, at least they don't go down like punks when they are beaten.

Also OP put Jojo's and Mononoke, no one with eyes would tell you they look the same.

Going down like punk certainly seems like disqualification for the Magnificent Bastard title. However, why is the series cliche? to me it seems that it takes the shonen tropes and deconstruct them into twisted versions.

Besides, its not like Western animation OR literature is beneath of using cliches to death.

 

[Clive Howlitzer]

I haven't watched an anime in a long time but as I got older, I found it very hard to watch any anime that used a lot of exaggerated whatever in the visual style.
I don't know what it is called. Super deformed stuff maybe? The kind where I feel like I am on an acid trip.

 

[Tanner The Monotone]

-

My favorite style is unfortunately used in things like Queens Blade.

Speaking of perverted things, have you noticed how newer anime has been getting more and more sexual?